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Stellaris Dev Diary #85: Decadence and Ascension Path Changes

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today's dev diary is the last dev diary for the 1.8 'Čapek' update, and will be going over the introduction of Awakened Empire Decadence and some changes coming to the three Ascension Paths and Megastructures. Decadence is a free feature in the 1.8 update, while the Ascension Path and Megastructure changes require the Utopia expansion.

Awakened Empire Decadence
Awakened Empires were added to the game as a way of throwing a new challenge at the player in the late-game. They are intended to be formidable foes, and only the absolutely most powerful player empires are meant to be able to take them on alone. However, this could lead to an unintended game state where the Awakened Empire had conquered or subjugated all regular empires and effectively 'won', with the player being stuck as an AE subject until the end of time. In order to address this, we've added a new mechanic called Decadence for Awakened Empires. Decadence is effectively a meter, going from 0 to 100, that starts filling up for Awakened Empires once a certain amount of time has passed since awakening. The larger they are (both in terms of owned planets and subjugated empires), the faster it builds up. Decadence reduces Awakened Empire resource income and fleet power, and also increases the rebelliousness of their subjects, and has very large penalties at high levels of Decadence. What this means it that while an Awakened Empire might start very strong, and grow even stronger as they expand, that very expansion will eventually turn into decline, until they're weakened to the point where the rest of the galaxy can rebel and overthrow them - if you end up their subject, you just have to be patient, build up your forces, and wait for the right moment to take back your freedom. Awakened Empires have also been changed so that they prefer to subjugate other empires (though still taking some planets as well) to conquering them outright, so there should always be a collection of subjects chafing under the precursor yoke and biding their time.
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Ascension Path Changes
One of the most loved features in Utopia is the Ascension Paths - the ability to choose an 'end goal' for your empire and species in the form of Psionic, Synthetic or Biological Ascension. However, the decision to restrict the Psionic and Synthetic paths based on ethics was less popular, and though I think the reasoning for it is sound (making ethics more diverse), this is a case where I think there is a valid case to say that balance should take a step back in favor of letting the player decide the path or their own empire. For this reason, we've lifted the Spiritualist-only restriction on psionics and have opened up for Spiritualists to research robotics and synthetically ascend. We have also removed the Materialist-only restriction on AI Citizen Rights.

To compensate for this loss, Spiritualists have received a buff in the form of stronger Temples, and Materialists have been given a new living standard called 'Academic Privilege' that boosts happiness and research output at the cost of more consumer goods. However, though we've lifted the hard restriction, the impact of the ascension paths on ethics attraction and faction happiness remain. This means that, for example, a Spiritualist empire that decides to Synthetically Ascend will have significant troubles with unhappy factions and materialist ethics drift, and similarly, the pursuit of Psionics will cause increased Spiritualist attraction and the likely creation of a strong Spiritualist faction.

In addition to these more general changes, there's a few more path-specific changes and additions:
Psionic: Buffed traits and Psi Corps building, and added an alert to tell you when the Shroud is ready for use. Additionally, psionically awakening other species in your empire now happens more often.
Synthetic: Added the ability to assimilate new biological pops into synthetic bodies, and the addition of robomodding significantly buffs this path. Synthetic and Cyborg leader traits were nerfed a bit to compensate.
Biological: Increased the total trait points by 1, and reduced the cost of advanced traits such as Robust.
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Megastructure Changes
The headline feature of Utopia was the Megastructures, massive constructions requiring tens of thousands of minerals and decades to construct. A frequent criticism we have received for the Megastructures is that they simply do not feel significant enough, with comments on how the Dyson Sphere should realistically be producing millions of energy, and so on. We've made some changes in 1.8 that we hope will address some of these complaints, though I want to preface this by saying that Megastructures are not and will never be 'realistic', nor is Stellaris meant to be a realistic game in the first place. However, they are meant to feel impressive and special, and when a handful of Habitats with solar power processors can match a Dyson Sphere in output, that impressiveness tends to fade, no matter whether it's actually balanced or not.

For this reason, we have decided to make a change to the Dyson Sphere and Science Nexus. Both of these Megastructures have been majorly buffed, with a finished Dyson Sphere now producing 1000 energy and a fully upgraded Science Nexus outputting a total of ~750 science. However, they have been changed so that each empire can now only build one of each, similar to the Sentry Array. This means that they can be very powerful without having to massively increase the build time or cost to prevent them from simply being spammed. Ringworlds have not been changed, and can be built in any number you want, indirectly buffing the effectiveness of the Circle of Life perk.

Additionally, we've made a tweak to the Master Builders perk. This perk, when taken, will now give you the Mega-Engineering technology if you do not already have it, similar to how World Shaper gives Atmospheric Manipulation and Mastery of Nature gives blocker techs. This allows for reliable access to Mega-Engineering for empires that want to focus on Megastructure construction.
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That's all for today! Next week we'll post the full patch notes for 1.8 and Synthetic Dawn. See you then!
 
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In my last test game I had 2 fully finished Ringworlds several decades before the Unbidden showed up.
:)

Impressive!

Did you have a large enough fleet to counter the initial crisis invasion? (What ever that might have been)

Did the changes mentioned in the DD help getting two full ring worlds set up so quickly?
 
Awakened Empire Decadence
[snip]

Sounds like a really good system to avoid AE's steamrolling everything on their path. Love the fact that their decline is gradual, and thus, you cannot really be sure of when it is a good moment to get ridd off their yoke.

Ascension Path Changes
One of the most loved features in Utopia is the Ascension Paths - the ability to choose an 'end goal' for your empire and species in the form of Psionic, Synthetic or Biological Ascension. However, the decision to restrict the Psionic and Synthetic paths based on ethics was less popular, and though I think the reasoning for it is sound (making ethics more diverse), this is a case where I think there is a valid case to say that balance should take a step back in favor of letting the player decide the path or their own empire. For this reason, we've lifted the Spiritualist-only restriction on psionics and have opened up for Spiritualists to research robotics and synthetically ascend. We have also removed the Materialist-only restriction on AI Citizen Rights.

I feel conflicted about this. Despite the community's feedback, I was more on the Wiz's side here, I loved to see how different ascensions tied with each ethos and hoped to see more ethoi-specific ascensions. Still, if that's the price to pay in order to play psi cyborgs, so be it.

To compensate for this loss, Spiritualists have received a buff in the form of stronger Temples, and Materialists have been given a new living standard called 'Academic Privilege' that boosts happiness and research output at the cost of more consumer goods.

Academic Privilege sounds cool and a great way to nudge materialism towards eligaritarianism! Curious about the exact temple numbers, they've gotta be big in order to compensate for the loss of Shroud exclusivity.

In addition to these more general changes, there's a few more path-specific changes and additions:
Psionic: Buffed traits and Psi Corps building, and added an alert to tell you when the Shroud is ready for use. Additionally, psionically awakening other species in your empire now happens more often.
Synthetic: Added the ability to assimilate new biological pops into synthetic bodies, and the addition of robomodding significantly buffs this path. Synthetic and Cyborg leader traits were nerfed a bit to compensate.
Biological: Increased the total trait points by 1, and reduced the cost of advanced traits such as Robust.

Sounds like good way to buff each path. Make them excell at different aspects instead of making them the same. Would love to see new exclusive biological ascension traits someday, too! It would be also good to see psiconic species being able to either "mentor" other species inside their empire so they can also ascend psiconically as well, or learn the secrets of the Shroud from other already ascended species.

Megastructure Changes

The headline feature of Utopia was the Megastructures, massive constructions requiring tens of thousands of minerals and decades to construct. A frequent criticism we have received for the Megastructures is that they simply do not feel significant enough, with comments on how the Dyson Sphere should realistically be producing millions of energy, and so on. We've made some changes in 1.8 that we hope will address some of these complaints, though I want to preface this by saying that Megastructures are not and will never be 'realistic', nor is Stellaris meant to be a realistic game in the first place. However, they are meant to feel impressive and special, and when a handful of Habitats with solar power processors can match a Dyson Sphere in output, that impressiveness tends to fade, no matter whether it's actually balanced or not.
[/QUOTE]

The realistic argument is cool to discuss from a philosophical point of view, but it is useless from a game balance perspective. The problem with megastructures were that they didn't felt "wondrous enough" due to their previous poor cost VS benefit ratio.

