China: Division and resurrection

[MattyG]

I agree on the Mongal thing. We hedged them back inthe caliphate, but I think it is more than we have the knowledge and skill for to work out what would have happened in Cgina and SE Asia if the Mongols had not succeeded.

Instead, we need to think of the recent last century as one where the end of Mongol rule was less 'straightforward', with Mongolia being the remnant of the Yuan dynasty, and the five successor states having emerged from there. Certainly one or two of these could have taken the same names as previous dynasties, in part to justify their rule, perhaps because the remnants of those families were at the 'helm' of the rebellions against the mongols.

 

[Incompetent]

Hmm, perhaps China 1 could go, with its territory shared between Mongolia and the Manchu, and perhaps Mongolia and Manchu could start as friends. China 1 could either be removed completely, or we could put another China 1 elsewhere in China, eg by taking some land off Chinas 2, 3 or 4.

That would make Mongolia a decent power, without meaning it dominates the Chinese region, and with its position somewhat precarious, especially if its Han provinces are wrong culture/wrong religion. In fact we're almost forced to say Mongolia has taken some of China if we want a viable Mongolia at all, seeing as so much has been blotted out by PTI.

 

[MattyG]

Again, intereting iodeas. Given that we have five China's at the moment (China's 1 - 4 and Lanzhou) I think we can afford to lose one of them. Plus, we could call Mongolia Yuan China to indicate that they still have claims on retruning to control the 'rebellious' lands to the south.

We certainly need to arrange the starting alliances, and Mongolia-Manchu would be an intriguing one, except that it place Korea in the firing line even more, as it controls one part of Japan. One solution to that will be giving korea some very fine starting leaders and monarch, indicating that it is currently in the ascendency as a nation.

I will make some changes for 6.21 and see what people think of it.

Matty

 

[Incompetent]

We certainly need to arrange the starting alliances, and Mongolia-Manchu would be an intriguing one, except that it place Korea in the firing line even more, as it controls one part of Japan. One solution to that will be giving korea some very fine starting leaders and monarch, indicating that it is currently in the ascendency as a nation.

I had an idea for Korea which involved them being pretty big in Japan - not just a province, but also one or two one-province vassals, and a COT to represent control of Japanese trade. As Japan would start divided, it would initially be little threat to Korea, though of course this would change as the country got united. I didn't really take things much further though.

If we don't want Manchu to smash Korea, they could start off with good relations or military access.

 

[MattyG]

I had an idea for Korea which involved them being pretty big in Japan - not just a province, but also one or two one-province vassals, and a COT to represent control of Japanese trade. As Japan would start divided, it would initially be little threat to Korea, though of course this would change as the country got united. I didn't really take things much further though.

If we don't want Manchu to smash Korea, they could start off with good relations or military access.

I have expanded Korea to own three Japanese provinces. They begin with an alliance with Japan (to avoid them crushing them in the first couple of years) and MilAccess with Manchu.

 

[MattyG]

Here's the plan for Asia in Interregnum 1.0

Noone is working on the region and I want to 'wrap up' my involvement and have version 1.0 playable out of the box, as it were.

Accordingly I will be instituting the following measures, unless someone sends me tons of completed material in the next month


1. Nothing east of the Il-Khanate, or south of Ashanti and Nubia for that matter, will be selectable.

2. All countries in this region (China, Indiia, SE Asia, East and Southern Africa) will have one monarch and a sries of generically-named leaders.

3. Any events for the region will be ai only, and the only event I can think of is one for the formation of China.

4. Korea and one of the Chinas will have timed explorers. Korea will target California and the China will target Peru, perhaps via Australia.

Thanks, y'all.

 

[unmerged(51378)]

Sorry to bump this up, and well I'm just curious, what will happen after 1.0? No more work? Only bugfixing? Or simply putting in 100% completed material?

 

[MattyG]

All three.

The thing is, I need to back away from the project for a while. It has taken 18 months to rebuild Europe, and still we haven't done Kalmar, Norway, Smolensk/Ryazan or the balkans and are still finishing up Bavaria, Brandenburg, Lombardy and others. To properly redo Asia (China, India and SE Asia) I would need what I do not have:

1. 18 more months with some spare time

2. Committed knowledgeable colleagues like mikl and Calipah

By that time, EU2 might be a thing of the past.

So, thinking about the time and people resources left, I can only confine Asia to a generic, ai-run glory, something that will challenge the players once they get out there.

It would give me much please to be part of a larger team that moves Interregnum forward, both in EU2 and EU3, but we shall have to wait and see what energy and talent makes itself available.

 

[unmerged(33577)]

Just a little comment from French forum :

They thing that the current setup for china (Latin techgroup) was a little too powerfull.
In one of the test, a china minor do a fastest tech advance than best european countries due to neighbourg bonus.

An the Mongol near Caspian Sea can be Orthodox tech group due of proximity with the european.

And for the future of EU2 and Interregnum... (despite the fact that i didn't do anything from months now) If it's exact that the Monarch system was ahistorical like in CK and if it cannot be forced by events... EU2 especially with mod like Interregnum still have a very long life before become obsolete

 

[loki1232]

I would say that Japan should be included with the rest of them, either china or latin/orthodox.

 

[MattyG]

I would say that Japan should be included with the rest of them, either china or latin/orthodox.

You mean as a coloniser, yes? If so, please explain why!

It already has orthodox tech.

 

[loki1232]

You mean as a coloniser, yes? If so, please explain why!

It already has orthodox tech.

Are you sure it has orthodox tech?

Oh well. I think that japan would have two routes, one of taking back the rest of the main islands and then invading korea and manchuria eventually, the other of colonizing much of the far north and later the philipines. Think ireland but in Asia.

 

[MattyG]

I'm sure. Look it up if you doubt me. :wacko:

Well, I chose Korea to play that role. It will be a primary colonizer.

But ALL the Asian nations can colonise. I will have their ai's designed to target certain regions, should they get a random explorer. It is unlikely that they won't, as there will be a special Asia-ai only explorer event to compliment the existing versions in the random even files. So, if Japan is successful in recapturing its home provinces, it would almost certainly expand. Northwards is not a great route for any coloniser, though. It's pretty poor north of Manchuria.

 

[orimazd]

Here's the plan for Asia in Interregnum 1.0

Noone is working on the region and I want to 'wrap up' my involvement and have version 1.0 playable out of the box, as it were.

Accordingly I will be instituting the following measures, unless someone sends me tons of completed material in the next month


1. Nothing east of the Il-Khanate, or south of Ashanti and Nubia for that matter, will be selectable.

2. All countries in this region (China, Indiia, SE Asia, East and Southern Africa) will have one monarch and a sries of generically-named leaders.

3. Any events for the region will be ai only, and the only event I can think of is one for the formation of China.

4. Korea and one of the Chinas will have timed explorers. Korea will target California and the China will target Peru, perhaps via Australia.

Thanks, y'all.

by east you mean that we probably won't be able to select the chinese states?

Bah, I (and anyone who knows extremely basic programming for this game) can fix that myself. I'll get my stuff in complete in december or january, screw 1.0. At least then I won't be overburdened with this on top of my school work and job hunting. Ngagheln first, the incas probably never. I know, wrong thread, but so what.

 

[MattyG]

by east you mean that we probably won't be able to select the chinese states?

Bah, I (and anyone who knows extremely basic programming for this game) can fix that myself. I'll get my stuff in complete in december or january, screw 1.0. At least then I won't be overburdened with this on top of my school work and job hunting. Ngagheln first, the incas probably never. I know, wrong thread, but so what.

1. Yes.

2. Sure you can, and that's fine. But by making them non-selectable I am trying to indicate that what's there isn't intended for play, because it hasn't really been developed properly.

3. Screw 1.0 ? You sound angry. As I said, I will still be around to bug check, add material, and ocassionally add some of my own new material.

I certainly hope I am not being flamed here ...

 

[orimazd]

1. Yes.

2. Sure you can, and that's fine. But by making them non-selectable I am trying to indicate that what's there isn't intended for play, because it hasn't really been developed properly.

3. Screw 1.0 ? You sound angry. As I said, I will still be around to bug check, add material, and ocassionally add some of my own new material.

I certainly hope I am not being flamed here ...

1. Okay.
2. Okay.
3. Well, screw the deadline. And that's what I meant...this is my busiest week this semester and on top of two presentations and four papers I am getting sick (for the presentations I might have to show off my l33t typing skillz instead of talking...wow, can the class consider me any wierder than they already do?). So, I might get something done next week. But instead I will probably be catching up with two of those essays, and another three in the same two classes. What I meant is that I'll send in the new material after 1.0 is done. I might have been angry, but not at the project. Probably sexual frustration, seems to be a common source of pointless aggression in my life, so lets blame that.

4. Do you want me to be flaming you? I don't think I can, though. You're too nice

 

[MattyG]

1. Okay.
2. Okay.
3. Well, screw the deadline. And that's what I meant...this is my busiest week this semester and on top of two presentations and four papers I am getting sick (for the presentations I might have to show off my l33t typing skillz instead of talking...wow, can the class consider me any wierder than they already do?). So, I might get something done next week. But instead I will probably be catching up with two of those essays, and another three in the same two classes. What I meant is that I'll send in the new material after 1.0 is done. I might have been angry, but not at the project. Probably sexual frustration, seems to be a common source of pointless aggression in my life, so lets blame that.

4. Do you want me to be flaming you? I don't think I can, though. You're too nice

I have to admit, I am screwing the deadline myself at the moment. Last weekend we had to go to Victoria so that I could be insulted by federal officials. It was a busy week in between amd this weekend my honey-do list was pretty long. Like Mike, I managed to get the shelving in, but none of the Interregnum work. (well, a little of it).

The dealine is really only mine, remember.