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HOI4 Dev Diary - Greece

Hey all! After a long break over the summer, we are back with our regularly-scheduled dev diaries! Before we delve into today’s main topic, let me give you some info on what we will be doing next and how this dev diary fits into the overall scheme of things.

Way back in 2017, we released Death or Dishonor, something we called a Country Pack at the time. Back then, the community was mainly asking for big new flashy mechanics and revamps of game systems, so the initial reaction from the community was pretty mixed. In hindsight perhaps we shouldn't have been surprised :D. These days though we are bombarded with requests of more, better and bigger focus trees, and people are wondering if it's going to take 10 years to add trees to everyone? As a Content Designer, it has been very rewarding to see the community get more excited to see focus trees!

So we have decided to bring back the idea of a Country Pack, a smaller expansion that focuses on a specific part of the world and covering 3-4 minor nations. But at the same time, we didn’t want to put the entire team on it while there were still other parts of the game we wanted to work on such as adding an intelligence system. The idea is that this will let us increase how many focus trees and flavor we add while still being able to deliver big juicy features in larger expansions.

The approach we took was to recruit a freelancer to work on the focus trees while the rest of the team in Stockholm worked on the next big DLC, which would eventually become La Resistance. Today we are going to show you the first of the new focus trees coming in the next country pack, and in the coming weeks we will share more information on what other countries get focus trees in the pack, as well as what other content will accompany the release. As always, the country pack will be accompanied by a patch that will fix some bugs as well.

We think that this approach allows us to get more content to you faster, without taking resources away from the main team, which continues to work on the next big DLC. You will get more information on what that DLC contains after the country pack releases later this year (disclaimer: it is 2020 and fate can be fickle).

I’ll now hand you over to the man of the hour: Freelance CD Busby, working from Australia!


G’day, my name is Busby and I am the Freelance Content Designer who was responsible for putting together Greece and another soon-to-be-revealed mystery nation! ‘Freelance Content Designer’, I hear you ask, ‘how does that differ from your standard run-of-the-mill Content Designer’? Well, with COVID-19, those lines have certainly blurred; nominally, it means that I work remotely of the core team so I can focus on getting this pack out to you while they all collaborate on the next big expansion! Of course, I didn’t work alone, and you’ll be hearing from a familiar face who worked with me on this next week!

Before kicking things off, I just want to say as someone who used to read Hearts of Iron IV Dev Diaries on my lunch break in high school that it is an absolute privilege and an honour to be presenting you all with one of my very own! So, without further ado: Greece!

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Greece was a very interesting challenge to tackle, they are well known for repulsing the Italian invasion of their nation and then successfully launching a counter-offensive of their own, which culminated in the Capture of Klisura Pass. So, it was important that Greece be able to play defensively, but it would also have been thoughtless to neglect what might be one of the world’s richest histories that shared in some of the grandest of accomplishments. Greece has been the beating heart of many historical empires, so they had to be capable of reaching their historical heights but without neglecting the many challenges that faced them at the time.

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To say that Greece is in a challenging position in 1936 would be a great understatement. The Hellenic Armed Forces are the one positive in a sea of negatives, and even they’re woefully underequipped. Greece’s economic and political issues are represented through their starting national spirits:
  • I am going to start first with Greece’s broadly encompassing Political Instability spirit. Greece was mired in political uncertainty throughout the entirety of the Great War, and although they were finally able to rally around the prolific political leader and vocal republican Eleftherios Venizelos for a time, this newfound stability was not to last. Greece decisively lost the Greco-Turkish War that immediately followed the Great War, and this loss sent shockwaves throughout the entire political scene: there were many coups, a dictatorship, and finally the Second Hellenic Republic came to a bitter end by November of 1935. In 1936, the country remains divided among those who believe in the institution of the monarchy, and those who are followers of the liberal democratic ideologue Eleftherios Venizelos.

  • The restoration of the monarchy turned the Greek political situation on its head: King George II, exiled in 1923, is back on his throne while Eleftherios Venizelos hides in exile after being forced to flee the country in 1935. The status of King George II serves as the ‘hook’ for every political path in the focus tree, but that will be addressed shortly. For now, understand that King George II’s status as monarch of the Kingdom of Greece is precarious to say the least.

  • The next four spirits are related to Greece’s economic situation, which is… not in a good state. Greece is buried underneath the tremendous debt it has accumulated over the past few decades, and this is represented through Greece’s Debt to the International Finance Commission spirit. If Greece wishes to free itself from the burdens of its debt, it will have to satisfy the three great powers holding the Greek economy hostage, and those would be the usual suspects: France, the United Kingdom, and the Kingdom of Italy.

