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Stellaris Dev Diary #29 - Pop Factions & Elections

Greetings fellow Spacers!

Today’s dev diary is about Pop Factions and Elections, which might sound like two wildly different topics, but they actually have some common ground. Let’s start with the Pop Factions. Now, as you know, each individual unit of population (a.k.a. “Pop”), has its own race, ethos and possibly even genetic differences compared to its species of origin. People who live far from the capital world of an empire - especially those who live in Administrative Sectors - tend to diverge in their Ethics over time. When you combine this with alien immigration and the conquest of alien worlds, you will soon have to deal with a potentially explosive mix of cultural diversity. As your empire grows, it will get harder and harder to keep everyone happy and your core group of loyalists might eventually find itself a minority. Discontent can manifest in two ways; the happiness of an individual Pop, and the growth of “Factions”, a type of political movement.

stellaris_dev_diary_29_02_20160411_factions.jpg


Unhappy Pops will tend to join or start the most appropriate Faction, depending on the reasons for their discontent. The most basic (and probably most dangerous) type of Faction is the Separatists, who desire independence. There are actually three Separatist variations; some want freedom for a single planet, some want their Sector to secede, and some are integrated aliens who seek the restoration of their lost empire. Another important Faction is the Democracy Faction, whose member Pops might prefer a change of Government Form, or just the right to vote (for example in the case of alien Pops who are denied the vote through a Policy.) There are other Factions as well, but one thing they all have in common is that you can actually deal with them before things get violent. This is an important use for Influence (and sometimes Energy Credits.) For example, you could bribe the Faction leader to prevent a revolt for a time, or you could grant a Separatist Faction limited independence as a vassal state. There are different potential actions depending on which type of Faction it is.

This brings us to Elections and how they tie into the overall scheme. All of the Democratic Government Forms in the game have Elections, though the terms might vary. One difference between the various forms of democracy is which leader characters are the most valid and supported candidates for the chief executive office. In a Military Republic, for example, your Admirals and Generals tend to win the elections. However, all of the Faction leaders are also valid candidates; even the ones who seek independence for their species. If a Faction leader wins an election, that does not mean that their demands are immediately met, however. Instead, what happens is that the Faction becomes passive and will not revolt, which is great for you. Unfortunately, it also increases the attraction of the Faction, which means that it is likely to get far more member Pops…

stellaris_dev_diary_29_01_20160411_election.jpg


Does the player have any direct control over Election outcomes? Yes, you can spend Influence in order to campaign for the candidate of your choice, but it’s not a sure thing, and the cost can be prohibitive if the candidate enjoys little popular support.

The main point of the Faction system is that big empires should become unstable and challenging to keep together. You should see a lot of dynamism in the galaxy, with many big empires descending into civil wars and breaking up. Of course, a lot of this depends on your choice of Ethics and general play style (using slavery and purges, etc), which trades internal stability for increased external pressure…

That’s all for now folks! Stay tuned for next week...
 
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Out of interest, do you people hate fun, or would you characterise your humourless sanctimony more as some sort of involuntary allergic reaction?

Maybe their definition of fun doesn't include memespam.
 
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I agree that the Roman Empire should be modelled as a military dictatorship, but I am not certain that it can be described as a model of stable succession.

The problem is you are picking a handful of instances from an empire that lasted nearly 1500 years. It had more stable successions than not and with the exception of attempts at a coup most issues were due to no or multiple heirs. Even then, Emperors often appointed heirs without issue.

On the issue of genocide, it isnt just WH40K fans that like it, those of us that like options approve. It also happens to be realistic. Few species will share western human values, and like in some sci fi some may not even recognize individuals as life.
 
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The problem is you are picking a handful of instances from an empire that lasted nearly 1500 years. It had more stable successions than not and with the exception of attempts at a coup most issues were due to no or multiple heirs. Even then, Emperors often appointed heirs without issue.

The Roman Empire hardly saw a generation or two pass by without a palace coup or a civil war. The Emperors who managed to put a legitimate heir on the throne were usually the exceptionally successful ones who retain some familiarity to us. There are dozens most people never heard of who perished at the hands of their bodyguards, wives and upstart generals.
 
