• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

Tinto Flavour #24 - 3rd of June 2025

Hello, and welcome one more Tuesday to Tinto Flavour, the happy days in which we take a look at the flavour content of Europa Universalis V!

Today, we will be taking a look at the Golden Horde! Being the most important Steppe Horde in 1337, it has a good mix of both unique and generic content. Let’s start, without further ado:

The great Činggis Khān managed to forge a great empire for all Mongol peoples, bringing into his fold great swathes of land from Europe to China. All people learned to fear the sound of the Mongol armies galloping and the might and power of the Great Khān.

As heirs of his legacy, the dream of bringing back the glory of the greatest Mongol Horde is still alive. It was Khān Borjigin Jochi, son of Činggis, and his son Khān Borjigin Batu who carried on the legacy of the Great Khān and established the Golden Horde.

Controlling the westernmost expansion of the great empire, they are in control of the vast steppes and many of the European countries are subservient to them, afraid of their great might.

Country Selection.jpg


Golden Horde.png

Diplomacy.png

As usual, please consider any UI, 2D, and 3D art as WIP.

Steppe Hordes are a type of Army-Based Country, and it has some specificities:
Government Horde.jpg

As you see, it starts with some Reforms and Privileges:
Estates1.png

Estates2.png

Legacy of Cinggis.jpg

Privilege Tribal Host.png

Privilege Share of the Spoils.png

Here you have some of the unique advances of the Golden Horde, as usual:
Advance Kipchack Khanate.png

Advance Legacy of Jochi .png

Advance Legacy of the Golden Horde.png

Advance Perso-Mongol.png

Advance Tatar Traditions.png

The Mongol Steppe Hordes have access to two unique units:
Horse Archers.png

A'Urughs.png

These illustrations were recently added to the unit tooltip; the first is the one for the East Asian graphical culture for Age of Traditions Horsemen, while the other is the generic one for supply units.

And also a couple of unique buildings:
Kurultai.png

Caravanserai.png

The Golden Horde has access to a unique mechanic to portray its relationship with the Russian Principalities, the Tatar Yoke, which is an International Organization:
Tatar Yoke1.png

Tatar Yoke.png

Tatar Yoke2.png

As you see, there are three statutes, the Tatar-Overlord (the Golden Horde), the Grand Prince of Vladimir (which in 1337 is Muscovy), and the regular members:
Tatar Yoke3.png

Tatar Yoke4.png

The Grand Prince of Vladimir collects the tribute from the regular members, and sends it to the Tatar-Overlord:
Tatar Yoke Payments.png

Tatar  Yoke Payments2.png

Tatar Yoke Payments3.png

…Or not, because each member has a special section in the country budget to pay more or less tribute, and then, the Grand Prince of Vladimir also chooses how much of that goes to their Tatar-Overlord:
Tatar Yoke Payments4.png

If any member, including the Grand Prince, pays less than 50% of the capacity, it will get a development malus, portraying the small-scale raids conducted by the Horde to put the princes in line. If the budget is over 50%, the members will get a bonus on their diplomats, and the Grand Prince, on its Prestige.

Finally, there are a couple of additional actions in the IO. One allows any member of the Tatar Yoke to declare war to break it, while the other allows any member to request the Tatar-Overlord to become the new Grand Prince of Vladimir:
Tatar Yoke5.png

Tatar Yoke6.png

Tatar Yoke7.png

Let’s now move into the narrative content. The most important piece of content is the Horde Civil War, a disaster that can appear if the horde unity dips too low. Once it starts, a pretender rebellion will be formed.
Horde Civil War Starting Event.png

Horde Civil War Starting Event effect.png

Horde Civil War Tooltip.png

Horde Civil War Panel.png

There are some events that can happen while the disaster is active, usually with not the best of outcomes:
Horde Civil War Rebellion Event.png

Horde Civil War Rebellion Event Option A.png

Horde Civil War Rebellion Event Option B.png


Horde Civil War Murder Event.png


Horde Civil War Border Event.png

Neighboring countries may take this opportunity to attack…

Once the rebel progress of the pretender reaches 100%, an event will fire, giving the option to either accept their demands or make it escalate into a full civil war.
Horde Civil War Rebel Progress Event.png

Horde Civil War War.png

It is treason then…

If victorious in the civil war, the pretender will be put in his place, but as long as the disaster is still active, another one will soon rise again:
Horde Civil War Winning Event.png

Horde Civil War Disaster Continues.png

Only when there are no more rebellions or civil wars active, and both stability and horde unity have been restored, will the disaster finally end:
Horde Civil War End.png

… And much more, but that’s all for today! Tomorrow, in Tinto Talks, we will talk about the mechanics of the Islamic religion!

And also remember, you can wishlist Europa Universalis V now! Cheers!
 
  • 136Like
  • 50Love
  • 6
  • 3
  • 2
Reactions:
I have serious doubts about autoconquer when at war.
This should be at max applied to the Steppes region and maybe similar Asian horde regions only, since the Mongols could not directly hold more forested areas to the north in Russia and Ruthenia. Only raids and military campaigns.

Nomads needed vast steppe grasslands to survive, that is why this feature is pointless and ahistorical for lots of other regions.
Maybe it should be only between hordes?
 
Last edited:
  • 14Like
  • 4
  • 1
Reactions:
And once again, Kyiv, Halych-Volhynia, Severian principalities (including those around Kursk) (maybe also those around Smolensk) never payed tribute via the prince of Moscow/Vladimir.
They were direct tributaries of the Golden Horde and had their own relations with them.

Kyiv had its own baskak mentioned in 1331 in a chronicle. The prince Fedir of Kyiv together with the Tatar baskak ambushed newly assigned bishop of Novgorod near Chernihiv on his way from Volodymyr to Novgorod.

Is it somehow reflected in the Tatar Yoke IO?

UPDATE: well... obviously, not :confused:
1748959348597.png
 
Last edited:
  • 29
  • 11Like
  • 1
  • 1
Reactions:
1748958780554.png

Also please elaborate why we are incentified to play rural. Sarai was one of the largest european cities in that time period. There was a fair bit of urbanization and settlement. GH are not tent-nomads anymore.
 
  • 8Like
  • 5
Reactions:
auto-conquer in war sounds too op in player's hands but I guess there is some balancing mechanism we didn't see yet
 
  • 1
  • 1
  • 1Like
Reactions:
Caravanserai doesn't look really unique to the golden horde from the description. Shouldn't it be location restricted rather than tag / culture restricted ?
Because they're for Mongol Steppe Hordes, this is my phrasing of units and buildings:

The Mongol Steppe Hordes have access to two unique units:

And also a couple of unique buildings:
 
  • 30Like
  • 6
  • 2
Reactions:
I think the "claimants" in horde civil wars should be scripted to be members of the Borjigin dynasty, or at least the ruling dynasty of the country.

The Chinggisid principle was very important on the steppes, even into the 1800s, and there would basically never be a non-Borjigin claimant. Even some very exceptional cases like Esen Taishi trying to become Khan of the Mongols could be viewed more like conquests than civil wars.
 
Last edited:
  • 12Like
  • 5
  • 2
Reactions:
What's the reason for independence wars now being fought under the insult CB? It seems a bit strange and not quite capturing what's actually happening.
 
  • 2Like
  • 1
Reactions:
Your beef is not with Paradox, they weren't the ones to name the Mongol overlordship of the Rus this way.
As a historical concept, I think there is nothing wrong with it to summarize the relationship between the Russian states and the Golden Horde.
But it is another matter in the game process. In this case, why do some people insist on making the name of the Byzantine Empire a replaceable option? TINTO also pointed out this point in the previous post?
 
  • 5
  • 3Like
Reactions:
Because they're for Mongol Steppe Hordes, this is my phrasing of units and buildings:
My mistake for misunderstanding, thanks for the clarification.

Still, shouldn't a country that isn't a horde still have access to the caravanserai building ? To me the building should be linked to location, or if that isn't possible, to trade occuring often enough in that place
 
  • 3Like
  • 1
Reactions:
I noticed that you made the Rus indipendent from the Horde(they used to be its tributaries and had its same colour), why is that, does the Tatar Yoke make tributary vassal mechanics unnecessary? Do the countries in the Yoke still get protection from the Horde?
 
Last edited:
  • 5Like
Reactions:
Hello, and welcome one more Tuesday to Tinto Flavour, the happy days in which we take a look at the flavour content of Europa Universalis V!

Today, we will be taking a look at the Golden Horde! Being the most important Steppe Horde in 1337, it has a good mix of both unique and generic content. Let’s start, without further ado:



View attachment 1311855

View attachment 1311856
View attachment 1311857
As usual, please consider any UI, 2D, and 3D art as WIP.

Steppe Hordes are a type of Army-Based Country, and it has some specificities:

As you see, it starts with some Reforms and Privileges:

Here you have some of the unique advances of the Golden Horde, as usual:

The Mongol Steppe Hordes have access to two unique units:
View attachment 1311875
View attachment 1311876
These illustrations were recently added to the unit tooltip; the first is the one for the East Asian graphical culture for Age of Traditions Horsemen, while the other is the generic one for supply units.

And also a couple of unique buildings:

The Golden Horde has access to a unique mechanic to portray its relationship with the Russian Principalities, the Tatar Yoke, which is an International Organization:

As you see, there are three statutes, the Tatar-Overlord (the Golden Horde), the Grand Prince of Vladimir (which in 1337 is Muscovy), and the regular members:

The Grand Prince of Vladimir collects the tribute from the regular members, and sends it to the Tatar-Overlord:

…Or not, because each member has a special section in the country budget to pay more or less tribute, and then, the Grand Prince of Vladimir also chooses how much of that goes to their Tatar-Overlord:

If any member, including the Grand Prince, pays less than 50% of the capacity, it will get a development malus, portraying the small-scale raids conducted by the Horde to put the princes in line. If the budget is over 50%, the members will get a bonus on their diplomats, and the Grand Prince, on its Prestige.

Finally, there are a couple of additional actions in the IO. One allows any member of the Tatar Yoke to declare war to break it, while the other allows any member to request the Tatar-Overlord to become the new Grand Prince of Vladimir:

Let’s now move into the narrative content. The most important piece of content is the Horde Civil War, a disaster that can appear if the horde unity dips too low. Once it starts, a pretender rebellion will be formed.

There are some events that can happen while the disaster is active, usually with not the best of outcomes:

Once the rebel progress of the pretender reaches 100%, an event will fire, giving the option to either accept their demands or make it escalate into a full civil war.

If victorious in the civil war, the pretender will be put in his place, but as long as the disaster is still active, another one will soon rise again:

Only when there are no more rebellions or civil wars active, and both stability and horde unity have been restored, will the disaster finally end:

… And much more, but that’s all for today! Tomorrow, in Tinto Talks, we will talk about the mechanics of the Islamic religion!

And also remember, you can wishlist Europa Universalis V now! Cheers!
Why in the game even Bulgaria can vassalize entire Golden Horde?
1748959099609.jpeg


there are also examples of it bieng almost fully annexed in a fex years
1748959136679.jpeg
 
  • 14Like
  • 4Haha
Reactions:
1748958805123.png



Let's say a horde conquers territory I haven't cored or integrated yet. Would asking for it back in a peace negotiation give me antagonism? Hopefully not. It probably also shouldn't cost war score.

Just imagine them conquering half your territory, or heck, everything but your capital, and you happen to occupy it "back". BUT by the time you peace them out, you suddenly don't have enough warscore to ask for your country back.


1748959261665.jpeg
 
Last edited:
  • 20Haha
  • 11Like
Reactions:
Love it.
But Horse archers with +20% in Steppe and only -10% in mountains and jungle sounds a bit soft.
How about +50% in Steppe and -50% in mountains? i beliefe a horse pretty OP in flat land and pretty useless in ragid terrain.
Wouldn't that describe the reality better?

And no this isnt an Austrian speaking, trying to keep away the Hordes in the Steppe .. .. ok maybe a little :D
 
  • 13Like
  • 2Haha
  • 2
Reactions: