Dream PDX Con 2018

[Lord Hoosier]

In my dream world we would get Vic III and EU Rome II. This would be my ideal, as CKII is slowly winding down and EUIV is getting slightly long in the tooth. But if we could have EUIV, CKII, HOI IV, Stellaris, Vic III, and EU Rome II all simultaneously I would be in grand strategy heaven. Match that with a certain other 4x game getting a major expansion in late winter and I'll be happy for a long time. What is your dream pdxcon?

 

[LumberKing]

I would also add a Cold War and a Fantasy Grand Strategy IP to that list.

 

[darth254]

Vicky 3 alone would be enough for me.

 

[Badesumofu]

Would loveV3 of course. I'd also love anything set in Roman era, like from the Punic wars until 476 or so. I'd also love a Bronze Age game.

 

[LiberiusX]

Vicky 3 alone would be enough for me.

Pretty much this.

I can wait until PDXcon 2019 for the HOI4 Cold War expansion...

 

[vyshan]

Vicky3, Rome2 and a cold war game are what I am hoping for.

 

[Parapluman]

Jake and Chris wearing kilts!

 

[loup99]

I would like to see a Rome II, Victoria III (1821-1936), a Cold War game (1945-1991) and a Dark Ages/Late Antiquity/Early Middle Ages game (395-867).

If at least one of these four alternatives are announced, I will be pleased.

 

[BarskiPatzow]

I dream about a Vicky 3, but I'm afraid that dream could end up being a nightmare...

 

[LiberiusX]

I dream about a Vicky 3, but I'm afraid that dream could end up being a nightmare...

That’s why I keep saying that PDS needs to leverage its save converter tools and allow us to play peacetime in Vicky 3 in the new Vicky 3. However, There needs to be something like World Tension that fluctuates throughout the campaign. Minor wars will still continue to be fought in Vicky 3, but when World Tension breaks a certain threshold, the concert of Europe breaks down and players that have bought an optional WWI DLC for HOI4(which I anticipate will eventually be released for HOI4 players) can load their Vicky 3 save into HOI4, and play the Great War out under modified HOI4 rules.

In my Humble Opinion this is the only way that Vicky 3 and HOI4 will ever be perfected. Vicky 3 will be able to set up an organic Great War played out under more in depth war rules, and the conclusion of this war will be the foundation of WWII, as it was in history.

Again, In My Humble Opinion, this will add a whole new importance to the Concert of Europe period from 1815-1914(though in true PDS spirit I don't believe WWI has to start in 1914 or has to start at all) as the Great Powers vie to improve their standing and strategic positions. At the same time, it will drastically improve HOI4 as the stereotypical Germany vs. the World shtick will be turned upside down, and we will see a new scenario for WW2 in almost every game we play. Perhaps the first world war is between the United States and Great Britain that starts over control of the Atlantic, or maybe France builds a coalition of revanche against Germany, with the niggle that Germany and Britain actually concluded an alliance in the early 1900's(which they very nearly did).

Both games would benefit from being linked to one another and PDS has the tools, Vicky, HOI and experience with converters, to do it.

 

[loup99]

That’s why I keep saying that PDS needs to leverage its save converter tools and allow us to play peacetime in Vicky 3 in the new Vicky 3. However, There needs to be something like World Tension that fluctuates throughout the campaign. Minor wars will still continue to be fought in Vicky 3, but when World Tension breaks a certain threshold, the concert of Europe breaks down and players that have bought an optional WWI DLC for HOI4(which I anticipate will eventually be released for HOI4 players) can load their Vicky 3 save into HOI4, and play the Great War out under modified HOI4 rules.

In my Humble Opinion this is the only way that Vicky 3 and HOI4 will ever be perfected. Vicky 3 will be able to set up an organic Great War played out under more in depth war rules, and the conclusion of this war will be the foundation of WWII, as it was in history.

Again, In My Humble Opinion, this will add a whole new importance to the Concert of Europe period from 1815-1914(though in true PDS spirit I don't believe WWI has to start in 1914 or has to start at all) as the Great Powers vie to improve their standing and strategic positions. At the same time, it will drastically improve HOI4 as the stereotypical Germany vs. the World shtick will be turned upside down, and we will see a new scenario for WW2 in almost every game we play. Perhaps the first world war is between the United States and Great Britain that starts over control of the Atlantic, or maybe France builds a coalition of revanche against Germany, with the niggle that Germany and Britain actually concluded an alliance in the early 1900's(which they very nearly did).

