Oleg Gordievsky said:
Excellent ideas. This allow Japan to join Axis when war kicks off in 39, yet have realistic reduction in US entry. Add Far East Netherlands also to the list. 3 months.
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Excellent ideas. This allow Japan to join Axis when war kicks off in 39, yet have realistic reduction in US entry. Add Far East Netherlands also to the list. 3 months.
-StUkOv- MK VII said:Next game i will play uk oleg, then if you still want those rules after that we can decide it then
OK, sounds reasonable but we proably shouldn't work on the basis that UK is always managed by a player capable of holding on for two years. Any balancing should be based on average skills. That way good players are able to show their skill and less good players (and Allies) are assisted if things go FUBAR.
-StUkOv- MK VII said:
I am interested into filling the UK sub spot, even if UK is in bad shape. I only bought HOI2 this weekend but i play HOI since its out, and i would like to try some multiplayer. So if you feel patient enough to have a noobi in, i am your man.
Can't gurrantee you a spot, but if you show up tonight in the HOI_2 and/or Common channels tonight in Valknet, you should see us and there is a good chance you can join.
I also think something needs to be done for UK, as they are being passed around like an inmate showering in a Turkish prison by the Axis at the moment.
Deciding on a rule now might not be ideal, as we have the 1.2 patch comming out soon, and they might have tweaked the balance of the 36 scenario a bit.
A rule which I personally favour, is tying US entry to Japan. An example:
US enters:
> Jan 1st, 42 latest;
> 6 Months after Japan joins Axis (if sooner the Jan 1st 42);
> Immediately when UK is invaded.
This either keeps the US out untill about the historic date, or gets it to join in time to relieve a beleaguered UK.
Next game, I would like US (if 3v3), or Canada
.
Kyril said:
Midnight Express ... time to pucker up.
I like these rule - comply with KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) standard and they're easy for me little brain to remember. Simpler the better.
But hopefully 1.2 will put an end to this discussion
Otherwise, we restart current game on Friday 2000 Eastern. Hopefully we'll finish it that night or Saturday middday/afternoon and can all then patch the next day and ready ourselves for a for a new 1.2 game Sunday.
New 1.2 game, if I remember last night's chat correctly, will be: The artist (.) formerly known as Default (Italy or Germany or USSR); Tavi (Japan); Stukhov (UK); Panzer (USA or ?
; Cyril (USA or Canada); me (Italy or Germany or USSR); Iksender, Elysdeon, Upton, Any other (USSR or whatever remains free).See you Friday if not before.
Kyril said:I also think something needs to be done for UK, as they are being passed around like an inmate showering in a Turkish prison by the Axis at the moment.
Deciding on a rule now might not be ideal, as we have the 1.2 patch comming out soon, and they might have tweaked the balance of the 36 scenario a bit.
A rule which I personally favour, is tying US entry to Japan. An example:
US enters:
> Jan 1st, 42 latest;
> 6 Months after Japan joins Axis (if sooner the Jan 1st 42);
> Immediately when UK is invaded.
This either keeps the US out untill about the historic date, or gets it to join in time to relieve a beleaguered UK.
Next game, I would like US (if 3v3), or Canada
I think if the AXIS are raping the UK to such an extent then the USA should join immidiately.
Current status of Game #2.
United Kingom is gone, annexed by the combined forces of Italy and Germany. For the most part, only South America has non yet been effected by the almost total world war. However, in early summer of 1940, Argentenia fell for the Axis siren song, and joined. With this act, FDR declared that America's well known Monroe Doctrine was breeched. After consultation with the State department, the United States decided to join common cause with the Soviet Union. Without the leader ship of the United Kingom and the fall of Austrailia, this was the only clear choice. At this time, neither America or the Soviet Union are at war. However, troop movements along the Soviet border and speaches by the Axis leaders make it clear the it only a matter of time.
United Kingom is gone, annexed by the combined forces of Italy and Germany. For the most part, only South America has non yet been effected by the almost total world war. However, in early summer of 1940, Argentenia fell for the Axis siren song, and joined. With this act, FDR declared that America's well known Monroe Doctrine was breeched. After consultation with the State department, the United States decided to join common cause with the Soviet Union. Without the leader ship of the United Kingom and the fall of Austrailia, this was the only clear choice. At this time, neither America or the Soviet Union are at war. However, troop movements along the Soviet border and speaches by the Axis leaders make it clear the it only a matter of time.
For Clarity sake, this is the Morone Doctrine in our games.
Allies cannot ask for any Western Hemisphere country to join unless America is at war with Axis or Comminten. Axis and Comminten can ask any Western Hemisphere country to join before USA is at war but in doing so, violates the Morone Doctrine. Any attack by Axis or Comminten on a Western Hemisphere country or province will also violate the Morone Doctrine.
No Axis or Comminten forces may be based in the Western Hemisphere. This includes Naval and air forces on annexed provinces. The Western Hemisphere is defined as anything left (that's west) of the "Atlantic Ocean" lettering on the game map, with the exception of Iceland. Iceland is, per historic communications to Germany by FDR after the fall of Denmark, to be covered by the Morone Doctrine. Allies may place troops on their colonal processions or controled provinces.
Once a violation of the Morore Doctrine has taken place, America can join Alliances or DOW at will. If her interventiost setting is not low enough, then it will be edited and lowered (5 I believe) to allow this.
Notes: Axis or Comminten Air and Naval forces may patrol and engage in combat in the Western Hemisphere as long as their base is not in the Western Hemisphere.
Allies cannot ask for any Western Hemisphere country to join unless America is at war with Axis or Comminten. Axis and Comminten can ask any Western Hemisphere country to join before USA is at war but in doing so, violates the Morone Doctrine. Any attack by Axis or Comminten on a Western Hemisphere country or province will also violate the Morone Doctrine.
No Axis or Comminten forces may be based in the Western Hemisphere. This includes Naval and air forces on annexed provinces. The Western Hemisphere is defined as anything left (that's west) of the "Atlantic Ocean" lettering on the game map, with the exception of Iceland. Iceland is, per historic communications to Germany by FDR after the fall of Denmark, to be covered by the Morone Doctrine. Allies may place troops on their colonal processions or controled provinces.
Once a violation of the Morore Doctrine has taken place, America can join Alliances or DOW at will. If her interventiost setting is not low enough, then it will be edited and lowered (5 I believe) to allow this.
Notes: Axis or Comminten Air and Naval forces may patrol and engage in combat in the Western Hemisphere as long as their base is not in the Western Hemisphere.
Gottmitdammerung!
The End of Days has come for the Allies, and the Communists will soon Follow.
Berlin, August 1940 The German army is victorious in conquering the whole of Europe. 60 Panzer Divisions are ready for the invasion of the Soviet Union, the italians have smashed all resistance in Afrika and the middle east, Japan has whiped Asia clean off its allied stench.
The German Generals plan their invasion of the Soviet Union, but wonder how USA will assist USSR? They concluded that it really doesn't matter what the Soviet-American alliance does, the German army will smash whatever comes againsts it.
The End of Days has come for the Allies, and the Communists will soon Follow.
Berlin, August 1940 The German army is victorious in conquering the whole of Europe. 60 Panzer Divisions are ready for the invasion of the Soviet Union, the italians have smashed all resistance in Afrika and the middle east, Japan has whiped Asia clean off its allied stench.
The German Generals plan their invasion of the Soviet Union, but wonder how USA will assist USSR? They concluded that it really doesn't matter what the Soviet-American alliance does, the German army will smash whatever comes againsts it.
Having liberated the oppressed people of much of Asia, the Imperial High Command has been bombarded with requests of other victims of colonisation in the region to be part of the Greater Co-Prosperity, soon to be know as the United Globe of Axisonia.
The brave Axis forces, guarding the peace from regions as far away as the pole circle to Terra del Fuego and Sydney, lie dormant for the moment. Still, let the world not be fooled by the apparent quietness: the divine winds will soon gain in strength and will blow away opposition in true hurricane strength.
The brave Axis forces, guarding the peace from regions as far away as the pole circle to Terra del Fuego and Sydney, lie dormant for the moment. Still, let the world not be fooled by the apparent quietness: the divine winds will soon gain in strength and will blow away opposition in true hurricane strength.
So i guess you guys continue friday night. Bad night for me friday. My wife is quite possesive about the friday evening so i'll have (sadly) to pass my turn. Maybe next evening ... have a good one gents, oh and thanks for letting me in last game, i had a blast, was fun !
Panzer Guderian said:
PG, was trying to message you but your comcast address seems dead?
-StUkOv- MK VII said:
Time to quote the big man:
"If your opponent is of choleric temper, seek to irritate him. Pretend to be weak, that he may grow arrogant."
Oleg Gordievsky said:
It's panzergDELETE_THIS@comcast.net. Working all to well at least for spammers.
Oleg Gordievsky said:
dont use Sun Tzu on me, use good WW2 speechs, like this one....
"Men, this stuff that some sources sling around about America wanting out of this war, not wanting to fight, is a crock of bullshit. Americans love to fight, traditionally. All real Americans love the sting and clash of battle.
You are here today for three reasons. First, because you are here to defend your homes and your loved ones. Second, you are here for your own self respect, because you would not want to be anywhere else. Third, you are here because you are real men and all real men like to fight. When you, here, every one of you, were kids, you all admired the champion marble player, the fastest runner, the toughest boxer, the big league ball players, and the All-American football players. Americans love a winner. Americans will not tolerate a loser. Americans despise cowards. Americans play to win all of the time. I wouldn't give a hoot in hell for a man who lost and laughed. That's why Americans have never lost nor will ever lose a war; for the very idea of losing is hateful to an American.
You are not all going to die. Only two percent of you right here today would die in a major battle. Death must not be feared. Death, in time, comes to all men. Yes, every man is scared in his first battle. If he says he's not, he's a liar. Some men are cowards but they fight the same as the brave men or they get the hell slammed out of them watching men fight who are just as scared as they are. The real hero is the man who fights even though he is scared. Some men get over their fright in a minute under fire. For some, it takes an hour. For some, it takes days. But a real man will never let his fear of death overpower his honor, his sense of duty to his country, and his innate manhood.
Battle is the most magnificent competition in which a human being can indulge. It brings out all that is best and it removes all that is base. Americans pride themselves on being He Men and they ARE He Men. Remember that the enemy is just as frightened as you are, and probably more so. They are not supermen.
All through your Army careers, you men have bitched about what you call "chicken shit drilling." That, like everything else in this Army, has a definite purpose. That purpose is alertness. Alertness must be bred into every soldier. I don't give a fuck for a man who's not always on his toes. You men are veterans or you wouldn't be here. You are ready for what's to come. A man must be alert at all times if he expects to stay alive. If you're not alert, sometime, a German son-of-an-asshole-bitch is going to sneak up behind you and beat you to death with a sockful of shit! There are four hundred neatly marked graves somewhere in Sicily, all because one man went to sleep on the job. But they are German graves, because we caught the bastard asleep before they did.
An Army is a team. It lives, sleeps, eats, and fights as a team. This individual heroic stuff is pure horse shit. The bilious bastards who write that kind of stuff for the Saturday Evening Post don't know any more about real fighting under fire than they know about fucking! We have the finest food, the finest equipment, the best spirit, and the best men in the world. Why, by God, I actually pity those poor sons-of-bitches we're going up against. By God, I do.
My men don't surrender, and I don't want to hear of any soldier under my command being captured unless he has been hit. Even if you are hit, you can still fight back. That's not just bull shit either. The kind of man that I want in my command is just like the lieutenant in Libya, who, with a Luger against his chest, jerked off his helmet, swept the gun aside with one hand, and busted the hell out of the Kraut with his helmet. Then he jumped on the gun and went out and killed another German before they knew what the hell was coming off. And, all of that time, this man had a bullet through a lung. There was a real man!
All of the real heroes are not storybook combat fighters, either. Every single man in this Army plays a vital role. Don't ever let up. Don't ever think that your job is unimportant. Every man has a job to do and he must do it. Every man is a vital link in the great chain. What if every truck driver suddenly decided that he didn't like the whine of those shells overhead, turned yellow, and jumped headlong into a ditch? The cowardly bastard could say, 'Hell, they won't miss me, just one man in thousands.' But, what if every man thought that way? Where in the hell would we be now? What would our country, our loved ones, our homes, even the world, be like? No, Goddamnit, Americans don't think like that. Every man does his job. Every man serves the whole. Every department, every unit, is important in the vast scheme of this war. The ordnance men are needed to supply the guns and machinery of war to keep us rolling. The Quartermaster is needed to bring up food and clothes because where we are going there isn't a hell of a lot to steal. Every last man on K.P. has a job to do, even the one who heats our water to keep us from getting the 'G.I. Shits.'
