EU4 - Development Diary - 21st of February 2017

[MiniVera]

Good. I've a question.

Is the subject type now can be modded?Since there are two new types this expansion,I am so curious about this.Like this

subject_type = {
name = *
trigger = {...}
overlord_modifier = {...}
subject_modifier = {...}
interactions = {..}
counted_in_dip_relations = boot
...
}

I would really like to know about this too, if you have an anwser

 

[Mortheim]

"Russia dropped her claims to the Kerch Strait, but was relieved from paying the annual tribute to the Crimean Khanate paid since the occupation of Muscovy by the Golden Horde."

Thank you <3

 

[Morricane]

This ingame mechanic would not fit that historical situation. The 10% income you can demand through war is more suitable for this. There's also a difference between being tributary and paying off an aggressor from time to time.

IMHO Muscovy however should start as a tributary of Great Horde. In theory shouldn't Ashikaga Shogunate also start as a tributary of Ming? I recall having read they were nominally.

Japan (as most actually) had an on-off relationship with China, the last I recall is that the Ming contacted Ashikaga Yoshimitsu and granted him the title of King of Japan thus including him into the tributary system (to give him an incentive to get rid of the pirates terrorizing the seas incidentally) in the later 14th century, but after his reign the relationship was disregarded by his successor, then reestablished by the 6th Ashikaga ruler Yoshinori (reigned 1428-1441). After that it gets complicated, Ming seemed to have acted as if the shôgun was a tributary, but it seems the next time this relationship can be surmised from Japanese sources was in 1451...and then again not until the 1490s. (its later than my field of expertise so this right now is google power)
The thing is that actual tributary relations were NOT necessarily a continuous relationship in history, and usually were initiated by the countries that were not whoever ruled China, but by the "subjects". As a matter of fact tributary relations were profitable for the tributary and more often than not functioned as a sort of state-sanctioned trade veiled under the guise of diplomacy. The reason arguably being that the Chinese court gifted more precious things in return because *they were essentially obliged to do so to demonstrate their superiority as a civilization*.

 

[luvian47]

Well,to chinese,that's really a good news.

 

[pguyton]

Love it ! Please add stuff like this to stellaris - the diplo over there feels weak next to eu4. We need more interaction at that level

 

[Super-Soviet]

My interminable attempts at playing Ryukyu shall now be just a little bit safer with my benevolent overlord China protecting me.

 

[Ozonosfera]

Can't wait to roleplay as Ming: everytime I receive a tribute, I bestow gifts to them. Hope I won't go bankrupt.

 

[Ornlu Wolfjarl]

@DDRJake Please give tribal nations the option to receive tributaries too. That's how most of Africa's (excluding North Africa) and America's overlord-vassal relationships operated, instead of the current vassal system, which is more suited to European, Middle Eastern and West Asian history.

 

[pedrito_elcabra]

What happens if one of your tributaries attacks another? Can you pressure peace or take sides?

There is already Enforce Peace... if your relations with your tributary are good enough.

 

[Dakka]

I cannot wait.
Was hoping the next dev announcement would be the release!

Unlikely. Still need to cover the Confucian and Shinto mechanics, so we have at least two more dev diaries, but I'm sure they will also have a subject/minor fixes DD. Guessing another month at least before release

 

[DictatorWalrus]

Unlikely. Still need to cover the Confucian and Shinto mechanics, so we have at least two more dev diaries, but I'm sure they will also have a subject/minor fixes DD. Guessing another month at least before release

Isn't there usually a beta that gets released though?

 

[KubiG37]

@DDRJake
archduchy of austria between (1533-1606), republic of venice (as long as they have ioanian islands), russian tsardom between (1571-1701) were tributary states of the ottoman empire. also safavids, poland and morocco paid tributes to the ottoman empire time to time.

In my Ottoman games they all always pay their regularly tributes in form of provinces, war reparations and direct money. Isn't that enough? (joke)

 

[Orosius]

Does tributary count in World conquest ?

 

[Aldrane]

Will the Kowtow achievement be changed so Ming has a tributary of each religious group, or will that stay as vassal?

 

[Alienatu]

This ingame mechanic would not fit that historical situation. The 10% income you can demand through war is more suitable for this. There's also a difference between being tributary and paying off an aggressor from time to time.

raises an interesting option from my point of view, if you can threaten war for a province, wouldn't it make sens to threaten war for tribute? like 5% of monthly income (smaller than war reparations).

 

[Stolen Rutters]

Ooh, so will Grenada be a tributary for Castile?

edit -never mind, I just caught the eastern religion group requirement...

 

[Yugithzale]

I see nowhere mention of the Ming or Qing empires paying their tributaries at al.. Only 'bestowing'...

This does not seem historically accurate. The Chinese demands that europeans only pay in silver was not because they loved the metal- it was becuase they were so cash strapped from paying all their tributaries massive amounts of silver.

The tribute system worked like this historically- whatever you gave to China- you received back ten fold. So while it makes sense that a tributary might send admin points or prestige or even legitmacy.

It makes NO sense for them to send money. The Tributary system should require the Ming to actually send their new subjects money. As was historically the case and eventually caused the ming to go basically bankrupt.

 

[AirikrStrife]

Ethiopia and horn of africa countries should also get the possibility for tributary states, somehow,

 

[bitmapmedivh]

It makes NO sense for them to send money. The Tributary system should require the Ming to actually send their new subjects money. As was historically the case and eventually caused the ming to go basically bankrupt.

That and having a massive amount of princes living off government stipends.

 

[[TR] mcbabayaro_57]

so, another contries ? every country had any tribute relation. example : ottoman, russia, france... etc