  • Greece’s colossal debt is only the start of Greece’s economic woes: Greece remains one of the only mostly agrarian economies in all of Europe by the game start, and this has spawned two issues: 1). Greece’s economy and working class are centered around their agricultural sector rather than the nation’s industrial output, and 2). Greece’s agrarian economy has led to a dependence on foreign nations to supply their heavy industry for Greece’s construction needs. Greece’s industrial paths are focussed on nullifying these issues while also rapidly modernising the country so Greece is able to still compete with its neighbours.

  • But it’s not all bad for Greece, for they have a continental guardian angel to assist with their crippling economic hardship… Germany! Yes, the Schachtplan, a clever mechanism that gives the Germans a higher degree of control over the country’s finances and natural resources, but when you’re struggling as hard as Greece you take any form of reprieve you can get - even if it is ultimately serving German hegemonic aims in Europe.
Now, I know these debuffs seem rough - perhaps even discouraging - but every negative national spirit can be removed or mitigated through Greece’s focus tree, which you can see here!

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We shall be going through the focus tree from right-to-left, like an old Japanese novel!

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Greece can often find itself wanting for manpower so most Greek games aren’t going to be about amassing large armies but rather about fielding a smaller, professional army. The same applies to Greece’s navy and air force, but with the right sponsor who’s to say Greece couldn’t put one of its decommissioned battleships back into action?

Each armed forces branch offers at least one permanent national modifier that helps ensure Greece can set up a successful defensive game even if it can’t muster the manpower or equipment for a large army. The Hellenic Academy Battleplans should help quite a great deal in this!

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Greece can preemptively draw up defensive plans against the major powers of Europe as well as its smaller but no less threatening neighbours. These temporary boosts to defense, and even to attack in some cases, should ensure Greece can successfully hold any frontline so long as they aren’t being faced with an overwhelming force - very much like real life! Next, let’s look at how you can get your industrial base to match the level of excellence of your armed forces.

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Greece’s industrial path is your one-stop shop to access the means of eliminating those pesky national spirits that Greece starts with. The first focus, which is 35 days, unlocks the ability to chip away at that pesky Debt to the I.F.C. through decisions.
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Greece immediately unlocks the ability to make small debt repayments after finishing the first industrial focus, and other options can be unlocked along the way. The forced industrialisation path, for example, offers a faster route to getting rid of the Debt to the I.F.C. spirit by unlocking large debt repayments - and while they are more resource intensive than small debt repayments, they can clear a debt away very quickly. Of course, if Greece happens to fall under the influence of a regime that doesn’t quite play by the established rules of the liberal democratic world then there will of course be other roads opened up to circumvent the nasty capitalist plot to ruin the Greek economy!

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Greece’s two branching paths in the industrial path allow the player to choose how the Greek economy modernises: they can either double-down on their service economy and use Greece’s large commodity export sector to enrich the nation using the means of the outside world, or they can force their farmers off their farms and into the cities so Greece can be brought fully into the twentieth century. As the path progresses, the effects of the Foreign Monopolies spirit will be lessened and lessened until finally they can be abolished or co-opted to the benefit of the Greek state. Greek national companies, which require the Foreign Monopolies to be banished, apply better modifiers but the foreign companies are cheaper and ultimately easier to attain.

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Next up are the investment focuses: the middle ground between the industrial branches and the political tree. Investment is a nifty way to spend any spare political power in the pursuit of free factories courtesy of your ally or sponsor. It would be wise to show restraint, however, for the sponsoring country will take on a pretty hefty penalty while they prepare to fulfill any pledges they’ve made to Greece.


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Ah, and now we get to the real meat of the tree: the politics. The first big choice of the game comes in the very first month via either a focus or decision, where the player will have to decide whether to place the king under arrest to prevent him from meddling in the election or allow him to forcibly establish a governmental mandate for the monarchists.

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Let’s start with the historical path, where the monarchists win their election and the king appoints former officer and arch-enemy of the republicans Ioannis Metaxas as prime minister and soon-to-be-dictator.
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The Metaxist path is all about trying to maintain your neutrality for as long as possible so you can take all the Metaxist focuses which provide some tremendous national buffs that all go away the moment Greece enters a faction. The exception is if the player reaches the end of the Metaxist branch by finishing Reviving the Spartan Warrior Spirit before they join a faction. Of course, the player doesn’t have to wait that long - they can go straight to the Allied path on the left or transform Greece from a quasi-fascist dictatorship into a full-blown fascist regime.

