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Stellaris Dev Diary #142 - Sectors

Hello everyone!

Today we’re back with a dev diary and we want to take the opportunity to be more open with how we will attempt to tackle one of our more difficult systems – the sector system. The sector system was originally added to help players manage their planets, so that you would not need to micromanage everything once your empire gets large. We’ve often felt sectors are in a bit of an awkward place between different playstyles and what they actually should do for the player. Sectors have gone through a couple of different iterations, but never felt quite right.

I will start by outlining some of the goals with the (new) system and problems with the old one. This probably doesn’t include every concern for every player who ever used sectors, but it should cover some of the larger things. If you have something to add, we certainly want to hear about it!

The goal
  • Sectors should help to alleviate the player’s need to micromanage everything
  • Sectors should feel like a more unique part of the player’s empire
Problems
  • Sector geography can feel wrong
  • There are too many sectors in late-game
  • Wars and rebellions can mess up sectors
  • Player has to micro the sector economy
  • No manual control of sector area
  • Sectors don’t manage space stations
  • No “sector capitals”
I CANNOT PROMISE THAT ALL THESE CHANGES WILL HAPPEN, OR THAT THEY WILL APPEAR IN THE SAME UPDATE.

Sector types

The Core sector will be the sector that is formed around your homeworld and any system within range. A regular sector is formed around a Sector Capital, which you will be able to assign. It will also include all systems within range. Any system or planet not within a sector will be considered to belong to “Frontier Space”.

We are looking into also having different sector types, or sector policies, in which you could have different settings for sectors. Potentially, a sector could perhaps adjust its range in inverse relation to something else, like Administrative Capacity. Occupation Zones might also be a valid sector type, to make it easier to manage conquered territory.

Sector range simply means all systems within X jumps from the sector capital.

Sector budget
Players will have the ability to give resources to a shared sector pool, both as one-off grants and as monthly subsidies. This will convert minerals/energy into a sector budget, like it currently does. The new thing being automated monthly subsidies and a shared pool. It will still be possible to give a specific sector grants. Sectors will first attempt to use resources from its own pool, then from the shared pool.

Players will also be able to set planet automation to on/off. Planets in sectors will have automation turned On by default. This means you should be able to turn off automation for a specific planet in your sector, which you may sometimes want to do.

Sectors can have a sector focus, similar to how they do now in 2.2. The automatic control of planets should take sector focus and planet designation in consideration.

Sector geography
The current plan is to have systems be automatically added to a sector within range. If a system could belong to two different sectors, it should be possible to nudge them to decide which sector they belong to. This important for players being able to set a sector geography that looks good to them in their game.

Moving sector capital will also redraw the sector, and could potentially remove or add new systems to it. You cannot add systems to a sector if they are outside its range. Systems must also maintain cohesion to a sector, so it's not possible to cut off parts of a sector.

Planet designations
We really like the planet designations, i.e. “Mining World, Agri World, Forge World”, but we also want the player to have more control over them. We want to add the ability to manually set a planet designation, in addition to the automatic setting. If you designate a planet to be a Mining World, it should perhaps also be quicker to build mining districts there. It should generally feel cooler to colonize a world, and based on its features, immediately be able to decide it should be an Agri World – and designate it accordingly!

We also hope this will make it easier for the AI to specialize their planets a bit more in certain cases.

Governors
Although governors will remain mostly the same as to how they are now, we will try to remake the governor traits to be a bit more generic and applicable to a sector as a whole, as opposed to being so planet-specific with their bonuses.

Space stations
We have discussed adding an auto-build function for construction ships, similar to auto-explore, which should hopefully solve this problem better.

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I CANNOT PROMISE THAT ALL THESE CHANGES WILL HAPPEN, OR THAT THEY WILL APPEAR IN THE SAME UPDATE.

Our goal is to be able to able to get as much of this done by the next update as possible, but I cannot promise what will get in when. This sector rework is fairly ambitious, so it might be deployed in sections over a few updates. I very much like the design though, and I think it's a good foundation to build upon.

Since the launch of 2.2 we've been a little quiet, with a focus on extensive post-launch support. Going forward however, I'd like to increase our interactions with you, our community. While we want to have a more open communication, we want to avoid over promising or disappointing you if ideas change radically.

This is also a good chance for you affect this great game, so I hope an open discussion will lead to some constructive exchanges.
 
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Could not ageee more. I would much rather be able to group planents by specilisation then geography.

Prehaps we can have 'ministers' which control how types of worlds develop. These ministres could then be expanded to fall under control of a faction. Giving bounese or penilties.

So there would be one for each resource type

Ministry of extraction (minerials)
Ministry of agriculture (food)
Ministry of energy (energy)
Ministry for entertainment (amenities and unity)
Ministry for industry (consumer goods and unique)
Ministry for war (alloys)
Ministry for sceience (sceience)
This!
If we can already set a planet to develope according to a specific plan (Agri-World etc.) setting a development focus for sectors becomes completely superfluous. Sectors don't need a budged, a Ministry does.
Sectors would be far more interesting as political enitites instead of economic ones. Frontier Territory, Occupation Zones, Core Sectors, Holy Lands, Pirate Havens etc. might be cool for a future Diplomacy-DLC, but it should not determine a building focus.
 
Didn't read all the answers so sorry if something is double

I hope that sectors will have some more internal power compared to factions or even interact with them
Sectors should also create some dynamic missions or goals for the player ... which in return should give them benefits

Also would like to see different amount of freedom based on government... in democratics each sector should also have a vote or even candidate with a lot of own rules.. in monarchies they should be dukes and barons and in corporations they could act as subsidiaries etc
All with different mechanics and benefits

And i still hope that they we get some autonomic warfleets to pursuit pirates and other fleets or defend a sector
 
Players will also be able to set planet automation to on/off. Planets in sectors will have automation turned On by default. This means you should be able to turn off automation for a specific planet in your sector, which you may sometimes want to do.

I'd like to see a "Future Planning" system put in place, where you can pre-plan a number of buildings/districts for a planet and the sector AI will build them, in order, when the resources/slots become available.

For example, I newly colonize a planet and I immediately set the first two buildings to be a gene clinic and a cloning facility. The population is still at 2, but as soon as it hits 5 it builds the gene clinic automatically.

I don't want the AI to decide what to build... basically ever. I'd rather the AI function as an underling who follows my instructions to the letter and doesn't try to get creative with it.
 
I'd like to see a "Future Planning" system put in place, where you can pre-plan a number of buildings/districts for a planet and the sector AI will build them, in order, when the resources/slots become available.

For example, I newly colonize a planet and I immediately set the first two buildings to be a gene clinic and a cloning facility. The population is still at 2, but as soon as it hits 5 it builds the gene clinic automatically.

I don't want the AI to decide what to build... basically ever. I'd rather the AI function as an underling who follows my instructions to the letter and doesn't try to get creative with it.

My thoughts exactly. An AI is always going to produce unsatisfactory results simply because every player has their own ideas on how planets should be built. Making a competent AI is also difficult. So just give us some way to plan the development of a planet and the role of the AI is just to realize that plan, without making autonomous decisions. This should be able to eliminate much of the tedious micromanagement and that's good enough for me.
 
Sector improvements?
ready.jpg
 
Please don't stop at purely economic sectors.
Please don't add more boring mechanics/buildings.

The sector system could be used to make empires more unique. Some ideas:
- Monastic Sector - buildable by spiritualists. Focus on stability, low pop growth, has access to unique buildings with a very competitive production/employment ratio. Great to limit your empire population while still producing goods.
- Noble House - available to imperialists. Each sector is de facto under the control of a noble family. You can't control directly who's the governor. You also need to make sure your noble houses don't become too powerful. Each noble house is represented by a faction. Unique events for competition between noble house, attempts to steal the throne... Internal politics. Those sectors are more independant (they provide less ressources) but maintain their own fleets.
- Crusader State - available to militarist/spiritualist when they conquer new worlds. Those new worlds are put within this special sector type which has a great boost towards spiritualist attraction and defensive bonus (like some sort of permanent martial law). They build their own fortresses. However they form a new faction that will become angrier and angrier if you don't go to war against heretics, or if engage in positive relations with them.
- Subcorp - Available to Megacorporations. Sectors that can produce a unique ressource (access to a unique building), providing either general bonus or gameplat-changing things, such as new weapons.
etc etc

There's a lot of potential to expand the sector system, please do something meaningful with them.
 
Please don't stop at purely economic sectors.
Please don't add more boring mechanics/buildings.

The sector system could be used to make empires more unique. Some ideas:
- Monastic Sector - buildable by spiritualists. Focus on stability, low pop growth, has access to unique buildings with a very competitive production/employment ratio. Great to limit your empire population while still producing goods.
- Noble House - available to imperialists. Each sector is de facto under the control of a noble family. You can't control directly who's the governor. You also need to make sure your noble houses don't become too powerful. Each noble house is represented by a faction. Unique events for competition between noble house, attempts to steal the throne... Internal politics. Those sectors are more independant (they provide less ressources) but maintain their own fleets.
- Crusader State - available to militarist/spiritualist when they conquer new worlds. Those new worlds are put within this special sector type which has a great boost towards spiritualist attraction and defensive bonus (like some sort of permanent martial law). They build their own fortresses. However they form a new faction that will become angrier and angrier if you don't go to war against heretics, or if engage in positive relations with them.
- Subcorp - Available to Megacorporations. Sectors that can produce a unique ressource (access to a unique building), providing either general bonus or gameplat-changing things, such as new weapons.
etc etc

There's a lot of potential to expand the sector system, please do something meaningful with them.

This is a great idea. Building sectors around their narrative role would be terrific
 
4 months since release:
Sectors botched + AI not able to handle economy -> micro management nightmare at mid game.
Manual migration -> micro management hell.

Just my opinion but those 2 things were working before and since Le Guin was advertised as better performing and easier for the AI to handle (2 big cases of false advertising by the way), then I have lost patience. Those are self inflicted issues by PDS and I'm tired of reading about plans about fixing them instead of downloading said fixes.
 
It is an interesting thought, and something to look into. I'm not sure a "planet template" will be very easy to set up, though, considering how different planets can be. Maybe a small limit to how much a template can include, so it more easily can fit different planets?

This is a good 80/20 solution - most of the fill-in-the-blanks micromanagement for me comes from early buildup, where everything gets some random resource district, then growth-boosting, then a capitol upgrade, and only then the build paths start to diverge to the point where I'm actually making choices instead of following my polished policy.
 
I'd like to see a "Future Planning" system put in place, where you can pre-plan a number of buildings/districts for a planet and the sector AI will build them, in order, when the resources/slots become available.
But this doesn't really work. It's fine for the first part of the game where I have nothing but food, minerals (and alloys and consumer goods), research, and unity. But then I get some possibly rare tech. I might go down that part of the tech tree or I might not. So, I might need motes or exotic gasses or one of the other rare resources.

If my planets don't product the rare commodities, my fleet can't function. That's a serious problem. I may not be able to afford to lose 30-40% in the Market selling something to buy rare resources, themselves marked up 30-40%.

Resource needs change over time, to the point where some buildings/districts needed early may need to be replaced to meet future needs.
 
But this doesn't really work. It's fine for the first part of the game where I have nothing but food, minerals (and alloys and consumer goods), research, and unity. But then I get some possibly rare tech. I might go down that part of the tech tree or I might not. So, I might need motes or exotic gasses or one of the other rare resources.

If my planets don't product the rare commodities, my fleet can't function. That's a serious problem. I may not be able to afford to lose 30-40% in the Market selling something to buy rare resources, themselves marked up 30-40%.

Resource needs change over time, to the point where some buildings/districts needed early may need to be replaced to meet future needs.

Yeah... This is one catch with AI and the new system. I don't think the AI should ever build past the first tier on any planet. Even if it means more micromanagement, I can't see a situation where the computer can ever accurately balance the player's fleet and economic needs re: strategic resources. (Edited)

I mean, that's honestly half the gameplay of the new economic system. If the AI could do that, it would basically be playing the game for you.
 
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I do like the idea of sector types as mentioned

Sector types
The Core sector will be the sector that is formed around your homeworld and any system within range. A regular sector is formed around a Sector Capital, which you will be able to assign. It will also include all systems within range. Any system or planet not within a sector will be considered to belong to “Frontier Space”.

But I do like to make a Suggestion that sector types could be used to represent different steps of autonomy inside the empire, like the "Frontier Space" already mentioned. (Confederal, Federal, Unitary, ...)
Or could be used to give different ethics and civics a unique feel, like calling sectors in empires with the Feudal Society civic Dutche or Fiefdom.
 
Sectors arent the problem what you did to world development is the PROBLEM! Fix that! None of my friends want to play this game anymore because of all the crap micromanagement you hav eto do with worlds now! You used to be able to set up and than forget it and than they would grow or build themselves into. You have made this so difficult and micromanagement intensive that no one wants to play this game anymore! Fix the damn game this used to be one of my favorite games to play with friends and now i have to hold a gun to someone head to play it. The horrible micromanagement has to go!
 
Yeah... This is one catch with AI and the new system. I don't think the AI should ever build past the first tier on any planet. Even if it means more micromanagement, I can't see a situation where the computer can ever accurately balance the player's fleet and economic needs.

I mean, that's honestly half the gameplay of the new economic system. If the AI could do that, it would basically be playing the game for you.
 
Just my opinion, but I don't want to spend half my time fiddling with districts and buildings on dozens or hundreds of planets. And that's not an exaggeration: a few tech breakthroughs can significantly change resource needs. The AI can't be expected to predict the future or know what I'm planning, so if I have to tell the empire, "Increase mote production for these new battleships I'm planning", that's fine. Having to adjust every planet that can produce motes is not fine and not fun. And that is one example of what might happen a dozen times in a game, either from needing a rare resource for a new purpose (see https://stellaris.paradoxwikis.com/Economy ) or just increasing efficiency making basics so I can now produce more science or unity or a bigger fleet or expand faster or something else.

Removing micro leaves more room for more story, in the players' limited attention.
 
I don't care about the game's design moving forward, I never have, I'm but a simple solo roleplayer. What I would like is a focus on making the AI feel more 'alive'. So more diversification of its choices and also fixes to its warmaking capabilities. Both of these issues cause me to lose interest in a game I otherwise thoroughly enjoy.

E.g. If I capture starbases or planets from many different empires, and they were all min-maxed in the same way, that jettisons me right out of the game. Additionally, if a passive player like me wins wars against superior opponents because they never decide what to attack or get stuck bombarding a planet, that also kills a savegame for me.

I understand those are big requests but they're also issues I've had with the game for a very long time. Despite having about 1,400 hours on the game and being well-versed in thriving on the difficulties I play, I can count the times I've maintained interest to the endgame on my hands, and it's always been these same issues that brought me out of the game.

Also, I want to be clear I'll continue playing the game regardless of what the future brings, and I firmly believe the dev team is up to the challenges they face. I wouldn't bother posting otherwise. I love everyone who's worked on this game for the joy it's brought me. Thank you for putting the same care into its development as I do playing it!
 
You're already speaking about changes I was agitated for since release (and current trade system is a system I offered immediatly after release ;)), so let me repeat myself.

1. AI is inherintly worse in implementing player vision then a player himself is, and autonomus sector would be worse then competent human-controlled sector is, because player (ideally) knows what does he want, and AI doesn't. So manual control for planets in sectors should be aviable, otherwise frustration would be far worse then any benefit. (Still, it doesn't mean AI shouldn't be at least decent, but "please improve AI" is a request impossible to fulfull.)

2. Sectors should be political formation as well as "simple" organizational ones, meaning they should have policies of their own, and this policies would definie sector types, giving bonuses and maluses (Mining Expanses is mine minerals better, but has worse social mobility and research production). Changing sector type costs influence (I thing 100 would be enough). Such a organization would mean that it should be possible to organize sectors manually, like it was in older versions. You're designating sector capital and then pointing planets manually there, up to sector range (to prevent "one sector to rule them all").

3. To prevent "everything is a core" modus, planets in frontier space should not be able to upgrade capital buildings and generate criminal (smuggler) jobs per population.

4. Every sector population should have assosiated faction. This faction issues should be non-ideological but political, with demands like "change sectoral policy to better one" or "grant independence".

5. Governor policy should be selectable: appointment / grassroot. Appointment works like it's working now. Grassroot means governors have lesser (far lesser) upkeep and generate automatically for the term at the cost of being unable to change them.

...and here we're came into internal politics rework, so I'm going to stop here.
 
I always thought it would be cool if sectors were treated like the evolution of multiple planet economies into a single sector economy.

For example: if you have 3 planets of size 15 each with enough pops to unlock building slots 4 on the first planet, 6 on the second, and 2 on the third; when combined into a sector you get a single sector management screen (which looks alot like the planet screen) except now the sector is size 45 (15 + 15 + 15) with 12 building slots (4 + 6 + 2) and the number of each district allowed is the sum of all the planets. The major benefit is that as a single economy resources are shared, so only one building slot is needed for a Capitol building, amenities are shared across all planets, only one 15% mineral production bonus building is needed, pops belong to the sector and don't need to be resettled inside of it.

Another way would be to treat sectors the same way as ecumenopolis. The combined planets get better districts to represent an integrated economy. Instead of a farming district giving 2 jobs and 2 housing, a sector has a super-farming district (can't think of a good name) which gives 5 jobs and 5 housing (or more). Then the total number of districts available to the sector doesn't have to be a straight addition of the planet districts, perhaps the number of planet districts divided by 2 or something. Maybe sectors have to be made with influence like ecumenopolis too and can only be formed if there would be three or more planets in it. Everything else is in frontier space and has to be handled planet by planet using the basic districts and without sharing resources (like amenities).

The immediate issues I see though are what about sectors with planets, habitats, and ecumenopolis, what kind and number of districts would a sector get. Also if a sector is broken up by conquest or something what happens?

I really like the idea sectors offering more political immersion with sectors belonging to a political faction or something. But as I think their purpose was orginally to reduce micro that should be the first focus. Or at least the focus of the free update.
 
The immediate issues I see though are what about sectors with planets, habitats, and ecumenopolis, what kind and number of districts would a sector get. Also if a sector is broken up by conquest or something what happens?
Another problem is that planets can have different modifiers for some resourses. Imagine you have 9-sized planet with Rich Minerals and 24-sized planet with 9 possible mining disctricts but with bad mineral modifiers; which should apply to sector output?