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Tinto Maps #14 - 9th of August 2024 - Western Africa

Hello, and welcome one more week to Tinto Maps, the day of the week for map nerds lovers! This week we will be taking a look at Western Africa! These lands were named historically in different ways, although probably the most widespread naming was Guinea, which also names the Gulf that makes for the southern limit of the region, with the Atlantic Ocean being to the west, the Sahara desert to the north, and the lands around Lake Chad making for the approximate eastern border.

With these regions, we’re also leaving the ‘Easy Mode Map-Making’ of Project Caesar, as getting comprehensive sources of information for 1337 for most of Sub-Saharan Africa is challenging, as the traditional historical record was oral, in contrast with the written records usual in Eurasia. In any case, we did our best to depict the rich history and geography of the region and its diversity, which is stunning. Let’s start, then!

Countries:
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The most important country, and one of the world's great powers, is the Empire of Mali, which in 1337 is at its zenit, still ruled by the infamous Mansa Mūsā. It controls not only the core lands of the Mandé-speaking peoples, but also holds the overlordship over Jolof, most of the fertile Niger river basin, and some of the most important Saharan outposts. To its south-east, the Mossi are organized in several polities (Ougadagou, Gwiriko, Yatenga, Boussouma, Tenkodogo, and Liptako). South into the coast, Kong, Dagbon, Bonoman, and Mankessim are polities ruled by the Dyula, the Dagbani, and the Akan (the last two). To the east, Fada N’gourma, Borgu, and Mamprugu connect with the lands of the Hausa, which rule from several city-states: Kebbi, Gobir, Zafara, Katsina, Daura, Kano, Rano, and Zazzau. Further to the east, the Empire of Kanem rules the lands around Lake Chad from its capital in Njimi, and over some of the Saharan corridors, making it the region's second wealthiest country. And finally, further to the south, there are the lands of the Nupe, the Yoruba (Oyo, Ife, Ijebu, Owo), the Edo (Benin), and the Igbo (Nri).

Dynasties:
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The dynasties of the region are a mix of well-known ones, such as the Keita of Mali, the Ndiaye of Jolof, or the Sayfawa of Kanem, and randomly generated ones for the rest of the polities, as we don’t have good enough sources on who was ruling over most of them in 1337.

Locations:
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The locations of Western Africa. We’ve tried our best to find suitable locations, correct naming, etc., although I’m sure there might be plenty of feedback to apply.

Provinces:
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Areas:
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Terrain:
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This week we have proper Terrain mapmodes at the release of the Tinto Maps… Not much to say about them, though, as the climate and vegetation are pretty straightforward, being divided into Arid and Tropical; while the vegetation goes from desert and sparse beside the Sahara, to increasingly more forested terrain, until reaching the tropical jungles by the coast. The topography is not very fragmented, with the Guinean Highlands and the Adamawa Plateau being the most important landmarks.

Natural Harbors:
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A new map mode this week, coming from the latest Tinto Talks! There are some decent natural harbors in the region, with Banana Islands (where Freetown would be founded), Elmina, and Calabar being the best ones.

Cultures:
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A beautiful map this week… I may repeat that we tried our best to approach the region, taking into account that this was the first African region we completed, around 3 years ago. When we review it, we may add some more diversity, as we have now some more tools than the ones we had back in time, but we think that it’s way best to read your feedback first, to make sure we are on the same page.

Religions:
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Take this map as very WIP. The Sunni-Animism division is kind of accurate, with the expected division for 1337 (Islam would later on advance more to the South, but we think this is the best for this date). What we have yet to do is to divide the ‘Animism’ population into some of the regional variants; we already have plenty of data, but we also want to read your feedback on this first.

Raw Materials:
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The goods of the region are quite diverse and very dependent on the geography. In the Saharan lands, there are plenty of locations with resources such as Salt, Copper, or Alum (regarding this resource, the lands to the north of Lake Chad make for the densest Alum hub in the world for 1337, something the historical sources talk about). Livestock is king in the Sahelian lands, while there are plenty of agricultural goods in the Niger river basin. The region is also full of luxury goods, of which Gold is the most relevant, as being the biggest supply of this metal to the Mediterranean and Europe in the Late Middle Ages, while also having others such as Ivory, Gems, or Spices (which in this region are portraying some goods such as kola nuts, or malagueta pepper). Finally, the coasts of the Gulf of Guinea have plenty of Fish. Maybe the only type of good that is not very abundant in the region is metals, as having some Iron, Tin, etc., but not much in comparison with other regions.

