Stellaris Dev Diary #106: 2.0.2 patch notes and the Road Ahead for Cherryh | Page 30

GAGA Extrem · Mar 2, 2018

ShoGuL said:
By the way, not sure if it has been mentioned but this patch is a huge buff to pacifists.

Fanatic pacifist now gets +10% yields from all mining and research bases from day 1. That's massive!

Does it? After all the back and forth regarding offworld deposits in the past, I don't even know what is going on or intended in that regard.

Also: It's even better than that - it's a multiplicative bonus, so it also applies to all your other yield modifiers.

That means late game it's easily worth 15-20% of extra yields.

terrycloth · Mar 2, 2018

Admiral_Obvious said:
It's only for Hiveminds I think.

It looks like the accidentally made it the tooltip say that for anyone who gets adaptability (or anyone in general?) but since it was just a rename in the first place I assume it still works. I should double-check.

Astax · Mar 2, 2018

Missing from patch: Increased possible max leader level from 10 to 20

terrycloth · Mar 2, 2018

Snoipah said:
Isn't. . . isn't the idea of infinity wars is wars that never end?

In Stellaris, that's modeled by rivaling someone and having a bunch of short wars 10 years apart. If you actually stay at war in game terms then one side or the other wins too quickly.

Saryn · Mar 2, 2018

In contrast to the growing faction speaking out against the energy upkeep for outpost stations. I would like to say that I really like this decision. It adds a sense of meaningful economy to the game. An empire that cannot support more outpost stations with its planets will need to find a way to adapt and improve the territory it already has in order to make that a possibility.
It creates a cycle of expand - improve - expand - improve that feels very realistic to me. In my games of 2.0 I was neglecting to even colonize planets in my territory because of how much easier it was to generate resources by just spamming outposts. And a single planet cannot realistically support that sort of galactic-scale network of stations.

Ways to improve include building habitats, researching terraforming, migrating other species into your empire (forcefully or peacefully), or adapting your species to new world types. Then you use those new planets to improve your station as a galactic power and open up the door to expanding further. I mean seriously - should an empire with 1 planet be able to hold the same amount of space (and defend it) as an empire with 20? That just goes against sci-fi. Playing "wide" should require at least some development of what you've claimed, else the whole game really does become an arena of snowballs.

In short, I think Stellaris players are the very ambitious sort.

Keep up the good work, dev team. And thank you for delivering this patch so soon. As a programmer myself I know how chaotic bug reports can be.

Toppopia · Mar 2, 2018

Leovinas said:
Been playing a few minor games to get the hang of Apocalypse.

One thing that slightly ruined my latest one was that I had the Enigmatic Fortress a few systems away from my homeworld - no big problem, except that it wiped my entire fleet when it auto-navigated home from across the map - right through the Fortress.

Some kind of pathfinding tweak might be in order so that fleets don't do something patently suicidal like auto-navigating through a Leviathan. The first I knew something was up was the 'combat' alert followed about half a second later by the 'fleet lost' alert. Either a pathfinding tweak so they don't blunder into a known Leviathan, or the ability to toggle certain systems as off-limits unless I give a very specific instruction to go there, might be in order.

Actually, come to think of it, the ability to plant a warning beacon or something on the edge of a system would be really cool, particularly if a player came across an alien or historical one in an otherwise suspiciously-deserted system.

When you go into the system view theres a button near the bottom left you can click which means all fleets ignore the system and won't travel through it no matter what. Even if you manually click on it.

terrycloth · Mar 2, 2018

Sakkura said:
You get FTL inhibitors on Starbases.

Starbases pop instantly. There's no time for someone to come reinforce.

terrycloth · Mar 2, 2018

Leovinas said:
Been playing a few minor games to get the hang of Apocalypse.

One thing that slightly ruined my latest one was that I had the Enigmatic Fortress a few systems away from my homeworld - no big problem, except that it wiped my entire fleet when it auto-navigated home from across the map - right through the Fortress.

Some kind of pathfinding tweak might be in order so that fleets don't do something patently suicidal like auto-navigating through a Leviathan. The first I knew something was up was the 'combat' alert followed about half a second later by the 'fleet lost' alert. Either a pathfinding tweak so they don't blunder into a known Leviathan, or the ability to toggle certain systems as off-limits unless I give a very specific instruction to go there, might be in order.

Actually, come to think of it, the ability to plant a warning beacon or something on the edge of a system would be really cool, particularly if a player came across an alien or historical one in an otherwise suspiciously-deserted system.

You have to manually restrict systems now, but there's a button to do it at the bottom in the system view.

Peerless Girl · Mar 2, 2018

I haven't tested this yet (going to finish up my running games before opting in). But I'm feeling like no W/E on occupation may be a bit busted (unless it's simply calculating or affecting the war in a different way). I can attest to the energy upkeep for Starbases is going to make a mess of early-game economy. It's already a facet that half my starbases have to be max-filled trading hubs/offworld trading company even WITH the Corporate Dominion ethic, and that's not counting taking out a fleet or two, when I always go negative, even with full prosperity tree. This may end up making a huge mess, and is the primary reason I'm not updating to it in my running games.

I feel like 0.5 might've been ok, but 1 is way too much, but we'll see.

Nox Eterna · Mar 2, 2018

Saryn said:
They're likely focused on non-expansion content bug fixes first.

Indeed, but arguably some titan "features" could fall under the "bug" category. I am talking about its tendency to sometimes rush ahead into the melee and the fact that the titan lance is not considered to be under a weapon type (so it doesn't benefit from any strategic resources or repeatable tech, you also cannot see it in after-combat log accuracy charts). Considering they are one of the core features of the expansion, it would've been nice to hear something like "We are also looking into the current titan performance..." I am guessing it is a low priority for the team at the moment, and that is understandable though.

ius · Mar 2, 2018

Leovinas said:
Some kind of pathfinding tweak might be in order so that fleets don't do something patently suicidal like auto-navigating through a Leviathan.

Actually, come to think of it, the ability to plant a warning beacon or something on the edge of a system would be really cool, particularly if a player came across an alien or historical one in an otherwise suspiciously-deserted system.

You can now click on a system and toggle a button to prevent your ships of moving through it.

I also would like a way to bookmark interesting systems. Just like the stars in CK2 and EU4.

doomwarrior · Mar 2, 2018

I think corvettes are a little OP right now. I did some battle tests on naked corvettes and bad ass level 5 ones...matched them up with bigger ships and whenever they lost i tried to counter their counter and so on. I ended up using torpedo + stormfire corvettes with tons of targetting. The only ship so far i found to beat that was 1 configuration of destroyers (though i didnt do all possible combinations, there are potentially more). However under the assumption that big weapons are a no go against corvettes, the options are indeed very limited. It also seems like fighters no longer target rockets or torpedos...which makes carriers sitting ducks.

So here is why Corvettes are super super strong right now:

Fastest game in the ship
Lots of firepower for a small ship with high end rockets/torpedos an if you balance the weakness of the torpedo with another weapon quite omnipotent
Hits nearly every ship nearly always
Is so fast, its a good firefighter if something happens
Is built extremely fast
Doesnt even get close to die as fast as it can be replaced
Cheap and energy can actually stay at level 5 even if you have a higher level generator...still maxing out effectiveness
Considerable amount of bang per buck doesnt feel in line with other ship types

This makes the corvettte the current backbone as you get speed, nearly always on top in most configurations the only enemy is a small weapon/pd destroyer and potentially some other small weapon configs of the same type. You do lose a considerable amount still which can drive up warscore a bit faster but if the enemy does not manage to save his bigger ships, who cares...

FleetingRain · Mar 2, 2018

GAGA Extrem said:
Does it? After all the back and forth regarding offworld deposits in the past, I don't even know what is going on or intended in that regard.

Also: It's even better than that - it's a multiplicative bonus, so it also applies to all your other yield modifiers.
That means late game it's easily worth 15-20% of extra yields.

* Space stations now use the country_mult modifier instead of the tile_mult modifier and no longer get the tile_add modifier

I guess it's WAD, considering the pop resource production bonus might be a country modifier. Seems counterintuitive though.

ShoGuL · Mar 2, 2018

FRagganoia said:
I think corvettes are a little OP right now. I did some battle tests on naked corvettes and bad ass level 5 ones...matched them up with bigger ships and whenever they lost i tried to counter their counter and so on. I ended up using torpedo + stormfire corvettes with tons of targetting. The only ship so far i found to beat that was 1 configuration of destroyers (though i didnt do all possible combinations, there are potentially more). However under the assumption that big weapons are a no go against corvettes, the options are indeed very limited. It also seems like fighters no longer target rockets or torpedos...which makes carriers sitting ducks.

So here is why Corvettes are super super strong right now:

Fastest game in the ship

Lots of firepower for a small ship with high end rockets/torpedos an if you balance the weakness of the torpedo with another weapon quite omnipotent

Hits nearly every ship nearly always

Is so fast, its a good firefighter if something happens

Is built extremely fast

Doesnt even get close to die as fast as it can be replaced

Cheap and energy can actually stay at level 5 even if you have a higher level generator...still maxing out effectiveness

Considerable amount of bang per buck doesnt feel in line with other ship types

This makes the corvettte the current backbone as you get speed, nearly always on top in most configurations the only enemy is a small weapon/pd destroyer and potentially some other small weapon configs of the same type. You do lose a considerable amount still which can drive up warscore a bit faster but if the enemy does not manage to save his bigger ships, who cares...

Hm.. I have had quite high attrition when using corvettes - they usually win the battle, but a lot of them die. I haven't done extensive tests, but I tend to default to battleships with Giga cannon and then rest neutron launchers (maybe one or two slots kin. arty)

With t3 line computers and aux firing slots, they even hit corvettes pretty well. The alpha strike is devastating and if outnumbered, once the enemy closes after a couple of volleys, you can retreat and save most of your ships.

Acetabularia] · Mar 2, 2018

Solid changes, looking forward to playing this, but...

Jamor said:
* Transcendent Learning ascension perk has been added to the game, and it increases leader level cap and empire leader cap

* Aristocratic Elite civic now gives +2 leader cap and +2 governor max level instead of +4 leader cap and -50% leader recruitment cost
* Distinguished Admiralty civic increases leader cap by +2

HNNNG, where am I supposed to efficiently get my extra leader cap from now?

RyanDA · Mar 2, 2018

FRagganoia said:
I think corvettes are a little OP right now. I did some battle tests on naked corvettes and bad ass level 5 ones...matched them up with bigger ships and whenever they lost i tried to counter their counter and so on. I ended up using torpedo + stormfire corvettes with tons of targetting. The only ship so far i found to beat that was 1 configuration of destroyers (though i didnt do all possible combinations, there are potentially more). However under the assumption that big weapons are a no go against corvettes, the options are indeed very limited. It also seems like fighters no longer target rockets or torpedos...which makes carriers sitting ducks.

So here is why Corvettes are super super strong right now:

Fastest game in the ship

Lots of firepower for a small ship with high end rockets/torpedos an if you balance the weakness of the torpedo with another weapon quite omnipotent

Hits nearly every ship nearly always

Is so fast, its a good firefighter if something happens

Is built extremely fast

Doesnt even get close to die as fast as it can be replaced

Cheap and energy can actually stay at level 5 even if you have a higher level generator...still maxing out effectiveness

Considerable amount of bang per buck doesnt feel in line with other ship types

This makes the corvettte the current backbone as you get speed, nearly always on top in most configurations the only enemy is a small weapon/pd destroyer and potentially some other small weapon configs of the same type. You do lose a considerable amount still which can drive up warscore a bit faster but if the enemy does not manage to save his bigger ships, who cares...

Agree completely, it's gotten to the point where i don't even bother building ships that aren;t corvettes. Torp/Disrupter vettes are just absolutely nasty.

Nictis · Mar 2, 2018

hashinshin said:
TRADITION_COST_MULT_NUM_SYSTEMS = 0.01 # Each System adds +X% Tradition cost

That's in their defines.

Well, I'm looking at the numbers and that's not right.

Matt516 said:
Yeah, that's because it's now bugged to ignore the colony penalty entirely while doubling the defined system penalty. So we're currently playing with a 0% colony and 2% system penalty. There's a bug report here:
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...colonies-2-for-systems.1074367/#post-23887470

Ah, thanks for pointing that out.

RyanDA · Mar 2, 2018

Nictis said:
Well, I'm looking at the numbers and that's not right.

Ah, thanks for pointing that out.

I actually went to the define and played around with it, the game is doubling whatever the define is. if you put 0.00 as the define, you get 0% unity penalty per system, if you put 0.005 you get 1%. if you put 0.03 you get 6%.

Currently on the 2.0.2 patch if you dont change the define and now that traditions are 100 base unity, this makes playing life seeded completely impossible.

Spartan322 · Mar 2, 2018

kpipersburg said:
If you don't have an empire that is too sprawling you can set up those hyperlane speed up modules as a highway system through your empire .

That's very ineffective for actually doing anything, its not made well for anything other then a friendly combat buff as far as I've seen (and I don't believe the AI weights those systems any better so it never cares either) and you waste starbase capacity when every system in between doesn't carry any advantage you use starbases for other then being an intermediate point of your empire, I want to be able to build highway hyperlanes or something of the like in the mid game at least because I can't have gateways and every starbase is still too essential to waste it on such an insignificant boost like that, might as well just stick to corvette spam, it be way more efficient.

Earmuffs · Mar 2, 2018

So, I'm a little slow to the party. I just played 2.0 for the first time last night and holy heck what a change. I come to just give my 4 cents for what it's worth.

So basically, I love the change. I think Stellaris was the weaker of the main Paradox grand strategy games. I couldn't really put my finger on it, it just wasn't as fun as EU4 or CK2 or HoI4. I liked it, don't get me wrong but basically it's the only Paradox strategy game I don't have hundreds upon hundreds of hours put into. (72 to be exact).
I think these changes will change that. Making this more "province based" (for lack of better word I guess) like the other games I feel is fantastic. It feels so much better to play.
I guess, less like a RTS like say Age of Empires and more GRAND strategy like EU4 or the others which is what I love. I kinda have to say screw you Paradox because I didn't get to sleep until 4am last night.

So yea, kinda cheesy but just wanted to say thanks to Paradox for always and continuously updating their games and for this massive change that's really elevated this game IMO.

Per Ardua Ad Astra

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