For this reason, we have decided to make a change to the Dyson Sphere and Science Nexus. Both of these Megastructures have been majorly buffed, with a finished Dyson Sphere now producing 1000 energy and a fully upgraded Science Nexus outputting a total of ~750 science. However, they have been changed so that each empire can now only build one of each, similar to the Sentry Array. This means that they can be very powerful without having to massively increase the build time or cost to prevent them from simply being spammed. Ringworlds have not been changed, and can be built in any number you want, indirectly buffing the effectiveness of the Circle of Life perk.

Additionally, we've made a tweak to the Master Builders perk. This perk, when taken, will now give you the Mega-Engineering technology if you do not already have it, similar to how World Shaper gives Atmospheric Manipulation and Mastery of Nature gives blocker techs. This allows for reliable access to Mega-Engineering for empires that want to focus on Megastructure construction.

Thanks God for all of that these changes. I think that making megastructures limited to one for each empire is the way to go, definitely. Now the question will be: Will ring worlds be able to compete toe to toe agaist habitats?
 
1.8 and Synthetic Dawn look really good. Well done Paradox!

What happens if you conquer all Servitor planets with organics and they are left with no Bio trophies? Will they simply have to find more, of a different species?
 
Impressive!

Did you have a large enough fleet to counter the initial crisis invasion? (What ever that might have been)

Did the changes mentioned in the DD help getting two full ring worlds set up so quickly?
I had ~1.9k Fleet Power (with a NF Cap of ~1.4k - this included a NF nerf across the board) ready when they came in, so I was able to take them out pretty quickly with Defender of the Galaxy.
Economy wise I could probably have gone to ~2.5k if necessary, but since a war of attrition didn't work too well against the Unbidden, I opted for the quicker solution.

The biggest game changer is that you can now reliably unlock Mega Engineering, so I started my first Ringworld construction around year 70.
 
I want this. Having a big empire should come with the risk of things falling apart due to iever increasing internal threats.

Should also help with balancing playing tall vs wide.

I want it too. But I would probably start creating vassals before it happened and release them eventually. Some with their own modified species, like in Perry Rhodan.
 
Awakened Empires / Decadence
I like this, and kind of wish there was more of this among conventional empires, too. In all my playthroughs so far: it's been far too easy to maintain persistent galaxy-spanning empires. Factions need to be more robust and testy, and perhaps hive minds should be susceptible to event chains that can cause planets to lose their hive cohesion.

Dyson Spheres
I'm less enthused about this. It's great to see them get an energy production buff for realism-purposes, but we lost one hard-restriction (ethics) only to gain another (one-sphere cap). Furthermore, by mid-game I usually have virtually unlimited energy & don't really need more. I'd rather the one-sphere cap be dropped & energy needs+usage increased, especially in mid+late game. Galaxy-spanning empires should need to build these.

Some minor thoughts on Dyson Spheres-

(1) I'd love for construction time+costs as well as energy production to vary by star type, with some perhaps requiring additional tech (black holes + neutron stars, in particular) but perhaps generating Physics output.

(2) It'd be interesting if stars on the galactic map would change appearance if a Dyson Sphere surrounds them. Though in reality it would probably seem to disappear, I could see that'd not be too UI-friendly.
 
Did I get something wrong...?
Why are changes to features from other DLC/Packs (Megastructures and Ascension Paths) tied to a Machine Story Pack?

