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Originally posted by shdwknightx
the Haig

'the Haig' ? :D

Was this his nickname or something, much like 'the Fons' from TV's Happy Days?

I can't quite see Sir Douglas strutting into the situation room wearing a shiny leather coat and looking at Byng, Gough etc and exclaiming 'heyyyyyyyyyyy'.....
 
I think Germany going for unrestricted submarine warfare in 1915 should bring some pros as well as cons.

Allenby says
I think this event is apart of the American war entry event chain. Your probably right, the player should be given the choice where possible - however, someone taking control of Germany will, with the benefit of knowing what would happen by continuing a policy of unrestricted submarine warfare, choose not to pursue it on nearly all occasions. There's always time to improve the events though.

I would disagree. If the year were 1917 a human Germany player would NOT go for unrestricted submarine warfare. However in 1915 the conditions were different. I'd like to quote from "More What If? Eminent Historians Imagine What Might Have Been", edited by Robert Cowley, published in 2002 by Pan Books. The essay within is entitled "The Great War torpedoed" written by Robert O'Connell, pages 202-205:

...the exchange rate was 29.67 merchant ships, or 69,015 tonnes sunk per U boat lost. This amounted to a very substantial advantage, which allowed the German Navy to build up U boats quite rapidly until their total in August 1916 stood at 111 with an average of 68 submarines available for the 19 months beginning in February 1915 - probably enough to do the job. But they were not allowed to and this was a matter of politics.

...[The Lusitania sinking] led directly to the suspension of the [unrestricted submarine warfare] program in September 1915. Most historians have judged the Germans prudent ....Yet the state of the US as a potential belligerent in the summer of 1915 argues strenously in the opposite direction....The army was tiny and ill equipped, the navy focused on relatively useless dreadnoughts, realistic battle plans were lacking, and the arms industry was incapable of producing modern heavy weapons. All of this could be righted, but it would have been time consuming. Even with the benefit of a gradual but significant Preparedness campaign, it required more than a year after the US's declaration of war in April 1917 before American troops began making a significant difference on the Western front. In 1915 it would have taken considerably longer. So Wilson's threat was without real substance......

So, as the basis of our counterfactual analysis, Bethmann-Hollweg will be removed from the scene on 10 May 1915...[unrestricted sub warfare goes on] Success follows in its wake. Backed by unwavering support, monthly scores could be expected to have accelerated from 127,000 tonnes (actual figure) to around 250,000 tonnes in August (183,000 actual). At this point the total of boats stabilised at around 58 until the first part of 1916, so it makes sense to keep the scores steady at a quarter million tonne per month for the remainder of 1915. Since the next eight months roughly doubled the flotilla to 111, a steady increase in kills up to 555,000 tonnes seems reasonable. If these figures seem high, it should be remembered that actual U boat sinkings peaked in April 1917 at 860,000 tonnesm achieved with a flotilla of 156 submarines. The net result from this 19 month campaign would have been roughly 5.3 Million tonnes sunk.

Yet based on the actual facts, the British reaction can be projected to have been fatally sluggish. The admiralty had only a vague idea of the shipping situation, since it failed to keep the necessary statistics. Hence it remained blissfully unaware of both the precipitous drop in replacement merchant ship construction during the 1915-16 period and the submarine induced congestion in ports, which was estimated to have reduced the annual carrying capacity of the ships affected by as much as 20%....The added pressure of a truly unrestricted submarine campaign might have added to an intuitive sense of a brewing crisis; but without access to the necessary figures, the admiralty would have had little way of understanding how truly desperate their situation was becoming. To further compound matters, British naval authorities could be depended on to have refused to take the critical steps necessary to save themselves, the introduction of merchant convoys. Prior to the Battle of Jutland on the last day of May 1916, the combat readiness of the battleships of the Grand Fleet at Scapa was universally considered vital. Therefore any request to detach even some of its 70 to 80 destroyers for convoy escort duty would have been summarily rejected. Even after the disastrous month of April 1917, the admiralty only relectantly acceded to convoys on the insistence of Prime Minister David Lloyd George. So the noose would have been tightened silently and rapidly around the condemned, with little prospect of the rope being broke.