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All of WH40k lore is also, basically, Imperial propaganda. The Tau Empire seem a perfectly good alternative the Fanatic Spiritualist space gulag.
To a certain extent you are correct, but the Tau are basically where humanity was right before the Dark Age of Technology. Soon enough they will start popping out Psykers, and if Chaos has its way, humanity will fall and the Tau will essentially repeat everything humanity did, just like humanity is following in the Eldar's footsteps, and they followed the Old Ones. 40k's overarching history is very cyclical. Everyone starts off all nice and good, then bam! Chaos subverts some psykers and shit hits the fan :)
 
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This whole 40K for the emperor forum spamming shit is very tiring but now this "friendship" is getting close too.
Welcome to every game forum ever :)
If you go over to the DA forums when there is actually news about a game you'll see Sten's 'No' meme spammed all over. ME will have 'come to the ship and lets bang, ok.' all over (even though it was never a line in the game).
People love to show their enthusiasm for their fandoms, its natural. Some of it might get annoying to people, but that isn't going to stop anyone, nor should it. People enjoy what they enjoy. I'm sure in a year we'll still be seeing 'friendship' memes all over the Stellaris forums. I look forward to it :)
 
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Yes, this struck me as rather strange. The faction leader's main goal is independence. It's exceedingly odd that on ascending to power, that goal recedes further into the future. I mean, it might work that way sometimes, but I don't think it should be the normal course of events. I'd prefer that if the faction leader won, they would negotiate a peaceful separation (and potentially spawn a restoration faction that wants to bring the newly-independent group back).

The problem there is that if the player was actually willing to let their factions go peacefully they would have done so already, sure the is the same old "realism" argument but from a gameplay mechanics point of view this system is very well thought out in my opinion.
 
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political triage indeed! Purging and force migrate those that bug you're empire is the way to go! I'm already looking forward to getting rid og those that will not conform to my military ambitions!

I hope everyone on this forum with that "i'll just purge 'em all, that'll show 'em" attitude realizes that that is not a solution, because long term that will just piss off more and more POPs, resulting in more purging, resulting in more factions, resulting in more purging, and on and on it goes until you're not the emperor of anything but i pile of corpses.
 
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Welcome to every game forum ever :)
If you go over to the DA forums when there is actually news about a game you'll see Sten's 'No' meme spammed all over. ME will have 'come to the ship and lets bang, ok.' all over (even though it was never a line in the game).
People love to show their enthusiasm for their fandoms, its natural. Some of it might get annoying to people, but that isn't going to stop anyone, nor should it. People enjoy what they enjoy. I'm sure in a year we'll still be seeing 'friendship' memes all over the Stellaris forums. I look forward to it :)

The friendship memes i get, that is from the streams, but the whole WH40k stuff is from a completely separate fandom with no connection whatsoever to Stellaris other than that they are both in the sci-fi genre, it's getting old... i come to this forum for stellaris, so i think it's quite reasonable if i'd be slightly annoyed if 69% of all posts were references to MLP, wouldn't you say?
 
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Isn't CK2 the best game ever? :D

Exactly, every time i assassinate my rival powerful vassals, i might get caught, and if i do all i'm gonna achieve is that for the next 7 generations the problem is going to be 10x worse than it already was. It's not a solution, it's an infected bandaid on an open wound.
 
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The friendship memes i get, that is from the streams, but the whole WH40k stuff is from a completely separate fandom with no connection whatsoever to Stellaris other than that they are both in the sci-fi genre, it's getting old... i come to this forum for stellaris, so i think it's quite reasonable if i'd be slightly annoyed if 69% of all posts were references to MLP, wouldn't you say?
Maybe, but reading through this very thread only 2 or 3 posts per page are non-provoked 40k posts (those responding to naysayers don't really count as their loyalty to the Emperor demands a response to heresy).
If you look at other threads they can go pages without a 40k related post. The DD on purging is an obvious outlier though.

As for why they/we are so popular here is because Stellaris is the closest we've ever gotten to commanding the Emperor's armies (outside table top campaigns). Stellaris has also brought out a lot of Trek fans, and Battlestar Galactica fans, and Babylon 5 fans for the same reasons. They are simply less vocal, though I've seen several Trek and BSG memes.
 
