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Stellaris Dev Diary #245 - We have a Situation

Welcome to this week’s dev diary! Eladrin is busy with something exciting this week, so I’ve been roped into writing about the almost as exciting new Situations system we will be adding in the next patch.

The idea for implementing this system comes from the realisation that Stellaris provides excellent systems to tell stories about things that have happened - e.g. anomalies and archaeology sites - but lacks a good structure through which to tell stories about things which are happening right now. While we have a number of such stories, they are often either not as complex as we’d like them to be (e.g. we’d prefer to have more factors taken into account), or they are disproportionately complicated for us to implement (i.e. time-consuming and bug-prone). Either way, the player experience is often not as we’d like it, since such stories and event chains are likely to be hard to follow, and it may not always be clear that events are connected to each other or why certain things happen.

This was a state of affairs we wanted to improve upon, so we decided to implement a system which aimed to:
  • Give players an interactive and informative interface by which to experience current affairs event chains.
  • Provide a structure that is (relatively) easy to add new content to.

Initially, we took some inspiration from Disasters in EU4, but we soon diverged from it, since we realised not all the stories we wanted to tell were disasters, and we wanted a more UX-intensive solution. The result can be shown off in this mockup:

1646842176465.png

Note that this is a mockup - so not necessarily how the final UI will look.

To unpack this a bit, the flow progresses something like this:
  1. The Situation starts. This could happen e.g. through an event. The Situation can either be empire-wide, or it can be focused e.g. on a single planet
    1646842816635.png

    Event text is final.
  2. Each month, the Situation’s “progress” will tick upwards or downwards, depending on your response to the Situation.
    1646842610214.png

    A WIP tooltip showing the monthly change. It'll list all contributing factors.
  3. As the Situation progresses, you may reach the next “stage”. Often, an event will be fired as soon as this happens, to develop the story. Effects can also be applied to the empire or planet based on the current stage, e.g. an instability-based Situation may reduce stability by 10 for each stage.
  4. There may also be random events along the way that can happen on any monthly tick. To distinguish Situation-based events from regular ones, some tweaks have been made to the event interface:
    1646842979882.png
  5. The player can choose how to respond to a Situation via a selection of “Approaches”. On occasion, one might be prompted to change these via events, but otherwise, one can freely pick them in the Situations interface. (We have not yet decided whether there should generally be a cooldown to picking an option). Approaches usually have effects over time, such as “spend X Unity per month to gain faster progress”.
  6. When either end of the Situation’s progress bar is reached, the Situation is resolved, usually through an event in which something happens.

Some Situations will progress in a linear manner from left to right, others will start you in the middle and progress either to the left or to the right based on your choices. And we also want them to be differently coloured depending on how threatening the Situation is:

1646842264908.png

This is also a mockup.

This is all a bit theoretical, so, what changes can players expect in practice? Now I will take you through a few of the things we have done and are doing with the Situations system.

Narrative Situations

Content Design often implements narrative-based event chains set on a certain planet. Now, if we feel like the story has a bit more to give, a planet-based Situation can be crafted instead. The ability to have different outcomes at either end of the progress bar is particularly useful, since it can show which sort of conclusion the player is advancing towards (or at least indicate that there are multiple). To avoid giving spoilers, I won’t say exactly what stories we’ve added in this way, but there will be a few new planet-based narratives to encounter.

The “targeting” function of Situations is not limited to planets (though most of our effort has been towards making it work well there), so we have also managed to try adding a Situation based around a system or starbase.

Owners of the Leviathans DLC - or other DLCs that add Leviathan NPCs to the game - can also expect a few surprises next time they go monster-hunting ;)

Deficit Situations

Situations are not all fun and games. As their origin as EU4 Disasters would suggest, they are a great system through which to portray negative events. They give the player all the information they need to know what is happening, what the results of it will be, how severe the current Situation is, and what they can do about it.

One of our main priorities when it comes to using this aspect of Situations was reworking Deficits. At the moment, Deficits are like a light switch: as soon as you are in deficit (stockpile of 0 and negative income) for a given resource, you get all the defined penalties for being in that deficit (which can be quite harsh). But as soon as you spend a month no longer in deficit, all penalties are removed. This feels a bit off. Also, the penalties are the same for all empires, which has frequently led to headaches where they either disproportionately impacted a certain type of empire or left others (say, one with less need of a certain resource) relatively untouched. Finally, they can also be a cause for “death spirals” (in particular for the AI), as a shortage of one resource leads to penalties, which leads to a shortage of another resource.

With our rework, being in a deficit will start a Situation. You will start at 25% progress in this Situation, and it will increase in severity as long as you are at 0 balance and have a negative income. The rate of increase will depend on how much you are losing compared to your income. Having a stockpile will gradually make the Situation tick downwards; having a positive income will make it do so more rapidly.

1646843561944.png

This is the actual UI as it looks like right now. We are hard at work finishing it up and making it look presentable!

The penalties you receive for being in a deficit will start off light compared to their present settings, but will increase in severity as the Situation escalates. We are also able to configure them depending on your empire’s attributes, so for instance a Catalytic empire will now correctly get alloy output problems for being in a food deficit.

We aim to give each deficit Situation a choice of approaches, so that you can try to mitigate it from within the interface. So, for instance, a consumer goods shortage might be mitigated by electing to defund scientists, with the result that researchers cost less upkeep but also produce less research.

If however the deficit continues to grow, at 75% progress an event will fire which will warn that your empire is in truly dire financial straits and will need to make cutbacks soon. It will suggest a few, and you can pay a price (e.g. devastating a planet, or removing a special resource deposit) in return for some immediate resources that might help you alleviate the deficit.

1646843965654.png

Numbers not final

Finally, if the deficit becomes so severe that the progress bar is filled up, the empire is declared bankrupt. This is an unambiguously bad thing to happen to you - current effects (numbers to be finalised) are downgrading all non-capital buildings to their lowest level, disbanding half the fleet and all the armies, and giving 25% higher costs, 25% less ship damage, and 50% less unity and influence for 10 years. But it’s also designed to avoid death spirals: in return for liquidating these assets, you are given enough of the resource you defaulted on to survive for a while. Additionally, all other deficit Situations you are currently experiencing are terminated immediately, without penalty, and you are granted some resources to avoid them returning too soon.

