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Stellaris Dev Diary #239 - AI++

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Hello and welcome back to another update on the Stellaris AI. This is Guido again. Today I’m here with my fellow human Offe who also enjoys doing organic things. Like generating energy through processing photosynthesised light in the form of matter via ingestion. I like bacon and ice cream. Everybody likes bacon and ice cream. So Offe, please, take it from here.

Hello, it is me, Offe!
I’m a 28 cycles old Human manufactured and operated up here in the north. I’ve worked here at the Arctic office for two years and recently joined the Custodian team as a junior programmer. Guido and I have previously worked on other projects together and he has taught me a lot about game development, but most importantly I learned some tips on how to improve my diplomatic interaction protocols. Where I would often use phrases like “it’s an absolute disaster”, he would instead prefer “This is pretty good, but it can be even better!”. This may prove to be important later on.

I would like to say Thank You to all the people out there who took time playing on the open beta and provided us with feedback and bug reports. If you ever find the AI in a situation where it is doing something strange, please bug report and most importantly attach save games, it helps tremendously! For example, two separate issues were found and addressed with the new job changes.

And lastly, this dev diary will contain older changes and screenshots that were made long before the beta, but also new changes which were not part of the beta, meaning that you still have some new changes waiting for you in the 3.3 release.

Changes to pop job system​

I will start with this change since it will also directly affect players and not only AI!

How it used to work:

Each time something important would happen on a planet, such as a pop is grown, a district/building gets constructed or an upgrade finishes, every single pop would update their desire (also known as weight) to work each job. Then all pops would be unassigned of their jobs, and all of them would be put back on a (potentially) new job.

Now there are some pros and cons with this approach. The good thing is that we are not doing any calculations when we don’t have to, since if nothing changes then we don’t update any of the jobs. However, the downside is that if you have scripted conditional job weights, for example, based on how many amenities there are on a planet, it will cause mass migrations of pops between jobs when the system eventually does update because all pops move at the same time.

In the current 3.2 system the most obvious problem is for hive mind empires where pops will mass move to the maintenance drone job when the planet amenity level is low, and then during the next update, all of them will leave due to having way too many amenities causing a perpetual ping pong effect.

This also affected non hive mind AI empires because in 3.2 the AI would prioritize a job producing a resource during a shortage across all its planets. For example, during an energy credit shortage it would prioritize the technician job on all its planets, causing every single job to be instantly filled. This would likely cause a shortage of some other resource such as minerals, resulting in most types of AI empires to get stuck in a ping pong behaviour once they had entered a resource deficit. This also had the unfortunate side effect of AI starting constructions that were not really needed, but the sudden shift of pop jobs made it appear so.

How it works in 3.3:
- During each monthly update, update the jobs on all planets
- Only remove or add maximum of one pop per job during the update

Many of you are now probably immediately clenching your fist in anger while picturing your poor CPU melting, as scripted calculations based on number of pops in stellaris can be very CPU demanding. But I have some good news for you, first of all in 3.2 there were some redundant calls to the job weight calculation. By removing them where possible, we could already reduce the amount of job weight calculations by about 75%.

Furthermore, we are now reusing job weights between pops that are of the same species and share the same job. Meaning if you have 40 pops working as miners on a planet, and they are all of the same species, the scripted job weight calculation will only be performed once instead of 40 times as in 3.2. This comes with some limitations though, as it is no longer safe to base job weight on individual pop data, such as which faction they are in or their happiness. In the end the vast majority of all job weight calculations were removed while still updating jobs every month.

With the new system it allows you to write a scripted job weight calculation that depends on itself without causing ping pong behaviour. For example, jobs that produce amenities can now base their job weight on the planet’s amenity level, or the enforcer job can now base its job weight on the crime level.

The intention is that you will not notice any difference from the system in 3.2 other than some jobs like enforcers and maintenance drones having a more reasonable amount of pops working that job.
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Jobs for your pops​


In 3.2 AI would look at the number of free jobs on a planet when deciding if it needs to build new jobs. So if there were for example 3 free jobs then the AI would clap its hands together and call it a job well done and move on. At the same time the planet could have huge numbers of unemployed pops rioting on the streets.

This scenario comes from the fact that not all pops can work all jobs, so while there are technically free jobs on the planet, that doesn’t mean that the unemployed pops can actually work those jobs.

In 3.3 we are changing the way that the AI is looking at planets when it is deciding what jobs to create. Instead of looking at the number of free jobs on the planet and then creating more when this number is low, the AI will now look at actual unemployed pops and make sure to create a job that the specific pop is actually able to work.

This solves a variety of issues present in 3.2 where AI doesn’t make good decisions for pops such as slaves or robots, this is something we will continue looking at but it is a big first step in the right direction.

AI scaling economic subplans​


Scaling subplans was something we mentioned earlier as a planned feature for the future, well the future is now so strap yourself in!

In 3.2 we got rid of the old economic plans which had a predefined early/mid/late game strategy and introduced the shared base plan which doesn’t look at what year it is, but rather looks at what state the empire is in.

Now when I first saw Guido’s new economical plans I immediately thought wow this is pretty good, but it can be even better! So I started working on the scaling sub plans which aims to remove all upper limits of production (previously mentioned 500 alloy per month cap in 3.2) but still provide the AI with a responsive plan that adapts to the current state of the AI economy.

How the system works as for 3.3:
The base economic plan is now very small, it sets a minimum target for all types of strictly needed resources such as minerals, energy and food (such as +20 monthly income). Once these targets are met, then a small amount of CGs, alloys and science targets are added.

Once all of the above base plans are satisfied we then enable the scaling sub plan, which is just like any other economic plan except that it will add itself each time it is fulfilled, an unlimited amount of times. The scaling plan contains a small amount of energy/minerals but primarily contains alloys and science. This means that the more mature the AI economy becomes, the focus on base resources becomes smaller and the primary focus will shift to military and science production.

Additionally we have added 3 separate conditional scaling sub plans which we enable for materialist, militarist(and total war empires) and spiritualist empires that add additional science, alloy or unity targets to their economic plan as a first step to making AI economy more distinct from each other.

Grand Admiral hive mind reaching a monthly income of 3k alloys and 22k science in one test run by year 2422. (Screenshot from before the unity rework)

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AI district/building specialization​

One of the big advantages that fellow Humans like you and I have over the AI is that we can easily make long term strategies which are based on assumptions and goals. So we may have a long term strategy to turn a planet that we have not yet colonized into a factory world. As mentioned in answers to the last AI dev diary questions, the economic AI is stateless which means that it has no notion of past nor the future, it only looks at what it has right now and what it can do to satisfy it’s economic plan. This makes it very good at adapting to the situation it is in, it will keep a close eye at the current economic situation and immediately react to any shortages but lack some of the long term planning capabilities that we have.

So how can the AI make specialized worlds without planning for the future? Well one straightforward way of doing it is simply by switching places of districts that we have already built in the past. So if we compare two planets where both of them have 5 mining and 5 energy districts each, we can gradually specialize the planets by replacing the districts one pair at a time until we end up with one planet with 10 energy districts and another with 10 mining districts.

This approach works quite well in practice and is also very dynamic in the sense that it allows the AI to make hybrid planets in the early game which becomes more specialized over time as the empire expands.

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AI consumer goods vs alloy production and planet designations​

In 3.3 we are adding an AI system where the AI will manually pick a planet designation instead of using the default scripted planet designation system which is the same one as the player gets if you do not change it yourself.

The AI system looks at the available designations for each planet and calculates how many resources it would get each month from choosing the designations. It then scores each designation by judging how well the gained resources fits into the AI’s economic plan, giving extra score to designations that align with its economic goals.

Normally it is very easy to pick the designation, for example, a planet with only mining districts on it will clearly have the mining designation. However, other designations such as Factory/Forge world are more complicated and the AI needs to carefully assign these designations in a way that keeps the economy balanced.

For non hive mind empires consumer goods and alloy production is the biggest AI economy challenge we have faced so far, since the AI needs to produce both resources independently of each other to meet their economy plan targets even though they are produced from the same district in three different possible ways. The current system is a step in the right direction but this is definitely a tricky problem that will require additional fine tuning in the future.

AI alloy spenditure​

Now that AI adjusts its alloy and consumer good production separately it was time to tackle how AI spends its alloys.

In 3.2 the AI really liked defense platforms, and keeping them up to date by upgrading them any time it was possible. Not only is this a massive drain of alloys, it would also more or less permanently fill the production queue in the shipyards with upgrades which meant that in some cases it wasn’t able to build any new ships even if it wanted to.

Further there was an issue where the AI would get blocked from building any modules or upgrading any starbases if there was an open module slot in which it wasn’t possible to build anything according to the AIs starbase templates. For example, the AI has dedicated shipyard starbase templates and if it has open slots in it then it would really like to build the titan assembly module on it. But if it wasn’t researched yet then the AI would get blocked here, preventing construction of new starbases.

In 3.3 the AI alloy spending priority goes something like this:
- Build new ships until we reach fleet cap
- Build starbase modules
- Build new starbases
- Upgrade starbases
- Upgrade ships (and defense platforms) if it gives a +30% fleet power bonus, and upgrade the entire fleet this ship is in while we are at a shipyard anyway. Saving both alloys and time!
- Build defense platforms as a last resort

AI tech picking​

The AI has scripted weights for each tech in the game, this gives it some direction as to what technology to pick next every time a research is completed. Both in terms of which technologies are more powerful but also taking into account AI personalities, militarist empires are for example more inclined to research weapon tech.

In 3.2 the majority of techs had some modifier on it which increased the chance of it being selected by the AI, but when you prioritize everything, well then you prioritize nothing. For 3.3 we went through all the techs in the game and remade the AI priorities from scratch, emphasizing techs that will help the AI scale into the mid and late game. For example, resource production boosting techs, pop growth techs and resource producing building chains are now more encouraged.

Additionally AI will now look much more favourably on techs that are cheaper compared to the other options, this allows the AI to more quickly cycle through the available options and find the techs that it really likes.



AI superfluous destruction​

This one is short and simple. AI will now delete stuff if it gives jobs, housing or building slots that we do not need. Meaning, if we for example have more free jobs and housing than provided by an energy district we will simply delete it to avoid paying the upkeep cost and freeing up this slot for something else in the future.

This scenario most often happens when an AI empire invades another planet and purges their pops, so determined exterminators will now be able to repurpose the conquered planets into something that aligns with their economy!

AI rogue servitor and bio trophies​

While there has been a lot of focus on the AI’s ability to compete economically with the player in this dev diary, one of the primary objectives of the AI initiative is also to enhance the role playing capabilities of the AI.

In 3.3 we are adding additional AI support for the rogue servitor civic and how they handle their bio trophy pops. The AI should now build an organic sanctuary on each planet that has an upgraded capital structure causing their bio trophies to spread to other planets. And they should build additional sanctuaries on planets with a lot of complex drones.

Additionally we have addressed a group of related bugs where the AI was unable to build special types of buildings like gaia seeders, spawning pools and chambers of elevation.

AI comparison​

As a final note we would like to share some comparison graphs between the 3.2 and the 3.3 AI. Please note that what you are about to see is based on one single test run on ensign and one test run on grand admiral. This comparison is not meant to be interpreted as evidence but as an indication of what has changed between 3.2 and 3.3.

In any AI playthrough there is a huge variance in the AI performance due to random factors such as how they pick techs, traditions and ascension perks. The experiment setup is also used for internal AI testing only and not representative of an actual playthrough.

Experiment setup:
  • Tiny galaxy
  • 1 AI empire
  • All test using the United Nations of Earth empire
  • Mid and late game years set to 2575/2600 so they don’t trigger
  • The map is the same between the 3.2 vs 3.3 comparison, but NOT the same between the ensign and the grand admiral test.

Let’s first look at the comparison between the 3.2 and 3.3 ensign difficulty:

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Up until year 100 the military power is roughly the same, but from that point on the results of the work we put into mid and late game AI scaling starts to really show. This allows the AI to act and react in a lot more interesting ways in the late game than before.


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1) Around year 150 the 3.3 (“develop”) AI reaches the 32/32 starbase capacity due to having researched all techs in the game, resulting in the slowdown of the military power development.

2) 3.2 AI gets stuck in an economic death spiral for about 30 years shortly after year 100, AI eventually manages to escape the death spiral and then has massive economic growth and is able to build up to the 32/32 starbase cap quickly due to having saved up alloys for 30~ years.

At year 200 the gap between both AI military strength gets smaller since neither AI is really building that many more ships due to having maxxed out starbase capacity and already way above their fleet cap resulting in very expensive fleets. The power gap at year 200 is mainly due to 3.3 AI having superior technology.
However, it turned out that for GA difficulty the AI wouldn’t correctly apply the increased buff from trade value. Now, when it does, the AI takes a good step in the direction of making it more challenging for players.

Overall the GA and ensign test show a similar pattern where the first 100 years are roughly the same and then the difference becomes substantial. However, in the GA test the upper limit of 3.3 AI scaling can be seen around year 150-200 as the military growth curve tends to flatten out at this point when reaching the starbase cap.

And that’s it for today's dev diary, if you have any questions related to AI economy feel free to post them below and I will do my best to answer them!
 
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Just in case it hasn't been addressed yet, are you aware of the issue where vassals lose their AI bonuses? This has been a long standing issue that makes turning AI empires into vassals a bad option, as without those bonuses they become kinda useless. I think there are a few mods that fix it but vanilla is always better.
 
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Just in case it hasn't been addressed yet, are you aware of the issue where vassals lose their AI bonuses? This has been a long standing issue that makes turning AI empires into vassals a bad option, as without those bonuses they become kinda useless. I think there are a few mods that fix it but vanilla is always better.
Isn't that working as intended/designed?

You can argued that the designed/intended is bad and convince them to change from there I guess (and I would agree).
 
We've been a bit quiet on the forums as of right now our focus is on our internal bug backlog. A good chunk of said issues are duplicated by posts on the forum.

We're moving focus now and will be doing a forum pass to make sure we didn't miss anything that the community has reported.
Oh, that's nice to hear. And to be fair, some of the bugs I've reported have been fixed without being responded to by even a Drone.
 
If it's intended its the first I'm hearing of it, and I think that would be a very strange design decision.

it is an obvious design decision to dodge abuses and exploit .

even if by consequence a vassalized AI will never be able to actualy try to regain indipendence without a major supporting it, as it loses all military bonuses ... but the alternative is having vassals with almost unlimited resources that you can trade with and feed you resources , in your pocket .
 
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Does this mean that we can look forward to no longer manually disabling enforcer jobs on every habitat, especially for Void Dwellers, to avoid the ~5% production loss of wasting about 1/20 pops to prevent "crime"?
As far as I can tell, yes, it does.
 
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it is an obvious design decision to dodge abuses and exploit .

even if by consequence a vassalized AI will never be able to actualy try to regain indipendence without a major supporting it, as it loses all military bonuses ... but the alternative is having vassals with almost unlimited resources that you can trade with and feed you resources , in your pocket .
But if the side effect is that they're practically useless, why even bother?
 
Sort of like the Galactic Market?

yes, but without the increase in price .

But if the side effect is that they're practically useless, why even bother?

its an accetable side efffect for them, with the rework of AI they should at least have a limited fleet capacity and just follow your "take point" fleet .

it is better to have a hegemony federation and force empires inside of it , but if you don't want to pick the diplomacy tradition, you should go for the feudal civ , but vassals will always be weaker than theyr AI counterpart if you have any difficulty .
 
Even if you want to avoid vassal abuse with massive AI bonuses, giving them even half of the bonus would suffice to maintain their competitiveness without outright breaking the game in the player's favor. I understand that the idea of a player being able to spin off a vassal with megastructure output being an absolutely terrifying idea (since, well, the player is still going to be much faster at getting to that dyson sphere than any AI empire) but from the perspective of fairness I just don't understand making them have zero bonuses. The AI gets those bonuses in the first place because, presumably, they need them to keep up with the player, and the obvious effect this has on the desirability of vassals should be incentive enough alone to maintain those bonuses in some form.

Otherwise... players with federations and the hegemony tradition will just fully benefit from those bonuses anyway, and the only material difference there is that you can't (trivially) spin off a planet with perfected districts + megastructures into a member state. It just seems like you're trying to snip off a problem at the head and accidentally cutting off the entire thing at the roots.
 
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it is an obvious design decision to dodge abuses and exploit .

even if by consequence a vassalized AI will never be able to actualy try to regain indipendence without a major supporting it, as it loses all military bonuses ... but the alternative is having vassals with almost unlimited resources that you can trade with and feed you resources , in your pocket .
It not really an obvious design decision, it's a hold over from the old dificulty system where the ai's increased fleet cap and increased resources were hidden from the playerbase.
The specific "exploit" with vassals keeping there bonuses is resources from tributaries, but this can be easily resolved by having the resource bonuses from dificulty applied after taxing as a tributary.
If the ai could functionally run an empire without dificulty bonuses then maybe them losing them when vassalised might work, but even in that case it would still invalidate the scion origin as an ai start and hamper as a player start. It also cripples the khan as the satropies lose all their bonuses.
It also breaks wars in heaven since all the ai who join either fallen empire are crippled.

Not sure where your figuring an ai vassal is getting anywhere near unlimited resources since that just lose a war to the player to be vassalised, or has a weaker economy to accept the proposal. Potentially player released vassals could have alot of resource production, but in that case just prevent vassal released by player having the bonus instead.
 
I haven't looked at tradition and AP selection yet but yes they are on the TODO list and it is for sure something that could be improved.
The screenshot from above with hive minds was one instance where they were terraforming everything into hive worlds but yes it is not that common to see it
Can I provide a suggestion? The problem with ascension perk and AI never completing its species ascension is that, when they unlock their perk slot, they usually don't have the technology required to pick the perk itself, and always end up picking all 8 perks including suboptimal one before they can choose the last ascension perk. It is the same problem for Galactic Wonder and Master Builder too since they can hardly complete the condition to get them before they have the last empty slot.
So, please add weight for "not picking any perk" and run that every 6 months to not impact performance. The weight for "not picking any" will be impacted by all picked ascension perks, available tech options, and researched tech options.
For example, if the AI got the synthetic tech option and has already taken cyborg perk, it will greatly prefer saving its ascension slot for synth ascension. And if a materialist is on their 2nd perk, they will lean toward waiting for "the flesh is weak" than immediately picking something. And if they already have colonial centralization they will be more likely to wait for droids instead of picking "executive vigor" immediately (lol they did that, believe me).
And, if AI is having a ruined megastructure within their border, they will certainly leave their last slot for Galactic Wonder. After all, if they have enough alloy they should start to build megas anyway, so why leave behind one of the strongest perks in the game?
 
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I'm still not sold on the wide tech nerv - since more people can research more stuff just like they can produce more stuff, i.e. bigger *is* better ceteris paribus but the AI stuff and bug fixes look absolutely amazing and should make modded games run so much better. Now more fleet upgrades freezing the game and hopefully an AI that is actually competitive. All in all I'm now very excited for 3.3
Well, a good solution is to change how empire sprawl and penalty are calculated. My idea is that since empire sprawl represents the strain of the government on managing a larger empire, why don't we change the penalty from tech cost to something actually represents that? A bigger empire shouldn't suffer from lower-tech, what it would really suffer is the inability to manage their own people
My idea is this: The effect of sprawl empire management would be exponential, meaning that it will be relatively small when the empire sprawl is small and skyrocket when sprawl rises. A 3-colonies empire should barely have any problem managing itself, an 8-colonies one might see some annoyance but still manageable, and an empire spanned half the galaxy should barely hold itself together. Also, the effect of sprawl should also scale with distance: you can tell people on your homeworld to do what you want, but good luck doing the same to a small colony half the galaxy away. Unless you force martial law, of course, with a resources penalty. So, I suggest using stability as a measure of how much control your empire had over a colony, which will decrease over distance, barring bypasses such as gateways. And empire sprawl will increase this penalty, so unless you can afford to build gateways in every habitable system you are going to deal with it.
So I propose that empire sprawl should affect:
+ Edict and tradition cost. Certainly, I agree with the dev about this, the more undermanaged the empire, the harder it is to implement something.
+ Crime: I suggest an overhaul of the crime mechanic. Criminal should be a bigger problem than 10% stability penalty. A player should think twice before saying "some criminal is of no concern". Also, please remove the crime limit of 100%. It should be more like a point assigned to the planet instead, so it can go as high as the planet's actual criminal situation.
I suggest that crime should generate criminal jobs regardless of planetary situation, with 20% crime per 1 job. Criminal jobs will reduce trade, stability, and citizen happiness, this effect should Megacorp criminal corporate building should boost the "output" of the criminal job, plus increase crime from pop by a fixed percentage.
And, since high sprawl means less control over citizens, it should also boost crime generation from Pop. The event of "poverty on colony X" should increase crime generation of unemployed Pop instead (make it a significant amount, like 200%). And if criminal activity reacts 100%, there is a chance that the criminals would attack to take over the world, forming a criminal syndicate empire.
In addition, there should be a minor change to the rebellion event: Empire sprawl would also play a major part in a rebellion, with it increasing the chance that one did rebel, and raising the stability threshold needed for such rebellion to take place. Therefore larger empires must find a way to keep their citizens happy, like constant luxury distribution, or they will suffer from mass rebellion. And empire with 1 system can go down to 5% stability at least with no concern from citizens. Certain civic should also help with this. Moreover, Hive Mind and Machine should also suffer from rebellion, in their case rebellion will be tied to deviancy or corruption instead. Like, a community if corrupted drones or network of machines decide to overthrow the old consciousness to become a new Hivemind or Machine empire.
Last, I suggest that a successfully rebelled "empire" have some boost. Just program it into the origin "separatist", so that if someone invades their homeworld, all citizen pop will also generate a defense army just like when they rebelled. They would also have a fire rate boost to their former oppressor while retaining any tech from them (unless they are taken in by other empires)

Edit: Please make it so that purging pops can also rebel if they outnumber the purger by a certain amount, and have happiness. It is completely unreasonable for a purge world of 1000 undesirable operate by 10 drones only. Why can't these people raise up and fight? Their armies might be just ragtag but they are numerous enough. And that will put some strain on purge player, as brought all undesirables on a single purge world would grant them a chance to rebel ( as well as the massive output they can also give).
 
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It not really an obvious design decision, it's a hold over from the old dificulty system where the ai's increased fleet cap and increased resources were hidden from the playerbase.
The specific "exploit" with vassals keeping there bonuses is resources from tributaries, but this can be easily resolved by having the resource bonuses from dificulty applied after taxing as a tributary.
If the ai could functionally run an empire without dificulty bonuses then maybe them losing them when vassalised might work, but even in that case it would still invalidate the scion origin as an ai start and hamper as a player start. It also cripples the khan as the satropies lose all their bonuses.
It also breaks wars in heaven since all the ai who join either fallen empire are crippled.

Not sure where your figuring an ai vassal is getting anywhere near unlimited resources since that just lose a war to the player to be vassalised, or has a weaker economy to accept the proposal. Potentially player released vassals could have alot of resource production, but in that case just prevent vassal released by player having the bonus instead.

Remember when Wiz said that Stellaris AI did not had any cheat that gave them free resources and then the community discovered hidden massive Upkeep discounts for the AI...? And then Wiz tried to defend that having massive upkeep discounts is not giving the AI free resources...?

I member.

Also, I agree about the Vassals bonuses. All vassals that are vassalized by the AI should retain their difficulty bonuses.

Vassals (and tributaries) from players should have half the bonuses to balance it out. I think this is a good compromise between the no bonus and full bonus.
 
It not really an obvious design decision, it's a hold over from the old dificulty system where the ai's increased fleet cap and increased resources were hidden from the playerbase.
The specific "exploit" with vassals keeping there bonuses is resources from tributaries, but this can be easily resolved by having the resource bonuses from dificulty applied after taxing as a tributary.
If the ai could functionally run an empire without dificulty bonuses then maybe them losing them when vassalised might work, but even in that case it would still invalidate the scion origin as an ai start and hamper as a player start. It also cripples the khan as the satropies lose all their bonuses.
It also breaks wars in heaven since all the ai who join either fallen empire are crippled.

Not sure where your figuring an ai vassal is getting anywhere near unlimited resources since that just lose a war to the player to be vassalised, or has a weaker economy to accept the proposal. Potentially player released vassals could have alot of resource production, but in that case just prevent vassal released by player having the bonus instead.

Remember when Wiz said that Stellaris AI did not had any cheat that gave them free resources and then the community discovered hidden massive Upkeep discounts for the AI...? And then Wiz tried to defend that having massive upkeep discounts is not giving the AI free resources...?

I member.

Also, I agree about the Vassals bonuses. All vassals that are vassalized by the AI should retain their difficulty bonuses.

Vassals (and tributaries) from players should have half the bonuses to balance it out. I think this is a good compromise between the no bonus and full bonus.


i didn't realy want to reply, as there is no way to convince you as you are quite convinced of what you say and is totaly a balance isuess so, it is not logical or anything , so i can't convince you in any way .

but i've to correct the missinformation .

AI vassals and awakened empire ""vassals"" retain the bonus to resources of the difficulty lvl, the lose of it is only chained with the player .
 
Remember when Wiz said that Stellaris AI did not had any cheat that gave them free resources and then the community discovered hidden massive Upkeep discounts for the AI...? And then Wiz tried to defend that having massive upkeep discounts is not giving the AI free resources...?

I member.

Also, I agree about the Vassals bonuses. All vassals that are vassalized by the AI should retain their difficulty bonuses.

Vassals (and tributaries) from players should have half the bonuses to balance it out. I think this is a good compromise between the no bonus and full bonus.

I agree that Vassals to AIs should keep their bonuses. I dont agree that the Player Vassals need any bonuses.

That beeing said, I dont have a solution for the Federation and hegemony Ais keeping their bonuses.
 
I agree that Vassals to AIs should keep their bonuses. I dont agree that the Player Vassals need any bonuses.

That beeing said, I dont have a solution for the Federation and hegemony Ais keeping their bonuses.
AI vassals HAVE theyr bonuses , becoming a vassal of an AI empire doesn't remove theyr bonuses from difficulty.
 
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Interesting. Did you teach AI to handle disabled buildings while you're at it? or is it still beyond their understanding?