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I hope everyone on this forum with that "i'll just purge 'em all, that'll show 'em" attitude realizes that that is not a solution...
Sure it is. Uncle Joe has taught us well. Who cares if you purge steppe nomadic Asians or millions of your own people? I don't hear Westerners cry about their deaths! Sure, your statues will get knocked down by your successors, but a couple of decades later you'll be regarded as STRONK LEADER who gave people NATIONAL PRIDE. Same with Chairman Mao--systematically starve to death millions of Chinese, but hey, today he's still affectionately worshiped by his people! Where's your Western outcry? Then again, Uncle Sam also taught us that it's a great idea to kill off most of your Natives--whom no one cared about back in the days--because you can still become champion of justice if you repent a couple centuries later after you've taken their lands and reaped the benefits. Oh, but do make sure you don't get your butt kicked by meddling self-righteous foreign regimes.

...because long term that will just piss off more and more POPs, resulting in more purging, resulting in more factions, resulting in more purging, and on and on it goes until you're not the emperor of anything but i pile of corpses.
Nice of you to dictate that most of my POPs are gonna get triggered by purges. While you're at it, which government, ethos, and traits did you have in mind for me? And are you also going to make all of my neighboring xenos nice and tolerant, too?

The friendship memes i get, that is from the streams, but the whole WH40k stuff is from a completely separate fandom with no connection whatsoever to Stellaris other than that they are both in the sci-fi genre, it's getting old... i come to this forum for stellaris, so i think it's quite reasonable if i'd be slightly annoyed if 69% of all posts were references to MLP, wouldn't you say?
If MLP were actually scifi, I can live with it. This forum has been liberally used as off-topic science, technology, and astronomy discussion board, but you don't hear me being a killjoy and whining about it.
 
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Exactly, every time i assassinate my rival powerful vassals, i might get caught, and if i do all i'm gonna achieve is that for the next 7 generations the problem is going to be 10x worse than it already was. It's not a solution, it's an infected bandaid on an open wound.

Thankfully, in the brave new world of 2200, all of your recalcitrant vassals can be replaced by robots, pumped full of happy drugs, have their objections drowned out in a wave of propaganda or simply be molded over time into Fanatic Xenophobes by their wise, cybernetically-augmented overlords. I think Stellaris might be a little more grimdark than the Star Trek universe its graphics suggest.
 
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Nice of you to dictate that most of my POPs are gonna get triggered by purges. While you're at it, which government, ethos, and traits did you have in mind for me? Or are you also going to make all of my neighboring Xenos nice and tolerant, too?

I'm not even going to dignify that with a response.
 
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RE: the bloody minds of Stellaris fans. I don't think it's just WH40K influence. In both Crusader Kings and Europa Universalis (I can't speak for other games), being a decent human being by any modern conception of the idea is a surefire path to pain, suffering, and destruction at the hands of enemies that appreciate the brutal realpolitik of history. It is, of course, Just a Game, but in order to quash the moral dissonance of pragmatically committing the very sins that would sicken them if found in a history book, Paradox players seem to often develop a demented sort of cartoon supervillain humor towards running their empires. (They might even have Dwarf Fortress players beat. Hard to say, though, especially given a fair amount of overlap.) So while the glorious future could allow us to build the beautiful Star Trek utopia of our dreams, force of habit has linked "Grand Strategy" with genocide and other wacky shenanigans.

Plus, once a player gets really good at a grand strategy game, they start coming up with challenges. Challenges like "is it possible to make my empire successful while basically turning into King Joffery every time somebody has an even legitimate complaint against me"?
 
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Paradox players seem to often develop a demented sort of cartoon supervillain humor towards running their empires. (They might even have Dwarf Fortress players beat.)

I don't know. My vassals in CK2 can be pretty annoying, but so far none of them have asked me to get them cardinal leather socks.
 
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*Intent to create a mod with an empty galaxy devoid of other intelligent life forms, but full of full of new xenoarcheology events, to be played by a decadent and rapidly expanding humanity prone to internal divisions and conflicts intensifies*

So basically Foundation: The Mod? Starting with founding the Galactic Empire, then playing forward to its eventual decline and fall... then leading a group of scientists, or just a lucky and clever warlord, back to galactic hegemony? Sounds awesome :cool:. That's my favorite space opera, personally.
 
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