1646844063692.png

Numbers are subject to change.

Changes are likely to come to this design as we continue to play with the new system and iron out its kinks, but we are hopeful that this new version of deficits will resolve many of the issues with the current deficits system, and make deficits, if not exactly fun to experience, at least a more interesting and less frustrating game mechanic.

Further “Strategic” Situations

We have further plans to overhaul systems or features using Situations. For these (unlike the Situations listed above), we can’t guarantee that they will definitely be in the next patch, but we are looking to adapt the likes of slave revolts, planetary separatism revolts, and the Synthetic Dawn AI Uprising to this new system.

With regards to the AI Uprising: we are broadly happy with the way the chain works now, but there are a few improvements to be made, and we feel that it would be beneficial to the player to be able to experience it through a UI. For instance, it has a bunch of events that an experienced player would recognise as warning signs that they should do something about it, but the inexperienced player would not know what is up and would not stop it from happening. With the Situations system, experienced and inexperienced players alike would know that something is up. However, this also makes it easier to know that you should do something about it, so we are also looking at making it a bit more challenging than just changing species right to end the Situation - after all, the robots are still extremely annoyed at you having deprived them of sentience for all these years! We are also looking at making purging the robots a viable if high-risk approach, at least so long as you don’t have too many robots.

With planetary revolts and slave uprisings, we have a feature that hasn’t seen much love for many a patch even as the game has changed around it, so we hope to improve it in a variety of aspects. At the moment, it would be fair to say that the unrest events are more a nuisance than a threat: revolts feel like they come out of the blue, but don’t have much teeth, as you can usually just conquer back the planet (since one planet alone cannot hope to stand against your empire). Our changes to this system are at a fairly early stage, but our goals include:
  • Make revolts feel less random - they will no longer happen suddenly, and whether unrest turns into a successful revolt will depend more reliably on factors such as how many pops are on the planet, and just how annoyed they are.
  • Smooth out issues such as one habitat in a system revolting leading to the loss of all planets in the system. The opinions of other planets in the system should have an impact on the success of the revolt.
  • Improve the system where planets can sometimes join other empires after the revolt. (At the moment, this can happen in separatist revolts if the original owner still exists and is nearby, and in slave revolts if there is an egalitarian empire nearby). Basically, they should be asked in advance if they wish to support the revolt, at which point it should progress faster, but on the other hand, the other side will know this is happening. Also, we may want to review the conditions for revolts joining other empires, since in some cases a completely annexed empire might have each planet revolt to form its own micronation.
  • We are toying with the idea of removing the stage where planets have ground combat during rebellions. Troops stationed there can be factored in during the buildup stage instead.
  • Ideally, a successful rebellion would start a war with the previous owner, but would also be a bit more of a potential threat. We’ll see what we manage to come up with, here.

That’s all for now! Except to add that, since an old version of the cheat sheet for what all Situations can do is actually available to you in 3.3, I’m attaching the new and updated version of this, so that those inclined can make plans for what to do with the system.

And keep an eye out for Eladrin’s dev diary next week. You won’t want to miss it.
 

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I really like that internal management is getting looked at. And I think this all sounds cool. But I have a few things I wanna discuss.

1. The Bankruptcy effects are the opposite of fun. I get that the point of doing it this way is to avoid death spirals but man does it look like a pain! Having all your upgraded buildings, half your armies and half your fleet just disappear would be soul crushing and would ruin your save forever. I'd just turn off the game at that point. I'm much more in favor of ships doing -50% damage, -25% to all incomes and so on. But then again, it might just not be so bad because...

2. Deficiencies never happen. I feel like you might be in a position here where you design a system that 90% of players will just never run into. If you ever run a deficiency in Stellaris, and much rarer actually run out of a stockpile, you just sell some rare resources and then *bam* you're back again. And with enough time bought to last until the situation fixes itself.

3. Too many player systems. I see that you already have this on your mind. I am afraid that that adding yet another system for players to learn, that is more complicated than the easy-to-understand Situation log, you risk adding yet another layer that keeps new players from entering this game. For people who have been playing continuously for years, this is no problem. But if someone hasn't played Stellaris before, they are greeted by planetary management, decisions, understanding jobs, what envoys are, espionage, not understanding trade in the slightest and having no idea what an edict fund is. I think it would be worthwhile to let some new players test the game in your presence to see what could be improved. It needs to be approachable.

4. Potential. I really like the idea of having bad things happen to you. Like planetary unrest. But it is only fun when you have a bit of agency over it. Choosing an approach seems like a really good idea. And there is also a chance that this system could be used for international situations. Like the crisis. Or two empires getting into a dispute. I foresee a bit inspiration from Victoria III coming in the future.

Also, as a bonus, the Arm Privateers Espionage operation should be ditched and instead an operation introduced that can lower stability on an enemy planet, increasing the likelihood of a rebellion. Or with this new system, an espionage operation that outright tries to induce a rebellion.
 
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The Good:
1. Acknowledging Deficits and related exploits/death-spirals are problems that needs fixing
2. Acknowledging Revolts aren't fun and are buggy
3. Adding lots of new thematic events and player choices

The Bad:
1. Absolutely everything about the suggested UI

Honest opinion here:
I kinda hate it. Sorry, I know it's a bit blunt. But I really hate the UI mock-ups. And for context I also hate similar obtuse patterns for showing progress that are in Federation, Espionage and Pop Growth screens.

Time is a clear simple and easily understood variable with clear units.
Build a building and you see "Simulation Site, (clock icon) 31" that's obvious, 31 days.
Research a technology and you see "9 months remaining", also obvious, that's 9 months.

Notice that I didn't have to use a calculator here.
Time is intuitive, simple and perfectly clear. That should be the default, normal design standard for UI elements. But it hasn't been recently.

One example, I want to see:
You're infiltrating an empire, "5 months until Medium Diplomatic Intel is revealed"
Tooltip showing what extra intel that unlocks:
  • Opinion Breakdown
  • Diplomatic Pacts

You could do that if you wanted, the maths is all there for the player to do in a calculator. But instead we get this:
But with espionage I see:

48^
#Somewhat useful. I at least know which operations I can perform... although I could see that by which are available to pick and which have infiltration in red.

(with this tooltip on hovering)
Current Infiltration level: 48/100
We will reach the next level in 4 days. #wrong, should be 2 days, someone forgot to divide by the progress per day
Progress: 241.70/245.00
Daily Progress: 2.17
#progress breakdown

So it says it's 4 days away from the next level (it's actually 2 days away). I do not care how many days level 49 is, as that doesn't do anything. I care about how long until 50 intel, as that does something.

So, 2 days away from being 49/100 infiltration level, and another 250/2.17 days away from getting 50 infiltration level (since the arbitrary number increases with each level)... which means it's however long that is +1 month until you actually go from 49 to 50 Intel as that increases by +1 a month up to the newly increased cap... which in turn unlocks Medium Diplomacy Intel... which gives you: Opinion Breakdown and Diplomatic Pacts information... which I only know by looking at the wiki or comparing two saves taken a few months apart after letting the game run for a while.

*eye twitches in annoyance and frustration*

So on stardate 2273.02.25 looking at espionage I need to ignore the buggy tooltips, then do 3 lots of maths:
(245-241.7)/2.17 + 250/2.17 + 30
/30
1.52 + 115.2 + 30 = 146.7 / 30 = 4.89 months, rounded up = 5 months

to work out that it'll be 2273.07.01 until I get Medium Diplomatic Intel, instead of the game saying:
"Medium Diplomatic Intel in 5 months"
(+40% from Relative Encryption, +55% from Empire Size)
It's worse if I wanted to know how long away 100 intel is... much, much worse. I don't want to do the maths. It hurts my brain.

And for Pop growth I want to see:
Growth of a new pop will be complete in 65 months
Assembly of a new pop will be complete in 13 months
Decline of a pop will be complete in 50 months

The UI wants to show me:
Growing (Bindle icon) 0.0
Assembling (Robot and wrench icon) 8.9
Decline (blank)

In the tooltips I see:
Growth Progress: 6.3/167.7 (+2.49/month)
Growth of a new pop will be complete in 65 month(s)
Base growth 3.0 (+1.50 from pops)
#Stuff
Modifier reductions:
Machine Intelligence 50%
#Stuff

OR for an organic empire example

Growth Progress: 21.6/211 (+3.62)
Growth of a new pop will be complete in 53 month(s)
Base Growth 3.0 (-0.44 from High Pops)
#Stuff
#Specifically this example is from 36 pops on a 46 capacity habitat with 10 spare housing.
Base Growth is decreased because the population is approaching the Planet Capacity
Building additional Housing or clearing Blockers increases Capacity #By how much? It's not shown on either the district or blockers tooltips.

What I want to know but don't see in the tooltips:

How many pops can I support before I lose the +1.5 growth from pops that I gain from planet capacity?
OR
How much more planet capacity will I need to build to get the full +1.5 bonus from pops? And how much do I get from housing buildings and districts?

e.g.
Growth of a new pop will be complete in 53 months (+23% Growth speed Penalty due to high population)

Planet Capacity 46
This planet can currently support:
31 Pops before incurring a penalty from high pops (approximately 43 months for a new pop)
23-24 Pops for Max growth from pops (+19% growth speed from pops, 36 months for a new pop)

This planet Cannot currently reach the logistical growth ceiling of +1.5 Growth due to low planet capacity.
Try building Habitation Districts (+5 Carrying Capacity) or reducing Housing usage of pops to increase growth.

With current population, 20 additional Planet capacity is required to maximize growth.
At 66 Planet Capacity, (+43% growth time from pops, 30 months for a new pop)
#Numbers for illustrative purposes only

So, in short. Almost none of the information I actually want is available or even remotely easy to try to calculate. I would need to do a lot of maths and/or trial and error with constructing and deleting buildings and districts and relocating pops (which I just did, painfully, and I'm sure with lots of errors) to find out that I could grow pops 76% faster than now (saving 23 months per pop) if I built 4 more Habitation districts... if I didn't mind losing all my actual production and pop jobs.

The UI is bad if I can only begin to understand the logical reasoning behind the numbers because I've seen reddit posts that show the graphs that are being used for the oddly modified carrying capacity equation and how those interact at very low values of carrying capacity like you find in habitats (often the most common planet type due to being cheap and almost completely unlimited).

It doesn't have to be this way. You can make things clearer and simpler. Stick to using times as a number whenever you can, don't show progress numbers first.

Now for the tooltips that are on the migration/Bindle Icon.

(Bindle) 0.0
Current Immigration 0.01
Increases monthly Pop Growth by 0.02
#sorry but this is just comically bad, the rounding .01 down to 0 for the display, and then 0.0115 down to 0.01 and up to 0.02 for the next lines of the tooltip without showing the +15% from traits makes it look like a series of bugs. Stick to the same number of significant figures and round consistently in the same direction, and if you modify a figure based on another variable, show the +15% from that variable in the tooltip.

#Breakdown of Pull and Push
And here there's the massive separate problem of the immigration balancing.

Specifically it's really hard to get to 100 net emigration push without also reducing growth to 0, which makes emigration also x0, making it useless as a mechanic as the one time you'd want people to move away you actually don't get anyone moving at all. That's not a UI problem, but if the UI was better then the game designers and testers would have easily seen that it was broken and the numbers needed rebalancing. In an environment where you always have at least +10 free housing due to the Planet Carrying capacity and you rarely have more than 1 unemployment due to unemployed pops relocating automatically the target of 100 net emigration push is unreasonably high and interacts badly with pop growth from planet capacity.

e.g. to get +50 pressure from overcrowding you need:
Negative housing
BUT
With Carrying capacity going over housing causes reduced growth, and so that reduced migration. Also before you reach the 100 pressure maximum you'll hit the cutoff that halts all organic growth entirely making the growth slot empty and migration also 0.

This means that you can't emigrate while pops aren't growing. Your Pops can only leave planets where more babies are being born than people are dying.
So sadly, even with 400 Emigration push (no houses, no jobs). You get 0 emigration.

What should happen is the pops should move over to the decline side with the decline rate equal to the emigration rate.
e.g. Pop Declining in 50 months
With Tooltip:
167.7/167.7 points (-3.35 from emigration push) # (167.7 growth per pop/50 months = -3.35 progress per month)

Technically you can get the required 100 pressure from unemployment (20 unemployed pops), but those pops will migrate away on their own using an entirely different system that almost completely overwrites the old one (with the poor UI and balancing).

The +2.49 growth in this example would only be converted into -2.35 migration and +0.12 growth if I have 100 emigration push, +50 from newly founded colonies, +50 from 10 unemployed pops or +50 from overcrowding at which points the pops wouldn't be growing anyway due to carrying capacity and pops simply not growing above a certain level of negative housing. It just breaks if growth hits 0 for any reason, even though the system should have been designed to handle both pop growth and pop decline and the smooth transition between the two states... it's right there in the display as a big decline box.

Also it's infuriating that all growth is lost whenever the pop in the growth selection box changes e.g. due to no pops of the current pop template existing, which happens after ascension paths modify all current species in your empire, resetting all growth and losing potentially 5+ years of pop growth throughout your entire empire. That is ridiculous. But it's just one of many annoying things with the UX.

Please, please... I beg you. Please stop adding UI interfaces that show +progress towards the next level instead of months until something happens.

Specific suggestions:
Looking at the mock-up I see:
1. Monthly change e.g. (6.5>>) and if things stick to the pattern seen in other UI elements I expect I'll probably see e.g.
6.5/500 Situation Progress
494 Months until something happens #not dividing by monthly progress properly
+6.5 Progress per month
#Breakdown of contributions to that number

But I would much rather see:
++
3+ Months until "Consequences"
9+ Years until "Irreversible Consequences"

With an increasing probability that the next stage happens after the minimum time to keep some uncertainty.

Specifically I have issues with the "6.5" part of "6.5>>", the number is the abstraction of complex issues (supply issues, armed rebellion) into game logic. I know why it's simplified into a number in the background but it's really offputting personally to see the game develop in such a way that all progress is being consistently turned into forward facing arbitrary numbers for abstract concepts, when a real unit exists "Time" measured in either days, months or years.

I like the >, >> or >>> to show that something is advancing quickly or is stagnating. I don't mind having some warning that something is 1 year or 10 years away with a breakdown of factors contributing to that time frame. I just don't like the idea of being constantly told that the reason an event is 10 years away is because I'm filling up a bucket that is arbitrarily of size 500 at a rate of 6.5 units a month. It's the same unsatisfying feeling I get from federation levels, knowing that I'm getting +5 progress and I need 500 more points is far worse than the UI simply stating that I'm 100 months away from upgrading the federation research aggreements.
For me the current UI trend in Stellaris is like being told:
35/70 Meal progress
Progress Rate: +7/minute

When what I want to know is:
Your meal is 5 minutes away

I don't want to have to do mental maths 5+ times on one screen to know which ongoing situations are months away from being disasters and which are decades away from being relevant.
If you aren't supposed to be able to do the calculations then don't show the numbers!
If you are supposed to be able to do the calculation then do the calculation for the players! rather than expecting them to do mental maths on every new screen.

Also, if the direction of a progress bar has no meaning (e.g. left=bad, right=good or left=no change, right=change) and sometimes you start in the middle, sometimes you start on the left... the inconsistency will drive me absolutely crazy. At the very least always start in the same position. Starting in the middle is completely inconsistent with most other progress bars but fine... sure. But for things that only progress in one direction you could just have the bar fill outwards from the middle in both directions until it is full.

But preferably don't.

Think a while longer on a better way of displaying that information. And think on the question of if it's even a good idea to be giving that information to the player.
Do you want the player to know that they can ignore a deficit for years? Do you want to make it into a legitimate playstyle with events and strategies?
If you do you'll have people aim for a deficit at the start of the game so they can get a magical lump-sum of 15k energy with almost no cost if they're boxed-in or have allies. I can see this going wrong in so, so many ways.
(Not so bad and easy to exploit if the energy is dynamically generated based on the number of things that are sold to cover the deficit, but it will still introduce more issues than it solves)

But I am glad you're trying to sort out old problems. I just really wish the game presented the current information more clearly, not to mention the proposed new information. I want the game to display Time in UI elements when Time is the actual variable that the player is interacting with. I don't think it's too much to ask from the UI.

EDIT: Some considerable confusion about this post so adding a summary below, I hope that helps a little to get my point over more clearly.

TL;DR
1. UI elements should show the variable the player is trying to optimize at the forefront. (like Time remaining for research. I also want to know the time until something happens in other UI elements - time until full/next intel unlock, or time until bankruptcy).
2. Keep the numbers and % modifiers around for people to see, in the tooltips. So I can see exactly how my actions are impacting things. e.g. Will triggering 50 devastation on one world actually let me delay bankruptcy until after this war or will it only save me for the next 3 months?
3. Improve the tooltips more generally to show extra information you may also want (like Carrying Capacity not really having much information in-game, Intel levels and breakpoints not been explained in-game etc.)
4. Be Consistent in how UI elements work - green for good/progress, bars moving to the right is advancing, to the left is downgrading, progress bars start in the same position on the same screen. Otherwise things look both messy and confusing when things are a jumbled mix in the same UI element.
 
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I really like that internal management is getting looked at. And I think this all sounds cool. But I have a few things I wanna discuss.

1. The Bankruptcy effects are the opposite of fun. I get that the point of doing it this way is to avoid death spirals but man does it look like a pain! Having all your upgraded buildings, half your armies and half your fleet just disappear would be soul crushing and would ruin your save forever. I'd just turn off the game at that point. I'm much more in favor of ships doing -50% damage, -25% to all incomes and so on. But then again, it might just not be so bad because...

2. Deficiencies never happen. I feel like you might be in a position here where you design a system that 90% of players will just never run into. If you ever run a deficiency in Stellaris, and much rarer actually run out of a stockpile, you just sell some rare resources and then *bam* you're back again. And with enough time bought to last until the situation fixes itself.

3. Too many player systems. I see that you already have this on your mind. I am afraid that that adding yet another system for players to learn, that is more complicated than the easy-to-understand Situation log, you risk adding yet another layer that keeps new players from entering this game. For people who have been playing continuously for years, this is no problem. But if someone hasn't played Stellaris before, they are greeted by planetary management, decisions, understanding jobs, what envoys are, espionage, not understanding trade in the slightest and having no idea what an edict fund is. I think it would be worthwhile to let some new players test the game in your presence to see what could be improved. It needs to be approachable.

4. Potential. I really like the idea of having bad things happen to you. Like planetary unrest. But it is only fun when you have a bit of agency over it. Choosing an approach seems like a really good idea. And there is also a chance that this system could be used for international situations. Like the crisis. Or two empires getting into a dispute. I foresee a bit inspiration from Victoria III coming in the future.

Also, as a bonus, the Arm Privateers Espionage operation should be ditched and instead an operation introduced that can lower stability on an enemy planet, increasing the likelihood of a rebellion. Or with this new system, an espionage operation that outright tries to induce a rebellion.

I.. speaking as a not great player, I get into deficiencies all the time. (And then have to spend a bit of time trying to fix it.). I'm sure a very good player can avoid it. (I also suspect it's meant to be a pain.). Personally, though, I think something that reinforces you absolutely need to watch negative growth is something Stellaris needs.

(As for 3: I actually think that most of the hard-to-learn stuff is the not obvious stuff, sadly.)
 
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.. you could have really said you just dislike complex UI and want everything oversimplified and left it at that.
Not even close to what I am saying.

I'm saying not enough information is presented for a player to make meaningful choices. (not, as you think I was trying to say, too much information). And that what information is presented is done in the wrong format as the first thing you see.

e.g. For research you can see the breakdown of Progress as 257/3237 and +x a turn, but the first thing you see is 7 months remaining, because that is the variable you are trying to optimize for.

Espionage isn't showing that it'll be 30 years to get the intel I want or that spending 20 intel to perform an operation will set my progress back 30 years and make me lose military vision. The result is that I (people in general) make poor, uninformed decisions.

On Planet Capacity, not knowing how much you get from blockers, buildings and districts or how it interacts also means I (players generally) will make poor construction choices.

On this new system, not knowing that a situation will occur in 6 years or 60 years without doing the maths means I'll also make poor choices. Some small (building buildings I don't really need), some monumentally huge - specifically losing all my upgrades and half my fleet
 
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Will there be special situations if the rebelling world has a Stellar Shock modifier on it (i.e. primitive world invaded by aliens)? Would be a fun situation if the rebellion won and they named themselves the Greater *insert species* Union.

I can see a lot of interesting situations that can arise from primitive interactions. Like the primitives finally noticing you turned their moon/orbiting planet into a Gaia World or Ecumonopolis.
 
a few key notes i want to say right off the bat

"an instability-based Situation may reduce stability by 10 for each stage." and "deficid based situations"

the first could become severly annoying, because they could either be 1, spiraling a quick shortage out of control for no reason, and or 2, could become another "pirate event on new game" annoyance.... please no to both

and to the second issue... it sounds like you are going to implement a failbetter-esque approach to stellaris... which i might add... doesnt work, and has never worked.
locking content behind failiure states IN VIDEOGAMES about avoiding these very failiure states is a very backasswards design philosophy, and arguably the biggest reason why failbetter games ... well, games dont work mechanically
please dont fall into the same pittrap
 
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Not even close to what I am saying.

I'm saying not enough information is presented for a player to make meaningful choices. (not, as you think I was trying to say, too much information). And that what information is presented is done in the wrong format as the first thing you see.

e.g. For research you can see the breakdown of Progress as 257/3237 and +x a turn, but the first thing you see is 7 months remaining, because that is the variable you are trying to optimize for.

Espionage isn't showing that it'll be 30 years to get the intel I want or that spending 20 intel to perform an operation will set my progress back 30 years and make me lose military vision. The result is that I (people in general) make poor, uninformed decisions.

On Planet Capacity, not knowing how much you get from blockers, buildings and districts or how it interacts also means I (players generally) will make poor construction choices.

On this new system, not knowing that a situation will occur in 6 years or 60 years without doing the maths means I'll also make poor choices. Some small (building buildings I don't really need), some monumentally huge - specifically losing all my upgrades and half my fleet

no it is exactly what you are saying.

1. Showing the numbers means you can see the modifiers.
2. Algebraic math is easy.
3. But moer importantly, you're basically saying this:

A. The game does not display exact months to when it's remaining.
B. Games that do not display exact months to progress lead me to make illformed decisions

And my argument is that "not display exact months to when it's remaining" is functionally equivalent to "over simplify calculations and displays."
By showing numbers, you are able to look at say, what is modifying your number so you can learn from it. Rather than having to go look at a guide somewhere to see what causes "65 months" to drop to "60 months" by doing.

a few key notes i want to say right off the bat

"an instability-based Situation may reduce stability by 10 for each stage." and "deficid based situations"

the first could become severly annoying, because they could either be 1, spiraling a quick shortage out of control for no reason, and or 2, could become another "pirate event on new game" annoyance.... please no to both

and to the second issue... it sounds like you are going to implement a failbetter-esque approach to stellaris... which i might add... doesnt work, and has never worked.
locking content behind failiure states IN VIDEOGAMES about avoiding these very failiure states is a very backasswards design philosophy, and arguably the biggest reason why failbetter games ... well, games dont work mechanically
please dont fall into the same pittrap

[Citation Required]
 
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I like the rework of Situations but a question from me.

