Is there anyone who still doesn't realize that victoria3 has failed?

[bbad89]

Misguided DLC Prioritization: Even granting the development team myriad justifications for inaction on the military front, have other, more straightforward aspects been handled competently? Specifically, why did the team, over the past three years, elect to prioritize DLC development for regions like South America and India, rather than focusing on nations such as Japan, China, Germany,or the United States? It is highly probable that among the Victoria 3 player base, individuals primarily interested in the Chinese and American experiences vastly outnumber those focused on all other nations combined. Conversely, how substantial is the player segment genuinely invested in the South American or Indian content?

I agree with a good chunk of the rest, but this is what really gets me. I’d be really interested to understand what drives the DLC selection process at Paradox, because these priorities have been completely backwards. The countries (and mechanic releases) that have been prioritized for Vicky 3 baffle me.

 

[47pik]

I agree with a good chunk of the rest, but this is what really gets me. I’d be really interested to understand what drives the DLC selection process at Paradox, because these priorities have been completely backwards. The countries (and mechanic releases) that have been prioritized for Vicky 3 baffle me.

It’s pretty obvious why they’ve been chosen. The countries are chosen because they pair well with mechanical overhauls in the accompanying free patch. French flavor content paired well with Agitator mechanics. Great Game flavor content paired well with hegemony mechanics. India flavor content paired well with political movement mechanics. What’s to be confused by?

Vic 3, more than any other PDX title I’ve played is using DLC as a Trojan horse for pushing out mechanical revisions they want to make for free. The devs are clearly coming up with free features they want to give everyone, and then figuring out how to sell something to keep the bosses happy.

It’s a shockingly proconsumer move and half this forum just cries about their favorite European country not getting content NOW.

 

[Unclellama]

vic3 presumably makes enough money to justify another year of dlc, as just announced.

i find vic3 fun! it's not my all-time favorite paradox game but i have enjoyed the (pretty big) changes they have made since release, and definitely feel the game was worth my time and money. i have no idea how many people feel the same way, but there must be a few.

india was a totally obvious choice for a dlc in this period. the history is interesting and relevant, the content fits well with vic3 game mechanics.

the military system is divisive, i'm glad we're not moving units around a least.

tbh i'm convinced you don't like the game, which is fine! i don't find your conclusions regarding the success or failure of the game convincing at all, unless you define 'success' as blockbuster hit / critics' darling, which i don't think it was ever going to be. vic3 looks like a moderately succesful niche game that some people really like, and others dislike for a variety of reasons.

i don't think many have played it for thousands of hours like EU4, CK2 etc. - for me there is simply a bit too much construction busywork, and a lack of narrative content for non-dlc tags - but i think many people have enjoyed their time in the game and are looking forward to messing around with it some more going forward.

 

[Timewalker102]

Victoria 3 haters when it comes to posting the same old tired complaints on the forums with the most obnoxiously hostile wording

 

[Delterius]

It’s a shockingly proconsumer move and half this forum just cries about their favorite European country not getting content NOW.

You don't understand. The most important territory of the most important empire of the game shouldn't be top priority for anyone thinking about victorian times.

 

[embrylex]

It’s a shockingly proconsumer move and half this forum just cries about their favorite European country not getting content NOW.

On the contrary, early flavour DLC are usually the worst ones. I really didn't want France to be the recipient of the first one!

Look how they massacred my boy! The "Divided Monarchists" journal entry is a disgrace. French politics is reduced to a single click progress bar event, and it's here to stay. On top of flavour being a mess, the few opportunities to rework core aspects of the game were missed. Multiculturalism still reigns supreme, we won't get alternatives such as French Universalism in the foreseeable future.

 

[Amina144]

On the contrary, early flavour DLC are usually the worst ones. I really didn't want France to be the recipient of the first one!

Look how they massacred my boy! The "Divided Monarchists" journal entry is a disgrace. French politics is reduced to a single click progress bar event, and it's here to stay. On top of flavour being a mess, the few opportunities to rework core aspects of the game were missed. Multiculturalism still reigns supreme, we won't get alternatives such as French Universalism in the foreseeable future.

I feel these flavor dlcs are terrible to the point I actively avoid them even if I want to play in those regions or countries.

 

[TheIronRelic]

NGL, I don’t play it and forgot about it. I hear good things, but AFAIK it’s fairly different. I like that they change the foundation as necessary, but also being fictional gives them that space as there’s no expectation for it to be a specific thing, or for specific mechanics to be added for accuracy.

That said, are people excited about it? I think they’re largely happy with it and satisfied by the continued development, but I think what makes Vic exciting to me is that there is literally no other game that does what Vic does. I’m not sure that’s true of Stellaris, although, again, I don’t play it so IDK.

This is a bit off topic but just to give you a vibe of how good the fans of Stellaris feel compared to essentially any other paradox gsg game, this is literally the first thread in the stellaris forums. They, unfortunately for vic fans, are really the envy of the ball.

How Much Life Does Stellaris Have Left?

Greetings! A few weeks ago, I got back into the game. I'm a big sci-fi fan, but due to personal reasons, I couldn't dedicate as much time to it as it required. During the last Steam sale, I went a bit crazy and decided to buy all the additional...

forum.paradoxplaza.com

 

[anyoneatall]

This has to be the best post ever posted on the internet.

 

[LeSingeAffame]

Vic 3 is quite literally the most exciting game Paradox has out right now.

- HoI4 and EU4 are continuing to bolt on uninteresting content to a bloated design framework collapsing under its own weight
- CK3 is stuck in a rut, and while the China stuff this year is cool, it has really deep problems that I’m not sure it will ever overcome at this point. Maybe next year?
- Vic 3 has issues, but the devs are actively solving those issues, and their roadmap suggests they see the same strengths and weaknesses I do, which is reassuring.

I’m tired of this “Vic 3 is failing” nonsense. Vic 3 is in a great place and has a bright future. Every patch makes the game significantly better. It’s also the only game doing what it’s doing.

Totally agreed, and I'd echo that sentiment for Stellaris, simply because the devs for these two games are willing to completely rework core mechanics, several times if they need to.

Compare base Stellaris and HoI4 to what they are at now, and the difference is night and day - not saying that HoI4 is a bad game but that I'm legit impressed by how the Stellaris team has profoundly changed the game in the last decade.

I greatly enjoyed Victoria 3 at launch, I still greatly enjoy it now, and I am confident that I will greatly enjoy it as long as they support it and are willing to rework core aspects of the game if they are lacking.

Does that mean it is perfect and every patch and expansion will be a banger? No, but that also did not happen to CK2, Stellaris, and non-Paradox games that I sink hundreds or thousands of hours in. But I know that the game is maintained by a passionate team willing to throw what doesn't work and rework even the most basic aspects of the game without sacrificing what drew me to the game.

But maybe I'm wrong and in two months all plans for the game will be shelved, who knows?

 

[TheFlemishDuck]

Stellaris?

I'm not sure what you are even doing here, other than come downvoting everyone who is a fan of the game and expresses it. It's one thing to be critical about the game, its another thing to have a bunch of people who are hostile to the fanbase and act accordingly.

Yes yes yes we are a "small and loud fanbase that defends the game wayyy to hard" so he expresses in the city skylines forum , so thats why you (and seemingly others) return regularly to this forum to bump hate threads and red x bomb fans. I guess similarly to the OP you just thingk of us as "stupid fans".What frustrates me is that i am a fan who would rather discuss the game and its mechanics and our posts are practicly bumped and flooded away by threads like these. So effing very very sorry that i enjoy the game and you do not but please just go leave us alone please?

 

[Sietrin]

I would have agreed that Vicky3 has failed before the planned content reveal. For now there is some hope and I have ceased calling buying Vicky3 a scam among my friends. And yes, I perferctly knew how bad the game was when I pre-ordered it, if the majority of the buyers were to know the same things I did about the state of the game, it would've flopped. Nonetheless I hoped that by supporting PDX in the long-term Vicky3 will become one of the greatest PDX strategy and the potential is still there

 

[Timewalker102]

Yes yes yes we are a "small and loud fanbase that defends the game wayyy to hard" so he expresses in the city skylines forum , so thats why you (and seemingly others) return regularly to this forum to bump hate threads and red x bomb fans

It's kinda funny how obsessed some Paradox fans are with hating Vic3, meanwhile you look at their upcoming projects like EU5 and they're all simulation-focused Vic3-esque games as opposed to the old board game style EU4-esque games. Hilarious one sided beef

 

[Sietrin]

It's kinda funny how obsessed some Paradox fans are with hating Vic3, meanwhile you look at their upcoming projects like EU5 and they're all simulation-focused Vic3-esque games as opposed to the old board game style EU4-esque games. Hilarious one sided beef

VIcky3 deserves all the hate and more, ion release it was a horrible uninspired game with no content, poor performance and even lack of the core mechanics, it was a donwgrade compared to Vicky2 in almost everything but UI. And the feature parity has not been achieved even after all the years in public beta called "post-release support". Only after the next global market update Vicky3 will become a proper game that I could recommend to anyone to actually buy if it will be on 50-70% sale. And despite all of that I see how the game has a bright future if it will not be abandoned, the Vicky2-only crowd is insane in their fanaticism not to see how flawed Vicky2 is

 

[cdub8d]

I'm not sure what you are even doing here, other than come downvoting everyone who is a fan of the game and expresses it. It's one thing to be critical about the game, its another thing to have a bunch of people who are hostile to the fanbase and act accordingly.

View attachment 1275836

Yes yes yes we are a "small and loud fanbase that defends the game wayyy to hard" so he expresses in the city skylines forum , so thats why you (and seemingly others) return regularly to this forum to bump hate threads and red x bomb fans. I guess similarly to the OP you just thingk of us as "stupid fans".What frustrates me is that i am a fan who would rather discuss the game and its mechanics and our posts are practicly bumped and flooded away by threads like these. So effing very very sorry that i enjoy the game and you do not but please just go leave us alone please?

I think CS2 and Vicky 3 are a very apt comparison. You will not find anyone that wants a good Vicky game more than me. The upcoming trade work looks quite promising and gives me a small hope for the future. Stellaris has shown that PDX is willing to rework massive parts of the game, so it is possible Vicky 3 improves.

Bit weird to be going through people's post history, but you do you man.

 

[Nirual]

Victoria 3 probably should have been in development for another year before releasing. It is nowhere close to being a failure though. If it was a failure, development would not continue. So it must be a success at least financially.

The slow pace of updates mostly comes down to the Victoria 3 team reworking parts of the game quite massively. E.g. look at the upcoming trade rework. Some content was even postponned to make it better at release which in my opinion is a very good sign. I would rather have less and slower updates than half-baked stuff that is buggy.

 

[Sietrin]

Victoria 3 probably should have been in development for another year before releasing.

I would argue that no, they should have done something similiar to tinto talks and got all of the frustration about trade and military during the early stages of development. Because, and you can check it yourself, the devis in the pre-release DDs were sure that they chose the correct path for the game and the community reaction basically forced them to revise almost all parts of the game turning it essentially into a successor of Victoria 2 not just in name but in design decisions as well.

Let's take autonomous building, it didn't exist at all, their reasoning was something like "a game is about doing something, Vicky2 was too passive" failing to see how the playerbase actually loved how the game was about directing, not controlling. And only because of the backlash we now get a trade rework and a DLC that are all about 1. full automation of trade 2. giving even more agency to companies that were introduced just as +10% production modifiers.

Ironically, the current military system is more inline with the spirit of Vicky2 than the original military in Vick2 itself becaue it required an immense amount of micro and was basically impossible to manange in bigger countries

 

[IsaacCAT]

Victoria 3 probably should have been in development for another year before releasing. It is nowhere close to being a failure though. If it was a failure, development would not continue. So it must be a success at least financially.

The slow pace of updates mostly comes down to the Victoria 3 team reworking parts of the game quite massively. E.g. look at the upcoming trade rework. Some content was even postponned to make it better at release which in my opinion is a very good sign. I would rather have less and slower updates than half-baked stuff that is buggy.

I am of the opinion that games cannot be developed without players feedback.

i do not condone to publish half backed games but that is not the case of Vic3. However, the game cannot be complete without the changes demanded by players and curated by devs. It is a symbiotic relationship.

Alas, It requires a minimum financial input to pay for the 30ish workers dedicated to the game continuous development. This amounts to 50.000 copies for the current year Expansion Pass by my calculations.

I have already contributed my part, but I will remain very critical (constructively) to whatever I believe is wrong with the game to nourish this relationship.

 

[Nirual]

I would argue that no, they should have done something similiar to tinto talks and got all of the frustration about trade and military during the early stages of development. Because, and you can check it yourself, the devis in the pre-release DDs were sure that they chose the correct path for the game and the community reaction basically forced them to revise almost all parts of the game turning it essentially into a successor of Victoria 2 not just in name but in design decisions as well.

Let's take autonomous building, it didn't exist at all, their reasoning was something like "a game is about doing something, Vicky2 was too passive" failing to see how the playerbase actually loved how the game was about directing, not controlling. And only because of the backlash we now get a trade rework and a DLC that are all about 1. full automation of trade 2. giving even more agency to companies that were introduced just as +10% production modifiers.

Ironically, the current military system is more inline with the spirit of Vicky2 than the original military in Vick2 itself becaue it required an immense amount of micro and was basically impossible to manange in bigger countries

I am of the opinion that games cannot be developed without players feedback.

i do not condone to publish half backed games but that is not the case of Vic3. However, the game cannot be complete without the changes demanded by players and curated by devs. It is a symbiotic relationship.

Alas, It requires a minimum financial input to pay for the 30ish workers dedicated to the game continuous development. This amounts to 50.000 copies for the current year Expansion Pass by my calculations.

I have already contributed my part, but I will remain very critical (constructively) to whatever I believe is wrong with the game to nourish this relationship.

I would have loved an open Beta/Early Access for it. I think the open Betas that we got for some of the updates were really good and helped the developers a lot. So basically one more year as an open Beta.

 

[Sietrin]

And my reasoning that got lots of "disagreement reaction" that Vicky3 was horrible at release and we for years have been playing an open beta boils down to the drastic changes in the design that were obvious to any fan of Vicky2. The Vicky3 couldnt have ever been released anywhere in a good state when they deliberatly developed it as one kind of a game and now it is reworked and pushed into a completely different direction requiring way more effort than if it was developed differently from the start.

I think everyone at the PDX hoped for CK3 style release with a playable decent game that lacks content but is generally liked and it would have been if all the systems worked as they will be working in 3 months. I am somewhat lenient on the devs for that reason that at least they didnt scraped it like IR despite IR being a solid game and I didnt get scammed for the second time in a row