170) BUG: Usurping titles held by Muslims

[Aquitaine]

Usurping titles held by Muslims

I may be missing something, but it seems to me that it's impossible to take titles away from Muslim rulers unless you destroy everything they have.

For example, the Emir of Almeria in my last game had a large chunk of Spain as well as some provinces around Anatolia. I took all of their Spanish holdings, but noticed that I couldn't create any new ducal titles. These titles weren't held by Almeria, who was just Emir of Almeria and Sheik of a few things around Anatolia. But they were 'tied up' with the Emir, because once I sailed over and destroyed what was left of his realm, three or four Ducal titles got 'unlocked.'

Shouldn't there be some way to usurp these titles, or should they simply become 'free' and open to be created once the muslim ruler no longer holds any of the related territory?

 

[kurtbrian]

can others confirm this?

 

[Solmyr]

I conquered all of the Emir of Cordoba's Iberian holdings, leaving him with a single province in Syria. He was still considered the Emir of Cordoba though, and I assume that prevented me from claiming the Duke of Cordoba as a title.

As I suggested in another thread, a ruler who no longer controls any lands in an area associated with a title (whether himself or through vassals) should probably lose that title and get only a claim on it instead.

 

[Aquitaine]

In my case it was actually several titles he had, even though he only showed up as the Emir of Cordoba and had no vassals, there were @3 ducal titles that became available once I finished him off.

But yeah, usurping is really only useful if you have between 66%-99%. If you have 100%...well...there's not much point in having to actually usurp, you pretty much already have it.

 

[unmerged(28213)]

But yeah, usurping is really only useful if you have between 66%-99%. If you have 100%...well...there's not much point in having to actually usurp, you pretty much already have it.

I agree that you should be able to usurp anyone regardless of faith, but I think you should always have to grab or usurp the title. After all, just because a ruler has fled to exile, his titles are not forfeit. The hit should maybe be lower if you have already conquered the entire area, but never zero imo.

 

[Derek Pullem]

I agree that you should be able to usurp anyone regardless of faith, but I think you should always have to grab or usurp the title. After all, just because a ruler has fled to exile, his titles are not forfeit. The hit should maybe be lower if you have already conquered the entire area, but never zero imo.

Yep - I agree with what Wrathkin said 100%. Except that usurping a Muslim or pagan shouldn't cost you much prestige compared to a Christian ruler. Or maybe get a piety bonus to offset the prestige hit?

 

[Grosshaus]

Buggified.

 

[Aquitaine]

You also shouldn't take a BB hit usurping from a muslim.

 

[kehnn]

I'm wondering if there should be a need to usurp a title from the infidels. I would think that the christian world would simply not recognize a moslem title as such, and thus would allow you to claim it when you acquired the requisite provinces..

 

[unmerged(28213)]

I'm wondering if there should be a need to usurp a title from the infidels. I would think that the christian world would simply not recognize a moslem title as such, and thus would allow you to claim it when you acquired the requisite provinces..

Usurping titles (after 66%) from characters of different faith should perhaps not cost BB or prestige - but then that should be true for islamic and pagan nations usuring titles held by christians as well.