Markets:
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Markets of the region, have an interesting distribution. The most important ones in 1337 are Niani, Kano, and Njimi, which are also connected to the Northern African markets, making it possible to get plenty of wealth by exporting well-demanded goods throughout the Sahara (for instance, exporting Gold or Alum for good money is a very viable strategy ATM). Later on, after the Age of Discovery, the coastal markets may get connected to other markets, making them more relevant, and maybe switching the power balance of the region from the North to the South, as historically happened (but take it as a ‘maybe’, not for granted, OFC!).

Population:
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Population of the region. We’ve improved a bit our tracking of the population data, to avoid further problems like the one we had with Germany. I can tell you that the total population of Western Africa is around 5.6M people, which is divided into 2.2M for the Sahel, and 3.3M for the coast of Guinea. You may very well notice that the hegemonic power here may be Mali, with around 700k people, but also that there are many more people not living under the rule of a polity, than living under it, which will make for interesting gameplay on how to deal with it (more about this in a later Tinto Talks, soon…).

And, speaking of that, I have the sad news that next Friday there is a bank holiday here in Spain, so there won’t be a Tinto Maps. The next one will be on Friday 23rd, and we will be taking a look at Eastern Africa! Until then, you may still stay tuned, as we will be replying to feedback, as usual, and we may have some informal maps incoming. Cheers!
 
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What do you think of these?
Yeah I already checked this one, it looked kinda weird to me. Usually, even if it's an old article from the late 70s, 80s or whatever, if they have been relevant for the academic community, they would be available via JSTOR. With that one, I can't find it anywhere, so I have no idea about the peer-review and thus the quality. And the title of the journal is a bit old fashioned (Comparative Civilizations Review), plus it's a rather old article that reviews even older sources. Though I have to admit a lot of sources on pop data are pretty old.

So I wouldn't say it's a very reliable source at first glance. Maybe if you follow the sources inside of that article, but it's a lot of work for relatively local data (various cities, not regions or continents).
 
There is no world in which I treat Maddison's estimate as credible.
But Maddison's work is available through the OECD, he has been working since the 1950s for the OEEC/OECD, he was a distinguished professor working on macro economy, his work is widely cited. It's very difficult to challenge him unless you go a lot into detail, and if you do, you will be challenged. So going with Maddison kind of seems like the safe option for now.
 
But Maddison's work is available through the OECD, he has been working since the 1950s for the OEEC/OECD, he was a distinguished professor working on macro economy, his work is widely cited. It's very difficult to challenge him unless you go a lot into detail, and if you do, you will be challenged. So going with Maddison kind of seems like the safe option for now.
Wait, I'd misremembered his estimate. Looking at the page now, he supposes the total for West Africa in 1000 AD was 9M, and 15M in 1500 AD. Those actually are credible estimates. Why is the EU5 population so low in comparison?
 
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Can't believe I missed this, I'm late so I'll read through this and delete my comment if it isn't needed

I'm fairly sure it's a little early for Oyo to be a major regional power I'd say it should still just control Oyo-Ile and a couple of neighbouring locations at most. I've seen a lot of suggestions to make Oyo quite a bit larger and I think those are a little anachronistic, we're at or around the beginning of initial Oyo expansion and especially if we do get more tags or more division of states into vassalage relationships I think Oyo would end up being too large and too powerful to suffer the loss it historically did a century or two after game start

I believe should still be at the height of Ife's power as a state. I've seen arguments that this was more a spiritual primacy of importance as a ritual site but I believe that is a relationship that comes from later in the period. Starting around the start date Ife enters terminal decline and the center of Yorubaland shifts westward which is party of why Ife ceases to be temporally important. I'll see if I can find some maps but the decline and collapse of Ife is part of what would lead to the destruction of the first Oyo state as well

