• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

Stellaris Dev Diary #44 - Space Creature Rework

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. This is the fifth part in a multi-part dev diary about the 'Heinlein' 1.3 update and accompaying (unannounced) content DLC. The topic of today's dev diary is the changes to space creatures coming in Heinlein.

Grounding the Space Creatures (Free Feature)
I've always loved the concept of space creatures - massive beings capable of living in vacuum, travelling between the stars under their own power. With Stellaris, I felt that we went a long way with the addition and fleshing out of space creatures such as amoebas and crystalline entities, but we failed to really ground them in the setting. You encounter them, you research them, you get some information about them... but where do they come from? They're just randomly scattered throughout the galaxy, with no real sense of belonging or having come from anywhere.

This is something we've changed in Heinlein. Instead of just spawning randomly anywhere, space creatures will belong to a particular region of space. They can be found outside it, but its rare, so once you encounter more than one set of mining drones, it's likely that you've entered mining drone space. In the region of a particular space creature, in addition to finding the regular versions of these creatures, you will also find a 'nexus', a system surrounded by powerful variants in which a 'boss creature' lives, and where this particular space creature is meant to have either its origins or their 'home', so to speak. For example, in the center of mining drone space, you will find the Mining Drone Home Base, a powerful adversary that once defeated will yield some significant rewards.
TqkTImo.png

wqZrUmD.png


Space Piracy (Free Feature)
Space pirates is another area where we just didn't go far enough with our implementation. Part of that is because we lack a real trade system for them to prey on, but even so, the one-off event that spawns a few ships (that may or may not look completely different from anything else your species uses) just isn't up to par. As such, we've decided to make pirates their own type of 'space creature', with a region of space they live in, a home base and several more variants of ships. From here, they will occasionally set out to raid interstellar empires across the galaxy until one of those empires has enough and attacks them at the source.

Power and Reward Rebalancing (Free Feature)
As part of these changes, we will also be looking at the power of each space creature, tweaking or creating more variants to ensure that they do not cease being relevant as soon as the player has built a destroyer or two. We will also look at rebalancing the rewards you get for killing and researching them, to make both finding and fighting them a more rewarding experience overall. The overall aim of our changes to the power and placement space creatures is to make encounters with them them rarer but more significant.
4wViR59.png


That's all for today! Next week we'll be talking about Enclaves, a feature in the DLC that will accompany the Heinlein update.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • 163
  • 50
  • 8
Reactions:
Really looking forward to Heinlein more and more with each of these dev diaries. If it even plays half as good as it sounds this update will be a huge improvement on the base game!
 
  • 3
Reactions:
This is something we've changed in Heinlein. Instead of just spawning randomly anywhere, space creatures will belong to a particular region of space. They can be found outside it, but its rare, so once you encounter more than one set of mining drones, it's likely that you've entered mining drone space. In the region of a particular space creature, in addition to finding the regular versions of these creatures, you will also find a 'nexus', a system surrounded by powerful variants in which a 'boss creature' lives, and where this particular space creature is meant to have either its origins or their 'home', so to speak. For example, in the center of mining drone space, you will find the Mining Drone Home Base, a powerful adversary that once defeated will yield some significant rewards.
This sounds a nice development, but I will mention one thing that I have picked up in a current game that I think would be ultrafine if it was expanded/turned out to have substance: ties to Fallen Empires and game-end crises. As a 'spiritual' empire I have been told that one type of space creature is "guardian of the holy places"; I have developed a suspicion that this might relate to the origin points for the end-game crisis. I have no idea if this is true or not - and I don't want to be told for sure! But such a schema for space creatures would be really, really nice, I think. For specifics of what I have in mind I'll put it in a "spoiler" block:

For an end game crisis with hostile creatures breaking through from another dimension, the space creatures could be guarding the break-through points. As the creatures at the relevant points are killed, the chances of the crisis occurring could increase. This would make an early game crisis impossible (all the break-throughs are blocked), with the chances slowly increasing with time. The "prophets" saying the race should be left alive would have to fight the desire for the nice resources available from the systems they are in...

Similarly, reading the "War in Heaven" stuff (which I'm definitely going to get!), the mining stations could be not so much a separate phenomenon, but the automated resource gathering network left by what is now a "Fallen Empire". The technology of the mining drones might be related to the major area of FE tech., and if the FE awakens it might be able to regain control of its network...

This seems to me to have so much potential!
 
  • 13
Reactions:
It's a bit of a pity that the only thing one can do with the space creatures is slaughtering them all until not a single one remains alive in the entire galaxy. I wish we could e.g. tame them or study them peacefuly.
 
  • 8
Reactions:
Hey Wiz, can you clarify the new TRACKING parameter for weapon?

Part of combat rebalance, it affects target evasion. Details coming in another DD.
 
  • 29
Reactions:
It's a bit of a pity that the only thing one can do with the space creatures is slaughtering them all until not a single one remains alive in the entire galaxy. I wish we could e.g. tame them or study them peacefuly.

Agreed. Outside scope for Heinlein though.
 
  • 47
  • 10
  • 1
Reactions:
There was a rather nifty 'bug' that I really liked, where if a Crystalline Entity, Amoeba, etc. spawned in a system with a 'primitive' world, that primitive world would then own the creature. This rendered the otherwise hostile entity neutral and you'd see gags about stone-age civs flying around the galaxy.

It was kind of cool, however, to see them come to the defense of their 'home' civilization if you attacked the world. As if the space creature had adopted the primitives, serving as their guardian.

I am not sure if this ever got fixed, as I've taken a break from Stellaris for the time being, but it was one of the cool little things I found early on that was a genuinely nice touch.

Any chance of making this bug a genuine feature for Heinlein, @Wiz ?
 
  • 17
Reactions:
Enclaves, huh. They sound interesting
 
  • 1
Reactions:
1. Will the "creature space" overlap with "player/AI empire spawn space"? Theoretically it could be either a gamekiller or a boon to start in space where early exploration is hindered by tons and tons of aggressive spacelife on the one hand, but you are isolated from enemies on the other hand. Especially if you can have some sort of non-agression with a particular animal due to your species having been born in the same space (or maybe even share some origins - can chrystalline sentient aliens be related to space chrystals?)

2. Will AI pacifism/miliarism ethos affect how likely they are to go hunting for space creatures/go exploring into space creature space?

3. Will it be possible for a fallen empire with preservation/conservation ethos or a AI/player empire with spiritual/preservation ethos to declare some area of space where something lives a "nature preserve" and try and stop anyone from hunting/colonising there?
 
  • 11
Reactions:
¿The creatures not have sex? Maybe not the drones, but the other monster are live creatures ¿No? ¿Why they cant reproduce out of their natal system? That is my principal problem with the space creatures.
Perhaps they occupy systems with real forces. Maybe you want a particular sistem and you have a cristal creatures infestation and need wait because not have a real fleet.

The creatures give me a sensation (in good sense) of wild and virgin galaxy. When more colonize planet exist, less creatures exist (my english are limited, sorry).

Maybe you can descover ecology techs, to can coexist with them.
Or explotations techs, but perhaps so they become extinct.

you know, the ethos...
 
  • 5
  • 1
Reactions:
Will we have also a non-lethal option to drive them away when they go out of their region of space?

And the possibility of studying the boss creatures not violently?
 
  • 4
Reactions:
Looks Brilliant!

Enclaves like, colonies not connected to your capitals space?
or enclaves like on your planets, peoples from alien species or even citizens of other empires, living in a clump?
 
Will space creatures and their accompanying weapons trees, will they be competitive with mid and late game weapons?

Aside from the missiles, lasers and kinetics trees; there is a huge scope in alternative and rare weapons lines such as 'organics', 'crystalline', 'void energy' and mining laser trees. The mining laser tree should have some poor man's lance potential. It's one thing for totally alien civilisations to have the same weapons trees but it would be fantastic if we got a bit of a blurring of the rock, paper, scissors.

i hope to see a balance like that :)

@Wiz do you think it is possible?

the space pirates will have their home planet, and will expand or just the space bases?
you can deal with them? for example the payment of a sum of mineral or a percentage not to be attacked or even hire them to annoy or sabotage an empire next?
 
Last edited:
  • 1
Reactions:
These changes will make space creatures a lot more engaging. I hope we also get mid/late game crises related to space creatures.

  • Space Rabies: All the space creatures suddenly go crazy and rampage across the galaxy, destroying stations and dropping space poop tile blockers on colonies.

  • The Void Stare Back: The Void Clouds start breeding rapidly, with the excess population aggressively migrating out of their region looking for new homes. If left unchecked they will eventually occupy every black hole in the galaxy.

  • Binary Fission: The Space Amoeba start breeding rabidly, with the excess population aggressivle migrating to expand their region. If left unchecked they wipe out sentient life in the star systems bordering their original region.

