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Tinto Talks #15 - June 5th 2024

Welcome to the 15th Tinto Talks, where we ask for feedback on our extremely crazily top secret game which has the codename Project Caesar.

One thing that many have asked for has been a more in-depth dynastical gameplay, so here it is.

Characters
Before we delve into the dynamics of dynastic gameplay, we must first talk about their building blocks, the characters.

european (1).jpg


Here is a European King with an early 18th century background.

While not copying the Crusader Kings mechanics, a Character in Project Caesar is a bit more alive than in let's say EU4. A character is born, lives, and eventually dies.

Every character has Administrative, Diplomatic and Military Attributes ranging from 0-100. Of course, these attributes will not add any sort of mana, but they will impact how well the character will perform certain roles. One example is that the diplomatic ability of an admiral impacts the morale of the navy he leads.

Newborn characters start with 0, but that grows until they are adults depending on what childhood trait they have. You can also assign your rulers’ children and grandchildren a specific education during their childhood

gifted.png

This is a trait that when on the heir of the player it increases the chance of hunting accidents by 200%.

Characters ruling a country will gain up to 3 traits, depending on how long they have ruled.
They are gained while ruling a country. Characters that are generals or admirals will also get traits after combat. There are also unique traits for characters that are REDACTED or OTHER_SECRET_THING.

Characters also have a culture they come from, a religion they follow, they keep track of where they were born, and where they currently are living. They belong to an estate, which for most characters tends to be the nobles estate.

Many characters will have a father and/or a mother as well. For some historical characters at the start of the game that will not necessarily be true.

The number of spouse(s) a character can have depends on religions and laws, but the number of children they get depends more on the fertility of the parents.

So what can you do with characters? Well, this is not Crusader Kings, so the characters themselves are not as important, and there are no character specific events like in Imperator either. In this game, characters are tools to be used for the greater good. If that means marrying off your daughter to secure an alliance with France, then that's what you have to do. You can arrange marriages in your country, send less useful characters into convents, ennoble great people, and much more.
ashanti (1).jpg


This is an African ruler, in his throne room, which while beautiful, is just a background image…


Speaking of marriages, royal marriages in Project Caesar are not just sending a diplomat, here it is far more limited, as you have to actually marry real characters, and often this is a vital action. If you can’t arrange a royal marriage with a country of enough prestige, that has a young consort, you may be forced to marry a local noble from your country, or worse, even a lowborn.

A Royal Marriage between two rulers will immediately form a union between those two countries. Every country has its own inheritance laws, which if they differ, may cause a Union to break, as the rulers would be different. This is probably not the audience where I need to explain the difference between Salic Law and Semi-Salic Law right?


bjälbo.png

And who was the founder of this dynasty?

Dynasties are important, as they impact diplomacy in direct and indirect ways. As some inheritance laws prefer their own dynasty, and having the same dynasty can improve opinions between countries.


As in almost all previous GSG, the game will keep track of who has ruled that country before, just so you can go back and admire them. We have tried to get in as much history as possible here, even if my heathen content designers refuse to have Odin as the original King of Sweden!

ruler_history.png

Of course regnal numbering and actual names depend on many different things..


Stay tuned, next week we’ll be back and we will then talk about how the cabinet will work.
 

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I saw that but that's why I'm trying to point this stuff out early hopefully the Devs and Johan will see messages like mine until they get to the Carpathian region.
I understand the sentiment but these things have a development cycle, meaning they aren't going to look at the Carpathians until they're done with other stuff that's higher up the queue. Early feedback won't equal early implementation of said feedback. We at least know they are aware Moldova's situation is delicate.
 
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I
A few things.

As much as it pains me to say, because i am from that region, Moldavia shouldn't exist in 1337, especially not as that form. If anything as a compromise it should probably own some land right over the Carpathians and should be a vasal of Hungary. The timing still isn't perfect but it would make more sense.
The second problem I have is with the dynasties in the region. The Movilesti dynasty became part of the high-nobility somewhere in the late 1400's close to 1500, definitely not in the 1300's.
The first ruling dynasty of an independent Moldavia (1356 was when Moldavia was officially independent) was called Bogdanesti and it eventually became the Musatin Family a few generations later.