Each man must not think only of himself, but also of his buddy fighting beside him. We don't want yellow cowards in this Army. They should be killed off like rats. If not, they will go home after this war and breed more cowards. The brave men will breed more brave men. Kill off the Goddamned cowards and we will have a nation of brave men. One of the bravest men that I ever saw was a fellow on top of a telegraph pole in the midst of a furious fire fight in Tunisia. I stopped and asked what the hell he was doing up there at a time like that. He answered, 'Fixing the wire, Sir.' I asked, 'Isn't that a little unhealthy right about now?' He answered, 'Yes Sir, but the Goddamned wire has to be fixed.' I asked, 'Don't those planes strafing the road bother you?' And he answered, 'No, Sir, but you sure as hell do!' Now, there was a real man. A real soldier. There was a man who devoted all he had to his duty, no matter how seemingly insignificant his duty might appear at the time, no matter how great the odds.
And you should have seen those trucks on the rode to Tunisia. Those drivers were magnificent. All day and all night they rolled over those son-of-a-bitching roads, never stopping, never faltering from their course, with shells bursting all around them all of the time. We got through on good old American guts.
Many of those men drove for over forty consecutive hours. These men weren't combat men, but they were soldiers with a job to do. They did it, and in one hell of a way they did it. They were part of a team. Without team effort, without them, the fight would have been lost. All of the links in the chain pulled together and the chain became unbreakable.
Don't forget, you men don't know that I'm here. No mention of that fact is to be made in any letters. The world is not supposed to know what the hell happened to me. I'm not supposed to be commanding this Army. I'm not even supposed to be here in England. Let the first bastards to find out be the Goddamned Germans. Someday I want to see them raise up on their piss-soaked hind legs and howl, 'Jesus Christ, it's the Goddamned Third Army again and that son-of-a-fucking-bitch Patton.' We want to get the hell over there." The quicker we clean up this Goddamned mess, the quicker we can take a little jaunt against the purple pissing Japs and clean out their nest, too. Before the Goddamned Marines get all of the credit.
Sure, we want to go home. We want this war over with. The quickest way to get it over with is to go get the bastards who started it. The quicker they are whipped, the quicker we can go home. The shortest way home is through Berlin and Tokyo. And when we get to Berlin, I am personally going to shoot that paper hanging son-of-a-bitch Hitler. Just like I'd shoot a snake!
When a man is lying in a shell hole, if he just stays there all day, a German will get to him eventually. The hell with that idea. The hell with taking it. My men don't dig foxholes. I don't want them to. Foxholes only slow up an offensive. Keep moving. And don't give the enemy time to dig one either. We'll win this war, but we'll win it only by fighting and by showing the Germans that we've got more guts than they have; or ever will have. We're not going to just shoot the sons-of-bitches, we're going to rip out their living Goddamned guts and use them to grease the treads of our tanks. We're going to murder those lousy Hun cock suckers by the bushel-fucking-basket.
War is a bloody, killing business. You've got to spill their blood, or they will spill yours. Rip them up the belly. Shoot them in the guts. When shells are hitting all around you and you wipe the dirt off your face and realize that instead of dirt it's the blood and guts of what once was your best friend beside you, you'll know what to do!
I don't want to get any messages saying, 'I am holding my position.' We are not holding a Goddamned thing. Let the Germans do that. We are advancing constantly and we are not interested in holding onto anything, except the enemy's balls. We are going to twist his balls and kick the living shit out of him all of the time. Our basic plan of operation is to advance and to keep on advancing regardless of whether we have to go over, under, or through the enemy. We are going to go through him like crap through a goose; like shit through a tin horn!
From time to time there will be some complaints that we are pushing our people too hard. I don't give a good Goddamn about such complaints. I believe in the old and sound rule that an ounce of sweat will save a gallon of blood. The harder WE push, the more Germans we will kill. The more Germans we kill, the fewer of our men will be killed. Pushing means fewer casualties. I want you all to remember that.
There is one great thing that you men will all be able to say after this war is over and you are home once again. You may be thankful that twenty years from now when you are sitting by the fireplace with your grandson on your knee and he asks you what you did in the great World War II, you WON'T have to cough, shift him to the other knee and say, 'Well, your Granddaddy shoveled shit in Louisiana.' No, Sir, you can look him straight in the eye and say, 'Son, your Granddaddy rode with the Great Third Army and a Son-of-a- Goddamned-Bitch named Georgie Patton!'
"That is all."
George S. Patton
:rofl:
Now just change "Germans" To "Russians" and "Americans" to "Germans" and its a great Motivation speech for the Whermacht