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304)BUG: Laws and vassal loyalty

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trajan

trajan

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Feudal contract?

I notice that the tool tip for feudal contract says that my vassals' loyalty will increase over time. However when I look at their loyalty in their character screen, I don't see any boost there. Is there supposed to be one just like there is for diplomacy value, prestige, etc? Or is this just behind the scenes?
 
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NeilJT doesn't say if he's using feudal contract so that doesn't really tell us anything.

It's possible the tooltip is working correctly but the law is not.
 
my overall impression in gameplay experience is that the loyalty part works fine. since it kinda seems that loyalty grows faster under feudal contract and slower under royal preorgatory. but diplomacy skill is the main factor.
 
Grosshaus said:
That kind of suggests this isn't a bug, but instead trajan missed that section in the tooltip. Was that the case?
Click to expand...

No it IS true. I have seen (and wondered about) this as well. I don't have any exact examples as I thought it was included in the calculations in some other way. But I have never seen a loyalty boost from Feudal Contract either.
 
According to the manual royal prerogative should decrease vassal loyalty buildup, feudal contract increase it and the rest have no effect. Is this the case or not?

Might it be that NeilJT was looking at nobles in provinces or something?
 
Last edited:
Grosshaus said:
According to the manual royal prerogative should decrease vassal[/] loyalty buildup, feudal contract increase it and the rest have no effect. Is this the case or not?

Might it be that NeilJT was looking at nobles in provinces or something?
Click to expand...


I haven't tried royal preorgatory yet. But I was looking in the loyalty calculation tooltip for my vassals and didn't see any addition for feudal contract. The reason I posted is that once I claimed a kingship (I was a prince when I first switched to feudal contract) I noticed that my vassals' vassals DID have a boost to loyalty "from laws" and I assumed it was supposed to work the same way for me. I'll fire up a game and do some more testing tonight.
 
I think I've figued out how it does work, but it'll need confirmation, and I reckon its not WAD.

Your laws do not affect vassal loyalty. It is the laws of the vassal which affect their relationship with you:

Example: Playing as Byzantium with Feudal Contract,

Prince of Adrinopolis has Royal Perogative... Has the -1 factor to loyalty.
Unfortunatly no vassals have feudal contract.
Prince of Wallacia has Traditional Custom.... Has no bonus to loyalty.
Unfortunatly no vassal have popular law.

May I suggest that it should be the laws of the liege, not the vassal which should determine bonuses to loyatly (i.e. My Prince of Adrinopolis should gain loyalty due to my laws, his vassals should lose loyalty due to his), therefore I would expect this is not WAD
 
NeilJT said:
May I suggest that it should be the laws of the liege, not the vassal which should determine bonuses to loyatly (i.e. My Prince of Adrinopolis should gain loyalty due to my laws, his vassals should lose loyalty due to his), therefore I would expect this is not WAD
Click to expand...

Sounds reasonable.
 
I can confirm that the law settings for feudal contract et al only apply to your loyalty to your liege, instead of your vassals' loyalty to your. This is bad for several reasons:

1) If you're a King, feel free to use the "decrease loyalty" law, as you have no liege to affect your loyalty to.
2) If you're a Count or a Duke, this is one way to artifically manipulate your loyalty to your liege.
3) Your vassals will hose you by picking the "-1.00" law rather than the "+1.00" you would prefer to use.

Verified as of 1.04a, and I see no change listed in the public beta.

-Richard Campbell.
 
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