Also for Wallachia the dynasty should be named Basarab not Basarabs.

And lastly I think the Principality of Karvuna or Despotate of Dobruja in the Dobruja region was a thing in 1337.
I believe they said they’re planning on reworking the Moldova region because of it
 
I really like this new character system. The only concern I have is that it seems we're getting 3d models now and I'm not sure how much that adds to the game, I know I don't mind characters just being a name and some stats. I've never gotten round to playing one of the games with the 3d model system but it seems like it would slow down the game significantly for what it adds to the game.

I also remember the lag I get when I try to open the dynasty/family tree menu in CK2, at least in the late game. Would it be a good idea to have the family tree in Project Caesar just be a list of names without any portraits or models?
 
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Since you're using AI for art anyway, can we expect many more character backgrounds than what's available in the other titles like CK3?

Do you have an approximate number of how many backgrounds are already in? or how many you expect there to be by release?
 
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What does the "er" represent in King Henri 1er? Is this an abbreviation of a title?

french regnal number stuff iirc
 
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My browsers (Firefox, Edge) do not display the pictures of this Dev Diary Tinto Talk. Opening it in another tab gives me an error 403.
Does anyone know how to fix this?
 
Here are some ideas:

1. If you could have a "Privacy Council" similar to the one of EU4 but functions as the administration branch of the nation. There would be about five designated roles/slots open for a ruler of a country to fill up as part of their council that would help them run the nation. Also, depending on the government type, an extra six slots would be open for a "prime minister" role that is free, due to being elected by the parliament or the people.

2. Imagine the immersion of listing the number of children a King or Queen has, for royal marriage purposes. This would not only add a realistic touch but also serve as a way to keep track of the potential future of the royal family, should the heir die.

3. Add a way for the player to keep track of "strong inheritance probability" when a nation has no heir to choose from.

4. There should be a factor about having royal marriages with noble houses and foreign marriages and how it would affect your country's opinion of the state.

5. I like the idea of a simple family tree to follow and having succession laws playing a role or how much the royal family has branched out to other kingdoms.

6. Have coronation cost and funeral cost be a factor.
 
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Me: All I wanted for EU5 regarding monarchs is a proper dynasty tree so inheritance, heirs and PUs make sense.

They overdeliver.

Character models look good, the African one somehow better than the European which looks a bit unsharp?
 
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The most controversial Tinto Talk yet.

I am also a bit skeptical about 3D models.

Perhaps they could be fine as long as there is enough variation in appearance. In past games (Ck3, Victoria3, Imperator) , unless the character was historical (therefore his appearance manually crafted) and every second game-made character looked just like another 10 dudes in all neighbor courts, to the point where one would often mistake which character the event is reffering to cause of how similar and uninteresting the characters looked.

TLDR: I am personally fine with 3D models but please, make them crisp and overflow with PERSONALITY.

Several types of crowns for different types of govermment ranks, even for one culture, same with clothes, rooms and most imporantly hairstyles. colours, facial features.

I to this day hate making a custom empire in Ck3 because characters get that goofy comically large crown. Oh youre not HRE or Byzantine emperor ? Here ya go , Burger King crown.

I am just rambling at this point but I think ive made my point clear.

Looking forward to more tinto talks
 
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Pretty disappointed tbh. I was thinking part of the new design philosophy was to do things as much different from vic3 as possible but this 3d portraits remind me of this game. My hype got a huge hit. Pleased consider adding 2d portraits.
 
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Since you're using AI for art anyway, can we expect many more character backgrounds than what's available in the other titles like CK3?

Do you have an approximate number of how many backgrounds are already in? or how many you expect there to be by release?
Where did you get that they were using AI? Last I checked the entire basis of that was some random speculation on an earlier TT about "oh hey this spot on the art looks smudged".

For Stellaris the most if I recall they mentioned using AI was just for getting ideas.
 
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Others have pointed out the presumably-placeholder names for distant countries, but what is up with that splotch of (Gediminid?) Purple around future St Petersburg? I am not aware of Ingria being independent at this time.

Pretty sure there is a Novgordian vassal there ruled by a relative of the Lithuanian Duke.


Oreshek was ruled by Alexander Narimuntovich who was a grand son of the Lithuanian Duke.. appointed in 1333 iirc
 
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