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The aim of the fascists is not only to bring themselves closer to the Axis, but to pressure Turkey into joining the war as an equal ally and partner. To achieve this aim, the player can choose to either appoint George Mercouris or Ioannis Metaxas as their fascist dictator. Of course, there’s always the chance negotiations could be sabotaged, giving the Greek player the opportunity to act counter to Germany’s wishes by forcing the Axis into a conflict with the Turkish regional power. Perhaps that might not be so bad, because while Metaxas is fixated on crafting his Third Hellenic Civilization Mercouris has a decidedly fixated obsession with the First Hellenic Civilization…

But let’s return to Metaxas, because even though he was a Germanophile it must be said that not every member of the Axis has Greece’s best interests at heart.

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Strange times call for strange bedfellows, and despite Metaxas’ fascist leanings he is free to align Greece up with its historical allies in the Mediterranean: the British Empire. Once the overtures have been made, Greece will be free to get down to the business of Cyprus and the facilitation of a change in administration of the island. But Metaxas isn’t the only possible would-be Allies member in the King’s administration…


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...so let’s talk about the Anglophilic King George II himself! Perhaps Metaxas just isn’t going to cut it for Greece, perhaps what Greece really needs is a strong monarch who can serve as a beacon of stability and hope for the Greek people! Of course, the people aren’t going to see it like that - in fact many of them are going to really hate the government’s guts.

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Years of instability and infighting shall culminate in a triumphant civil war between the monarchists and the republicans! It’s perhaps not the most delicate solution, but a good civil war really does have the habit of ironing out a nation in contempt of itself. Take on King George II as your absolute monarch and assist the British in scourging fascism from Europe, or alternatively perhaps a good bit of that fascism has already been purged away and the Central Powers have been reborn. Well, in that case link up with your royalist brethren and fight together to protect the divine right of kings!

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Political Instability keeps coming up as a concept, so let’s look at the spirit. Greece is divided into four factions: the Monarchists, the Republicans, the Communists, and the Fascists. They’re all pretty hateful of each other, but there was also a common consensus that Greece needed to be strong and united in the face of a global catastrophe (like a World War). Not every leader saw it that way, *cough* Metaxas *cough*, so there will be three primary ways of dealing with political instability.

First, to progress the spirit and lower its debuffs it's necessary for progress to be made down the political tree - every ideology has its own unique Political Instability spirit but although the modifiers change the universal principle remains the same.

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The player can choose between smashing a faction and negating the negative debuffs applied to the nation by having a hostile faction, or they can go the longer and more expensive route of co-opting a faction and making them an ally. Generally, the more allied factions the better because more allies means more manpower and more ministers, but sometimes the resources required to commit to such an act would be better spent elsewhere preparing for external threats rather than internal ones.

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Speaking of factions, how about some insight into the most incongruous of factions - the communists! Communism, being allied with the concept of republicanism, requires the Venezelists to seize the election. Once that is done, they can choose to ally together with the communists so that a Third Hellenic Republic can be reborn. However, as you can imagine the communists aren’t really content with anything short of… well… full-blown communism.

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Of all the branches, the communist one perhaps adds the most in terms of industrial potential for Greece: while all those other sucker ideologies focus on culture and heritage, the communists focus on more material achievements. Although, would it really be a communist branch without a doctrinal split near the end?

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Take the nation under the wing of the uncompromising revolutionary Markos Vafeiadis, and assist Josip Broz Tito in his ascent to power in Yugoslavia as you prepare to tackle the fascist menace in Europe. Or perhaps you’re a little more loose with your Marxist morals; perhaps Stalinism doesn’t seem so bad after all! Chairman Nikos Zachariadis is your man!

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Why waste precious resources fighting fascism when you can leave that to the capitalists! Your objective, like your theory, is based on practicalism and not idealism. Orders from Moscow dictate that the Bosporus must be taken at any cost. To fulfill Stalin’s whims, a crisis must be started - one border conflict shall escalate into another, and before the world knows it Southern Europe will be red from Corfu to Kars!

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...well, that might be all fine and dandy for everybody whose favourite colour is red, but we’ve got one last path to discuss! Yes, yes, the so often spurned democratic path - but even though this path comes last it is certainly not least! Few parties were as influential in Greece’s history between 1910 and 1936 as Eleftherios Venizelos’ Liberal Party, and it was important to me that the player felt some weight playing as these titans of Greek politics. Although, if the Venezelists were titans then Venizelos himself was a colossus. This is reflected in his Ethnarch trait, which provides some much needed manpower and stability - but utilise him while you have him, for he is not long for this world!

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Something that sets Greece’s liberal democratic party apart from many others is that warmongering is a core part of their doctrine. The Venezelists were staunch believers in the Megali Idea - the irredentist dream of a Greater Greece incorporating many parts of modern day Turkey. The Venezelists made a grand attempt to fulfill the Megali Idea after the Great War… it led to the Greco-Turkish War… which, to put it mildly, did not end well for the Greeks. They were decisively defeated by the Turkish Kemalists, and the Hellenic Republic fell apart shortly afterwards.

When you restore the Venezelists, you inherit their shattered legacy - the only way to restore the reputation of Venezelism is to couple yourself with the monarchists, fulfill the Megali Idea, and avenge the terrible loss the Greek nation endured. But not everybody in Greece believes the Venezelists deserve a second chance…

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Enter, stage left: a new breed of fascist, Ethniki Enosis Ellados. The EEE collapsed in 1935 due to infighting, but with the reemergence of the Venezelists they have found new purpose: to unite the millions of Greeks who were exiled from their homes in Anatolia after the Greco-Turkish War, and to oust the government that led them into defeat last time. The EEE is a ‘no half measures’ movement, to them the Megali Idea is not worthy of the paper it was written on - when it comes to reclaiming territory from Turkey, it must be all… or nothing.

Playing as the Venezelists, the EEE are going to be a serious thorn in the side of any government trying to effectively unite the country, and before the Megali Idea can be addressed the EEE must be dealt with. There’s a particularly famous and talented young man who was also an exile from Anatolia, and it might be expedient to encourage him to form a counter-movement to thwart the nascent EEE. Or perhaps the player wants to see the EEE in government, well, the option to take them into a coalition is certainly available - although the consequences of this course of action will be on your head…

Once the EEE are out of the way, it will be time to call on the original Treaty of Sèvres signatories so that a frank discussion on the future of the Turkish state can be had. The end result of a particularly fruitful Heraklion Convention is truly a sight to behold.

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But should the Venezelists fail… should their legacy be trashed once again, and their leaders thrown out of office… well, that could be a truly dark day for Europe indeed…

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That’s all for this week, so thank you for reading! Make sure to stay tuned for another Dev Diary next week!
 

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Have I just read Kaiserreich Dev Diary? Especially, the Byzantium restoration. Oh my, this focus tree is just fine (not on a level of Bratyn's work though) but new faction system and debt machanic are great change. However I'm so confused with the ideologies path in this focus tree. It's so weird to see democratic path leading to Byzantine while the fascist path allying with their archenemy Turkey.
Now I kinda wish Yugoslavia, Romania, Czechoslovakia and Hungary weren't in DoD DLC. :)
For 4 minors in the upcoming collie pack, I think they're Greece, Turkey, Bulgaria and Albania too. The last one could also be Iran (for the USSR update) or Belgium (the last nation had colonies without focus tree left).
I hope it would be Albania though cause it'll fit perfectly in this pack.
Love the idea of country pack DLC.
 
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I like what I see here (and I am a sucker for deeper political mechanics like this faction system), however I would like to ask for clarification on one thing:
Ah, and now we get to the real meat of the tree: the politics. The first big choice of the game comes in the very first month via either a focus or decision, where the player will have to decide whether to place the king under arrest to prevent him from meddling in the election or allow him to forcibly establish a governmental mandate for the monarchists.

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It looks like this mission/decision is simply a matter of arresting the king if you want the republicans to win, or not if you don't. Is there more to it than that? It strikes me as a strange design if not, why add the complication of the mission and decision, why not just have there be options in the election event for the winner? Or even make the focuses selectable from the start and abstract the outcome of the election into the focuses? It reminds me a bit of MEFO bills, before the change when the necessity of repeatedly clicking a decision for what amounted to flavour reasons was rightly recognised as a waste of time for the player and a source of potential unnecessary mistakes. I hope this isn't like that.
 
Disappointed this pack doesn't contain an Italian rework, but honestly, just Turkey being more likely is good enough for me
 
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I was looking forward to Greece coming around sooner or later. Wonder if Greece has any mechanics to help them out a bit in a historical game after the inevitable(in multiplayer) capitulation? The Netherlands had a series of decisions to get access to a few toys to give them things to do while they are capitulated(even if they did not relocate to the East Indies). It would be nice if the Greek tree has something in there of that nature, especially something to perhaps incentivize the allies to help Greece hang on to Crete.

The tree does look a little more linear than I'd like in comparison to say, Mexico or Netherlands, but it mostly looks serviceable. My biggest issue with it is one that plagues almost every focus tree in the game.

While it's good that Greece has a whole heap of additional issues to tackle at the beginning of the game like most minors that receive focus trees, it basically makes the dedicated military portion of the focus tree a bit pointless. Greece's political and economic situation is so bad that it is a no brainer to put off doing military focuses for an indefinite, perhaps permanent time. By the time the vital political and economic focuses are done, you will likely be at war. At that point it is usually more useful to take a continuous focus rather than waste any time taking focuses that give a minor country research bonuses on planes, tanks, or ships that they will be unlikely to produce in any worthwhile numbers anyway.

I feel like not only Paradox's own content, but even many mods struggle to find a way to make a dedicated military sub-portion of a focus tree feel meaningful and worthwhile. Research bonuses are really only hugely significant, for the most part, for a major country who will be putting potentially dozens of factories on building that kind of specialized equipment. More often than not I usually end up just not taking many, if any of the military focuses in the focus trees. Usually the first one or two will offer 1 or 2 100% research bonuses for land doctrines, but after that I find them not to be worth it unless, like in the case of France, you are required to do get rid of a debilitating national spirit.
 
also the facist path seems really dull, what the heck is turkohellenism

Exactly, Turkey and Greece are mortal enemies. Alt-history is fine, but it should at the very least have some minimal base in reality. Even today, despite being in the same military alliance, Turkey still is sitting on invaded North Cyprus and still there are military stand-offs. In this context I don't see what Greece could offer Turkey to make them change their minds.

If any re-aproach would happen it would need to come from the Turkish side, which is the more agressive one, like a democratic path where the left+Kurds takes power in Turkey and stops imperialist policies.
 
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Thrilled to see Paradox working on the Byzantine Empire instead of well known problems with the AI.
It's selling content that allows them to pay for stuff like ai improvements that likely goes into the free patch.
 
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You must've missed all those rather large free patches that come with every DLC.
But by all means, don't lemme ruin your big drama queen moment.
Yes, every game does free patch updates..... Probably to fix bugs. I think it’s not more than normal to do those for free but okay.
 
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I wonder what the next major expansion will be. And I wonder why Death or Dishonor was considered a major expansion instead of a country pack.
It wasn't. It was considered as "an" expansion, which can be big or small, but the price was lower and it was called "country pack" in the dev diaries.
 
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That’s an outdated way of thinking about publicly listed companies. Creating shareholder value is still important today, but not the myopic focus that was around 20 years ago. Why Paradox may not hear anyone out is not really related to their status as a listed company - that’s more related to company culture.
It's not like it's been turned around either. People just found out that sound business practices make better ROI over time.
 
Damn, you exceed the limits of being unfunny gg.

People can still want a product if you don’t overdose it with overpriced DLC. Imagine a game like Minecraft charging you 10-15 bucks just for some new mobs and structures to be added. That wouldn’t happen because everyone would lose their shit and Mojang arent scumbags.

If you like being fucked over by game companies, then you can. I don’t.

The amount of content for each DLC pack is not worth 20,- dollars. Something every sane person will agree with. You probably haven’t even played any mods yourself if you think it’s implausible that modders can dedicate more work than the Devs. Look at Kaiserreich, OWB, TNO. Kaiserreich has a unique focus tree for every single nation there, including events.

I don’t think you’ve played La Résistance but okay. The first I’d do is play every nation with a new focus tree. I’m not gonna write an entire essay why I think the French focus tree is bad, its unnecessary. Most people that have played the new one will agree that a lot of the focuses are pretty broken. From what I’ve heard is that it was made by some guy who doesn’t really do a good job at doing it.

When did I mention AI in my review? Oh I didn’t, but thanks for reminding so I’ll talk about it here. Yeah, the AI is pretty shit overall and utterly useless, they’re more of a burden than an ally to you.

I can complain cosmetic shit I dont need, yes. And I literally gave the reason why no one needs or wants them and it’s just a quick cash grab. Everyone can get song packs for free in the workshop. Lmao call it ranting. I personally don’t care what you think but that’s besides the point.

You can continue sucking Paradox's cock now. Hf

I think you are quite opinionated for someone who literally joined the forum to rant about how he doesn't need this particular DLC and that he dislikes the DLC business model in general, because apparently you can have all sorts of great fun for free, thanks to modders....


who modify a commercial game that wouldn't exist if the company who made it wasn't having revenue to pay the people who do the hard stuff.

You are not even making good points here, you do the same fallacy other people here make in terms of "nO mOrE fOcUs TrEeS, fIx ThE aI!!1!", But in reverse.
Because apparently PDX could churn out dozens of focus trees in a month, perfectly functional, but they just choose not to, to...grab money, I guess.

Well, maybe it's because they need to pay people. Modding is cool and I am thankful for every good mod in any game, but I don't expect games to be created for nothing, like you do.
I mean, criticize money grabbing all you want, but every dime of revenue PDX makes is a good reason for them to continue supporting hoi4.

so, go play Minecraft, you are in the ignore zone now.
I cannot stand your tone.
 
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Woo, DDs are back :D Cheers for the DD Buzz (and congratulations on getting on the team - very cool indeed - and also am glad to see an Australian in the mix :cool: ), the work getting the DD up Podcat (it sounded like a lot of 'fun'!) and the extra info Archangel/Cranium Muppet :)

And content packs sound good with me - if they're a good way of optimising team resources to maximise output, then go for it :) And pay no heed to the people suggesting that focus trees are done on the back of an envelope for no effort after dinner before sitting down to watch the latest thing on one's streaming service of choice - I've modded enough to know that quality focus trees take serious time, effort and testing, and the work that's gone into this one is very much appreciated :)

If you make us Content Designers work on the AI code I assure you that the number of problems will not go down.

But think of the potential memes! Surely that has to be a PDX KPI by now? (Joking, of course :) )

Professor Michael Wailbel's paper Echoes of History: The International Financial Commission in Greece. It wasn't my only source, but it was the most prolific in its contributions to my designs.

Love the effort put into the research (as evidenced by plenty else in the tree as well) - much respect :)

The same applies to Greece’s navy and air force, but with the right sponsor who’s to say Greece couldn’t put one of its decommissioned battleships back into action?

From memory these two ships were in pretty poor shape by 1936 - I'm going from memory, but I think the engines of one of them were barely functional - and even if they had been brand new, they'd have been woefully obsolete, and very expensive to run for the capability they provided - if the resources were available, they may well have been better off ordering a modern ship that'd provide a better return. That said, I'm not suggesting it's wrong if any of the NF's put them back into action (and for all I know, maybe the Gov't had plans to that effect?) - in terms of a short-run stopgap, a couple of clunky pre-dreadnoughts are better than nothing :)

For a naval pic though, I'm going with Georgios Averof - a similarly dated ship that was at least in somewhat better shape - here's a shot of her off Bombay in 1941.

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So before jumping into the new Greek focus tree, I just would like to comment on the "Country Pack" format coming back, I find it hilarious too that TfV wasn't mentioned, and while I'm not opposed to the idea, I'm hoping the execution goes much better then it did in the first 2 Country Packs. But not only do I hope the content is higher quality, personally in my opinion every tree in TfV and DoD has aged very poorly, some passable, such as Czechoslovakia and New Zealand, but ones like Canada, Hungary, Romania, Yugoslavia, South Africa, Australia and India have some major issues. Anyway, when I say higher quality I just mean better planned out trees, that work with many mechanics and not just the DLC it's paired into, but previous ones too. That's one big issue with me for many focus trees in DLC is they seem to ignore old mechanics and focus purely on newly introduced mechanics and it just makes the trees have some big issues.

Now onto the main subject, Greece, going from right to left like the DD

Starting with the Greek military tree, looks decent, I do think 2-3 more focuses for the army and navy would be nice to see, just something to do if they survive longer or maybe even join the Axis or different faction then historical that allows them to not be crushed so swiftly. Air force having a tiny tree isn't horrible in my opinion since quite frankly when I think of Greece I think of army and navy, with a small elite air force, so just a few focuses makes sense to me. The problem with such tiny branches and then adding exclusivity, which I'm a fan of, is that a tiny tree becomes even smaller, so really the army only has 6 focuses, the navy 6 and air force 5, not the total 9, 9 and 8 that we see overall. Perhaps some land and naval forts, some air bases and some lend-lease and license options would be appreciated.

Next up we have the industry tree, as someone who isn't well versed in the history of Greece during the buildup to the war and during, it looks decent to me and I don't have any big issues. And while I previously said I like exclusive options in trees, I think there's too many in the industry tree. So maybe you make the last 3 exclusives not exclusive but personally that feels a little too strong so maybe just add 1-2 focuses that are generic industry boosts, regardless of them going Utilize Our Strengths or Force the Farmers into Factories. But overall, looks mostly solid for a minor and fairly interesting consider the Greek situation on debt, a very interesting mechanic and situation I wish we could see more countries in. (Can't wait for the people who only want war mechanics to rage at having to manage a country)

Now lastly we have the political tree and oh boy, I see some issues

Starting with the historical path of Metaxas, I guess it's fine for a historical run where they don't last long, however what really disappoints me is the fact they have nothing for after occupation. A whole mechanic was made for governments-in-exile and then you make nothing, and it's not like Greece can really run away to anywhere. One might argue Crete and while true, there doesn't seem to be much about holding onto Crete and biding your time in the hopes of a future return. Nothing about the clash between communist/socialist, republican/liberals and fascist/monarchist groups that culminated to the Greek Civil War (something missing from the game and it appears will continue to be missing).

Regarding the optional path to embrace fascism completely, it also seems lacking in options to form a faction in the Balkans, nothing about partitioning Turkey (it looks like the focus Last Country Standing is a wargoal against Turkey but my guess is it's a generic "Annex Turkey" wargoal and not something interesting with taking over large parts of Turkey, beyond the Megali Idea, and perhaps liberating parts of Kurdistan and Armenia and setting up friendly regimes as puppets and having the choice between annexing what's left of Turkey or keeping them as a puppet in Central Anatolia.

I would talk about the monarchist path but.... it doesn't seem to exist so.... (Note for those who want to say "Umm actually it does exist, you're just blind", yes it does exist, but it's just the historical Metaxas tree but you have a king instead of dictator and you have the option to ally Germany (if they go monarchist I'm assuming).

Communist path seems decent, some more focuses for the Stalin path would be nice, perhaps the Soviets send some support to Greece after proving their loyalty or something like that, just seems like you turn communist, buddy with Moscow then invade Turkey and you're supposed to just annex them. Where's the option of liberating the oppressed workers that Turkey has prosecuted under the capitalist system (where's the puppets) why can't they take on Bulgaria and Yugoslavia, why not puppet Albania and retake Northern Epirus, lots of options here. The Balkan path seems to be better, but suffers the same problem but with a little more, you get the war on Bulgaria, no option of supporting Tito (which is questionable to have listed here) but at a cost of North Macedonia. Just kind of has that generic "go take this over, nothing unique or special will happen, just literally annex everything because that makes logical sense".

Lastly we have the democratic path, which I will say, is a bold take, while I'm aware about Venizelos being quite an advocate for the Megali Idea, not having a more peaceful (at least moderate) optional tree is quite odd to me. While yes true that he wanted more land for Greece, realistically speaking if Greece went on a rampage and took over land they would most likely be seen as a war hungry nation by the Allies, it doesn't matter if you're democratic, you're still a warmongering nation, many members of the Axis weren't actually fascist, examples are Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria and I guess Finland (who never officially signed into it but effectively were Axis). But I do think it would be an interesting dilemma for a democratic Greek player to have the option of going war like and joining the Axis or going their own path or having a moderate path where they join the Allies, you could also give them the option to go their own path I suppose, maybe instead of annexing vast areas of land they set up a puppet government, or more, and they work together in a Hellas faction while the player remains Greece. I will say I very much like the name change to Hellas if you conquer parts of Turkey, especially since if Greece crosses the Aegan then Greece would only apply to the European part of Hellas so I really like that small but flavourful change.

I will get this out of the way, I hate the idea of Byzantium being a thing but it was before this expansion so I can't blame the tree too much for it but it still bugs me. Byzantium was dead, Venizelos, from my understanding, had no interest in restoring the full old dead empire, so I believe it's overboard for the democratic path to get this, I could maybe see the fascists getting a choice between focusing on the Byzantium Empire or being a proper Greek Empire, instead of the crappy fake Romans that Byzantium was.

I do hope that Greece has ways to take over, in every path, Northern Epirus, Northern Macedonia, Northern Thracia, Cyprus, Dodecanese and Ionia (at least the western coast of Anatolia). Things like Pontus, Kurdistan, Armenia being liberated should be more ideology exclusive, I think there should be more stuff with cooperation or wars in the Balkans, such as annexing/puppeting Albania, breaking up Yugoslavia, maybe you could even add some stuff where you cooperate with Romania since Greece and them would be the 2 big non-Slavic powers in the Balkans (yes I know Albania isn't Slavic, that's why I said big powers), perhaps splitting the region into their own spheres of influence where the 2 dictators of Romania and Greece partition the region as such, Greece gets Southern Bulgaria, Albania and Southern Yugoslavia and Romania pushes into Northern Bulgaria and the rest of Yugoslavia and in return for Romania getting more land they have to aid Greece in the war against Turkey, since Greece would get that land it sort of balances out. Just things like that, unique storylines for the alternate history paths seem to be missing and it's quite a shame. Just something like a Metaxas and Antonescu dictator alliance came to my head in minutes and is quite fascinating. Both of them Prime Ministers who assume dictatorial powers while under a king and they sort of share similarities but also start in different situations, one is trying to keep and expand their Greater Romania while the other is trying to finally beat their demon and form their own Greater Greece/Hellas.

A lot of the new mechanics and spirits seem interesting and I hope more countries get them in the future *PTSD flashback to American House and Senate system being available to no one else*. And the map changes, that we see in the faction map, seem nice, it looks like Northern Epirus is finally a thing and that Bulgaria is getting more states, both badly needed map updates in my opinion. I think there's a new state in Yugoslavia but I haven't looked at the state map of the country for a while so I don't know. Was hoping for a couple state reworks for Turkey but it seems to be the same, disappointing to me, can't deny.

Overall I think it's a decent tree just could use some tweaking in certain areas, compared to other minors, who die much sooner then Greece it does feel like the tree is a bit smaller then it should be but should still be fairly enjoyable compared to generic tree. Also wondering, since it was said Country Packs will be 3-4 countries, how many are in this DLC, with Greece being a country it seems obvious that Bulgaria and Turkey will also get a tree. The big question is if Albania gets one too, honestly don't care if they do or don't, to me it would be a meme tree considering how short lived they are in-game and that resisting Italy is quite a challenge, and if they don't get one, well it's not the end of the world. I am sad that Italy is going to have to wait until, most likely by my guess, 2022 to have a new tree since it was basically confirmed they won't be in this one and we all know the Soviet DLC is going to take a while and since Country Packs will only be affecting minors, while Italy is a major (though I would heavily debate that). F in the chat for the Spaghetti leader himself, Il Duce.
 
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This is an excellent point. People gush over the Kaiserreich ideologies and often propose those as a solution to this problem, but ultimately, they all function exactly the same and there are no mechanical differences between them. Being a Totalist or a Market Liberal affects your alliance and obviously the nature of your country from a flavor perspective, but the game itself doesn't change. How would you alter the current ideology system to fit your concerns?

It it were up to me, I would go with a seven ideology system: The former Democratic ideology is split between Conservatism and Liberalism, the former Non-aligned ideology would become Absolutists, Authoritarian Republicans, and Anarchists, while Fascism and Communism would remain undivided.
  • The differences between the two democratic ideologies would be on a nation-to-nation basis (elections would become more important and national focuses/decisions could reflect the differing policies of the ruling party) but they would cooperate with each other to preserve democracy across the world much like they already do.
  • Absolutists and Authoritarian Republicans would not necessarily cooperate with each other as non-aligned nations do nowadays (Pakistan joining the Międzymorze and Finland joining Afghanistan's faction are both pretty wacky).
  • Anarchism would be exclusive to countries that had major anarchist movements (the only one I can think of is Spain), but those nations could perhaps start anarchist uprisings in other countries.
  • Fascism would remain pretty much as it currently operates.
  • You could divide communism into Stalinism and Trotskyism camps, but I think this wouldn't be necessary as there were few communist countries at all in this era and most of them were authoritarian like Stalin's Soviet Union. Rather, if Trotsky took power, he could get special traits/focus tree to accurately reflect Trotskyism.
Instead of Absolutists and Authoritarian Republicans, call them Autocrats and Authoritarian Democrats and it's fine. That way you can cover more regime types and set clear which is more opressive: Autocrats doesn't necessarily mean monarchy, it could be a military dictatorhsip like Franco, and AuthDem can include semi-constitutional monarchies and soft dictatorships.

And Democratic ideology should be split in at least three: Conservatism, Liberalism and Social Democracy.

It's simple, don't invent the wheel, most mods use the same ideology pattern because it works.
 
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Apart from Greece, I can only think of Turkey and Bulgaria to be in the country pack as well, which is rather less. As TfV has 5 and DoD has 4 nations. What else am I missing? Italy is out of question, I can't see Albania getting one to be honest? Maybe Egypt or Iraq? Or even a retouch of Yugoslavia and Romania?
 
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"Greed" is a phenomenon that is essentially good in capitalism. PDX is a public corporation. Their task is to make profit for shareholders.
Whatever your problem with the business model is: as long as they are making green, they won't hear you out.

It's not like it's been turned around either. People just found out that sound business practices make better ROI over time.

Are you saying that you just found out - or that Paradox hasn't found out? If the latter, that's a pretty bold statement to leverage at a Swedish company, an equity market which is notoriously stakeholder focused and less shareholder focused.
 
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