Tinto Talks #18 - 26th of June 2024

[gcpt]

It will be possible for countries with specific policies, yes.

Venetian and Genovese debt trap "hiring" are also included here?

 

[Pavía]

Question:

Will we be able to see how far back a succession line goes, and will we be able to see heirs of foreign households claims in succession? Will we be able to choose an heir from another country or kingdom?

Will estates start to build their own building types without the player’s assistance?

1. I'm not entirely sure how far it's going to be possible to show in the UI, but yes, it will be possible to have heirs of foreign households, if they're eligible enough.
2. Already mentioned by Johan a few TTs ago, estates are able to build buildings on their own.

 

[Ispil]

Of course, there are many.

I'd assume that Byzantine Law would be around for the various countries that would apply to?

And if you're feeling like having an extra bit of fun, Serbian law as a thing that shows up within 10 years of the start date as "Byzantine law but we added a whole new thing to cover all the specific cases pertinent to Serbs", i.e. Dušan's Code.

I wouldn't really know how it would especially differ mechanically, but it's those little things, y'know? Having Serbia transition from Milutin's Code to Dušan's Code for their legal code.

 

[AlexandruRadu]

Common Law for now, with the option to switch to Civil Law. Nothing stopping us from making a unique legal code for them though if you have some suggestions for how it could work.

Scotland would just have seen the compiling (probably) of the Regiam Majestatem, which attempted to suppress private courts and other decentralized institutions in favor of an emphasis on royal majesty and kingly power. However, the Regiam was:
1. Incomplete because the guy who wrote it probably died halfway through
2. Is a digest based on the Common Law "Glanvill" digest (with selective edits towards Justinian's Institutes to emphasize royal power)
3. Is intentionally archaic by choosing to use old temporal law, mish-mashed with new Papal decrees
4. Was only recognized by the Scottish parliament as one of the authoritative texts of Scottish law in the 1400s and then subjected to a lot of reform
5. Was rebuked by Viscount Stair in the Institutions of the Law of Scotland as "not-Scottish" and sidelined for the later half of the game's timeline.

So it would be something like a legal code that boosts centralization and crown power at the cost of lower stability (because it's not done) and making estates unhappy (you are taking away their traditional rights and imposing English law). And then later on you'd potentially be able to change it for an improved legal code?

Source: Taylor, A. (2021) ‘What Does Regiam maiestatem Actually Say (and What Does it Mean)?’, in W. Eves et al. (eds.) Common Law, Civil Law, and Colonial Law: Essays in Comparative Legal History from the Twelfth to the Twentieth Centuries. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, pp. 47–85.

 

[Cosrau]

Is Brehon Law an option for the Irish clans/nations to use instead of Civil or Common Law? It would be interesting flavour for them I think considering it was still found in quite a lot of Ireland until the end of the Nine Years War in 1607.

 

[SaintDaveUK]

Is Brehon Law an option for the Irish clans/nations to use instead of Civil or Common Law? It would be interesting flavour for them I think considering it was still found in quite a lot of Ireland until the end of the Nine Years War in 1607.

Yep we have Irish countries starting with Brehon Law and Tanistry

 

[sermaciej]

Will there be laws regarding whether the peasants pay rent or have to work for their overlord, and how much they have to pay/work, affecting nobles and peasants productivity/gold and satisfaction equlibrium?

 

[Pavía]

Will there be possible to depict enaction of the Dusan's Code? Could be done as an event and could it be considered in game as early constitucion or code of laws which can be expended upon (since it historicaly regulated all parts of one's life and it had some interesting articles like article 172 (in which it is mentioned that court should rule based on law and not on fear of the emperor)?
View attachment 1153986

Yes!

 

[schmidticus]

There is an Inquisition Law, with [checks the script] 5 different policies, of which some are common for all the Catholic countries, and some are unique (and, of course, there's a Spanish one, as everybody expected!).

Will the Edict of Expulsion be an included pre-exsiting historical law for England then? Also will religious laws like this hinder assimilation/culture conversion for said pops until toleration is explicitly adopted eg Ashkenazim/Sefardim not being as easily assimilated whilst being considered religious outsiders during this time in some countries?

Also will Jewish culture groups be considered part of one broader Jewish culture group or part of their respective local areas (Sefardim for Iberian, Ashkenazi for Germany etc)?

 

[Pavía]

Very solid and fascinating TT, at a pair with the granularity of the rest of what we've seen so far. I have a few questions if they can be answered.

Can a country have more than one parliament, i.e., "Cortes" of the Crown of Aragon for example?

And for laws, can each historic territory/state within the country have its own laws?

If true any of the above, can these parliaments and laws be merged into one instead, if there is enough centralization and right conditions?

It's not possible, I'm sorry.

 

[aniikola]

Which unique laws would you expect?

It’s definitely there already but Devşirme would work so well with all the pop-adjacent systems.

 

[Sigismund der Münzreiche]

Looks brilliant! The only thing I find slightly odd is why a military doctrine is a law but it's not a big deal.

 

[Pyoro]

Are there any laws at all that are tied to some gameplay mechanics in a way that's not a modifier?

Okay, I guess literacy leading to local newspapers is something approaching this (though the building itself seems to basically be a modifier again ^^; ).

I'm thinking more like, no idea, some military leadership laws where the estates decide who gets to lead armies instead of the player. Or, eh, you can't do a royal marriage without the agreement of the noble estate? Merchant marine apportioning a part of your budget to automatic ship building or something. Whatever; something of that fundamental type that really makes you play differently?

 

[Damick]

I recommend that the unique laws (from culture, country, religion etc) have a apropriate symbol to show that they are unique and its source. For example, a unique governement law from the Ottomans can have a little flag of the Ottomans on the top right corner of the bar of the law name/description. If it is a catholic or muslim especific law, to have the symbol of the religion and so on and so forth.

 

[Azgabeth]

Only historical religions will exist

In this case would it be possible just for Anglican to have dynamic names?

For example if the Spanish monarch is the first to ho Anglican to have it be named “Spanish Chruh”?

But keeping the same mechanics.

 

[aniikola]

Yes!

Yeah Im preordering this

 

[Thiurekr]

Will Scandinavia have allodial laws from launch?

 

[Ahmadmltft]

It's not possible, I'm sorry.

Then how is the governance of spanish crowns represented?

 

[bretjemaine]

I love all of this. The only thing that's confusing me a little bit is how naval doctrine can be a law.

So for example, there is the boarding doctrine that increases capture of ships 33%. Of course this is an abstraction, like everything. But what does this 'law' mean?

Does it mean that I'm forcing the navy to train and develop boarding tactics? Or am I just choosing a general style and it's a total abstraction and only grouped into laws to try and keep all the systems a bit tidier?

 

[Aquila SPQR]

Stay tuned, because next week we will finally talk about ages and institutions, which is something we have hinted at for many weeks.

Dearest Johan, Illustrious One, Bringer of Joy, the Dev that was Promised, Johan-al-Gaib, Comforter of Romaboos, the Great Designer, POP Bringer, 3D Enjoyer, War Crimes Enabler, the God of Alternative History who allows us all to correct historical mistakes,

please take a look at this magnificent screenshot:

It's beautiful, it's pretty, look at those buildings, these fields and roads, so magnificent, so great. I know, I know, the terrain map of EUV isn't finished yet, but please, can you grace us with even a glimpse of it? You don't have army models finished? No problem, don't show them, or show them in the distance, blurred a bit, no problem, it's fine. You said EUV will use an upgraded Imperator-like map, so surely there's something you can show us now, surely a lot has been done already.

I know, I know, the image you'd post in your endless benevolence would then spread on the internet like a wildfire with everyone praising it and your kindness so you have to be careful of what you show, but we're but a children, we're faithful, we understand. You can slap a huge "WORK IN PROGRESS", "NOT FINAL QUALITY", "WE KNOW THIS IS ALREADY PERFECT, BUT FINAL QUALITY WILL BE EVEN BETTER" on it, it can even cover 1/3 of the image, no problem, no problem, it's fine. Just allow us to catch the glimpse of heaven, marvel at the beauty you and your team created.

I know, I know, you're on holidays. That's good. You've earned it. Rest well, rest well and look at the beautiful landscape, but also think of us and that we also would like to look, even for a tiny moment, at some beautiful landscape of EUV, so that both your and our eyes can enjoy beauty. It's only just, it's only right to do, yes.

So please.