Open to being wrong on either of those but I'm definitely sure Ijebu should not control Ikosi and it probably shouldn't control Ikorundu at this time. I see the map has changed in this region and I'd still say Ijebu shouldn't directly control either territory. Both locations should have their own towns and could be under a suzerain Ijebu later but as early as 1337 it shouldn't be in control of the coast. Eko and the Lagos lagoon aren't and have never to my knowledge been considered part of Ijebuland and there's no tradition of the Ijebu being a coastal people. There should be a state called "Awori" or "Isheri" on the coast

I appreciate how much effort you've made to represent the region and especially that unsettled/semi-settled people are being modelled

Edit:
Obviously the degree of detail in the region depends on how much capacity there is for more tags but I personally think more tags would go a long way to preventing the problems this region has in most paradox games around a lack of content and rapid colonisation. It also would make early colonisation for European players make more sense. If they follow the model used in Kongo and play local powers off against each other gameplay will flow better than anachronistically sending 50k space marines from Paris to smash a rebellion against a colony growing at 5 people per decade
 
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Yeah I already checked this one, it looked kinda weird to me. Usually, even if it's an old article from the late 70s, 80s or whatever, if they have been relevant for the academic community, they would be available via JSTOR. With that one, I can't find it anywhere, so I have no idea about the peer-review and thus the quality. And the title of the journal is a bit old fashioned (Comparative Civilizations Review), plus it's a rather old article that reviews even older sources. Though I have to admit a lot of sources on pop data are pretty old.

So I wouldn't say it's a very reliable source at first glance. Maybe if you follow the sources inside of that article, but it's a lot of work for relatively local data (various cities, not regions or continents).
It seems to base the numbers largely off of Chandler 1987. He gives Cairo 360,000 to 400,000, while Tinto give it 577,000. He gives Paris 228,000 to 185,000 while Tinto give it 374,000. He gives Constantinople 100,000 to 75,000 while Tinto give it 131,000. Basically Tinto give a 1.5x mark up on his numbers. Applying this multiplier to his estimations, Niani should go from 37,000 to 65,000, Kano (can't find the location on the pop map) to 45,000, Gao from 20,000 to 45,000, Djenne (can't even find it on the location map) to 30,000, Timbuktu from 20,000 to 30,000, and Oyo from 34,000 to 75,000. Based off of this and provided Tinto's distribution is accurate, with some dodgy extension the population of west Africa should approximately double so 11 mil
 
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I think the estimates range from 15 million up to 25 million enslaved Africans. The problem with the 50 million in the Mali Empire is that it's based on the assumption that it was at a minimum 200 million on the African continent (p. 684), which is extremely high (China and India combined).
You missed an important point here, it's nost just about those taken as slaves but also those dead in the slave wars. The 15 or 25 million are just those taken alive and sold into slavery but the wars that produced these prisoners of war to be sold into slavery killed a lot more.

My source for this is Dick Harrison's excellent series on Slavery.
 
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Will you be representing the tsetse fly in any way? A large reason the Sahelian empires took the shape they did was that their cavalry (and to a certain extent soldiers) were obliterated by the fly south of the arid regions you depicted on the map. This could be represented by a severe attrition modifier (80-100% attrition for cav units, 60% for the others) that can be lessened by tech like in V3? It would also make a lot of sense to separate the tech groups along this line as well, with sahelian having a cav unit and different troops than the sub-sahelian/guinean/west-african. Would love to see the ways other diseases will also be represented in the game, especially when it comes to the new world!

This gives an avenue for states like Oyo to have a unique advance that deals with maintaining cavalry in the southern tsetse belt

Along with attrition I think there should also be a much higher cost to maintaining cavalry in the Sahel than the Maghreb and in Guinea than in the Sahel. It's not just that cavalry couldn't be maintained on campaign but that populations of horses had to be constantly traded from north to south in order to maintain a cavalry force. Which is also part of what prompted consolidation in sahelian states until the trade routes shifted to the coast and both imported weapons and gunpowder technology began to break the primacy of cavalry forces

I'm so sad I missed this thread
 
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This gives an avenue for states like Oyo to have a unique advance that deals with maintaining cavalry in the southern tsetse belt

Along with attrition I think there should also be a much higher cost to maintaining cavalry in the Sahel than the Maghreb and in Guinea than in the Sahel. It's not just that cavalry couldn't be maintained on campaign but that populations of horses had to be constantly traded from north to south in order to maintain a cavalry force. Which is also part of what prompted consolidation in sahelian states until the trade routes shifted to the coast and both imported weapons and gunpowder technology began to break the primacy of cavalry forces
I was unaware there were also difficulties in maintaining cavalry in the sahel. How did they fare in the sudanian savanna, between the sahel proper and the guinean forests?
 
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I’m sure groupings can and have been made but was just saying I’m not aware of them, with the added granularity regarding religion I guess I’d expect each culture to have their religion. There are many that are very difficult though. There’s no information on Wolof religion prior to Islamisation, it got removed/altered from their oral traditions. I imagine you only need scraps of information for religion flavour and mechanics, just like monotheism vs polytheism, adorcism etc.? I’d like to see a sentence on creation myths in the window of text that you get the first time you load into a save
You don't need a whole new religion for any of that.
 
Religions in west africa are ethnoreligions, I think they could just have religions for each ethnic group, I’m not aware of wider groupings
This is the problem with splitting up African paganism in particular. An "accurate" depiction is unlikely, I don't see the mods making distinct religions for every culture/culture group. Also have yet to hear proposals for differences between them that would justify so many religions.
 
This is the problem with splitting up African paganism in particular. An "accurate" depiction is unlikely, I don't see the mods making distinct religions for every culture/culture group. Also have yet to hear proposals for differences between them that would justify so many religions.
? Different gods for starters, different practices, this isn't something I've looked into but to suggest they're homogenous is ridiculous. If we're going super granular with Christianity and having 10s of denominations, we should treat animism the same.
 
Why not just have groupings and add flavor etc for each individual cultures, instead of complicating things by adding twice/thrice as many religions? I'd be okay with some superficial abstractions if we still get diverse content beneath the hood.
I'd be okay w that for the smaller cultures, but a lot should have their own religions. The mechanics don't seem suited to ethnoreligions so it might be worth having them be denominations of animism and have high tolerance within animism
 
I'd be okay w that for the smaller cultures, but a lot should have their own religions. The mechanics don't seem suited to ethnoreligions so it might be worth having them be denominations of animism and have high tolerance within animism
Yes, this is something I've wanted to see since EU4. Always felt very weird to see the Aztecs converting Mayas to Nahuatl or vice versa, particularly when Nahuatl was extended to so many other peoples.
 
? Different gods for starters, different practices, this isn't something I've looked into but to suggest they're homogenous is ridiculous. If we're going super granular with Christianity and having 10s of denominations, we should treat animism the same.
I know they're not homogenous. I'm just saying, every time I've looked into the political aspects of pagan religion in African kingdoms I find a lot of the same patterns: annual festivals asserting dynastic power, royal ancestor cults, divine or semi-divine nature of ruler. Yes, the gods differ, but to what extent did these cultures differentiate between themselves based on religion instead of language, ethnicity, culture etc? I think one could say religious differences were often an expression of more general cultural identities.

I know splitting is inevitable at the end of the day and I'm fine with it, just exploring the ideas.
 
I know they're not homogenous. I'm just saying, every time I've looked into the political aspects of pagan religion in African kingdoms I find a lot of the same patterns: annual festivals asserting dynastic power, royal ancestor cults, divine or semi-divine nature of ruler. Yes, the gods differ, but to what extent did these cultures differentiate between themselves based on religion instead of language, ethnicity, culture etc? I think one could say religious differences were often an expression of more general cultural identities.

I know splitting is inevitable at the end of the day and I'm fine with it, just exploring the ideas.
sorry I strawmanned, I don't know how they theologically differ but have the same impression. I think people would still very easily differentiate between the religions based on the different practices, rituals, and beliefs. The Traditional African religions wiki article is basically exclusively on west Africa. African philosophy and theology is generally something that has been incredibly under studied and deprecated
 
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I was unaware there were also difficulties in maintaining cavalry in the sahel. How did they fare in the sudanian savanna, between the sahel proper and the guinean forests?

Pretty much anywhere the Tsetse fly exists it’s impossible to maintain a cavalry.
 
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