• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

Stellaris Dev Diary #85: Decadence and Ascension Path Changes

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today's dev diary is the last dev diary for the 1.8 'Čapek' update, and will be going over the introduction of Awakened Empire Decadence and some changes coming to the three Ascension Paths and Megastructures. Decadence is a free feature in the 1.8 update, while the Ascension Path and Megastructure changes require the Utopia expansion.

Awakened Empire Decadence
Awakened Empires were added to the game as a way of throwing a new challenge at the player in the late-game. They are intended to be formidable foes, and only the absolutely most powerful player empires are meant to be able to take them on alone. However, this could lead to an unintended game state where the Awakened Empire had conquered or subjugated all regular empires and effectively 'won', with the player being stuck as an AE subject until the end of time. In order to address this, we've added a new mechanic called Decadence for Awakened Empires. Decadence is effectively a meter, going from 0 to 100, that starts filling up for Awakened Empires once a certain amount of time has passed since awakening. The larger they are (both in terms of owned planets and subjugated empires), the faster it builds up. Decadence reduces Awakened Empire resource income and fleet power, and also increases the rebelliousness of their subjects, and has very large penalties at high levels of Decadence. What this means it that while an Awakened Empire might start very strong, and grow even stronger as they expand, that very expansion will eventually turn into decline, until they're weakened to the point where the rest of the galaxy can rebel and overthrow them - if you end up their subject, you just have to be patient, build up your forces, and wait for the right moment to take back your freedom. Awakened Empires have also been changed so that they prefer to subjugate other empires (though still taking some planets as well) to conquering them outright, so there should always be a collection of subjects chafing under the precursor yoke and biding their time.
2017_09_07_1.png


Ascension Path Changes
One of the most loved features in Utopia is the Ascension Paths - the ability to choose an 'end goal' for your empire and species in the form of Psionic, Synthetic or Biological Ascension. However, the decision to restrict the Psionic and Synthetic paths based on ethics was less popular, and though I think the reasoning for it is sound (making ethics more diverse), this is a case where I think there is a valid case to say that balance should take a step back in favor of letting the player decide the path or their own empire. For this reason, we've lifted the Spiritualist-only restriction on psionics and have opened up for Spiritualists to research robotics and synthetically ascend. We have also removed the Materialist-only restriction on AI Citizen Rights.

To compensate for this loss, Spiritualists have received a buff in the form of stronger Temples, and Materialists have been given a new living standard called 'Academic Privilege' that boosts happiness and research output at the cost of more consumer goods. However, though we've lifted the hard restriction, the impact of the ascension paths on ethics attraction and faction happiness remain. This means that, for example, a Spiritualist empire that decides to Synthetically Ascend will have significant troubles with unhappy factions and materialist ethics drift, and similarly, the pursuit of Psionics will cause increased Spiritualist attraction and the likely creation of a strong Spiritualist faction.

In addition to these more general changes, there's a few more path-specific changes and additions:
Psionic: Buffed traits and Psi Corps building, and added an alert to tell you when the Shroud is ready for use. Additionally, psionically awakening other species in your empire now happens more often.
Synthetic: Added the ability to assimilate new biological pops into synthetic bodies, and the addition of robomodding significantly buffs this path. Synthetic and Cyborg leader traits were nerfed a bit to compensate.
Biological: Increased the total trait points by 1, and reduced the cost of advanced traits such as Robust.
2017_09_07_2.png


Megastructure Changes
The headline feature of Utopia was the Megastructures, massive constructions requiring tens of thousands of minerals and decades to construct. A frequent criticism we have received for the Megastructures is that they simply do not feel significant enough, with comments on how the Dyson Sphere should realistically be producing millions of energy, and so on. We've made some changes in 1.8 that we hope will address some of these complaints, though I want to preface this by saying that Megastructures are not and will never be 'realistic', nor is Stellaris meant to be a realistic game in the first place. However, they are meant to feel impressive and special, and when a handful of Habitats with solar power processors can match a Dyson Sphere in output, that impressiveness tends to fade, no matter whether it's actually balanced or not.

For this reason, we have decided to make a change to the Dyson Sphere and Science Nexus. Both of these Megastructures have been majorly buffed, with a finished Dyson Sphere now producing 1000 energy and a fully upgraded Science Nexus outputting a total of ~750 science. However, they have been changed so that each empire can now only build one of each, similar to the Sentry Array. This means that they can be very powerful without having to massively increase the build time or cost to prevent them from simply being spammed. Ringworlds have not been changed, and can be built in any number you want, indirectly buffing the effectiveness of the Circle of Life perk.

Additionally, we've made a tweak to the Master Builders perk. This perk, when taken, will now give you the Mega-Engineering technology if you do not already have it, similar to how World Shaper gives Atmospheric Manipulation and Mastery of Nature gives blocker techs. This allows for reliable access to Mega-Engineering for empires that want to focus on Megastructure construction.
2017_09_07_3.png


That's all for today! Next week we'll post the full patch notes for 1.8 and Synthetic Dawn. See you then!
 
Last edited:
i dont know about this fallen empires nerf.
I Played like less then 1k hours of stellaris, finished my Last 5 Games on very hard difficulty with high agression, max empires, Always with 3-4 fallen empires on 600-800 Star maps( i sadly cant go above, cause my PC is crap and lategame becomes unplayable slow.
And i only saw once a fallen empire take over 1/3 of the Galaxy bevor i roflstomped them to dust...
Apparently be capable of lose the game is considered a design problem.
 
The tech requirements of many of the ascension perks are very annoying and makes me have to save several ascension points till I have the techs. I understand that this block is so these buildings come a certain time in the timeline... But its frustrating having to check stellaris wiki to see the requirements for the requirements for the requirements (e.g. habitats or biological acension path)... And very non intuitive for new players.
 
Apparently be capable of lose the game is considered a design problem.
The problem is that getting turned into a vassal of an Awakened Empire didn't make you lose the game, it just put you in gridlock.

So Paradox had two options to address this: either make that a really boring and unsatisfying loss condition, or introduce new mechanics to break the gridlock.
 
The problem is that getting turned into a vassal of an Awakened Empire didn't make you lose the game, it just put you in gridlock.

So Paradox had two options to address this: either make that a really boring and unsatisfying loss condition, or introduce new mechanics to break the gridlock.

And they DID it in a surprisingly elegant way.

Way to go, Martin!
 
What would happen to your vassal when War in Hell starts? Do they still get to leave you and join one of each AEs?

Technically, they shouldn't. This would spark a war. Vassals should stay with their previous overlord, and Federations should (primarily / more often) stay together. It's all in my opinion, of course.
 
Technically, they shouldn't. This would spark a war. Vassals should stay with their previous overlord, and Federations should (primarily / more often) stay together. It's all in my opinion, of course.
Dev should clarify this. The previous mechanism was really bonkers, and not fun. I either integrate all my vassals before Hell War or just beat the FE's before they turn.
 
Question: has any thought been given to simply starting Fallen Empires off as Awakened Empires but at full Decadence?

Not yet sure if I agree or disagree! It'd definitely be a neat mechanic... perhaps a small percent chance of generated FEs instead generating as a large-but-collapsing AE at game-start? I'd be curious how that might work into early and mid-game, how it'd affect nearby empires, and how broken-off empires might fare.
 
Harder, better, faster, stronger...hmmm, I see what you did there
 
No words.... should have brought a poet.

Seriously though, super syked about the changes. Now my cyber Sith empire can become a reality :)

Edit: Just realized this won't be possible.... back to mods then. Shame. I still think that the 1st level of synthetic ascension should be available to psionic ascended empires.
 
Last edited:
The problem is that getting turned into a vassal of an Awakened Empire didn't make you lose the game, it just put you in gridlock.

So Paradox had two options to address this: either make that a really boring and unsatisfying loss condition, or introduce new mechanics to break the gridlock.

Though it'd be a neat story to become vassalised, bide your time, demand civil rights for your people, possibly go through some degree of resistance or rebellion, achieve citizen rights, demand that your people become eligible for being leader of the AE, take over diplomatically, reemerge as the controller of the AE & rapidly integrate your vassal-kin.

...Granted, the time involved in this would make for rather painful gameplay.
 
You lose only when you give up, or being completely destroyed. This is not the case. They fixed the state of the game when in becomes tedious and uninteresting.
So you never lose the game, regular AI empires are a joke, AEs now are just a "accept vassalization and wait for your innevitable win", internal revolts and problems are pratically inexistent, and crisis are easily defeated after you learn the basics about fleet design.
Currently, Stellaris is just a game where is impossible lose if you dont is actively restraining yourself or dont is a new player and this is a very bad desgin.
 
Decadence won't change anything for me. I will either try to defeat them quickly to prevent them from getting too strong or make sure I'm the first one to defeat them before someone else get the rewards. So I'm not worried that it will be easier.
 
How do I see how decadent the fallen empire is @Wiz is it just displayed where trust would be?