Both games would benefit from being linked to one another and PDS has the tools, Vicky, HOI and experience with converters, to do it.

I disagree with that in that I don't believe that the Great War should be in HoI4 which is a WW2 strategy game. Either it deserves a separate game or it should be included in a Victoria 3.

 

[Woifee]

At PDX Con:
Our surprise release of Vic 3 in Jannuary was a huge success.

 

[LiberiusX]

I disagree with that in that I don't believe that the Great War should be in HoI4 which is a WW2 strategy game. Either it deserves a separate game or it should be included in a Victoria 3.

The more I learn about WWI, the Interwar Period(through which there were actually several small wars) and WWII, the more I have to agree with Winston Churchill that WWI and WWII were a second Thirty Years War, and not 2 separate independent events. In fact, as I understand things now, it's impossible to separate the two.

 

[loup99]

The more I learn about WWI, the Interwar Period(through which there were actually several small wars) and WWII, the more I have to agree with Winston Churchill that WWI and WWII were a second Thirty Years War, and not 2 separate independent events. In fact, as I understand things now, it's impossible to separate the two.

However, you were talking about HoI4, not historiography in relation to the connections between the two conflicts. That is where our points of view differ on this matter and why I raised my concern, because as much as one can pretend and agree with the notion that the two world wars were a single long world war, it does not make the game Hearts of Iron IV more adapted to WW1. The lack of in-depth internal politics, espionnage, diplomacy, trade and economy come to mind as crucial flaws in particular.

 

[LiberiusX]

However, you were talking about HoI4, not historiography in relation to the connections between the two conflicts. That is where our points of view differ on this matter and why I raised my concern, because as much as one can pretend and agree with the notion that the two world wars were a single long world war, it does not make the game Hearts of Iron IV more adapted to WW1. The lack of in-depth internal politics, espionnage, diplomacy, trade and economy come to mind as crucial flaws in particular.

Likewise, I don't see how Vicky 3 can possibly accurately model a Great War. The problems of the Western Front aside, HOI4's rules are far more suited for modeling total war than Vicky 2 ever was.

It's telling that the position of Minister of Munitions became as powerful as the position of the Exchequer in Britain during World War I. By 1916, the economies of the Great Powers were producing far more war material than consumer goods...the demand of consumer goods being met by the United States for the Allies...and well conditions got progressively worse for consumers in the Central Powers.

Vicky 2 only half asses its modeling of this economic aspect of Total War. At least the abstraction of HOI4 makes an attempt at capturing economic warfare...though I must admit the naval warfare aspect needs to be totally redone, particularly the role of submarines. I'm confident it will be modeled fairly well in an upcoming patch, as it is the #2 source of criticism directed at HOI4.

Besides all that Vicky has no espionage system to speak of, whereas podcat mentioned that some sort of espionage will make its way into HOI4 someday.

So, please tell me how Vicky is superior in modeling Total War, particularly that in which each side has a multitude of armies? I can't speak for Vicky 3, obviously, but using modified Europa Universalis combat rules to model strategy and combat during the late industrial age is just as egregious, if not more so, of a abstraction as is trying to abstract the Great Depression's impact on "consumer goods" in HOI4.

 

[loup99]

So, please tell me how Vicky is superior in modeling Total War, particularly that in which each side has a multitude of armies? I can't speak for Vicky 3, obviously, but using modified Europa Universalis combat rules to model strategy and combat during the late industrial age is just as egregious, if not more so, of a abstraction as is trying to abstract the Great Depression's impact on "consumer goods" in HOI4.

I didn't claim Victoria 2 was superior in modelling total war, so this isn't something I can justify. However, WW1, the Interwar period and WW2 were much more than just total war, which HoI4 does not represent at the moment, while Victoria 2 does represent all other aspects (except maybe espionnage). Naturally more could be added to Victoria to do the representation more justice, but that is always the case and the 3 will be an occasion to do just that.

 

[steveh11]

Going back to topic:- My dream PDXCON2018 would be one where tickets were available. I wonder what the hold up is?

 

[Reidy]

I would be extremely happy for a Vicky 3 or Rome 2, also because Paradox acquired Triumph Studios id be ecstatic if it was announced Overlord 3 was in development (although that is admittedly extremely unlikely due to the short time-frame between Paradox acquiring Triumph).