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Tinto Talks #40 - 4th of December 2024

Hello everyone and welcome to another Tinto Talks, the Happy Wednesday when we talk more about our upcoming top secret game with the codename Project Caesar.

This week we will go into details about the government reforms and look into some specific ones that you may use or not.

Representing everything from ancient traditions to progressive amendments, Government Reforms outline the shape of governance in a country. Each one is unique, but they often give powerful trade-offs or open up unique play styles.

At the start of the game, countries are only allowed 2 government reforms, but in every Age there is at least one advance that unlocks another slot for reforms. Some specific reforms also add another slot, so they are essentially “free” for that country. On average in the final Age of the game, a country may have 7 or 8 reforms.

Common Government Reforms that are available to everyone are likely to have an Age requirement, spreading out their availability over the game.

Some reforms are major reforms, and a country may not have more than one major reform at the same time.

There will be a diverse selection of reforms in each age, with about 5 common new ones added each age, and another 2 per government type. The unique ones are far more plentiful, and diverse, with over 150 currently in the game.

In the User Interface, the government reforms exist in the Crown’s part of the Estates Screen, as the Crown does not really have any estate privileges…

french_estates.png
France can have 3 reforms, but are the current ones actually beneficial?



Removing a Government Reform currently costs 20 stability, which is a bit cheap, but that may change. Some reforms can not be removed at will though, and are locked until specific circumstances allow them to be removed.

Adding a new reform does not have a cost, but it takes up to 2 years before the benefits are fully implemented.



Common Reforms
Here are some examples of early government reforms that many nations have access to from the start.

Religious Tolerance
For when your country is populated by people who practice different beliefs and confessions. Therefore, it would be prudent to govern in a tolerant manner with them, ensuring their support for the government.

religious_tolerance.png

It will make your country a bit more communal though..

Diplomatic Traditions
From time immemorial our people have favored the word above the sword, giving us the ability to forge lasting relationships with our allies and friends and a reputation as honest and loyal.

diplomatic_traditions.png

For certain types of countries, this is rather important..


Military Order
This is a major reform that catholic theocracies have access to. It is one of the types of reforms that truly defines a country.

The Military Orders were created in the Middle Ages as a militant body of the Catholic Church. Its members are both warriors and monks who take religious vows and are destined to defend and expand Christianity.

military_order.png

Military Sponsorships are vitally important to a Holy Order!



Unique Government Reforms
So let's take a look at some of the more unique government reforms that we have in the game right now.

Family Sagas
This is a unique reform that anyone with the primary culture of Icelandic can get, which both Iceland and Greenland starts with.

Our ancient sagas passed orally through the generations tell of adventurous expeditions to a distant and wild land over the western sea. Perhaps one day we may follow in the footsteps of our old compatriots.

family_sagas.png

If only they had the population to exploit it..

Three Departments
This is available to any country that has Chinese or Korean as their court language.

The Three Departments System originates from the ancient Chinese empires and is the primary administrative structure of the state. All departments focus on several aspects of the process of drafting, establishing and revisiting state policies.

three_departments.png

If you want laws changed, this is the reform to have..

Magna Carta
This is a unique reform that England starts with, and is also possible for any country with the English primary culture, or if their overlord has this reform.

The 'Great Charter' is a constitutional law that distributes power away from the monarch and towards the barons. First signed in 1215, it is also one of the earliest documents to enshrine the idea of civil liberties, such as the right to a fair trial, and protection against illegal imprisonment.

magna_carta.png

It gives some power to the nobility, and shapes the country towards certain ideals.


Stay tuned, as next week we will look into all the different types of Parliaments, and how you interact with them...
 
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But why even have it when this culture's major exploration exploits were hundreds of years in the past by the time that the game starts?
Which other population in Europe was regularly travelling 500-1500km in the open sea to trade like the Icelander and Greenlander were in 1337?
 
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I agree. In fact, any country interested and fit for colonial projects should be allowed to do so.

But not given a leg-up. Especially to a country that failed at the very project being used to justify it, aka Vinland.
I don’t think there’s any special leg-up here, the reform only allows them to explore and invite settlers; nothing major, not even a bonus. Granted, as I said before, being able to explore shouldn’t be a fixed value but instead come from naval tradition or having a seafaring culture, but that’s something else entirely.

As Johan said, it’ll be pretty much impossible, due to the situation in greenland and iceland, to even leave their island for the most part.
 
