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HOI4 Dev Diary - Chain of Command

Hi everyone and welcome back to regular dev diaries. This and upcoming diaries will be covering stuff happening in the 1.5 "Cornflakes" update as well as the unannounced expansion that will come out together with it. One of the main focuses of those can be summarized as "making players care more about armies, leaders and troops" (our DLCs tend to have 1-3 main focuses or missions). The first feature that touches on this, and the topic of today's dev diary is adding a military chain of command to the game.

After Hearts of Iron III, where something like organizing the soviet chain of command could take about an hour of the players time we decided that we wanted something that was a lot less effort to work with for HOI4. We basically settled on a flat level with field marshals with no restriction on commanded divisions, and generals with a limit on division count but with a different set of traits. Over time we felt that we lost a bit too much of the WW2 military flavor with this abstraction, so we started thinking about how to do it in a more interesting way.

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What we have done now for 1.5 is that field marshals are now leading an Army Group, which is a certain number of Armies (what we had before) led by Generals. There are then places in theaters as before. Theaters are like before just a geographical organizational tool for the player and don't have a commander or the like to keep them as flexible as possible. This means that we have a Theaters->Army Groups->Armies->Divisions structure now.
While the Generals still come with a soft cap for how many divisions they can efficiently command, the field marshals will now have a number of armies they can efficiently command.

I also want to make sure to point out that this is still very early on in development, so stuff is very likely to change, and some stuff aren't completely working as it should yet. So we are showing you this in progress rather than showing a completely finished feature, and as always any numbers you see are extremely subject to change ;) Also I very sneekily hid the topbar for now ;)
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When it comes to controlling your troops the new system introduces some changes to the battle planner. You can either do a plan for each army in the army group, or have a central plan for the whole Army Group where each army has a part of the frontline assigned as its responsibility. You can also do a mix, in which case an Army will finish its plan and then fall back to executing the Army Group's plan. We are still iteration on this stuff though but I figured you all wanted to know how it would work in practice.

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Something that does not really come across in the images is that we are working on ways to streamline the process for setting up fronts using the new army groups. This should make at least the basic cases feel smooth to set up, even with one more command level and more armies without a ton of extra clicking.

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The sharp eyed reader will also notice that we have removed the skill level for generals. This is now replaced with separate skills of different kinds. Attack, Defense, Planning and Logistics. Attack and Defense do what you expect while Planning improves planning speed and Logistics lowers supply consumption. Field marshal stats apply together with army general stats at a reduced capacity, so you will always want to have a chain of command for best efficiency.

The chain of command feature is going to be part of the free update, although there is some cool DLC features that tie into it we will be revealing in later diaries. Also expect to read more details about the system itself like how things in combat are affected etc.

See you next week when we will be taking a look at national unity...
 
Great DD, very happy to see some sort of OOB returning. :)
 
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You are being a little unfair to poor Rommel. The German army as a whole didn't emphasize logistics; neither did the Soviets or Japanese. No one did logistics like the US (As a retired US Army logistician I may be a bit biased) in WW2.

It is true that Germany wasn't logistics; they were still heavily dependent on horse-drawn carts and had the expectation of a fast war where they could win before the issue caught up with them. This worked for them in France and Poland, but Rommel had far greater distances to cover.

Compared to the rest of the German army, I think Rommel showed even less consideration for supply and logistics with his headlong charges across North Africa whilst supply convoys were being sunk. He also lacked the training related to his promotion to Field Marshal and had a style of frontline micromanagement that left him further unsuited to the role. He may well have been better served in adopting a defensive posture at a certain point in the campaign to draw it out and work from a shorter line of supply. Mind you, I don't think there was much that could be done to protect the convoys unless the Italian navy started risking some surface actions that would sap their strength and run afoul of torpedo bombers.

I must add that it is great to hear an opinion from an expert in logistics. The Hearts of Iron games have given me so much more appreciation for a role that is often overlooked yet made the amazing feats of D-Day and the island hopping campaign a possibility.
 
I don't really agree with the simplistic notion that attacking only improves your attack skill (same for defense). A general with lots of battle experience will be better at both attack and defense even if his nation has spent the last couple of years on the strategic offense or defense.
Since Attack improves Soft and Hard attack, both of which are used offensively and defensively, and defense also improves breakthrough, both skills should improve whether the general is on the offensive or defensive.
 
Best...Change...Yet!!!

This was something I felt was really lacking in HOI4. I'm also happy to see that you guys split the general's rating into four :)
 
Since Attack improves Soft and Hard attack, both of which are used offensively and defensively, and defense also improves breakthrough, both skills should improve whether the general is on the offensive or defensive.
I fully agree. I was mainly trying to avoid people getting locked into the mindset already mentioned in this thread that certain activity like attacking would be the only way to raise attack skill. They then posited the question of how to raise logistic and planning skills. I think generals should simply gain experience as they already do now. We only need to have some system introduced that converts that experience into improvement in one or more of their skills.
 
I hope you can partition the frontline between the armies and their army groups so the frontlines don't end up overlapping and the ai starts acting up, having the frontline neatly divided between the armies would be great, it would also be nice to have this on an army group level.
 
I hope you can partition the frontline between the armies and their army groups so the frontlines don't end up overlapping and the ai starts acting up, having the frontline neatly divided between the armies would be great, it would also be nice to have this on an army group level.

One of my gripes is when you're fighting in the front lines alongside another country, which territory you don't have access to, and it keeps creating useless frontlines with them instead of the enemy.

Have to say though, very excited for the showcased feature.
 
Well done Paradox. Most people felt that your jump from HOI3 to HOI4 was not great and I appreciate that you listened to people who asked for some for of OOB to be reinstated into the game.

Perhaps I can actually pick up the series once again and keep playing now.
 
Im very pleased with this. It will be good to have a chain of comand again.
 
We surely need more new commander to fulfil this feature.
Agreed. In 1936 USSR had more marshals than 4, shown in the game. I can find at least 4, which were repressed during 1937-1938. With portrait photos and even drawn portraits from 1980-s postcard series "Heroes of civil war". Lazy-lazy PDX...

Another problem is that in 1936 a lot of soviet generals are officers of too low ranks - most haven't even achieved level of divisional commander. Technically, one of reasons, they were promoted, was the officers purge which left a lot of "vacant" places.

That is problem similar to one of german aces, who is at school at the start of game but can be set as air force commander as soon as you have 150PP.
 
Best Dev diary I've seen in a while, so much so that its the first time in a long time that I signed in to comment!

I would love to add that one more level in the chain like others have requested though.

Also glad you hid the top bar. Wouldn't want to give away the improved oil resource too soon right? :D
 
I suspect, I'm in a minority but I'm kind of meh on the OOB. I ike the idea pretty well. But I really hated spending hours organizing and then reorganizing the OOB in HOI3.
If it's two level and no more complicated than assign divisions to armies and armies to theaters, than cool.

But please make sure that playability isn't it really impacted that much.

That said it might be kinda of cool to keep some of the statistic hidden from the player until we actually assign a general to combat.
 
There will be limitiations about range, but we havent implemented a solution as of yet. We'll talk about it when we have the followup diary with more details in the future

The most logical solution seems to me to be to base range penalties on the distance from HQ (where the field marshal is).
 
I suspect, I'm in a minority but I'm kind of meh on the OOB. I ike the idea pretty well. But I really hated spending hours organizing and then reorganizing the OOB in HOI3.
If it's two level and no more complicated than assign divisions to armies and armies to theaters, than cool.

But please make sure that playability isn't it really impacted that much.

That said it might be kinda of cool to keep some of the statistic hidden from the player until we actually assign a general to combat.
The only additional work to set up the new system, as far as I can tell, is to take the armies you are already making anyway and group them together into an army group. You then assign a FM to that AG. Comparing that to assigning individual division commanders to 400 units and then setting up a full hierarchy and then keeping them all in range of each other as the front shifted is like comparing tic tac toe to HOI.

The old HOI3 system was an unpleasant chore. The new one will be no burden at all, none.