May I add that Lloyd George would only become PM in 1916, so imagine if Asquith was in power and the German sub campaign was in full swing? Clearly had the campaign continued in 1915, it could have brought a swift enough victory as the USA would not have enough time to prepare for war.

The French wanted a war of aggression. Remember Plan 17?? The drive into Alsace Lorraine which failed miserably? "On 14 August, in the opening salvo of Plan 17, the French had crossed into Lorraine, one of the provinecs lost to Germany in 1871. Bands struck up the Marseillaise as the troops in the lead tore down the striped posts that marked the boundary." [same source as below, page 273] However sentiment in Britain was anti German, not French, so if Belgium were invaded Britain should remain neutral. This is very ahistorical but Britain knew the main threat was Germany, not France. What you could do is have the Americans VERY pissed off if the Frenchies invade Belgium. Give them negative war entry.

Another crucial point. WHEN Britain entered the war was important. Once again another quote (this time shorter) from "What If? The World's Foremost Military Historians Imagine What Might Have Been." published in 2000 by Berkley books, the essay is "The What Ifs of 1914" by Robert Cowley. Page 266-9:

In a letter Asquith wrote that night (Friday 24 July 1914), he spoke of a coming "Armageddon" on the continent. "Happily", he added, "there seems to be no reason why we should be anything more than spectators.".....Even as late as Friday 31 July, as Austria, Russia, Turkey and France mobilised, Asquith was still planning to make a speech at Chester on the next morning, after which he would catch a train to spend the rest of the weekend with his friend Lord Sheffield. Recapitulating the chronology of those next days, you can almost believe, if only for a moment, that Britain will not burge from the sidelines. The 947,000 young men from the Great Britain and its Empire will not die....The war will be confined to the continent...the US too will stay out...The empire will not need the US. Its strength undepleted by a war in which it played little part, it will remain the dominant presence on the globe far beyond 1945, a date that will have no special meaning in history. What would have happened if there had been wholesale resignations and the Asquith government had fallen? Even if had had been replaced by a Coalition government that favoured war, a delay of a week or more would have changed everything. There would have been no rearguard actions at Mons or Le Cateau, where the British Expeditionary Force (BEF) were blooded in the first encounters with a continental enemy since the Crimean war. And Britain might have hesitated to send the 80,000 men and 30,000 horses of its tiny army, concentrating instead on closing the sea approaches to Germany. If, on the other hand, new elections were called, the decision to go to war would have been put off until the fall. How could there have been a declaration of war before a general election? Also, as it became obvious that the German wheel was not immediately menacing the channel ports, the demand for action might have been defused.......

This could have bought Germany the time it needed to finish the French once and for all. Remember the altered Schlieffen plan did not call for such a wide arc on the right wing, so the channel ports would not be priorities, as was Schlieffen's original intention.

So the British enter the war if Belgium or France is invaded. What if Germany adheres to Moltke the Elder's plan, and defend on the western front? In that case, FRANCE would be the aggressor, and Germany is only attacking in the East. If France invades Germany, what would the British do? My guess is they would be very turned off the war, give them minus war entry or something. But what if the Germans rout the Russians, then in a massive counterattack drive into the heart of France? Would the British suddenly say "tut tut we cant allow the Germans to do this" or would they say "those Frogs asked for it, they shouldnt have invaded Germany in the first place!" as was the case in the Franco Prussian war, where France made the declaration of war after the Ems telegram and NOT Prussia.....

This seems to be a good tactic for a German player - dont mess with France or Belgium.....