  • Delved Too Deep: The Ancient Mining Drones start manufacturing more of themselves and start building Automated Ship Yards. If you intervene you will seize control of the warships produced by these shipyards. The longer you wait to intervene, the larger the fleet you get as a reward. If you wait too long, the Mining Drones awaken into an AI empire with the Automated Extractors personality. They then use their new fleet to expand their territory militarily and use robot pops to colonize planets


It would be cool if Pacifists got options to partially tame/coexist with low level space creatures, kind of like the Gaia's Stepdaughters faction in Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri. I also have some ideas for interactions between space creatures and Pacifist Fallen Empires

Pacifist Fallen Empires are Serene Cultivators.

These empires are self-appointed caretakers of the galaxy and its myriad lifeforms. Bear in mind that this is not the same thing as believing in the universal sancticity of sentient life. The star systems in and near Cultivator territory are teeming with Space Fauna, which breed and then migrate across the galaxy. Many of these space fauna are more unique, numerous, and powerful than normal. So while Pacifist FEs don't directly forbid you from colonizing nearby, doing so requires an expensive upfront investment in alien pest control. Plus, even if you successfully settle a planet, a giant herd of space cows can still periodically stampede through the system, eat all your stations, and drop space poop tile blockers on your new colony.

Examples of Serene Cultivator Requests and Demands:

  • Find and return a Void Cloud that ran away from home. Bring it in alive and unharmed, the poor dear is probably scared out of its wits
  • Several star systems traditionally used as Space Amoebas breeding grounds have been colonized by lesser empires. If you are one of these empires, the *Cultivators will politely request that you abandon those planets by either resettling or purging the offending pops . If you are not a filthy space polluter, you can earn browny points by using the abandon planet war goal against empires who are
  • A rare breed of Crystalline Entity has been spotted in a far off corner of the galaxy. Collect a specimen for the Cultivators to use as a breeding stud
  • We misplaced several boxes full of Psionic Titanic Xenomorph eggs a couple of millenia back. If you could go find those for us, that would be great
  • Stop smashing those vintage antique Mining Drones! They belong in a museum!
  • Demolish a percentage of your buildings, stations, and fleet capacity in order to prevent something they call "galactic warming". Probably fake.
Cultivators offer especially exotic rewards, such as tamed Space Amoeba with the fleet strength of a battleship, eternal youth genesplicing tech, nurgle-tier bioweapons, semi-sentient slave pops that have been specially bred/lobotimized for obedience and cuteness, giant Tiyanki that eat stars,
and psi emitters that attract space fauna to attack a star system.


Space poop tile blockers guys. Think about it.
 
  • 26
Reactions:
Another good dev diary. Stellar creatures are just a minor aspect of the game, but I'm glad to see they're being fleshed out a bit -- and I agree with a previous poster that it gives the galaxy a "geography" with various species native to certain regions. Ideally, this could also be tied to various stellar phenomena such as nebulae for gas grazers?

To clarify: Is it intended/planned for there to be a proper trade system at some point down the road? I ask because at the moment there's nothing to organically tie the empires together, or to each other, and it's something an otherwise great game glaringly lacks.
If you're not averse to playing with mods, perhaps check out Civilian Trade in the Steam Workshop.

Another mod, Fight for Universe, also has a pretty ingenious way of introducing trade by adding planetary Food Import/Export starports -- the export version detracts 5 Food from a planet and generates 1 "Food Supplies" as a new strategic resource, whereas the import version requires 1 Food Supplies to function and provides +5 Food to the planet. They can be upgraded for free to increase requirements/production. In addition to allowing for "breadbasket" worlds, this also allows you to trade Food with other empires!

Ultimately, I too would like to see trade and espionage become a thing for Stellaris in the vanilla game, of course; both sound like they'd complement existing mechanics well. Some day, perhaps. :)
 
  • 3
Reactions:
Great features. Good to see that the team know about their past mistakes. That's a great step towards success!
I can't wait for the next DD!
 
As far as the pirates go, would there be only a single "nexus" for them, or multiple? Space creatures would need some time, possibly ages to form on one planet and venture out into the galaxy (I guess) but pirate lairs could spring up more frequently I reckon.

It would also b pretty cool to have pirates set up shop in certain systems, and if nearby empires ignore them, the lawlessness of the region attracts more and more pirates.
 
Not for Heinlein, but entirely possible in the future, yes (that is not a promise though).

The lack of a tangible economy makes the Stellaris universe feel hollow. You're probably tired of hearing this, but the economy in Distant Worlds is pretty dang amazing and should be an example to follow imho.
 
  • 6
  • 4
  • 1
Reactions: