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Tinto Flavour #14 - 17th of April 2025 - The Papal States

Hello, and welcome to another session of our Tinto Flavour. This week we are continuing with the Christian Easter feel by taking a look at the Papal States.

Since its creation by the hand of Saint Peter himself, the Catholic Church has been guiding all of humanity to salvation through the ages, thanks to the leadership of the bishop of Rome, the Pope.

Starting with the Donation of Pepin, the blessed Papal States were created to both govern and help the faithful. However, the last decades have been a constant struggle as the death of Pope Bonifatius VIII Gaetani Aquila forced the relocation of the court to the exclave of Avignon, as the Papacy fell under the influence of King Philippe IV the Fair Capet, and its holdings in Italy were dominated by quarreling noble families.

What will the vicar of Christ do? Will he fully become a puppet of the Kingdom of France and allow the temporal rule over the spiritual? Or will he break free and rise to the position at the top of Creation that God himself intended for its Church?
Click to expand...

Let’s look at the country directly:
Pope.png

As usual, consider all art as WIP.​

And here are the lands they have, taking into account that their capital is in Avignon, not in Rome.
Country Map.png


They start with a special government reform, unique to the Papacy:
Holy See.png


And they also have some special privileges, representing their division between their French and Italian holdings:
French Cardinals.png

Powerful Italian Families.png


And also a unique policy:
Papacy Policy.png


They also have a work of art:
Palais des Papes.png


And here are some of their unique advances:
Word of the Lord.png

Glory to Rome.png

Donation of Constantine.png

Holy Father.png


One particular characteristic of the Papacy is that their succession is not like the rest of the countries. As such, they have a special succession law:
Papal Conclave.png


That makes it so that when a Pope dies, the country enters into a Papal Conclave Regency, and eventually it will be resolved with an event firing, where the player will be able to choose between some of the cardinals available.
Conclave Regency.png

Conclave Election.png


Here are some more events available to the Papacy:
Castello Event.png


Giving access to this special building:
Castello.png


And events for some special individuals:
Raffael.png

Galileo.png

Borgia.png

I’m sure this last one will have no repercussions whatsoever…​

There’s also some events about some famous "refurbishings":
Sistine Chapel.png

Sistine Chapel Artists.png

Saint Peter.png

Saint Peter Monument.png


… and much more, but that is all we will show for today. Next week we will go to the military branch of Christianity by taking a look at the Military Orders of the Teutonic & Livonian Orders and Knights Hospitallers. See you there.
 
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Roger Corominas said:
There's currently nothing forcing them to stay using Latin, although there's no much incentive for them to change either. However, we may disallow them from changing altogether, as it would probably make sense.
Click to expand...
I think the only time it could change is if during the council of Trent they go more conciliatory with the Protestants to have a law that allows them to use the vernacular of the masses
 
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I hope you make a mechanic for cardinals to be loyal to rulers or the papacy, and then when you elect a new ruler as the papal state, you can only influence the votes of your loyal cardinals, if your preferd character becomes the poed depends what the other rulers told their cardinals to vote for.
 
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Magj101 said:
I think the only time it could change is if during the council of Trent they go more conciliatory with the Protestants to have a law that allows them to use the vernacular of the masses
Click to expand...
I wonder if going full conciliatory in the council of Trent (marriage of priests, language of the masses, etc) can mend the schism caused by the reformation even if it happens in only 1/10 or 1/20 games.
 
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cumaethor said:
I actually prefer horizontal - vertical distinction. As you would be able to see at a glance, with out reading the header, what is Production Method and what is for construction .
Click to expand...
I feel the position would provide the difference. I think the horizontal is easier to take in with a glance rather than needing to connect the value to the good while also taking in the whole group (Yes, this one is a singular line but that hasn't been the case with other building types
 
You've mentioned before that the Papal States would "re-emerge" if conquered; maybe the Papacy should become a BBC if conquered? (Catholic rulers would have to allow it, if all country of a different faith conquers Rome, then it might be given a choice if it allows for a BBC Papacy in Rome)
 
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1. It says artist under Galileo Galilei. Are all scientists called artists?
2. Is it possible for the Papal States to change their form of succession? It's said Alexander VI (Borgia pope) tried or at least wanted to make papacy hereditary.
3. If the Papal States change their succession, will it still be called the Papal States and be head of the Catholic church?
4. Are there any exceptions to the "Blocked from forming countries" by some event or something, can Papal States form Italy or Rome? If so, is the abovementioned change of succession a prequisite?
5. Is the fate of the Papal States and the Papacy fixed in some form if someone else forms Italy or Rome?
 
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It feels so odd that the Curia has so much control. Honestly the way it was in eu4 was a bit better representative. The cardinals would vote, make a Pope from a country and that country would have more ability to use the Pope and the Pope would be in the Papal States with his own abilities. Some of the mechanics need to be changed more in line with the Pope being more in control and the Curia just having the ability to elect the Pope. They can propose things and maybe bribe the pope kinda like a parliament maybe? But that’s about it.
 
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But... But... At game start all the italian papal holdings are in turmoil, most of the cities are Ghibelline and only nominally under the Papal State since they weren't paying any tithe or giving any levy.

Giovanni di Vico is still podestá of Rome but will be in few years time de facto duke of Latium and Umbria, I mean the Pope invoked an effing Crusade to take back his holdings... And instead we got the big white blob...

Where is Albornoz? Where are the powerful cities? Where are the Papal Purges?
 
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