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331) Feedback: 'NO' means 'NO'

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'NO' means 'NO'

Templars, Hospitaliers and all those other mongrel orders. I say no, I loose 50 piety, one month later they ask again, I say no. Over and over this goes on and on. Can those buggers quit that? I hate all knightly orders, Teutonics, the most, because those pansy little $%^# stole my land. And I hate the others too, what do I get for handing over territory. Zilch, nada, zero.

Ok, we need some sort of a thing that once you say NO, they don't ask again until your son inherits or something, or they need to become your vassals, without the negative loyalty that you get, when you normally vassalize them. Also, it would be nice if you could appoint the head of the Templar Order, since I don't want French or German or whatever guys, running around and converting provinces to their culture. I rule a Polish Kingdom, I want a Polish man to lead the Order, if I am founding it.
 
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Lol. You mean '"No" doesn't mean "maybe"? :D

It might be better easier to do if you can't make a propisition to X state until Y months go by or until the current ruler dies, which ever is first.
 
EricSaxon said:
Templars, Hospitaliers and all those other mongrel orders. I say no, I loose 50 piety, one month later they ask again, I say no. Over and over this goes on and on. Can those buggers quit that? I hate all knightly orders, Teutonics, the most, because those pansy little $%^# stole my land. And I hate the others too, what do I get for handing over territory. Zilch, nada, zero.

Ok, we need some sort of a thing that once you say NO, they don't ask again until your son inherits or something, or they need to become your vassals, without the negative loyalty that you get, when you normally vassalize them. Also, it would be nice if you could appoint the head of the Templar Order, since I don't want French or German or whatever guys, running around and converting provinces to their culture. I rule a Polish Kingdom, I want a Polish man to lead the Order, if I am founding it.
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Um, Teutonic Order wouldn't be TEUTONIC if it wasn't run by Germans...
 
Yes I know the Teutons were German, but why the hell would they get free land from a King, without having to fight him. Oh, I am sorry, you own this land, well I call myself a Teuton, so now I own this land. If this ever happened, with a Catholic king, they would have been murdered to the last man. Like all other Crusaders, the Teutonics were beggars, who begged for land, because they failed in their crusades. And I don't see why I should be penalized with piety, because I don't want to give them land, they can go to hell for all I care, my land, not theirs, so they can bite me.
 
daboese said:
that they are asking. When I played, they just took the land.
Accept it.
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"Be gald," because the game is broken!?!

What you couldn't come up with something like, "Shut up, because I can't figure it out. So rather than say nothing, because I don't know; I will answer because I need attention."
 
EricSaxon said:
"Be gald," because the game is broken!?!
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Well, you won't die if you lose 1 prov to each knightly order. If you plan ahead, you even lose the crappiest prov. For example, when I go to take Prussia, I always take Memel first, then wait for Teutons to take it and only after that I go for Marienburg.

Besides, you can't directly control all those provinces anyway, so does it matter so much whether your silly country cousin or some silly teuton / hospitaller / templar controls it. You rarely need the money from vassals in any case.

If you can defeat the Fatimids (as I suppose you did, if those orders start popping up), you won't run out of provinces anyway, because there is SOO many moslems to take and they are all piece of cake.
 
EricSaxon said:
"Be gald," because the game is broken!?!

What you couldn't come up with something like, "Shut up, because I can't figure it out. So rather than say nothing, because I don't know; I will answer because I need attention."
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This is great stuff !

I dont think this is a bug Eric, frustration aside, how else are they supposed to get the land? Its a game event, probably hard coded, sure it would be nice if it were a bit more dynamic or you had some options, but yeah I think your going to have to just "be glad" for now.

Just assasinate, F' em !
 
Boys, boys...

Please only post things to contribute to the question of whether there is a bug, and what, precisely, the bug is.

EricSaxon said:
Templars, Hospitaliers and all those other mongrel orders. I say no, I loose 50 piety, one month later they ask again, I say no. Over and over this goes on and on. Can those buggers quit that? I hate all knightly orders, Teutonics, the most, because those pansy little $%^# stole my land. And I hate the others too, what do I get for handing over territory. Zilch, nada, zero.

Ok, we need some sort of a thing that once you say NO, they don't ask again until your son inherits or something, or they need to become your vassals, without the negative loyalty that you get, when you normally vassalize them. Also, it would be nice if you could appoint the head of the Templar Order, since I don't want French or German or whatever guys, running around and converting provinces to their culture. I rule a Polish Kingdom, I want a Polish man to lead the Order, if I am founding it.
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Sorry EricSaxon, I have no idea what you are talking about. Is it some event that is occurring? [over and over again...] It sounds like it - and if so, the mtth obviously needs some work. Please post some precise information to help us fix this thing. :)
 
State Machine said:
Boys, boys...

Please only post things to contribute to the question of whether there is a bug, and what, precisely, the bug is.


Sorry EricSaxon, I have no idea what you are talking about. Is it some event that is occurring? [over and over again...] It sounds like it - and if so, the mtth obviously needs some work. Please post some precise information to help us fix this thing. :)
Click to expand...

As far as I understood the rant the problem would go like this:
- Event "Give Hospitalers land or lose 50 piety" happened to him
- He refused and lost 50 piety, because he wouldn't have gained anything from accepting
- Then the same "Give Hospitalers land or lose 50 piety" event happened again
- And again
- And again

And possibly same stuff with Templars too.
 
Yep, you got it right on the nose. I say NO, I take the 50 piety hit, one month later I loose another 50 piety, one month later loose another 50 piety......

