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HoI4 Dev Diary from the Product Manager

Hello everyone,

For those of you following these Dev Diaries, you know that we are taking a short break from the regular diaries to talk about other things we do in order to bring a game your way (not to worry, next week podcat will be back with more juicy stuff on what we are working on). Last week KimchiViking, the Project Lead on HoI IV, described what our development process looks like. This week I will try to give you some insight from a publisher’s perspective, as I work as the Product Manager for HoI IV at Paradox Interactive.

Many of you probably already have an inkling as to what a publisher does, but just to set the bottom-line straight, the publisher finances the development of a game and is in charge of the distribution and marketing of it! My role as a Product Manager is to make sure that we can deliver the best possible game to you guys whilst ensuring that the teams involved get the resources they need to do so.

In the case of HoI IV, I work closely together with the Product Team, meaning the Game Director (podcat),the Project Lead (KimchiViking) and the Product Marketing Manager who coordinates all the activities dealing with the marketing & sales department. It is in this constellation we discuss what we need to do for upcoming months/year. The Game Director is the one who is responsible for coming up with ideas for the expansion(s), the PL works out when we can deliver these and the PMM is in charge of how we market the expansion in question. And I am responsible for the budget (profit/loss).

Normally we work with yearly plans (even though we naturally also have a more long term vision of where we want to take the game). This means that around this time of year we start planning more concretely for what we want to do in the next 12-18 months.

This is an iterative process where we look at:

- the content we want to add to the game (i.e. what each expansion should be),

- what development staff is required to do this (no of programmers, content designers, QA etc),

- the optimal timing of release and the cost of marketing to make you, the players, aware of the expansion (competing releases, campaigns such as the Paradox Weekend on Steam and various trade shows etc.),

- and finally the business case for all of the above.
(For a more detailed description how we work within the Product Teams around an expansion, I recommend my colleague Gruffa’s, PM for CK2, dev diary. We work in a similar way to them; https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/ck2-dev-diary-59-publishing-ck2.1036690/)

When all of this is done I look at the budget requirements and compare that to my initial estimates and goals. Hopefully those match, or else I have to revisit and change the plans or I need to request additional funds from management, be it that the developers need additional funds to add amazing new features to the expansion or that we would like to buy 30 seconds of airtime during Super Bowl. ☺

So, in a world of infinite money and time, I would say yes to most requests, but alas it is also for me to sometimes set tighter deadlines and/or budgets due to whatever constraints we may face. But normally we sit down and try to agree together on how to best proceed.

planning-generals.jpg

The Product Team busy planning the next move for HoI IV

A very concrete case for HoI where we have had to alter our plans was for the first expansions which has affected those of you who bought the Expansion Pass. Our initial plan was to include the first two expansions at a USD 50 value for USD 40. After the launch of HoI IV we realised after your feedback that certain aspects of the base game needed attention. We already had plans for these expansions, but we decided to scope Together for Victory and Death or Dishonor down and put more effort into the free updates and bug fixing.

We believe that we have made the base game a better experience thanks to these fixes but this has made the Expansion Pass holders confused as to what and when they will get their promised content. And rightly so. What I can say is that we are aware of the situation and are working on a solution. Our goal is to make the holders of the Expansion Pass feel it was worth the wait even though it is taking longer than initially planned. Stay tuned!

KimchiViking mentioned last week that I would mention how we decide our release dates/frequency. This is really down to two things: how long it will take to make the content for a particular expansion and secondly how much money we need to make in any given period of time. If we were to need 52 weeks to create an expansion with all the people that are involved, it would be pretty hard to recoup that cost. So it’s about finding a balance between the time we spend on making the expansion and how much we can charge for it. We want to have a dedicated team working on the game over the year to ensure continuity. We also want to support the game long term, just like we are doing with other titles like CK2 and EUIV. This means that we will have a certain amount of cost that we need to recoup. This will be done by releasing a certain number of expansions over a year. Meaning that with smaller expansions we normally need to have a more frequent release schedule and less so for larger expansions. With this logic Death or Dishonor should have come out sooner after Together for Victory. In this particular case we decided to put extra effort on bug squashing and other fixes during Q1 this year rather than releasing an expansion. Additionally having paid content allows us to work on the free stuff that we provide with all releases.

We also want to ensure that we reach as many as possible once we do release an expansion. Once we have decided on the expansions that we plan on releasing within the next 12-18 months, we need to look at when it is deemed best to make them available to the players. In the Product Team we decide on a release window (usually a couple of weeks) and then our marketing team gets back to us with a proper release date as we approach that “window”. This date is based on other competing releases and when we can have suitable campaigns on platforms such as Steam, Green Man Gaming etc.

Once we have released an expansion we always look at the reception from you guys and the sales numbers to see if and what we need to address going forward. We value your comments and strive to make adjustments where it is feasible. We are thrilled and happy to see that so many of you keep on coming back to the game on a regular basis. This doesn’t mean that we are content and sated! Hopefully you will be pleased with the stuff that we have in the pipeline which podcat will start revealing next week in the next dev diary.

Please continue giving us your feedback! I will stay around the thread to answer as many questions as I can.
 
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Not in any way to put your personal financial situation in a negative light (for you, $150 over five years, or $30 a year, or 58 cents a week, may be prohibitively expensive), but some things to keep in mind:
  • More staff on the team means the DLC has to become more expensive, not less. Staff aren't paid for in dreams and good intentions. It would have more in it (at least hopefully), but whether it would be possible to produce content as efficiently with more staff is something the devs have suggested may well not be the case - so you may end up paying more for less (you'd just get it sooner).
  • You only have to pay full price at launch. If money is an issue (and my 'fun' budget has had its moments when it's been quite restricted, and I had to manage it carefully), wait for sales. Paradox have regular sales (DoD (10 per cent off) and TfV (20 per cent off) are on sale at time of typing from the Paradox store, and Steam sales are pretty frequient as well). Wait long enough, and you'll get permanent price drops as well (I can personally attest to HoI3 not costing $9.99 at launch!)
  • $25 of DLC in 12 months is hardly exorbitant or out of step with the industry. To take a random example of DLC pricing from another game released last year, it's $19.99 for XCOM 2's Reinforcement Pack, and $39.99 for 'War of the Chosen'. Civ V's Brave New World and Gods and Kings still cost $49.99 each, years after release (I just looked that up then, my eyes are still de-widening!)
  • At one point, you complain that you don't want to pay $150 for something you're already playing now for free using mods. There's a number of layers to this:
  • If this is true, why on earth are you complaining? Why not happily play the mods, have fun and profit? Indeed, you could even be appreciative of Paradox's modding policy that allows you to avoid getting any DLC at all because (if what you are saying is true.....) everything's been made and is available already.
  • The reason for this, I'd wager, is that it's not true. There is some great modded content out there, and mods are brilliant, but DLC has its advantages for a number of reasons:
  • Quality: Now, some mods are of a level of quality that is comparable with vanilla content, but these are few and far between. The vast, vast majority of mods lack the thoroughness of research (and yes, there are some slips in vanilla, but there is an extraordinarily large amount of data in HoI4 - any dataset that large will have slips in it - there are plenty of slips in mods as well, and generally more off them), the QA or the balance.
  • New features: Autonomy, licensed production, tech-sharing, blitz (controversial, but nonetheless true). These are all new features that were added in via DLC that were not possible via modding.
  • Ongoing support: Very few mods stand the test of time (and big credit to those that do). DLC, generally has ongoing support for the rest of the game. I don't need to worry about my Commonwealth focus trees in TfV not being updated in two years time, for example.
  • While we don't have to pay for it (at least, at the time of the DLC), one of the key things to keep in mind is the reason that DoD and TfV were smaller in scale than regular expansions was because the devs were working hard on free updates to the game. The new air UI and system (there's a new system under the hood, even if it's not entirely apparent on the surface), the substantial improvements to AI, the garrison feature and a bunch of other things have all been added, and at a price that regardless of your income, financing isn't an issue. Now, as I'm sure we're all well aware, someone has to pay for this at some point (be it Paradox from reduced profit, or the fans that are more wiling to pay for the improvements covering the cost for those that aren't - devs don't eat and electricity doesn't flow for nothing), the pricing structure is such that those who don't pay for the DLC still get regular updates to their game, support and new features. This is a good thing, not a bad one.
Sorry if I sound short - a bit crook - you're absolutely entitled to complain. It's important, however, to consider the broader context of what you're complaining about if you're looking to make a difference.

. More staff does not mean pricier DLC because we are paying overprice already. Instead of Paradox investing in Games they hadn`t even announced yet (as far as I know there are three project they started as developers and nobody knows if they will all finish) they should perhaps develop their current games faster and at reasonable price, so that when the team makes the finished game they go on to support the other secret projects. Instead what they are doing wright now is using HOI fans as cash cows with no real product offered to them.

.Mods are better than base game right now and some of them like Kaiserreich have massive teams behind them - bigger than the paradox one. The reason I am complaining about vanilla being unable to reach the quality of mods is: I do not want to play in fantastical setting all the time and i do want to play for achievements. However if I want that i got to wait years and pay overpriced.

. HOI as a whole in contrast to CKII and EUIV suffers from serious replayability issues as it is and cannot afford to have prolonged DLC schedule of 5 years (the game is just too bare bones if you play generic country). I remember after DoD came I played the new countries for a week, but the content is so lacking in quality and quantity that I began playing mods again. Even the people I play Multiplayer with are mostly sick of Vanilla and play mods in MP exclusiv.

. From the new features you mentioned only Autonomy is widely used and generally useful and even autonomy can be ignored.

. DoD was especially lacklustre and not because they wanted to give us more free improvements - that is an obvious lie. The reason is greed. At first they announced they are working on Axis minors - wich includes Finland and Bulgaria and even Croatia. After releasing the cut version of DoD the explained they cut Bulgaria off because of not being interesting enough (that statement can only be explained with arrogant ignorance) and they said they cut Finland off because of plans for Scandinavian DLC even though Finland is the typical DoD country (so basically because of corporate greed). To say a country is not interesting enough to be developed is showing lack of creativity and ignorance and even if they plan to readress the country in another DLC we are back on the question of greedy drop feeding. So clearly working on free improvements is not the reason they produced so little content.

. Most people that are unhappy with current DLC policy are not just unhappy about the price but about what are they getting for the price they pay and how much the finished product will cost. the two CIV V - DLC you mension were kind of game transforming, just like Art of war and rights of men for EUIV. I have not seen a game transforming DLC in HOI IV yet.
 
OK, so the project manger's plan is essentially to mass-produce more superfluous content while ignoring the AI. From an "improving gameplay perspective", it's like polishing a shit, but I guess from the "maximise short-term profit and look good at my resume" perspective, it's smarter to hype up and produce lots of new flashy features because it's easy to sell (in the short term).

Sigh.
 
OK, so the project manger's plan is essentially to mass-produce more superfluous content while ignoring the AI. From an "improving gameplay perspective", it's like polishing a shit, but I guess from the "maximise short-term profit and look good at my resume" perspective, it's smarter to hype up and produce lots of new flashy features because it's easy to sell (in the short term).

Sigh.
The manager's plan is to produce flashy content so they can fund actually improving the AI.

Selective reading should be considered a disease.
 
The manager's plan is to produce flashy content so they can fund actually improving the AI.
You'd think with last year's sales they'd have some money to actually make the game AI WORK.

Is it too much to ask for a fix for a game we've already paid for? Apparently, yes!:mad:
 
The good news is that you can never buy a DLC for HOI ever and still get free patches for the life of the game. There is no requirement that you pay out precious money for a DLC. If you decide that you absolutely cannot play the game ever again without buying a DLC, then that's on you. Just my own personal, unsolicited opinion...for what it's worth.

Yes, I know I've said this before, multiple times in fact, but so long as people continue to act as if Paradox DLCs are a game requirement, then I'll just keep repeating myself. I'm hateful that way. :)
 
You'd think with last year's sales they'd have some money to actually make the game AI WORK.

Is it too much to ask for a fix for a game we've already paid for? Apparently, yes!:mad:
The AI works for me. And by that I mean it works about as well as HoI3's AI worked in it's last update, which was about what I expected from HoI4. What you expected was apperently an overblown hyped-up super competent AI which could continue to have any hope of beating people that have played the previous games for hundreds of hours after a few games. No strategy game AI I have ever seen can beat a player after said player works out their pattern.

Regardless, nobody in this business does things for free. Saying that "they made profit before, so they should fix things for free now" is basically asking them to lose money and time for no reason. Most big updates should have some form of turning over a profit via a DLC along with it, otherwise there's little point in making said update. Since they can't put crucial AI fixes into a DLC... What do you expect the project manager to do?

Despite all of this, though, you could still not buy the DLC and still receive free updates, and you go do that if you want to. The truth is at the end of the day, nobody is forcing you to buy these DLC's, and you will still have a fully supported game for years after this conversation of ours is over.
 
Despite all of this, though, you could still not buy the DLC and still receive free updates, and you go do that if you want to. The truth is at the end of the day, nobody is forcing you to buy these DLC's, and you will still have a fully supported game for years after this conversation of ours is over.

Not really though. Paradox understands that the only thing they can profit from this game is selling National focus trees which you really cannot play without.
First of all Focus Trees serve as exploit fixes (example Canada manpower being locked behind focuses is keeping them them from steamrolling USA in 1937) and second of all the exploring of national Focuses is the reason people are even playing the game in single player.
I personally refuse to play with the generic focus trees anymore because it brings me nothing to enjoy the game with in terms of flavor. And how many times can you play the majors until it gets really boring easy and old. Instead of pressuring the team for fixing the bugs, which of course will never be done, how about requiring from them to deliver all the content (wich I am certain they fully have already) in order for the game to be replayable, because right now the game sucks from lack of quality content. The reason the game sucks is not for lack of potential but from using the same DLC policy that EUIV uses. EU IV has in comparison endless replayabilty though.
 
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. More staff does not mean pricier DLC because we are paying overprice already. Instead of Paradox investing in Games they hadn`t even announced yet (as far as I know there are three project they started as developers and nobody knows if they will all finish) they should perhaps develop their current games faster and at reasonable price, so that when the team makes the finished game they go on to support the other secret projects. Instead what they are doing wright now is using HOI fans as cash cows with no real product offered to them.

While Paradox have announced a number of things of which you weren't aware (that there were three DLC in the expansion pass now, and that the next DLC would be a larger, mechanics-focussed expansion), we don't know the details of their budgeting or resource allocation, and are not likely to. It's simple economics, though, that they'll need (or at least aim) to recoup return on investment for what they put into a game. If they put more resources in, then they need to be paid somewhere. It's not about the price (directly), it's about covering the cost of development. If what you see as "overprice" doesn't do this, then new resources are likely going to mean higher prices (assuming constant sales levels).

.Mods are better than base game right now and some of them like Kaiserreich have massive teams behind them - bigger than the paradox one. The reason I am complaining about vanilla being unable to reach the quality of mods is: I do not want to play in fantastical setting all the time and i do want to play for achievements. However if I want that i got to wait years and pay overpriced.

This is a matter of opinion. Personally, while I very much enjoy mods (and have made a couple myself - click the link, check out the TWAS alpha /shameless_plug) I also enjoy the vanilla game, and find it's more a choice of the desired experience, than 'better' or 'worse'. I like TWAS for the naval variant events and extra detail in the historic capabilities of ships, but others may find the events annoying and the detail unnecessary micro (not a shameless plug here - much safer to use my own mod when talking about downsides as well).

However, regardless of all of this, the mods wouldn't exist without the base game. Mods are not the same as full game development (and then some). Mods are great, but without the work that had been put into vanilla in the first place, those mods wouldn't exist.

. HOI as a whole in contrast to CKII and EUIV suffers from serious replayability issues as it is and cannot afford to have prolonged DLC schedule of 5 years (the game is just too bare bones if you play generic country). I remember after DoD came I played the new countries for a week, but the content is so lacking in quality and quantity that I began playing mods again. Even the people I play Multiplayer with are mostly sick of Vanilla and play mods in MP exclusiv.

This is strongly a matter of opinion. HoI4 replays in a different way (it's not an empire builder as much as a wargame), but the way the war can be replayed can vary substantially, even with historical NFs turned on. I'm 700 hours in and still enjoying it immensely. Of course, your mileage may vary, but by the sound of it you've played a game with each major and many minors, so it sounds like you're getting pretty decent value for money (in terms of $ per hour of entertainment), even if you're playing constant speed five without pausing.

. From the new features you mentioned only Autonomy is widely used and generally useful and even autonomy can be ignored.

Again, opinion. I use Blitz all the time, and for a minor production licenses are wonderful. I also use conversion a heap (but can't remember whether that was DLC or base game - but regardless it was a new feature).

. DoD was especially lacklustre and not because they wanted to give us more free improvements - that is an obvious lie. The reason is greed. At first they announced they are working on Axis minors - wich includes Finland and Bulgaria and even Croatia. After releasing the cut version of DoD the explained they cut Bulgaria off because of not being interesting enough (that statement can only be explained with arrogant ignorance) and they said they cut Finland off because of plans for Scandinavian DLC even though Finland is the typical DoD country (so basically because of corporate greed). To say a country is not interesting enough to be developed is showing lack of creativity and ignorance and even if they plan to readress the country in another DLC we are back on the question of greedy drop feeding. So clearly working on free improvements is not the reason they produced so little content.

There were substantial improvements to the air interface and underlying mechanics in the free patch that accompanied DoD. This is a fact, plain and simple. There were also substantial improvements in the land AI, and numerous bug fixes. There were almost definitely other things as well, but I'm fuzzy-headed and my memory's doing what it does best (forget things :oops:). It was not an obvious lie, and the data are available to determine this. The changes may not have been what you wanted personally (and complaining about this is fine) and the countries focussed on may not have been your preference either (also fine), but to say that there weren't free improvements is categorically false. This is what I mean about being convincing - if you say things that are out-and-out not correct, people will have a harder time taking you seriously, and if what you want is change, you don't want to come across as 'just another blowhard on the internet' (I'm not saying that's what you're coming across as, but it is a risk with the approach you're taking).

. Most people that are unhappy with current DLC policy are not just unhappy about the price but about what are they getting for the price they pay and how much the finished product will cost. the two CIV V - DLC you mension were kind of game transforming, just like Art of war and rights of men for EUIV. I have not seen a game transforming DLC in HOI IV yet.

The two Civ DLC I mentioned also cost more than HoI4 at launch, so they'd want to be good (which they were, I'm very partial to Civ V and VI, and IV, III, II and I while we're at it). Art of War and Rights of Man were both a good deal more expensive (in percentage terms) than TfV or DoD, which may well bear some relation to the scope of the content offered. I agree that HoI4 hasn't had an 'Art of War' DLC yet, but the devs have also made it clear they have been working on the base game.
 
There were substantial improvements to the air interface and underlying mechanics in the free patch that accompanied DoD. This is a fact, plain and simple. There were also substantial improvements in the land AI, and numerous bug fixes. There were almost definitely other things as well, but I'm fuzzy-headed and my memory's doing what it does best (forget things :oops:). It was not an obvious lie, and the data are available to determine this. The changes may not have been what you wanted personally (and complaining about this is fine) and the countries focussed on may not have been your preference either (also fine), but to say that there weren't free improvements is categorically false. This is what I mean about being convincing - if you say things that are out-and-out not correct, people will have a harder time taking you seriously, and if what you want is change, you don't want to come across as 'just another blowhard on the internet' (I'm not saying that's what you're coming across as, but it is a risk with the approach you're taking).

As you can tell if you actually had read what I wrote. Excusing the lacking content in DoD with the usual free content fixes is a lie or at least a corporate deception manoever. I know very well what the free improvements are and that they exist but I cannot possibly accept they are an exuse for selling such bad DLC. And do not take it I do not like the countries they developed - on the contrary with the exception of Czechoslovakia the were all thematicly part of the axis minors.
On own admission of the developers they cut down the number of those countries (in the case of Finland because of Intentions to make Scandinavia DLC), which feeds on to my theory that the real reason for the cut down DLC is corparate greed. Not to mention the astonishing explanation they did not include Bulgaria because of not being interesting enough. You can find those explanation in the forum. The explanation with free content is just an empty excuse, which means deception, which means a lie.

And using frases like "its a matter of opinion" in a Forum is quite redundant. Also i have 881 hours in the game - a lot of it in MP. I know what i am talking about. I would not want to spend a single hour more in the base game though until it gets real and engaging content someday.
 
Excusing the lacking content in DoD with the usual free content fixes is a lie or at least a corporate deception manoever. I know very well what the free improvements are and that they exist but I cannot possibly accept they are an exuse for selling such bad DLC.

The developers have a limited amount of time to spend though, and it needs to be split between free patches and new DLC content. Would you prefer that they followed the DLC approach of HoI3 and HoI2, which means to get any updates at all except the few weeks of patches after release, you need to buy all the expansions?


Instead of pressuring the team for fixing the bugs, which of course will never be done

To the claim that the devs are not fixing bugs or making fixes podcat responded with with a list of changes since release in this post:

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum...-product-manager.1042544/page-2#post-23253510

Quite a long list for never fixing bugs, don't you think?
 
The developers have a limited amount of time to spend though, and it needs to be split between free patches and new DLC content. Would you prefer that they followed the DLC approach of HoI3 and HoI2, which means to get any updates at all except the few weeks of patches after release, you need to buy all the expansions?




To the claim that the devs are not fixing bugs or making fixes podcat responded with with a list of changes since release in this post:

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum...-product-manager.1042544/page-2#post-23253510

Quite a long list for never fixing bugs, don't you think?

I never wrote such a claim i just wrote it will never be done. Have you ever seen a complex game without bugs? No matter how hard they try there will always be bugs especially if the devs whant to continue with the current DLC model which introduces new bugs after every change in the focus trees.

I do not care much for the old or the new DLC models HOI is not suitable for both anyway. What they should do is release all the content at once and balance it out allthogether. Now I know that is economically unsound decision at first glance but it can be balanced out by increasing the game price.
 
I never wrote such a claim i just wrote it will never be done. Have you ever seen a complex game without bugs? No matter how hard they try there will always be bugs

So taking the same argument one step further, just because the world will never be rid of bad things or bad people we shouldn't care about it but just ignore them all and let them continue? What kind of strange twisted logic is that?!

IMO Problems should be dealt with, by order of importance and how easy they are to solve ( cost vs benefit ), and you should always strive to improve whatever you are doing.

What they should do is release all the content at once and balance it out allthogether. Now I know that is economically unsound decision at first glance but it can be balanced out by increasing the game price.

So you would have liked them to release HoI4 in 2021 for an asking price of 175€ is that what your saying? ( since current generation of Paradox games seems to have at least 5 years DLC lifespan and the development cost/pace judging DLC releases so far is ~25€ per year / copy ).

If they did this they would also not be able to implement any player feedback, suggestions or player mods at all, so it would be a significantly worse game then current HoI4 will be by then.
 
So taking the same argument one step further, just because the world will never be rid of bad things or bad people we shouldn't care about it but just ignore them all and let them continue? What kind of strange twisted logic is that?!

IMO Problems should be dealt with, by order of importance and how easy they are to solve ( cost vs benefit ), and you should always strive to improve whatever you are doing.



So you would have liked them to release HoI4 in 2021 for an asking price of 175€ is that what your saying? ( since current generation of Paradox games seems to have at least 5 years DLC lifespan and the development cost/pace judging DLC releases so far is ~25€ per year / copy ).

If they did this they would also not be able to implement any player feedback, suggestions or player mods at all, so it would be a significantly worse game then current HoI4 will be by then.

They can always support the game with patches and support the modding comunity afterwads. And yes i would rather pay more for the full content once in the case of HOI because right now I am in a proverbial pickle where I badly want to play the game but at the same time have no engaging game content left to play even in Multiplayer.
 
As you can tell if you actually had read what I wrote. Excusing the lacking content in DoD with the usual free content fixes is a lie or at least a corporate deception manoever. I know very well what the free improvements are and that they exist but I cannot possibly accept they are an exuse for selling such bad DLC. And do not take it I do not like the countries they developed - on the contrary with the exception of Czechoslovakia the were all thematicly part of the axis minors.
On own admission of the developers they cut down the number of those countries (in the case of Finland because of Intentions to make Scandinavia DLC), which feeds on to my theory that the real reason for the cut down DLC is corparate greed. Not to mention the astonishing explanation they did not include Bulgaria because of not being interesting enough. You can find those explanation in the forum. The explanation with free content is just an empty excuse, which means deception, which means a lie.

And using frases like "its a matter of opinion" in a Forum is quite redundant. Also i have 881 hours in the game - a lot of it in MP. I know what i am talking about. I would not want to spend a single hour more in the base game though until it gets real and engaging content someday.

I'm strugglling a little with your logic (and I am reading what you're writing, but apologies for any misinterpretation). You argue that the DLC are overpriced (which they obviously are for you - but value for money is about as subjective as it gets, I was very happy with the price myself, whether in intrinsic fun factor, $/hour of gameplay, comparison with industry norms or net amount of content - but you are of course welcome to your opinion, just remember that it's one opinion and may not be shared by others (although I do know you're not alone :))), and then you argue:

What they should do is release all the content at once and balance it out allthogether. Now I know that is economically unsound decision at first glance but it can be balanced out by increasing the game price.

This isn't going to make it any cheaper (a good deal less cheap, most likely). At the end of the day, Paradox will require a return on investment on the amount of resources they put into the game. They get this by selling X copies of the game at Y price. The work needs to be paid for, one way or another. The difference at the moment is that the DLC (quite cleverly) allows for a tiered pricing approach. People that enjoy the content more, or have more disposable income (so either place a higher value on it, or have enough money that they can place a lower value on it and still fit it into their budget) buy it earlier on, then as the price drops others buy it at a price that suits the value that DLC provides them with. As I argued in my original response, you absolutely don't have to pay full price (or buy the DLC at all - if it's such bad value you can say "well, I've had 881 hours of fun, I'll do something else now") under this current model - but under the "Duke Nukem Forever development cycle" approach, you're more likely to have to pay a higher price for longer to get all of it - and bad luck if you don't want the South American focus trees - it's all one game and you either get all of it or none of it. The 'all one big game' together seems consumer and choice-unfriendly. However......

They can always support the game with patches and support the modding comunity afterwads. And yes i would rather pay more for the full content once in the case of HOI because right now I am in a proverbial pickle where I badly want to play the game but at the same time have no engaging game content left to play even in Multiplayer.

....one option is to decide that the game isn't finally released until all the DLC are complete - you'll be waiting a while, but I'd bet good money you'll be able to buy a "HoI4 complete" for a substantial discount at that time. If you consider that the 'proper' release, you can almost definitely get what you want, and at a far cheaper price than if everyone had to buy it all at once at that time.
 
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The manager's plan is to produce flashy content so they can fund actually improving the AI.

Selective reading should be considered a disease.

If that's the fantasy you want to believe, be my guest.

The AI works for me. And by that I mean it works about as well as HoI3's AI worked in it's last update, which was about what I expected from HoI4. What you expected was apperently an overblown hyped-up super competent AI which could continue to have any hope of beating people that have played the previous games for hundreds of hours after a few games. No strategy game AI I have ever seen can beat a player after said player works out their pattern.

Regardless, nobody in this business does things for free. Saying that "they made profit before, so they should fix things for free now" is basically asking them to lose money and time for no reason. Most big updates should have some form of turning over a profit via a DLC along with it, otherwise there's little point in making said update. Since they can't put crucial AI fixes into a DLC... What do you expect the project manager to do?

Despite all of this, though, you could still not buy the DLC and still receive free updates, and you go do that if you want to. The truth is at the end of the day, nobody is forcing you to buy these DLC's, and you will still have a fully supported game for years after this conversation of ours is over.

First of all, the HoI4 AI isn't merely "not good", it is sadly completely broken. Just take the logic loops it gets caught in that makes it frontally assault the Maginot line for 1 year until it dies, as one example. Secondly, you're essentially saying it's OK for a company to first sell you a broken product and then instead of patching it up, selling you more flashy, useless features while hinting that "if you buy enough, we might get our asses in gear and starting fixing the problems". Lol, what a ridiculous, and indeed naive, argument.

IMO this whole shebang degrades PI's reputation among it customers, and that might come back to bite it in its ass. After all, the reason people buy PI games (unlike AAA titles) is content in a very niche genre, instead of awesome graphics and flashy features.
 
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....one option is to decide that the game isn't finally released until all the DLC are complete - you'll be waiting a while, but I'd bet good money you'll be able to buy a "HoI4 complete" for a substantial discount at that time. If you consider that the 'proper' release, you can almost definitely get what you want, and at a far cheaper price than if everyone had to buy it all at once at that time.

Yeah, The current DLC policy is a win for everyone involved, I think it's pretty brilliant.
  • The skeptics can buy years later for massive discounts and enjoy years of free patching, getting great value for their money.
  • The fans can buy all DLCs at release to support their favorite game and help more content get developed faster.
  • Everyone in between can buy the DLCs that interest them and wait with buying the others until they are sufficiently discounted to be worth the price.
 
I'm strugglling a little with your logic (and I am reading what you're writing, but apologies for any misinterpretation). You argue that the DLC are overpriced (which they obviously are for you - but value for money is about as subjective as it gets, I was very happy with the price myself, whether in intrinsic fun factor, $/hour of gameplay, comparison with industry norms or net amount of content - but you are of course welcome to your opinion, just remember that it's one opinion and may not be shared by others (although I do know you're not alone :))), and then you argue:

Well, let me clarify my logic then. Imagine somebody does an incomplete and bad job (developers making DoD) and writes on the forums reasons for why the job is not complete (among others the reason is at least partly - they want to leave some of the work for another DLC, which sounds that they want to milk the people who continue to buy the flavour content as much as possible). Then Paradox reads the bad steam reviews and outraged forum posts and decides to enlighten us as to how game management works in order to manage consumer anger. The game manager then writes in this forum thread the reason for the incomplete job are the free updates (which sounds a lot better than desire to make as much DLC as possible) and makes vague promises for the ones that prepaid the season pass (like me). So leaving out the very information the developers gave months ago is the actual deception and lie.
I am sure the free updates are a lot of work but I am also sure the making of Focus trees is quite easy especially because they probably have rough idea what to be included in those focus trees. Even considering the QA testing for conflicts and bugs - another 2 focus trees to complete the theme of the DLC would have been no real effort.

Bad opinion is the majority in the steam reviews about DoD, also discontent about DoD is the majority in this Forum posts after DoD release, so it is actually only your opinion if you think i am marginalised.

I agree the DLC policy is good for the other games paradox but not for HOI IV. The only way for DLC to work is to centre them mainly on game mechanics and to provide more focus trees in every update or even for free.
I actually think national focus trees and politics is a core game mechanic which all the people who play the game should have access to. Right now the base game is really lacking, boring and samey because of flavor deficiency. And the game flavor improvements like focus trees and politics are too slowly added, which make people like me not want to play base game right now.
 
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I have no problem with Paradox's DLC model, which I think is fair... I just wish I had any interest in some of the actual DLC. :oops:
 

Yeah, you have no actual idea about how complicated coding and balance actually are, and thus you have imagined that building focus trees that make sense and don't accidentally wind up over/under powering a nation is quite simply easier than it actually is.