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If that is the case, then please, hand exploration and settling bonuses to every single low-population, seafaring western European that tried to have even the most remote of colonial projects. It is only fair.

We should recognise their knowledge, too, after all.

Sure, if you post a list of other European countries who have a cultural memory of reaching the Americas in 1337 I'll add the same modifier to them :D
 
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Hi @Johan Will there be other ways to Invite settlers than just the Family Saga Reform?

It would be nice if other countries could have them and invite different types of people to their country to help populate it.

Like Hungary inviting Saxons, USA inviting European settlers or etc

Also, will there be ways to send certain populations in your country to other parts of your country? Like Russia sending Russian migrants to the newly conquered Steppes, or China sending Han migrants to parts of their Empire
 
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I agree. In fact, any country interested and fit for colonial projects should be allowed to do so.

But not given a leg-up. Especially to a country that failed at the very project being used to justify it, aka Vinland.
The very project is Iceland arguably? Or even Greenland, although that had issues
 
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Shouldn't Religious Tolerance lead to Individualism, not Communalism? That strikes me as backward.

Communalism is about homogeneity, where everyone is the same and part of a single indivisible whole. Individualism is about heterogeneity, where individuals and groups are welcome to embrace their uniqueness.
 
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Ok @Johan , so what if I want to switch government? Like if the Teutons want to become a republic do they just need to remove the military order reform and put a republican one?
 
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Just wondering, for Castille, how are you going to implement the Basque "Fueros"? Is it going to be through a government reform described in this TT? Specially because of the weird interplay between being part of a bigger country but at the same time having the privilege of not giving manpower to castille or not having to obey laws that went against their traditions ("Foru Pasea")
 
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The Iberians were successful because they combined technologies available in their context to make ships capable of supporting long-term colonial projects. They weren't just 'lucky'. They had the the backdrop of the Reconquista, the wars between themselves and their naval industries to encourage them to pursue ocean-going ventures and become uniquely prepared to explore and colonise the African and American coasts. The caravels and carracks didn't pop up just because the Portuguese 'stumbled' on to them, they were deliberate projects by a country that was readying itself for 'outremer' expansion.

This is to say, if any region in Western Europe was ready to be the first to have long-term, large-scale colonisation projects, it was Iberia, and Portugal in particular. Not Scandinavia.
One thing that annoys me is the constant downplaying of the Portuguese Enterprise. It was decades of exploration, studies and discoveries, advancing naval technologies and shipbuilding.

Geography population and money will limit the early northern colonization game. They are big on their oral traditions I don't see an issue with them having a bonus like that at the start of the game. Just don't kneecap Portugal later on.
 
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What exactly is the distinction between policies and reforms?

Reforms are more flexible.

laws are "pick 1 of x policies"
 
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Which other population in Europe was regularly travelling 500-1500km in the open sea to trade like the Icelander and Greenlander were in 1337?
And yet they did not do much exploration or colonization in the game's period, so why give them a bunch of bonuses for that?
 
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One note - aren't these little people icons next to the numbers supposed to be different for each estate?

which ones?
 
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Cool, internally how do you guys decide what should be a policy and what should be a government reform?
We toss a coin, and it depends if it's heads or tails. :p

Now seriously speaking, this is very, very contextual. It depends a lot on the historical content we have for a certain country. So, let's say, we have a Law for the Legal Code, it may be easy to check if there was a unique/specific legal code for a certain country. But sometimes you may have a specific tax that may fit into several categories, so it could perfectly be a government reform, but also could potentially fit into, let's say, a Law of Economic Policy. But also if a country has 2 or 3 content assets that are kind of similar, sometimes we want them to be a choice for the player, so they fall in the same category, and for others, we may want them to be active at the same time, so they're all available at the same time, depending on the gameplay we think that works better for that country.
 
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Would we eventually get a list of unique government reforms so that they could better benefit from community feedback (and satiate our curiosity too of course)?

eventually if its easy to get in a usable format
 
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This looks like a very nice system, but I'm again a bit disappointed with the fact that (except for the noble power bit on the England unique reform), there's no clear drawback at the moment to these - you're sort of choosing which benefits to have when picking reforms, and the consequences are near nonexistent. I would much prefer if this was a balancing act and the choices you make when reforming your country can backfire down the line, or hinder you in other areas. I will say, some bonuses look like a step in the right direction with the benefits not being just +number, but instead allowing clergy as leaders, allowing military sponsorships, etc.
More knowledgeable people here could probably elaborate better than me, but I hope I got my point across.
 
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