Edit: Damn it, Wiz said Utopia DLC is required :/
 
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i dont know about this fallen empires nerf.
I Played like less then 1k hours of stellaris, finished my Last 5 Games on very hard difficulty with high agression, max empires, Always with 3-4 fallen empires on 600-800 Star maps( i sadly cant go above, cause my PC is crap and lategame becomes unplayable slow.
And i only saw once a fallen empire take over 1/3 of the Galaxy bevor i roflstomped them to dust...
are you guys now fixing AI behavier because ur playerbase (random dudes which never played grand strategy bevor) are crying about the Game beeing to hard?
This is how Blizzard destroyed WoW, lowering the difficulty so every braindead noob can win...
At least if you have to nerf it, make it optional in the gamesettings to turn this fallen empire decadence crap on Or off. I World like to loose more often.
I thought that is what paradox Games are all about. Having fun, while loosing and learning and Improving on your gameplay to give it another try.
 
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Awakened Empire Decadence
It isn't clear from the description, would I be correct in assuming that each AE has its own Decadence meter? Also, will this value be visible to the player?
However, they have been changed so that each empire can now only build one of each
How does this interact with ruined megastructures? If I repair a ruined Science Nexus, does that mean I can never build one of my own? Or if I build one of my own, will the ruined Science Nexus just sit there, unrepairable?
 
As a Fanatic Materialist Egalitarian, am I the only one very concerned at the over lap between utopian abundance and the new materialist living standard? This is really worrying me actually, as short of having once species set up for research, and another everything but, the value of each now seems at least slightly reduced. I could be entirely wrong. Please tell me why before you get mad. In addition, I can't help but feel that the materialist ties to AI are very loose now? Am I right in saying that it's now just a few buffs as opposed to actual features like temples, full bombardment and purging?

Edit: don't get me wrong, I love everything but this :) great job!
 
Did I get something wrong...?
Why are changes to features from other DLC/Packs (Megastructures and Ascension Paths) tied to a Machine Story Pack?

They are not. They come along with the free update. Read dev diary again.
 
You can already check them on steam.
Great, thanks for that!

624f421f050eed8d251a62ada9e1620c2d6ec52b.jpg

Rise of the Machines
As a Determined Exterminator, conquer or eliminate all biological Empires in the galaxy.

548514b6e431da1e150d9715cc1cde731d4a5c3e.jpg

Distinctiveness Added
As a Driven Assimilator, own cyborg Pops of at least 5 different species.

8ee04525f03f75424651eb042f9e0e59e6afdc32.jpg

Retirement Home
As a Rogue Servitor, own at least 10 Pops from Fallen Empires.

21e560c9695fb22a6e750dd9387e8a76550d5ffc.jpg

Does Not Compute
Shut down the Contingency plan.

4d38e171b9e90131aca0d2697b18071445cef25f.jpg

Planet of the Mechs
Terraform a planet into a Machine World.
 
Awakened Empires / Decadence
I like this, and kind of wish there was more of this among conventional empires, too. In all my playthroughs so far: it's been far too easy to maintain persistent galaxy-spanning empires. Factions need to be more robust and testy, and perhaps hive minds should be susceptible to event chains that can cause planets to lose their hive cohesion.

Dyson Spheres
I'm less enthused about this. It's great to see them get an energy production buff for realism-purposes, but we lost one hard-restriction (ethics) only to gain another (one-sphere cap). Furthermore, by mid-game I usually have virtually unlimited energy & don't really need more. I'd rather the one-sphere cap be dropped & energy needs+usage increased, especially in mid+late game. Galaxy-spanning empires should need to build these.

Some minor thoughts on Dyson Spheres-

(1) I'd love for construction time+costs as well as energy production to vary by star type, with some perhaps requiring additional tech (black holes + neutron stars, in particular) but perhaps generating Physics output.

(2) It'd be interesting if stars on the galactic map would change appearance if a Dyson Sphere surrounds them. Though in reality it would probably seem to disappear, I could see that'd not be too UI-friendly.
Agreed on both counts here- while I'd sort of stopped thinking about it, back when I first started playing I remember a lot of talk about how rebellious worlds should be made to work better; post-Factions, I've never had a single world slip out from under my control, which is a real shame because I thought "your colony wants independence!" was a really cool mechanic.

As for the Dyson Sphere cap, yeah, I'm disappointed. I also love the idea of them changing the galaxy map appearance- I had a similar idea ages ago about how it'd be cool if the Unbidden portals made the system they were in become like, an Eye Of Terror or something.