The Teutonics, just steal it, but the Templars and Hospitaliers, just kill you slowly with their nagging and the 50 piety hits, every time you say no. Once you say yes, you get (0 of anything) no piety, no prestige, no end to crusades, nothing, you don't even get a thank you card in the mail, they just go independent and you get the feeling, that they are telling you "Thanks for the land, idiot, now go to hell." This is absurd.

As for controling the whole world, I control 73 provinces and I am just getting started, so :p, because I have mines, glass or some other item, that lets me increase the value of those provinces, so I don't need vassals in those provinces. By the time the murdering and raping Mongrels show up, I am going to cut them into itty, bitty little pieces and send their horses to my meat manufacturing plant. So, there.
 
a) You are using a bug (the one with Royal Posts, which is supposed to be fixed) so that you can pile up demesme land without heading drastic measures. This is not the way the game was designed to anyway.
b) Besides, if you are using a bug anyhow, you can also hit f12 and then type 'piety', that will compensate for your loss.
c) The templars might- after a while- provide you with troops helping you out, and in reality they just grabbed the land as well (see what Johan says about it here ). As I said, in my cases they don't even ask if they can take the land but they just take it.
d) The only 'bug' that I can see is that they are asking each month. Perhaps they should ask you every second month or so, but it doesn't change the fact that they should appear.
 
And historically when a King, espcially the Emperor but others to, refused to grant land to those knights order, that was a great diplomatic issue with the Pope. (I'm reading a birography of Friedrich II. and it was a main issue during his reign)

So Ithink the repeating loss of piety is WAD
 
Hi EricSaxon,

sorry to sadden you but in RL the Teutonic Order was INVITED by the Duke of Mazovia, although much later then they pop up in CK.
The contents of the agreement between the Knights and the Duke and it`s execution could fill many a scholarly debate, so we can leave it be. But they were given a little land for a starting base.

Also, when the Knights came to Prussia in RL there was no Poland, only petty realms governed by diverse Piast princelings.

IF you dislike the Knights then make or have made an event: "Bracia Dobrzynscy set up shop in ...."

They were an order set up under control of some Piast to counterbalance the Teutons. In this way you can have a really Polish or Piast controlled order. But in RL they were never popular to enter and actually merged with the Teutons soon. But CK is about changing history, and we can never have too many knightly orders, can we? :rolleyes:
They should be playable too.

Rgds, Oldtimer
 
daboese said:
c) The templars might- after a while- provide you with troops helping you out, and in reality they just grabbed the land as well (see what Johan says about it here ). As I said, in my cases they don't even ask if they can take the land but they just take it.
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Johan hasn't said anything like that in that thread though...
 
true. I have a 3,000 templar army waiting near Bukhara. Nice, as there is no manpower waste using them where losses risk being heavy. Hey, bad hits sometime happens, both 3 orders did free without letting me the choice. And it made me stronger in fact. I even vassalized the one near Jerusalem.....
 
OLDTIMER said:
Hi EricSaxon,

sorry to sadden you but in RL the Teutonic Order was INVITED by the Duke of Mazovia, although much later then they pop up in CK.
The contents of the agreement between the Knights and the Duke and it`s execution could fill many a scholarly debate, so we can leave it be. But they were given a little land for a starting base.

Also, when the Knights came to Prussia in RL there was no Poland, only petty realms governed by diverse Piast princelings.

IF you dislike the Knights then make or have made an event: "Bracia Dobrzynscy set up shop in ...."

They were an order set up under control of some Piast to counterbalance the Teutons. In this way you can have a really Polish or Piast controlled order. But in RL they were never popular to enter and actually merged with the Teutons soon. But CK is about changing history, and we can never have too many knightly orders, can we? :rolleyes:
They should be playable too.

Rgds, Oldtimer
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First, thank you for making my point, for me. If I am playing Poland, then I don't want Crusader States, because I don't like the Teutons, so why the heck would I want to create more of the same. DOHHH

Second, someone said that the German Emperor was getting into trouble with the Pope for saying NO. GUESS what, the Kaiser never retook Jerusalem, if he had, the Pope would not bug him with knightly orders, he would just have said, "Nice job, keep killing those heathens." The reason the Pope was bugging the HRE, was because they were not going to war against the heathens, like they were supposed, too, as good Catholics. Fine, penalize the ones who are not retaking the Holy Lands and leave the kingdoms doing their job, to their own devices, because they seem to be getting the job done.

Also, this is the FEUDAL age, not the IDIOT age. If I give you land, I will expect something in return, like vassalage or taxes, I don't give land away for free. I am playing a King and not a local village idiot.
 
EricSaxon said:
Also, this is the FEUDAL age, not the IDIOT age. If I give you land, I will expect something in return, like vassalage or taxes, I don't give land away for free. I am playing a King and not a local village idiot.
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But it wasn't only feudal age, it was also sort of Papal age. If Pope told you to jump you asked "how high?" instead of "what's in it for me?".:)
 
Grosshaus said:
But it wasn't only feudal age, it was also sort of Papal age. If Pope told you to jump you asked "how high?" instead of "what's in it for me?".:)
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Oh, really? Hmmm? I wonder why all those kings got excommunicated, it that was true?

Oh, wait, it couldn't be! Those kings actually did not ask "how high?"

Second point, the Crusading Orders were created for what reason? Could it be to retake the Holy Land? Well, if I am doing it, then what the heck am I doing, giving my land away to the slackers who did nothing. Do you really think the Pope would offend his best King, you know, the one who retook Jerusalem, by bugging him, as to who should rule the Holy Lands? Do you, really?
 
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