One last suggestion for the time being. Tanks. The British should get an event allowing them to invest in tanks (at a huge cost). In our timeline, Germany actually produced 20 tanks in 1918 but that was too late. Perhaps give Germany a choice whether to focus on tanks earlier on? Germany knew about the tank, but never really thought it was going to be useful.

http://www.firstworldwar.com/weaponry/tanks.htm

Tank Production 1916-18
Year UK France Germany Italy USA
1916 150 - - - -
1917 1,277 800 - - -
1918 1,391 4,000 20 6 84
 
Last edited:
Oops I forgot to mention what I think should happen if Germany continues the unrestricted sub warfare in 1915.

US war entry increases by 10? or whatever it takes to ensure they can declare war by April or May 1916.

Brits lose shipping every month (how much? I'll have to play more HoI to tell you, I've only just got the game...I'm EU2 player at heart :))

And the convoy system can only be proposed if Lloyd George is in power, which can happen earlier than December 1916 if dissent is high enough everyone wants Asquith to go.

Now I'm not a fan of determinism, but if we can get Lloyd George in power by Jan or Feb 1916, and assuming the Germans have enough U boats, its a race against time as to how many tonnes must be lost before the sue for peace event comes up. Let's just say if the convoy system isnt installed at all, Britain would have to sue for peace in 2nd half 1916. I suggest converting 550,000 tonnes into HoI terms and call that x tonnes per month. Say 5.5 million tonnes must be lost, so that means 10x HoI supplies must be lost? Is there a way to calculate how many resources Britain needs per month, and if the lack of resources is less than half needed for 10 months, then the sue for peace event comes up?

Which sums up as - holy crap! for Britain and rapidly rising dissent. War entry for USA should be scripted so they declare war on Germany sometime in mid 1916 (one year earlier than in real life) but troops only actually get to France in 1917.

I don't agree about France becoming a German puppet if the peace treaty is signed after 1916. Weimar Germany was emasculated but not to the level of puppet; I think Berlin would realise that France is a great power and cannot be puppeted. Another interesting outcome is the Social Democrats rise to power even IF the Germans win. It is not impossible, as a long war could sicken the German populace and piss people off that they've had enough of the military dictatorship, and demand greater rights for the Reichstag. Liberalism wins, and in that case the treaties will be very lenient, maybe even status quo antebellum. After all, ever since 1871 the forces of liberalism had been strengthening, ja?

BTW Allenby what do you mean you're glad I could post? Hong Kong may be a part of China but we arent living under an oppressive dictatorship here.....(sorry, I don't know what you actually mean, but I get the dumbest questions from many Brits such as "do you have tanks in the streets? do you see the military around much?" God no, we're a financial city dammit!)
 
Originally posted by Allenby
'the Haig' ? :D

Was this his nickname or something, much like 'the Fons' from TV's Happy Days?

I can't quite see Sir Douglas strutting into the situation room wearing a shiny leather coat and looking at Byng, Gough etc and exclaiming 'heyyyyyyyyyyy'.....

:) Oooopppsss.

Well that's what you get when you try to write a post and watch a movie at the same time.
 
Originally posted by ptan54
I think Germany going for unrestricted submarine warfare in 1915 should bring some pros as well as cons.

Most certaintly.

Originally posted by ptan54
I would disagree. If the year were 1917 a human Germany player would NOT go for unrestricted submarine warfare. However in 1915 the conditions were different. I'd like to quote from "More What If? Eminent Historians Imagine What Might Have Been", edited by Robert Cowley, published in 2002 by Pan Books. The essay within is entitled "The Great War torpedoed" written by Robert O'Connell, pages 202-205:

Not necessarily, your assuming that in the game that the war will be going exactly the same as in history, when in 1917 game time the human Germany could be doing much better and just decide to risk the US war entry to finish off the Entente before the US can mobilize. Similiar to what the German generals thought at that time too, but their decisions proved wrong.

Originally posted by ptan54
May I add that Lloyd George would only become PM in 1916, so imagine if Asquith was in power and the German sub campaign was in full swing? Clearly had the campaign continued in 1915, it could have brought a swift enough victory as the USA would not have enough time to prepare for war.

It could have, but since it did not happen I can not say how well it would have worked in the end.

