Tinto Talks #26 - 21st of August 2024

[Johan]

Can a extraterritorial country own location's? Can the Hanseatic league control a location completely as example?

No, they never own locations directly

 

[Johan]

I loved idea but there are few questions for you.
1-Can these countries gain land without force of arms or by someone giving it to them?
2-Order of Teutonic Knights had both lands in Prussia and Pomerelia beside having a big network of castles in German lands in HRE. Will this mean they will have a combination of both or will one branch be vassal of other?
3-Teutonic Knights had their settlements founded on Germanic law , will this have an effect on game which will affect Teutonic Order in Prussia even though it had no direct subordination to HRE?
4- Will multiple non territorial countries have right to own a branch in same tile? (like both Teutonic Order and Hansa having a branch in Rostock for say)

2 - both

 

[Johan]

So building based countries have no way to become settled? What about the Japanese daimyos, seems like they would be a good example of a building based country that should be able to settle, or at least take over whoever controls the settled nation of Japan?

How and why do you make the distinction between army based countries and societies of pops? Building based countries are definitely distinct, but the distinction between ABC and societies as both being relatively disorganized, nomadic nations seems more arbitrary

I’d not call the states that created the biggest empires on earth as being similar so minor tribes with a few thousand people who are close to stone age tech.

 

[Johan]

So... to eliminate a Society of Pops... you commit genocide?

No, you force them to become loyal to you.

 

[Pavía]

Amazing dev diary, super excited about how innovative all this is!!
On a different note, holy order map in iberia is quite inaccurateView attachment 1177840

I need to do a proper pass on them, as they were implemented as 'placeholder-WIP' feature, and there are some errors to be corrected, indeed (like having the seat of Order of Santiago not in Uclés, as it should be); but we decided to wait until getting some more functionalities until doing this pass (which will most likely be this autumn).

 

[Johan]

Prediction: Timur will be an ABC which spawns sometime after 1370 and the nearby human players will get the option to play as him if they meet certain conditions.

You need to start as Chagatai

 

[Johan]

Amazing DD as is tradition by now.

Questions:
1. Do we plan to have pirates as a non land based country? Would they be an example of a navy based country? Or are pirates another system and do not constitute countries?
2. Shouldn't Portugal have the Order of Christ, survivors of the Templar Order? It does not seem like Portugal has anything on the map about Extraterritorial Counties.
3. Can Extraterritorial Counties do the normal things a landed country does? I.e. wage war, vassalize countries, have armies (levies and standing), create navies, tax, have alliances, etc?
4. Can a banking country similarly raise an army and forcefully collect their debts?

1) most likely as navy based
2) yes they do, in the south iirc
3) yes
4) hiring mercs yes

 

[Johan]

what’s the gameplay loop like for bankers? accumulate ducats managing loans and diplo? is there some vanity project we can spend it on like palaces in ck2 republics?

Green numbers go up!

 

[Johan]

Is there a Society of Pops in Western Africa? Can you share information about a Society of Pops in Africa in Tinto Maps? (future and existing) I think the community can greatly help to create more precision in this regard

Lots and lots

 

[Johan]

So just to clarify

Will trading companies like the VOC be army based countries, building based countries or land based countries?

I'm still a little confused on those

Building based.

 

[Johan]

How about extraterritorial countries, society of pops and control mechanic ?
Will a society of pops havealways perfect control upon all his pops, whatever the location, or will locations' control plays a role (like the controle of a state owning the location hampering his capacity to command a pop) ?

Control is nothing society of pops care about.

 

[Johan]

Maybe this was adressed on the post about vassals, but since they're all "countries", could you vassalize banks and holy orders?

Yes

 

[Pavía]

I suspected them of being a place holder, no worries then. ^^
Could I ask if you could post their final updated state somewhere once you are done? (In case some feedback is needed)

Sure!

 

[Johan]

can army based country start a war against a landed country?

Yes

 

[Pavía]

Is there a Society of Pops in Western Africa? Can you share information about a Society of Pops in Africa in Tinto Maps? (future and existing) I think the community can greatly help to create more precision in this regard

From now on we will be showing them wherever they are, and I'll retroactively show the ones already existing in the threads of previous Tinto Maps.

 

[Johan]

Or being in a PU?

Yes

 

[Johan]

Is it possible to flip a country from one type to another via effect, both to owning land and away from owning land, via effect? That is, if I so chose I could make it so that if the Pope were to have the last of their territories be conquered, that they would flip to an extraterritorial country and still stick around?

Yes thats doable.

 

[Johan]

Are building based holy orders playable?

Yes

 

[Johan]

That and also, what's preventing other nations where you are to just decide "OK, I don't want you anymore, die" ? Are your tools limited to "but look at what I can give you" or can you "hurt" them somehow ? A bit the same for countries such as the Hansa, how are they to keep their subjects should they decide it's time to become independent ?

Gold for mercs are damn useful. And having more than one branch is good to not be relying on a single country.

 

[Johan]

Do ABC need to own locations or do they exist so long as they have an army (and that army can migrate and shit)?

They just need their army to survive, but with no land, no mnapower or tax for it.