I often find myself clicking past anomalies and not reading so maybe this change affects me.


It says in the WIP, that you left click to go to the Situation and click the dialogue to simply "react" and 'click on past' - but does the actual Spoiler Alert placeholder stay? E.g. You know something has happened or developed in a Situation but that text is now going to reside only in the Situations window? Or is that spoiler image meant to be a new bit of UI we're not revealing yet? :)

1646953995944.png
 
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no it is exactly what you are saying.

1. Showing the numbers means you can see the modifiers.
2. Algebraic math is easy.
3. But moer importantly, you're basically saying this:

A. The game does not display exact months to when it's remaining.
B. Games that do not display exact months to progress lead me to make illformed decisions

And my argument is that "not display exact months to when it's remaining" is functionally equivalent to "over simplify calculations and displays."
By showing numbers, you are able to look at say, what is modifying your number so you can learn from it. Rather than having to go look at a guide somewhere to see what causes "65 months" to drop to "60 months" by doing.



[Citation Required]
What you are taking away from my words is not the same as the meaning I am intending.

I am not trying to suggest the game never show numbers, modifiers or calculations. Quite the opposite. But I do want the first number you see on a screen to be the relevant number or variable that you are trying to optimize. If possible the game can and should do some of the basic addition, multiplication and division for you rather than obfuscating those numbers.

All the additional numbers and modifiers should still exist to be found. Like how research shows the months remaining BUT ALSO the % modifiers, the progress, income, the increases from empire size etc. But the first number you see is time remaining. Because that's the one that matters when you're planning to start a war or refit a fleet.

2. I personally don't find mental maths easy or quick, nor fun in my recreational time.

In game, I can't tell you how many years it'll be before I reach 10, 20, 30 intel if I'm getting +1.4 progress a day and each intel level also increases the amount needed for the next level by +5.
I can't look at losing 10 infiltration levels going from 47 to 37 and tell you I'm losing 27.4 years of progress at current rates. I just have no clue at all. The numbers presented aren't useful to my decision making.

If I could do that math in my head then I'd perhaps think on how useful each operation is. Or how viable a deficit is. Or how many city districts I really want to have.
 
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(and yes, there is a case for updating various event chains to use the system).
Was going to ask about this because two that come to mind are The Dancing Plague and that cave fungus chain. Both have multiple stages of effects that happen on a planet, and both have different outcomes depending on your choices, but the randomness with how events fire means you can often see the stages progress literally days apart. When the consequences only last three days, the results of your intermediate decisions don't really matter and it detracts from the event chain.

Also, really looking forward to the improvements with the AI Uprising. That event chain is such a new player trap, where it's clearly obvious something is wrong and about to happen but not clear at all on how to fix it. Every other event chain has event options which resolve the situation, but the AI one does not, so your first time through you're waiting for an event in the chain that lets you make the decision to fix it, which will never come since the solution is in the policies window that's only touched a handful of times in a game. And then of course, on repeat play-throughs you just immediately resolve the situation once the alert comes up and never deal with the rest of the chain again.
 
My Suggestions for how I'd rather this information was presented:

Take inspiration from the Galactic Community resolution UI.

1. Have the situations listed top to bottom sorted by time until the next choice has to be made. And show estimated months until the next decision.
This works really well as a way to sort resolutions by the order in which they will be put to vote. Gives the player some focus and the ability to plan ahead with what to expect next.

2. Colour-code situations into broad categories based on the type of situation (like Yellow for commerce and industry, Purple for workers rights and diplomacy, Pale blue for technology or space events, Red for war or crisis)

3. Always move progress from left to right, but have the end point(s) be different/varied based on your choices.
So instead of the progress bar starting in the middle and going left to be friends with the underground civ and right to go to war, after the first choice the colour of the banner on that situation in the log turns Yellow, Purple, Blue or Red (with an appropriate icon) based on how you are approaching the problem.
Purple for Integrating them
Yellow for Trading with them
Blue for studying or sharing technology with them
Red for going to War with them.
Each option with a normal looking progress bar that moves from 0 to 100, left to right as progress bars normally do.

4. Treat Deficits and Disasters differently.
Add a large, fixed widget with a special icon showing the gradually increasing negatives, with bad things happening at thresholds and a scary red bar.
A second entry showing your progress towards the next positive step in resolving the effects, these can be good things, with costs depending on the path taken to resolve the situation (through Technology, Politics, Trade or Military, with costs and progress speed determined by research output, influence or unity invested, resources and pop output spent and fleet/army/starbase actions respectively).

5. Add a tab for resolved situations. I want to know what I've done and what consequences it had.

Why?
1. If you have more than about 6 situations it's going to be a mess to work out which is more urgent if it's sorted almost completely at random or by the date the situation started.
2. We already use the colours for broad categories so it's easier to understand at a glance what the situations involve, or how you were trying to resolve them (which branch of the decision tree you've gone down).
3. I'd like the system to be planned to have the flexibility to have more than 2 approaches to dealing with every situation
4. Deficits and major disasters need to be more urgent and prominent and never 4th or 40th in a long list just because you've got a lot of stuff going on right now. It's also nice to separate the positive things you can influence via past and future choices and the negative effects you are going to suffer.
5. A lot of things are lost or forgotten from game to game. I want to know what happened and not just what's happening.
 
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My Suggestions for how I'd rather this information was presented:

Take inspiration from the Galactic Community resolution UI.

1. Have the situations listed top to bottom sorted by time until the next choice has to be made. And show estimated months until the next decision.
This works really well as a way to sort resolutions by the order in which they will be put to vote. Gives the player some focus and the ability to plan ahead with what to expect next.

2. Colour-code situations into broad categories based on the type of situation (like Yellow for commerce and industry, Purple for workers rights and diplomacy, Pale blue for technology or space events, Red for war or crisis)

3. Always move progress from left to right, but have the end point(s) be different/varied based on your choices.
So instead of the progress bar starting in the middle and going left to be friends with the underground civ and right to go to war, after the first choice the colour of the banner on that situation in the log turns Yellow, Purple, Blue or Red (with an appropriate icon) based on how you are approaching the problem.
Purple for Integrating them
Yellow for Trading with them
Blue for studying or sharing technology with them
Red for going to War with them.
Each option with a normal looking progress bar that moves from 0 to 100, left to right as progress bars normally do.

4. Treat Deficits and Disasters differently.
Add a large, fixed widget with a special icon showing the gradually increasing negatives, with bad things happening at thresholds and a scary red bar.
A second entry showing your progress towards the next positive step in resolving the effects, these can be good things, with costs depending on the path taken to resolve the situation (through Technology, Politics, Trade or Military, with costs and progress speed determined by research output, influence or unity invested, resources and pop output spent and fleet/army/starbase actions respectively).

5. Add a tab for resolved situations. I want to know what I've done and what consequences it had.

Why?
1. If you have more than about 6 situations it's going to be a mess to work out which is more urgent if it's sorted almost completely at random or by the date the situation started.
2. We already use the colours for broad categories so it's easier to understand at a glance what the situations involve, or how you were trying to resolve them (which branch of the decision tree you've gone down).
3. I'd like the system to be planned to have the flexibility to have more than 2 approaches to dealing with every situation
4. Deficits and major disasters need to be more urgent and prominent and never 4th or 40th in a long list just because you've got a lot of stuff going on right now. It's also nice to separate the positive things you can influence via past and future choices and the negative effects you are going to suffer.
5. A lot of things are lost or forgotten from game to game. I want to know what happened and not just what's happening.
3 is terrible. The use of both directions allows for progress to occur in either direction

Also it's not hard to look at existing issues and spot when they'll come up next.

I agree that deficits should possibly get priority but this sounds a lot like you want the game to track priorities for you. And it seems that the game wants you to do that yourself

Eta: I agree an srchive of situations and such would be neat and allow us to see our history though.
 
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Love the look of this so far!

Any possibility of folding some existing mechanics like terraforming, crime, and/or espionage operations into the situations system? Here's some other things that could involve situations:

SituationProgress modifiersSome possible approachesPossible effectsResolutions
Reforming your government0% → 100% (empire)
> How far you're shifting your authority type.
> How many civics you're adding
> How many civics you're removing
Spend more unity per month for faster progress
> Gradual reform
> Rapid reform
> Revolution
> Costs unity per month based on empire size instead of a single up-front cost
> Authority shift can cause egalitarian or authoritarian rebellion
> Adding or removing certain civics could alter faction approval or attraction
Reform completed
Embraced a faction0% ← 50% → 100% (empire)
> Relative support between that faction and the opposing faction
> Which faction ruler leads
> Propaganda
> Spend unity
> Assign faction leaders
> Crack down on dissenters
> Decreased approval in other factions
> Greatly decreased approval in opposing faction
> Unrest events
100%: Unity reward?
0%: Rebellion
War exhaustion0% → 100% (empire)
Same way it works now, but you have a single war exhaustion situation instead of separate levels of war exhaustion for every war you're in.
0% ← n% (empire)
Decreases gradually while at peace instead of automatically resetting to 0.
> Institute a draft
> Spend consumer goods
> Propaganda campaigns
> Reduced naval capacity
> Increased pacifist ethics attraction
> Lower ship performance outside your territory
> Can start to cost unity
> Can prevent declaring additional wars
> Unrest events
100%: Forced status quo acceptance. Starts a secondary extreme war exhaustion situation that can force surrender if status quo not accepted.
Terraforming, Arcology Project, Expand Planetary Sea, etc.0% → 100% (planet)> Terraforming Gases (no longer an edict)
> Assign scientist and/or construction ship
> Assign governor with a corresponding skill
> Resource upkeep
> Some mid-situation terraforming events involving deposit manipulation or modifier removal
> Reduced pop happiness if planet is inhabited
Planet changes class / is improved
Megastructure construction0% → 100% (system?)> Recruit specialists, reducing specialist pop job output
> Spend living metal
> Close supervision from sector governor, reducing their level effects on colonies
Resource upkeepStage completed
High Crime0% ← 50% → 100% (planet)
> Crime level
> Anti-Crime Campaign
> Crime Lord Deal
> Declare Martial Law
> Send criminals to penal colony
> Crime events
> Reduced happiness / stability / trade value / output from jobs
100%: Planet rebels as a Criminal Syndicate or a criminal faction forms in your government
0%: Crime reduced, chance to close criminal branch office
Golden Age of Space Piracy0% ← 50% → 100% (empire)
Total piracy on an empire level
> Trade naval capacity for piracy protection
> Hire pirate hunters
> Increased max piracy
> Increases piracy accumulation rate
> Spawns pirate fleets
100%: A pirate empire is created and seizes some of your systems. They ally with any empires that were funding piracy via espionage.
0%: Piracy reduced, possibly gain an admiral or some ships
Being in breach of galactic law0% ← 50% → 100% (empire)
> Number of laws you're breaching
> How severely you're breaching said laws
> Assign envoys
> Spend influence
> Cover-ups
> Reduced diplomatic weight
> Reduced opinion with other galactic community members
0%: Get kicked from the Galactic Community
Subject integration0% ← 50% → 100% (empire)
> Loyalty
> Shared or opposing ethics
> Expected species rights changes
> Significant policy differences
> Assign envoy
> Assign governor
> Bribe officials
> Spend favors
> Promise not to fire leaders or replace ruler stratum pops
Costs influence
> Pops can auto resettle from subject to your empire
100%: Subject is integrated
0%: Subject rebels
Disloyal subject0% ← 50% → 100% (empire)
> Opinion
> Shared or opposing ethics
> Certain policy differences
> Assign envoy
> Spend favors
> Show of force
> Spend infiltration to increase overlord ethics attraction
> Starts paying less tribute
> May refuse to join wars
> Can't be integrated peacefully
100%: Increased opinion
0%: Subject rebels
Low federation cohesion0% ← 50% → 100% (all member empires)
> Cohesion
> Assigning envoys
> Spending influence
> Decreased diplomatic weight
> Costs influence
> Reduced effectiveness of federation perks
Empires that hit 0% leave the federation.
L-Gate investigation
(Remove the discover L-Gate clue techs)
0% → 100% (empire)
> Number of controlled or occupied systems containing L-Gates, or in empires you have research agreements with
> Number of L-Gate systems you have good intel on
> Assign scientist
> Buy info from curators
> Assign envoy to steal clues from other empires
> Spend more research
> Spend nanites (if you have some from anomalies)
Physics and engineering research upkeepGain an L-Gate clue/anomaly, then restart the situation if you don't have 7 of them yet
Precursor investigation0% → 100% (empire)> Assign meticulous or archaeologist scientist
> Spend minor relics
> Spend research
> Buy info from the Curators
Society research upkeepSpawns a precursor anomaly. Finishing investigating that anomaly restarts this situation if you haven't found their home system yet.
Genetic modification0% → 100% (empire)
> Number of pops being modified
> Medical Workers work on conversion instead of increasing pop growth / assembly
> Assign scientist
> Spend more research
> Reduce job output of pops being modified
Costs society research
> Some pops can shift template before process completes, instead of all at once
> Can cause unrest if removing higher brain functions (e.g. by adding Nerve-Stapled)
Species is modified
Robomodding0% → 100% (empire)
> Number of pops being modified
> Roboticists work on conversion instead of new robots
> Assign scientist
> Spend more research
> Reduce job output of pops being modified
Costs engineering research
> Some pops can shift template before process completes, instead of all at once
Species is modified
Self-modifications0% → 100% (planet)
> Number of low habitability pops
> How many genetic modification techs you have
0% ← n%
Situation aborted by using terraforming or gene modding to fix habitability issues.
> Spend consumer goods
> Suppress unauthorized modification
> Costs society research100%: Triggers the A New Species event chain
Uplifting0% → 100% (planet)> Assign scientist> Costs society researchUplift complete
Technological Enlightenment0% → 100% (planet)
> Civilization ethics
> Species traits
> Assign scientist
> Reduce tech progress
> Indirect enlightenment via faked discoveries
> First contact and direct enlightenment
> Costs society researchIncrease civilization's tech level by one, then restart the situation. Repeat until enlightenment complete.
Covert Infiltration0% → 100% (planet)> Biologically modified infiltrators
> Robot / internet inflitration
> Impersonate religious / mythological entities, form cults
Infiltration complete
Civilian First Contact0% → 100% (both empires)
> Surveying each other's systems
> Having ships in each others systems
> Having ships / stations / planets within sensor range
0% ← n%
Situation aborted by completing the normal first contact process
> Secure communications
> Fear campaign
> Restrict border systems
> Approaches can effect pops based on their ethics.
> Chance to speed up official contact process
100%: Civilians establish unofficial contact, giving you no control over the response and splitting the influence reward between both empires.
Espionage Operations0% → 100%Requires envoy
> Extra funding
> Assign extra envoy
> Assign another leader, depending on operation type
> Spend influence
Costs energy upkeep
> Operation events
Operation completed
Counterespionage Operation0% → 100% (empire)
> Assign leader, different classes are better at uncovering different info or interfering with different types of operations> Costs energy upkeepChance to discover info about a random empire's spy networks in your empire (or the lack thereof)
> Opinion modifier based on results and response you choose
> If discover an envoy building a spy network, can expel or attempt to capture them
> Can destroy assets or sleeper cells, or attempt to make them double agents
> Can interrupt ongoing operations
> Can discover completed operations, possibly granting a casus belli.
Certain colony events that don't currently work correctly
Cybernetic and Synthetic ascension path projects0% → 100% (empire)
> Number of pops being converted
> Roboticists and Medical Workers work on conversion instead of normal job output
> Reduced resources from pop jobs
Costs research of all types
> Risk of unrest from Spiritualist pops
> Decreased opinion from anti-robot empires, may give them a casus belli to stop the conversion
Pops are modified
Latent Psionic and Psionic ascension path0% → 100% (empire)
> Number of pops being converted
> Spend Zro
> Assign Psychic leaders
> Assign Psionic Expertise scientist
> Spend
Pops are modified
Entering the Shroud0% → 100% (empire)
> Spend Zro
> Assign Psychic leaders
> Assign Psionic Expertise scientist
> Enlist Telepaths, replacing their normal job effects
> Sacrifice some psionic pops
Costs energyShroud vision event


Regarding rebellions, could we perhaps see several systems rebelling against the same empire form a Rebel Martial Alliance?
 
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I'm not sure how often deficit situations will be relevant given the requirement is to have zero of a given resource in the stockpile. I'm almost never at zero stockpile because I can just sell what resources I do have on the galactic market and use the money to buy what i need. Unless I'm misunderstanding something.
 
I feel like a system where, after prolonged slavery/ideological division in planets, a chain reaction forcing you to take a series of decisions result in a larger or lower possibility of a revolt or uprising occurring would be more exciting. A situation system based on loading bars might be too predictable and too easy to deal with as you know more or less specifically when a revolt is going to occur as it fills up.
 
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I am absolutely thrilled by this update.
Yes!!! My body is ready for a better storytelling system in Stellaris.
As grand as Stellaris is, it's the little stories from events, archeology, anomalies, etc that build its lore.
I hope we get events for construction, espionage, diplomacy, and governors.
 
The “Empire Defaulted” modifier from a bankruptcy event should include hefty bonuses to pop demotion time, automatic pop resettlement chance, and emigration push to simulate citizen desperation in the face of economic collapse, with newly-unemployment former specialists taking menial jobs or just packing up and moving to try to find new opportunities. It also serves a metagame purpose in cushioning a potential stability crash when scores of unemployed specialists hit the streets from all of the downgraded buildings, while also easing a return to a more basic worker-stratum economy to help the empire recover. Maybe also force a economic/production policy change if an appropriate resource is in deficit?
 
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