• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

Tinto Flavour #12 - 4th of April 2025 - Ilkhanate & Persia & Chagatai & Rise of Timur

Hello, and welcome one more week to Tinto Flavour, the happy Fridays in which we take a look at the flavour content of the super secret Project Caesar!

Today will be an interesting day since we will be taking a look at the content we have for the Persian/Iranian region, including the Ilkhanate IO, and also at the content related to the Rise of Timur situation, which includes the flavour for the Chagatai Khanate.

Let’s start a bit differently today by first looking at the Īlkhānān, the in-game flavour name of the most commonly used Ilkhanate IO:

As usual, take all UI, 2D and 3D Art as WIP.

Ilkhanate Tooltip.png
All IOs have a quick-access button, a feature we call control groups, with their own icon (which, in the case of unique IOs, is unique, as you may see). This is the overview tooltip of the Ilkhanate.

Ilkhanate Panel.png

This is the Ilkhanate IO panel, where you can see its status, members, and possible actions.

Ilkhanate Map.png

And this is the starting situation of the Ilkhanate, with the three main contenders (Jalayirids, Hüleguids, and Gurgan) in blue, and all its members in green color.

The reign and death of Abu Sa'id Bahadur Khan, last Ilkhan of the Borjigin dynasty, led to a power vacuum in the Ilkhanate, with several contenders trying to claim the title of Ilkhan for themselves while also trying to restore the old order over the lands ruled by the Ilkhans.

We’re portraying this convoluted political situation through different mechanics.

In order to be able to restore the Ilkhanate in its full glory, you need to be one of the Claimants to the Īlkhānān, a ‘Special Status’ (a feature available for all IOs; more about this next week, in the HRE TT):
Ilkhanate Claimants1.png

Ilkhanate Claimants2.png

Ilkhanate Special Status.png

This is a good example of our lovely nested tooltips. The yellow texts are hoverable features, while the blue texts are game concepts. I took the screenshots in the same sequence, but you could go even deeper, and hover over the International Organization game concept, for a further explanation.

There is a way to become a Claimant to the Īlkhānān, through IO action Claim the Īlkhānān:
Ilkhanate Claim the Ilkhanan.png

By being Claimant to the Īlkhānān, you will get access to this special CB, which can be used against other members of the Ilkhanate, making it easier and more straight-forward to conquer them:
Ilkhanate CB Unify Ilkhanate.png

All members of the Ilkhanate also have access to this other CB, that in case of victory, allows to remove the Claimant to the Īlkhānān to the status from the objective country:
Ilkhanate CB Refuse False Claimant.png

If you end up being the only Claimant to the Īlkhānān, you will automatically become its leader (this is something that we want to change, so it becomes an action in the Main Actions panel, to make it more clear for the player). By becoming Leader of the Īlkhānān, you may be able to unify the IO into a proper country once again:
Ilkhanan Form Ilkhanan1.png

Ilkhanate Oldschool.png

There’s a broken tooltip there, which has already been reported as a bug; the second condition is that there aren’t any countries with the status Claimant to the Īlkhānān. You also need to control 75% of the locations owned by all the members of Ilkhanate IO in order to form the country; the IO will disappear the moment you form it, too.

On a different track, ff you are a Persian member of the Ilkhanate, you also have the opportunity to fight your way towards unifying the region in a completely different way, with this CB:
Ilkhanate CB Shed the Shackles.png

The Ilkhanate may cease to exist if:
  1. All its members are conquered by a country not a member of the IO.
  2. There aren’t a Leader or Claimants of the Ilkhanate.

These are the main contenders for the Ilkhanate at the start of the game:
Country Selection Jalayirids.png

Country Selection Huleguids.png

Country Selection Gurgan.png

The Persian/Iranian countries that are part of the Ilkhanate have their own flavour content available:

The lands of Persia have always been situated in a privileged position, serving as a point of contact between the West and the East and on the path of many trade routes. These lands have thus also served as a hub for exchange of ideas, cultures, and faiths, with Zoroastrianism, Islam, Christianity, and even Buddhism permeating among its population.

The Iranian peoples are thus world people, and Persia has also been the birthplace of many great empires in the past, from the Achaemenids to the Sasanians. The recent Mongolian invasion and the establishment of the Īlkhānān have imposed on them foreign rule, but the Iranian peoples are ready to rise once again.

For instance, you have advances like these:
Advance Sasanian Heritage.png

Advance Silk Road.png

There are in total 21 different advances for the Persian countries.

There are also special buildings like the Ṣafawiyya Order Hall and the Ḡilmān Barracks, and special units like the Kızılbaş Skirmisher and the Ḡilmān.

This is the formable for Persia, and how it would look like:
Persia.png

Persia2.png

Let’s now take a look at one of the main contenders in Central Asia, the Chagatai Horde:

The great Činggis Khān managed to forge a great empire for all Mongolian peoples, bringing into his fold great swathes of land from Europe to China. All people learned to fear the sound of the Mongolian armies galloping and the might and power of the Great Khān.

As heirs of his legacy, the dream of bringing back the glory of the greatest Mongolian Horde is still alive.

Country Selection Chagatai.png

Mongolian countries (which also include countries involved in the Ilkhanate IO, such as the Jalayirids or the Hüleguids) have a ton of content available, both for being Steppe Hordes, and also specific Mongolian content. We aren’t going to reveal today most of it, since this is already a meaty Tinto Flavour, and we still have to take a look in the future to the Golden Horde, which also has unique content; but this is an overview of it:
Government Type Content.png

These are some of the most relevant features for the early game:
Advance Steppe Slave Raiding.png

Reform Legacy of Cinggis Khan.png

Advance Horse Lords.png

Unit Horse Archers.png

Unit A Urughs.png

Let’s now take a look at the content for the Situation The Rise of Timur. It can happen to you if you start the game with Chagatai or any of its subjects. But if you start the game with Barlas, one of these subjects, you will find this lovely baby in your court:
Bay Timur1.png

Baby Timur2.png

Trait Prodigy.png

Apparently this baby might be a Prodigy!

There are some events about the childhood and adolescence of Temür, and if he gets to the adult age, this event will trigger:
Rise of Temur.png

This event can fire initially not only for Barlas, but for Chagatai or any of its subjects, firing then a follow-up information event for all the rest, in which the player will get the chance to choose to change into the Timurids country if there were not initially playing the chosen country and the Timurids is AI. This gives a bit of variation on the starting situation of Timur while also ensuring that the player can always follow the Timurid path if they are playing in the area.

Temür has several traits, but this is the most important:
The Scourge from Central Asia.png

The chosen country will change, becoming the Timurid Horde:
Timurid Horde.png

And the Situation itself will appear:
Rise of Temur Panel.png

The counters for enemies kills and cities razed are there just for flavour, they don’t have any mechanical purpose.

The End Requirements make the situation likely to last for the entire life of Temür:
Rise of Temur End Requirements.png


These are the requirements to form Mongolia, BTW:
Form Mongolia.png

The first of the actions, Plan Invasion, has this effect:
Plan Invasion.png

Plan Invasion2.png

Rise of Temur CB.png

If you are able to unify a region, the second action, ‘Select Core Region’, will appear:
Rise of Timur Select Core Region.png

Rise of Temur Select Core Region2.png

Rise of Temur Select Core Region3.png

After having selected a Core Region, a third action will unlock:
Rise of Temur Reform into Monarchy.png

Which, in case of being selected, will make you a Settled Country, with the Monarchy Government type, and the Rank of Empire. This might potentially be the result:
Timurid Empire.png

A successful Timurid Empire, across Central Asia and Persia!

There is more content and events triggering during the situation, but these are its core features. From here, there’s also more flavour content for the Timurids, related to the historical events and situation that happened to the Empire. This is probably the most important event for them:
Event Integration Iranians.png

Event Integration Iranians2.png

Which unlocks this Major Reform:
Timurid Diwan.png

The Governorship is a unique mechanic of the Timurids, that allows them to have a unique type of subject, for members of the ruling dynasty. This may have its cons, as there might several claimants to the Timurid throne…

…And much more, but that’s all for today! We hope you enjoyed it! Next week will be intense, since on Monday we will have the Tinto Maps Feedback for the Horn of Africa, on Wednesday we will have the Tinto Talks for the Holy Roman Empire, and on Friday we will have the Tinto Flavour for Saxony! Cheers!
 
  • 122Love
  • 98Like
  • 8
  • 3
  • 1Haha
  • 1
Reactions:
Rise of Timur Select Core Region.png


Does this mean the Timurids will lose most of their cores after Timur's death? It'd be a good way to simulate the issues they had after his death in real life, since that was Shah Rukh's whole thing (trying to consolidate and properly integrate the empire)
 
  • 7Like
Reactions:
ok so question, but for example can I as Georgia, become the ilkhan? is there a relgious blocker, can I become a blood descendent of Genghis by way of marriage trickery?, what does the ilkhante look like if yuo go by the puppet route? can we have a christian il-khanate?
 
View attachment 1276432
…conquistators? What are the spanish doing in Central Asia? :p
Nobody expects the Spanish Conquistadors!

My bad, since it appears in the Army Based Countries flavour group, I took it without a second thought; changing it for one of the others Horde-related assets in the main post.
 
  • 25Haha
  • 11Like
  • 1
Reactions:
View attachment 1276423

Wouldn't "can become an empire -> no" make more sense ?


View attachment 1276430
In some completely unrelated game tinto developped, these requirements were opened up, which could be translated in this game to things like "at least 1/3 the population in region x" or "you need 60% of cities and towns in these areas" or ...

What is the reason to go back to these less flexible "exactly locations x, y and z" requirements ?
Thanks for the report! There are lots of old triggers and tooltips in the formable countries, it's a section of the game we need to review, and adapt to our newest standards, something that we already have planned and scheduled.
 
  • 35Like
  • 3
Reactions:
The potential for the Timurids looks absolutely bonkers. It's hard to see in the screenshots provided, but I hope that the "Select a Core Region" option will only be able to be selected once, especially with the context that we have from previous Tinto Talks on how long it takes for cores to be established elsewhere in the world.

I do have a few other questions that I've built up after reading the previous Tinto Talks and hope that they're okay to ask here:
- Will PC have the dev console built directly into the game, or will we have to launch the game in "debug mode" like V3 or CK3? EU4's ability to open the console without having to exit and re-open the game just to fix something like a modded event not working as intended, or spawning in easter egg nations like the Synthetics or Jan Mayen is sorely missed when playing V3 and CK3.
- Is there potential in the future for multiple Tinto Flavors to happen in a week? It feels that we kind of are getting this currently with the next unspecified amount of Tinto Talks being focused on International Organizations and their mechanics, I hope that there can be the potential for multiple Flavors being gone through in a given week ~~not just because I want to play PC sooner and know that there are still 48 more Tinto Flavors based on what was announced~~
- Is there a rough timeframe for the remaining Maps feedbacks being posted? It feels like there has been a pretty large gap between the one being posted on Monday and the last one to have been posted.

- Added in edit: In the weather Tinto Talks it was confirmed that there would be a map mode of volcanoes/faults, will there be something similar for weather systems themselves? It would be frustrating to put ships out to sea just for them to be swept away by a Cyclone that was being built up in a weather system that couldnt be seen.
 
  • 2Like
  • 1
Reactions:
Will minor Ilkhanate members be able to support different claimants, outside of just being a vassal? Obviously if you support them too much it'd be suicidal to your nation but I imagine say fighting for the Jalayirids to get their support and friendship as you conquer Gurgan, and then once you have a power base you declare yourself your own claimant/declare independence. Or is that just handled through being a vassal/subject normally. And do non-vassal members of the Ilkhanate pay any taxes to anyone or is it just state of limbo for them?

Will the Timurids have an ability to transport pops to your core region? Timur famously transported many people forcibly to his capital IIRC.

I feel this is probably obvious, but the Chobanids will be an event spawn ABC I assume? If they don't already exist.
 
  • 3Like
Reactions:
What you say is more accurate, historically-wise, right. However, RoT is a very important situation for the game since it shaped the status of Central Asia, Persia, and India for the next half millennium; therefore, we decided to sacrifice some of that historicity to make it more gameplay-friendly and also easier for an AI Timurid Empire to appear.
Well sure, but at that point you're basically ignoring all of the context just to get Timur's empire on the map.

We have the tools to make this happen in a way that's novel and interesting. I'm not saying we need perfect historical fidelity here, but if we're really just doing it for utilitarian reasons... move the event up to 1380 (his first conquest outside of Transoxiana was 1381 with his invasion of Herat) and have him annex all the other Chaghatai Ulus tribes (instead of just the Yasa'uri so that he can have Samarqand). At least that way he isn't conquering his own state.
 
  • 10Like
  • 2
  • 1
  • 1
Reactions:
View attachment 1276435

So would you mind adding a modifier that make it so as temur conquer a nation he get 1 point in each adm,diplo,mil skill. This would be to show that he is ever more brutal the more he conquers, I just don’t think it’s immersive to have a terrible temur but having him conquer all of Persia
Oh, this is because I forced the situation to trigger through the console, so he was not able to develop his skills (in that screenshot, he literally has baby skills!). Some of those events during his childhood improved his skills, as well, so it's very likely to have him become an adult with very good skills.
 
  • 24Haha
  • 22Like
  • 4
Reactions:


@Pavía if I may suggest, unless it's unfeasible to implement, that the natural disintegration of the Ilkhanate should be tied to the combined strength of the claimants to the Ilkhanate.

While they may be fighting eachothers, their combined strength and continued efforts are the only thing still keeping the idea of an Ilkhanate alive, and each is a point of gravity pulling their peripheries to that idea.

As time passes, the pretenders beat eachothers up and lose overall strength, the peripheries should essentially peacefully dissipate from the Ilkhanate as a whole.

Far out places like Makran or Hormuz, or powerful countries lile Georgia, Eretnids or Kartids should be the first to go in this process. These countries never needed to fight to "break free", they just faded away.

Additionally, if the Ilkhanate IO finally disappears as too much time has passed, the Chobanids and Jalayirids should be able to drop their claim and adopt other ways to legitimize themselves. Much like how the Jalayirids historically turned into a Sultanate (much later), adopting Islamic practises and Persian administration, once they realized their chance was gone.


 
Last edited:
  • 12
  • 6Like
  • 1
Reactions:
  • 29Like
  • 4
Reactions:
He married into it, not claiming descent from it. That was also the whole point why he still appointed puppet khans and never took the title of "khan" for himself.
View attachment 1276445
Which, again, I want to make abundantly clear: he was never a Khan. Never took the title, never could take the title. That was kinda the whole thing.
Noted, thanks!
 
  • 42Like
  • 2
Reactions: