The Resistance - Game IV

[Cliges]

lol. That sounds .. 'fun'.
I think this should be treated the same as votes though: Public play counts, private play is an option. Especially with No Confidence - if that is played (publicly or not), there is little reason to continue the phase. Instead we should just abort it, and move on to the next leader. Whoever that might be.

It may be the best practical option. However, I'm fine with letting players do what they might in the thread, but I really do not care for a player rescinding a card. Last game, it was stated explicitly by saying one using a card was final and couldn't be undone. So, if we could go with all cards being used publicly (again, first come, first served), but in no circumstance could a card be unplayed.

 

[Cliges]

Also, when someone plays a NC (in this case, if it's before the vote deadline) or SL, we can move to the next leader, but I think to be fair it would be necessary for the the new leader to have a whole day, so we couldn't just have the new one abide by the next deadline. In other words, if someone uses a SL 10 or 8 hours before deadline, it's too soon for that new leader's proposal to be the one voted upon for the deadline; he'd have to get the remainder of that day, plus the time for the deadline after that. While that is a bit of downtime, I'm not sure of any easy way around it. That's one of the drawbacks of a deadline.

 

[Cliges]

I'm going to update the rules shortly to clarify and explain how all of this works on the first post, more or less as already stated, but like you mentioned, it's good to have the most finalized version out there and more or less codified in one place.

Once that's out of the way, I can determine and send roles. The 1st leader can propose a team whenever ready and the first deadline should fall on Saturday the 27th. So, there will be some extra time for the first team proposal. I think that would work well so that any last minute issues, problems, concerns, questions, etc, can be addressed before the first deadline.

 

[marty99]

Also, when someone plays a NC (in this case, if it's before the vote deadline) or SL, we can move to the next leader, but I think to be fair it would be necessary for the the new leader to have a whole day, so we couldn't just have the new one abide by the next deadline. In other words, if someone uses a SL 10 or 8 hours before deadline, it's too soon for that new leader's proposal to be the one voted upon for the deadline; he'd have to get the remainder of that day, plus the time for the deadline after that. While that is a bit of downtime, I'm not sure of any easy way around it. That's one of the drawbacks of a deadline.

I don't see a problem with this at all. The game goes on as long as it was going to, and the players have more time to spend analysing decisions that will actually impact the game.
I'd much rather spend two hours on a day that is going to get NC'ed no matter what happens, and 46 discussing the next team, than spend a full 24 hours discussing the first team for no reason.

Now, if its say 36 hours to the next deadline and there isn't much fuel for discussion, that could get boring. But if you wanted, you could make the deadline 24 hours from the lat update, whenever it occurs.

That's a possible solution for people who really want 24 hour days - I really don't mind extra downtime.
(I'd personally rather keep going until a satisfactory consensus is reached no matter how long it takes. This doesn't usually last much longer, and may overall take a shorter period of time, and has the advantage of each day length being naturally tailored to the amount of discussion generated. But of course the rules of this game have been set.)


Question: what if a player in possession of an immediate use card just isn't online?

 

[Cliges]

Question: what if a player in possession of an immediate use card just isn't online?

I guess we hope that the player is around soon enough that it's resolved in a timely way. This game works best if everyone checks up on things a few times a day.

 

[Cliges]

I have updated and corrected the rules in the first post. If anyone is unsure of something, feel free to ask. Further details and clarification can be made to the post if necessary.

Roles and leader order to follow very soon.

 

[Cliges]

As stated, rules have been updated and clarified. All of the alterations have been mentioned thus far in the thread, but players should read post 1 of this thread if they are unsure of anything. Anyone would do wel to have a look at the first post no matter what just so that they are familiar with everything.

Deadline is 18:00 GMT. First Deadline is Saturday. That gives us somewhat more than an entire day until that point. This will allow for addressing questions and concerns. With that, we can say the game official starts now.

Here is the leader order, which will also be found in the event log on page 1 in post #2.

citizen1oo1
tamius23
Ranger900
gliomarto
RepBentley
esemesas
Cymsdale
jpr123
Xarkan
marty99

Round 1

citizen 1oo1 is the first leader. He has the following cards to pass:

Strong Leader – One time use - The player to whom the Leader passes this card may use this card to become the Leader. Use of this card must be declared before Plot Cards are drawn by the GM. When a "Strong Leader" is played, another "Strong Leader" may not be played until a Vote has been taken.

and

No Confidence – One time use - The player to whom the Leader passes this card may use this card to reject an approved Mission team (successful Vote). Using this card counts as a failed Vote.

and

Open Up – Use immediately – The player to whom the Leader passes this card must choose one other player publicly. The player chosen by the Leader will have his Role revealed by the GM through PM to the player that he chose.

The leader can pass cards and propose a team when ready. Mission one requires a three (3) person team.

Players on the team proposed by citizen1oo1 can send their SUPPORT or SABOTAGE orders when ready.


First deadline is Saturday, April 27 at 18:00 GMT

 

[unmerged(281782)]

Allegiance confirmed.

I'll have to go for now.

Also, on the subject of deadlines, perhaps it would be good to add that when all players agree on ending current phase early deadline with its results happens early? It doesn't move the next deadline (unless time left is over 24h owing to consecutive early deadlines), but it gives more time to discuss the next phase with information from the newest report.

ED: Oh, got the turn start while posting. It will give me something to think about while I walk.

 

[Cliges]

I'm not sure about whether agreeing to end a current vote early would work, because a player always has until the deadline to play a card and change approval votes and mission orders. I fear it might lead to too difficulty in confirming that they have decided with finality about their vote, mission order, and whether or not to play a card.

 

[randakar]

(I'd personally rather keep going until a satisfactory consensus is reached no matter how long it takes. This doesn't usually last much longer, and may overall take a shorter period of time, and has the advantage of each day length being naturally tailored to the amount of discussion generated. But of course the rules of this game have been set.)

The deadline is mostly there to protect against indefinite waiting periods when somebody drops out for no readily apparent reason.
But I wouldn't be opposed to this at all, if everyone is active.

Question: what if a player in possession of an immediate use card just isn't online?

.. that's when/why you use a (fair!) deadline to give that player a set and predictable amount of time to show up, of course.

Allegiance confirmed.

Good idea!

@Cliges - in BSG games we have this rule that when you get your loyalty cards you are supposed to confirm receipt of these cards with a bolded "confirm loyalty" statement in the thread.
That might be a good idea here, given what happened last game.

And while on the subject of borrowing things from BSG - another thing you can do, as a GM, is to put an "Action queue" at the end of your posts that lists exactly what happens next, in what order, and who is responsible for that happening.
This helps speed things along by preventing confusion about the state of the game. Especially when the game is rather complicated, like BSG tends to be.

Like this:

Action queue:
=> Everyone: Confirm loyalty (bolded!)
=> citizen1oo1: Pass out plotcards
=> Whomever gets the "Open Up" card: Choose who to use it on.
=> citizen1oo1: Propose team

 

[jpr123]

I'm going to propose that whoever receives the Open Up should post in the thread then use the card on whoever posts after him. That should make it harder for any spy just to hand it to another spy...

 

[Cymsdale]

I'm going to propose that whoever receives the Open Up should post in the thread then use the card on whoever posts after him. That should make it harder for any spy just to hand it to another spy...

I'm going to second this. If the card receiver refuses, then I'm going to assume they are a spy forever, and if they are not one we will have lost the game.

Edit: Also, JPR gets .1 spy point for this suggestion. Spies love suggesting things that make things "difficult" for themselves.

 

[unmerged(281782)]

I'm not sure this is such a good idea. If the spy gets Open Up and passes it to another spy, sure, we are somewhat deceived for the moment, but if later we find out one of them is the spy, we can recall this and find the second is the spy. If, on the other hand, we force the receiver to give away the card on random, we don't get an information as to who he would give this card to.

 

[Xarkan]

I'm not sure this is such a good idea. If the spy gets Open Up and passes it to another spy, sure, we are somewhat deceived for the moment, but if later we find out one of them is the spy, we can recall this and find the second is the spy. If, on the other hand, we force the receiver to give away the card on random, we don't get an information as to who he would give this card to.

No, but, if a spy passes it to a random, there is the chance that a resistance member gets it and uses it on a spy.

 

[Cliges]

Action queue:
=> Everyone: Confirm loyalty (bolded!)
=> citizen1oo1: Pass out plotcards
=> Whomever gets the "Open Up" card: Choose who to use it on.
=> citizen1oo1: Propose team
[/color]

I'll see if there's some kind of system for that. It could help, though the GM probably won't need to make too many posts and the mechanics of the game are quite simple.

In the short term, it would be helpful if everyone made a post to confirm that they are ready to start and that they understand how the deadline works, and that mission orders are pre-played so as to occur concurrently with approval votes. Those are the major changes from previous games. But for the updates, occasional vote count, and taking care of card actions, there aren't too many other posts a GM would need to make.

The main advantage of the deadline is that the game is always moving forward. Perhaps it will even go faster than the past because the voting and mission parts occur at essentially the same time.


Also, it's in the rules, but since I neglected to mention explicitly elsewhere so far: There are 4 Spies in this game. They know about each other.

But, as for what's going on now:

=>It would be helpful for everyone to confirm that they're ready. Just posting at all pretty much takes care of that.

=>Ask questions about the current rules, deadlines, and card resolution if anyone has one.

=>citizen1oo1 has cards to pass and a team to propose.

=>Everyone votes on the team once one is proposed.

=> If you're on the team, send orders

 

[unmerged(281782)]

No, but, if a spy passes it to a random, there is the chance that a resistance member gets it and uses it on a spy.

Wait, I've thought the talk was about the player who receives Open Up (that chooses whom he opens up to).

 

[Xarkan]

Wait, I've thought the talk was about the player who receives Open Up (that chooses whom he opens up to).

Oh wait, my mistake, you are correct on that point.

 

[Xarkan]

I'll see if there's some kind of system for that. It could help, though the GM probably won't need to make too many posts and the mechanics of the game are quite simple.

In the short term, it would be helpful if everyone made a post to confirm that they are ready to start and that they understand how the deadline works, and that mission orders are pre-played so as to occur concurrently with approval votes. Those are the major changes from previous games. But for the updates, occasional vote count, and taking care of card actions, there aren't too many other posts a GM would need to make.

The main advantage of the deadline is that the game is always moving forward. Perhaps it will even go faster than the past because the voting and mission parts occur at essentially the same time.


Also, it's in the rules, but since I neglected to mention explicitly elsewhere so far: There are 4 Spies in this game. They know about each other.

But, as for what's going on now:

=>It would be helpful for everyone to confirm that they're ready. Just posting at all pretty much takes care of that.

=>Ask questions about the current rules, deadlines, and card resolution if anyone has one.

=>citizen1oo1 has cards to pass and a team to propose.

=>Everyone votes on the team once one is proposed.

=> If you're on the team, send orders

I am ready to start, deadline is at 18:00 GMT (14:00 EDT for me), and I understand that if I am on a team, I should send in my support order along with my approval/rejection.

 

[Cliges]

Posting in the thread since round one has started should suffice for confirming being in.


No need to get too fancy.

 

[jpr123]

I'm not sure this is such a good idea. If the spy gets Open Up and passes it to another spy, sure, we are somewhat deceived for the moment, but if later we find out one of them is the spy, we can recall this and find the second is the spy. If, on the other hand, we force the receiver to give away the card on random, we don't get an information as to who he would give this card to.

This would still apply. If the spy manages to pass it to another spy, even if it's through luck that a spy was the next one to post, we will end up in the same situation as if we hadn't bothered with this and let him pass it to a spy anyway. If we discover that the person who uses the card is most likely a spy but was said to be a resistance member then we know the one who got told that players role is likely a spy as well (well done to anyone who actually understood all that...). By removing the opportunity of picking who they can open up to we just create a chance that a spy is forced to reveal themselves to a resistance member, even if that doesn't happen we still have just as much to analyse we hadn't tried this.

Posting in the thread since round one has started should suffice for confirming being in.


No need to get too fancy.

I hereby decree that I, jpr, having read all rules and regulations and understood them to the best of my ability, as well as having received and read my role, am ready and able to participate in a game of resistance. Furthermore, I waive all right to seek compensation for physical and/or mental damage that I suffer as a result of my participation.

Signed,

JP