Originally posted by ptan54
The French wanted a war of aggression. Remember Plan 17?? The drive into Alsace Lorraine which failed miserably? "On 14 August, in the opening salvo of Plan 17, the French had crossed into Lorraine, one of the provinecs lost to Germany in 1871. Bands struck up the Marseillaise as the troops in the lead tore down the striped posts that marked the boundary." [same source as below, page 273] However sentiment in Britain was anti German, not French, so if Belgium were invaded Britain should remain neutral. This is very ahistorical but Britain knew the main threat was Germany, not France. What you could do is have the Americans VERY pissed off if the Frenchies invade Belgium. Give them negative war entry.

Certaintly possible. Although if the France invades and Germany does not, then Belgium should join the Central Powers.

Originally posted by ptan54
Another crucial point. WHEN Britain entered the war was important. Once again another quote (this time shorter) from "What If? The World's Foremost Military Historians Imagine What Might Have Been." published in 2000 by Berkley books, the essay is "The What Ifs of 1914" by Robert Cowley. Page 266-9:

It has been a while since I have read that book of my shelf.

Originally posted by ptan54
This could have bought Germany the time it needed to finish the French once and for all. Remember the altered Schlieffen plan did not call for such a wide arc on the right wing, so the channel ports would not be priorities, as was Schlieffen's original intention.

Which is why we have for Britain's war entry either Germany's invasion of Belgium or the capture of the French ports along the Channel (i.e. Lille province)(or at least that is what I think Allenby said a while ago.)

Originally posted by ptan54
So the British enter the war if Belgium or France is invaded. What if Germany adheres to Moltke the Elder's plan, and defend on the western front? In that case, FRANCE would be the aggressor, and Germany is only attacking in the East. If France invades Germany, what would the British do? My guess is they would be very turned off the war, give them minus war entry or something. But what if the Germans rout the Russians, then in a massive counterattack drive into the heart of France? Would the British suddenly say "tut tut we cant allow the Germans to do this" or would they say "those Frogs asked for it, they shouldnt have invaded Germany in the first place!" as was the case in the Franco Prussian war, where France made the declaration of war after the Ems telegram and NOT Prussia.....

Hard to say, but since Germany was the one to declare war first this time (on Russia if I recall correctly), France could have been seen as coming to an allies call for help. Actually as Allenby has stated before, GB was interested in the balance of power (BP) in Europe, not one controlled by Germany or French/Russian alliance. So in the first case you get what hisorically happened Britain coming to France's aid. The second case you get Britain letting France/Russia feel some hurt, and then come to the rescue...let the proverbial 'Frogs' know their place as it is.

Originally posted by ptan54
This seems to be a good tactic for a German player - dont mess with France or Belgium.....

One which I am waiting to try when the mod is out.

Originally posted by ptan54
One last suggestion for the time being. Tanks. The British should get an event allowing them to invest in tanks (at a huge cost). In our timeline, Germany actually produced 20 tanks in 1918 but that was too late. Perhaps give Germany a choice whether to focus on tanks earlier on? Germany knew about the tank, but never really thought it was going to be useful.

I think it is better to just let the player decide when to invest in tanks through the tech tree. That's why its there and I don't see a reason to not let a player invest in them earlier if they so choose.
 
Originally posted by ptan54
Oops I forgot to mention what I think should happen if Germany continues the unrestricted sub warfare in 1915.

US war entry increases by 10? or whatever it takes to ensure they can declare war by April or May 1916.

Brits lose shipping every month (how much? I'll have to play more HoI to tell you, I've only just got the game...I'm EU2 player at heart :))

And the convoy system can only be proposed if Lloyd George is in power, which can happen earlier than December 1916 if dissent is high enough everyone wants Asquith to go.

Certaintly doable, although I don't know if it possible to sleep a tech until an event pops up there 'allowing' you to research it. Which is why in my event chain I have the 'Convoy System' Doctrine (which if I recall, is a late medium doctrine, hard but not impossible to get to by the time the event should happen) is moved to the top of GB's tech research.

Originally posted by ptan54
Now I'm not a fan of determinism, but if we can get Lloyd George in power by Jan or Feb 1916, and assuming the Germans have enough U boats, its a race against time as to how many tonnes must be lost before the sue for peace event comes up. Let's just say if the convoy system isnt installed at all, Britain would have to sue for peace in 2nd half 1916. I suggest converting 550,000 tonnes into HoI terms and call that x tonnes per month. Say 5.5 million tonnes must be lost, so that means 10x HoI supplies must be lost? Is there a way to calculate how many resources Britain needs per month, and if the lack of resources is less than half needed for 10 months, then the sue for peace event comes up?

Hard to say how many resources GB will need to have per month, because the IC number is not a fixed number. Besides your automatically reducing large numbers of supplies by event (which I could be in favor if done once or probably twice), however I think if Germany wants to sink that many tonnes (either human or AI), they need to build subs and go out an do it, not get it free by event.

Originally posted by ptan54
Which sums up as - holy crap! for Britain and rapidly rising dissent. War entry for USA should be scripted so they declare war on Germany sometime in mid 1916 (one year earlier than in real life) but troops only actually get to France in 1917.

Since I am not a big fan of War Entry (it is broken, and in my opinion a poorly done concept), it can easly be scripted to have an event chain declare war on Germany in mid 1916 should Germany choose to continue it URSW.

The thing is that US troops, i.e. manpower, while welcome was not really needed in 1915 (even in 1918 the Entente was only just starting to feel the crush of manpower shortages, by 1919 the US troops would have certaintly been desperately needed.). What the US supplied for the Entente was several things: Money (and lets say Money for the next three or four in the list), food stuffs, and the real kicker processed raw materials. If I recall correctly it was the war factories in France and GB that actually produced the weapons of the war (both for themselves and US troops), while the US supplied the finished/processed raw materials for them to do so. While the small US military industrial complex was being added to and built upon it just was not sufficient to arm/supply the millions of US troops.

Originally posted by ptan54
I don't agree about France becoming a German puppet if the peace treaty is signed after 1916. Weimar Germany was emasculated but not to the level of puppet; I think Berlin would realise that France is a great power and cannot be puppeted. Another interesting outcome is the Social Democrats rise to power even IF the Germans win. It is not impossible, as a long war could sicken the German populace and piss people off that they've had enough of the military dictatorship, and demand greater rights for the Reichstag. Liberalism wins, and in that case the treaties will be very lenient, maybe even status quo antebellum. After all, ever since 1871 the forces of liberalism had been strengthening, ja?

I think the puppeting is done to represent war reperations. Since puppets give almost all of their resources to their puppet master it becomes a good way to simulate war reperations. I don't think the puppeting is meant to be permenent, only for a few years.

Certaintly possible if the war drags on for too long.
 
Very good points you bring up - didnt think of the unfairness of the Brits losing so much whilst the Germans dont have to do anything.

I suggest the following then if the Germans continue their sub warfare in 1915.

Add ___ to sub research. Make sure its enough to make some difference. Add 5(?) or more subs. British take a onetime dissent hit (+10?) if enough convoys are sunk after 3 months.

In favour of reducing ICs by event once or twice? Good, let's have 2 disastrous months. One in Dec 1915, the other in March 1916. The other months are up to the players to decide. Let's just program it so that if the Brits dont have the convoy system they are really in for hell.



Hard to say, but since Germany was the one to declare war first this time (on Russia if I recall correctly), France could have been seen as coming to an allies call for help. Actually as Allenby has stated before, GB was interested in the balance of power (BP) in Europe, not one controlled by Germany or French/Russian alliance. So in the first case you get what hisorically happened Britain coming to France's aid. The second case you get Britain letting France/Russia feel some hurt, and then come to the rescue...let the proverbial 'Frogs' know their place as it is.

I thought the mod starts in Jan 1914? If thats the case the German player can always decide NOT to declare war first, and ensure the French and Russians fire the first shot! I think Belgium joining the Central Powers is a good idea, but if the Germans crushe the French in Germany, the French should get an event of "propose status quo antebellum" and if the war drags on, then the Brits get war entry option.

Balance of Power in Europe eh? Well the Brits certainly did their part to ensure that it shifted away from Europe and to the New World!
 
Originally posted by ptan54
BTW Allenby what do you mean you're glad I could post? Hong Kong may be a part of China but we arent living under an oppressive dictatorship here.....(sorry, I don't know what you actually mean, but I get the dumbest questions from many Brits such as "do you have tanks in the streets? do you see the military around much?" God no, we're a financial city dammit!)

I was being courteous
 
event = {
id = 21503
random = no
country = GER


name = "Restrictions"
desc = "We must now impose strict limitations on the operation of our
submarines."
style = 0

action_a = {
name = "Impose the restrictions"
command = { type = trigger which = 56504 } # ENG
}

action_b = {
name = "We do not fear these empty American threats!"
## Gain 5 submarines.
## Sub max organisation +10
## Gain some sub doctrine
## Sub harder to detect by +1
## Subs deal +1 damage, +2 to convoys (if this is possible)
## British immediately lose 1000 supplies. I calculate this because playing as Germany with a huge army I need 500 ish a month, so losing a few months worth of shipping sounds ok. British army slightly smaller so this sounds right.
## December 1915 British lose 1300 supplies. (better subs)
## February 1916 British lose 1600 supplies.
## British dissent +3, 4, 5 in each lose supplies event. (+12 in total)
## 1st March 1916 Asquith govt collapses, Lloyd George forms coalition. Gain convoy doctrine (or whatever its called)
## US war entry +20 immediately
## December 1915 US war entry +35
## February 1916 US war entry +45
## May 1916 US declares war (if the AI hasnt done so already).
## May 1916 or US declares war British and French dissent - 8.
}

}

What say ye all?

Also what exactly triggers fall of Austria Hungary? Military defeat? Or historical inevitability (this is in fact true, question is when?)
 
Originally posted by ptan54
event = {
id = 21503
random = no
country = GER


name = "Restrictions"
desc = "We must now impose strict limitations on the operation of our
submarines."
style = 0

action_a = {
name = "Impose the restrictions"
command = { type = trigger which = 56504 } # ENG
}

action_b = {
name = "We do not fear these empty American threats!"
## Gain 5 submarines.
## Sub max organisation +10
## Gain some sub doctrine
## Sub harder to detect by +1
## Subs deal +1 damage, +2 to convoys (if this is possible)
## British immediately lose 1000 supplies. I calculate this because playing as Germany with a huge army I need 500 ish a month, so losing a few months worth of shipping sounds ok. British army slightly smaller so this sounds right.
## December 1915 British lose 1300 supplies. (better subs)
## February 1916 British lose 1600 supplies.
## British dissent +3, 4, 5 in each lose supplies event. (+12 in total)
## 1st March 1916 Asquith govt collapses, Lloyd George forms coalition. Gain convoy doctrine (or whatever its called)
## US war entry +20 immediately
## December 1915 US war entry +35
## February 1916 US war entry +45
## May 1916 US declares war (if the AI hasnt done so already).
## May 1916 or US declares war British and French dissent - 8.
}

}

What say ye all?

Also what exactly triggers fall of Austria Hungary? Military defeat? Or historical inevitability (this is in fact true, question is when?)

Germany seems to be getting a whole lot of free techs in that event, not to mention a lot of free sinkings of British supplies (a one shot loss is okay in my opinion, two really bends it though). I would not even bother with war entry for the US, just pick a date with an offset and have them declare war on that date if Germany picks that choice(b).

Try looking at Havard's HOI Hacking Haven (there is a link in the HOI - scenarios and modifications forum, I believe.), it has all you need to know about event coding, etc.
 
I agree, I think that needs to be watered down a bit - would Asquith's government really fall because of shipping losses?

On the whole, I think the effectiveness of the submarine war should be left to the players, without having events which meddle and interfere too much in the natural flow of the game.
 
Our first coded Bulgarian event.

Code:
event = {
	country = BUL
	id = 8001
	random = no
	style = 0
name = "Join the Central Powers?"
desc = "Ever since its foundation as a modern state, Bulgaria has 
laid claim to the territory of Macedonia.  However, conspiracies by 
the Great Powers and an alliance of her Balkan rivals had given 
the land to Serbia instead.  Now, with Serbia under attack from 
the combined forces of Austria-Hungary and Germany, the time 
may be right to join with the Central Powers and secure 
Bulgarian rights in the region."

trigger = { 
	war = { country = SER country = GER }
	war = { country = SER country = U11 }
	atwar = no
	NOT = { alliance = { country = BUL country = RUS } }
	# Check the Central Powers are not losing the war in the East:
	control =  { province = 647 data = GER }  
	control =  { province = 635 data = U11 } 
	control =  { province = 873 data = TUR } 
	 }

date = { day = 6 month = september year = 1915 }
offset = 1 
deathdate = { day = 0 month = january year = 1924 }

action_a = {
	name = "Join the Central Powers"
	command = { type = alliance which = GER }
	command = { type = addcore which = 755 } # Skopje
	}

action_b = {
	name = "Remain neutral"
	command = { }
	}
}
 
Romania joined the war on the Entente side though, even though Germany was faring well in the east.

Are we going to make Romania = Entente almost certain?

The Bulgarian check for Turkish success makes this event happening very unlikely.

The reason is the Turks get thoroughly clobbered by Britain all the time.

Also - does Britain start the war as Entente, or does it join the Alliance after France/Belgium is attacked?

The French AI could invite Britain to join the alliance even without German attacks in the West.....which would be a problem.
 
Originally posted by ptan54
Romania joined the war on the Entente side though, even though Germany was faring well in the east.

Are we going to make Romania = Entente almost certain?

The Bulgarian check for Turkish success makes this event happening very unlikely.

The reason is the Turks get thoroughly clobbered by Britain all the time.

Also - does Britain start the war as Entente, or does it join the Alliance after France/Belgium is attacked?

The French AI could invite Britain to join the alliance even without German attacks in the West.....which would be a problem.

Romania joined because the Entente offered them practically all of Hungry including the kitchen sink (not really, but a good chunk of it). If say the Central Powers offered them Moldovia and perhaps a part of Transylvania then they might join the CP. But that would certaintly not make the Hungarians/Austrians happy.


We could do a check to see if the Ottoman's have occupied the Suez and still retain control of Basrah as precondition for Bulgaria staying out of the war.

(I assume your still using the unofficial Beta by Josip as reference to the Turks losing? Since we have yet to code our AI, references to that mod is really irrelevant and should not be made.)

Britain starts the game as neutral. If Belgium is attacked or Germany occupies the Channel Ports (i.e. Lille province) then Britain joins the Entente. I do not know if there is anything we can do with France asking Britain join the Entente.
 
name = "Restrictions"
desc = "We must now impose strict limitations on the operation of our
submarines."
style = 0

action_a = {
name = "Impose the restrictions"
command = { type = trigger which = 56504 } # ENG
}

action_b = {
name = "We do not fear these empty American threats!"
## Gain 5 submarines in Wilhemshaven.
## Gain Basic Sub construction tech (you have to have the basics?!)
## Gain Unlimited Sub warfare doctrine (+15 org).
## Dec 1915 gain Wolfpack doctrine. (+15 org) [is this pushing it? it does tie in with unlimited sub]
## British immediately lose 2500 supplies. I calculate this because playing as Germany with a huge army I need 500 ish a month, so losing a few months worth of shipping sounds ok. British army slightly smaller so this sounds right. EDIT - combined the later 2 losses events.
## British dissent +3 immediately, +4 in Dec 1915.
## British immediately gain Blue Water Doctrine.
## Aug 1915 British gain Merchant Raider doctrine.
## 1st Feb 1916 Asquith govt collapses, Lloyd George forms coalition. Gain sea lanes doctrine.
## 1st May 1916 US declares war
## 1st May 1916 British and French dissent - 7.
## 1st May 1916 US gains the first doctrine in land naval and air.
}

Oh an interesting side note -

What if Britain is NOT at war with Germany in May 1915? Does this event still occur?
 
Originally posted by ptan54
name = "Restrictions"
desc = "We must now impose strict limitations on the operation of our
submarines."
style = 0

action_a = {
name = "Impose the restrictions"
command = { type = trigger which = 56504 } # ENG
}

action_b = {
name = "We do not fear these empty American threats!"
## Gain 5 submarines in Wilhemshaven.
## Gain Basic Sub construction tech (you have to have the basics?!)
## Gain Unlimited Sub warfare doctrine (+15 org).
## Dec 1915 gain Wolfpack doctrine. (+15 org) [is this pushing it? it does tie in with unlimited sub]
## British immediately lose 2500 supplies. I calculate this because playing as Germany with a huge army I need 500 ish a month, so losing a few months worth of shipping sounds ok. British army slightly smaller so this sounds right. EDIT - combined the later 2 losses events.
## British dissent +3 immediately, +4 in Dec 1915.
## British immediately gain Blue Water Doctrine.
## Aug 1915 British gain Merchant Raider doctrine.
## 1st Feb 1916 Asquith govt collapses, Lloyd George forms coalition. Gain sea lanes doctrine.
## 1st May 1916 US declares war
## 1st May 1916 British and French dissent - 7.
## 1st May 1916 US gains the first doctrine in land naval and air.
}

Oh an interesting side note -

What if Britain is NOT at war with Germany in May 1915? Does this event still occur?

First off, no, the first line in the command states that Germany must be at war with Britain for unrestricted warfare to be enacted. My reasoning behind this is that if GB is not as war with Germany then the German High Seas fleet can operate (even if GB closes the channel to all warships, while more difficult not impossible). Then since IIRC the German fleet was on par if not better than the French fleet the Germans would have relied less on subs than surface ships. So even if they did stop neutral shipping they could have escorted it away from French ports instead of just sinking it outright.

Next:

originally posted by ptan54
Gain 5 submarines in Wilhemshaven.
## Gain Basic Sub construction tech (you have to have the basics?!)
## Gain Unlimited Sub warfare doctrine (+15 org).
## Dec 1915 gain Wolfpack doctrine. (+15 org) [is this pushing it? it does tie in with unlimited sub]
## British immediately lose 2500 supplies. I calculate this because playing as Germany with a huge army I need 500 ish a month, so losing a few months worth of shipping sounds ok. British army slightly smaller so this sounds right. EDIT - combined the later 2 losses events.
## British dissent +3 immediately, +4 in Dec 1915.
## British immediately gain Blue Water Doctrine.
## Aug 1915 British gain Merchant Raider doctrine.
## 1st Feb 1916 Asquith govt collapses, Lloyd George forms coalition. Gain sea lanes doctrine.

I don't have too much of a problem with 5 free subs (perhaps put them in the build que with only ten days remaining on the build)

Germany should not get two techs for free. I would say if anything have Unlimited Sub warfare doctrine be put first in Germany's tech que. No free wolfpack doctrine.

2500 supplies seems a bit high. Until the US really starting sending over material most of what was shipped into Britain was raw materials from the Dominions and abroad (Since most of the war material was produced in Britain's factories.). So I would cut supplies down to 1000 (representing the few war supplies bought abroad at the time), and 750 of each of the raw materials.

Dissent increase is fine with me, the initial +3. However I would give the player the choice as to whether change the government. If the player/Ai choses to stay with the Asquith government then the second +4 dissent increase, perhaps along with the blue water doctrine being moved to the head of the tech que, while if Lloyd George is chosen a slight increase in dissent, say +1 (there are always those unhappy with change), and moving the convoy doctrine to the head of the tech que.