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unmerged(1047)

Commander, US Pacific Fleet
Feb 21, 2001
5.167
1
Just something I thought I'd offer....

If someone (or several someones) would be willing to provide a quick and dirty outline or summary of the alternate histories leading to the positions at game-start, I could rewrite those little descriptions and strategies in the scenario selection screen all nice and neat and dramatic....
 
You got ICQ?:)
 
Unfortunately, no... for some reason, every time I've tried to install an ICQ client on my computer, it refuses to open properly.

However, we should be able to do it by email ...
 
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Well, that too. I just figured that Archduke might be looking for a non-forum method there...

Anyhow... I'd really like to do the creative writing, I just need the 'skeleton' ideas to build from. :)
 
Hmm, consider checking the events out. Byz, Finn, Savoy, Brittany and Scotland need a check with desc..
 
That'll work for the later part, but I'd also like to explain how they got to where they are at game-start...

Eire, Scotland, and Brittany, and maybe the Hanse for example: I could explain their control of Britain as something like the following-

"Following the mutual annihilation of the Norman and English armies at Hastings in 1066, the English kingdom was quickly overrun from the north by armies from Scotland, and the Welsh tribes swore allegiance to the High King of Eire. The Scottish conquest was finally halted in southern Britain by a final alliance between the Lord Mayor of London and the Earl of Wessex. However, both quickly went their seperate ways, and being unable to stand against Scotland on their own, swore allegiance to outside powers. Thus, London and surroundings became part of the Hanseatic League, while the Earl of Wessex swore allegiance to the Duke of Brittany."
 
Sounds Ok :D

Finland remained independent, thus it must have survived the 'crusades' of 1250-1350 and united under that threat. They obviously also beat up on Novgorod, forcing that city to seek Hansa protection as well.

Al-Andalus (Grenada) won some vital battle in 1212 iirc. Look it up ;)

Byzans - for some reason the fourth crusade didn't target Byzans, or at least didn't manage to get into the city, so no fragmentation into 'Latin empire' statelets.

That's all I know with reasonable certainty.
 
Still working on some others, but here's my first three....

Eire:
"Eire was united under the authority of the High King in response to Viking raids, and became a powerful nation on the seas, in order to fend off further Viking invasions, in the 1040s. After the collapse of the Anglo-Saxon kingdom of England in 1066-67, the neighboring Gaelic land of Wales swore allegiance to the High King as well, and the combined territories of Eire and Wales remain under the authority of the High King.

After the resurgence of Granada in the late 1300's, the nobility of the short-lived Kingdom of Portugal evacuated to Eire, where the High King has expressed some interest in their ideas to establish sea trade with China, India and the Spice Islands by circumnavigating Africa, although this would lead through thousands of miles of uncharted waters. Following the example of St. Brendan, Irish sailors are beginning to look far beyond their own shores, now that they are protected by the combined shields of Scotland and Brittany."



Scotland:
"The Kingdom of Scotland was formed when the Gaelic tribal kingdoms of northern Britain were finally united in the 1040s, in response to a percieved threat from both the Vikings and the newly united Irish. Unlike the Vikings and Irish, Scotland laid its trust in a powerful land army, and by 1067, had some of the best-trained foot soldiers in Western Europe.

Following the mutual annihilation of the armies of the Kingdom of England and its invader, the Duke of Normandy, at Hastings in 1066, the King of Scotland led his troops south into the chaotic, disintegrating Anglo-Saxon kingdom. Soon, the entire northern half of England was brought under Scottish rule, although the advance was halted in a climactic "last battle" near Cambridge, where the combined forces of the Earl of Wessex and the Lord Mayor of London were able to fight the Scottish army to a standstill, and killed the King of Scotland's chief general. The disheartened King made peace, establishing the borders that exist until this day, and the following generations of the Scottish royal family have devoted their attentions to the Viking threat of the Kingdom of Norway."



Brittany:
"The current Kingdom of Brittany began as the Duchy of Brittany, itself a relic of the Celtic tribes that lived in Gaul prior to the Frankish migrations. In an attempt to preserve Gaullish-Celtic culture, the Duke of Brittany swore allegiance to the King of the Franks, Charlemagne, in the year 799, and afterwards Brittany lived in peace for over 250 years, its soldiers volunteering to crusade against the Muslim conquests in Iberia under the banners of French and Spanish lords as mercenaries. Brittany had always had a close relationship with Normandy, another French vassal state of non-Frankish culture - the Normans were originally Vikings - and with the peoples of the British Isles, who shared its Celtic heritage, and its warriors often served as mercenaries on both sides of the Channel as well as in Iberia.

Thus, it was torn between its historic loyalties when the Duke of Normandy decided to invade the Kingdom of England in 1066, and declared neutrality, with the Duke taking the unusual step of forbidding Bretons from serving on either side as mercenaries. This turned out to be a stroke of luck, as the Norman and English armies virtually annihilated one another at the Battle of Hastings, and the Kingdom of England collapsed, with the Duke of Normandy lacking the force to take over. England was soon being overrun by the armies of Scotland, and the two most influential noblemen in Southern England - the Earl of Wessex and the Lord Mayor of London - formed a final alliance to stand against the advancing Scots, and the Duke of Brittany allowed Breton mercenaries to join the Earl of Wessex. The resulting Battle of Cambridge ended in the death of the chief Scottish general and a peace treaty. This preserved the independence of the two noblemen's territories, but neither was large enough to defend itself against a future Scottish attack, so both looked beyond their borders for help. The Earl of Wessex quickly signed an alliance with both Eire and Brittany, hoping to balance the forces of Brittany against any attempt by Eire to force him into fealty to the High King.

When the King of France died without heirs in the Fourth Crusade, the Duke of Brittany quickly applied to the Pope to create the Kingdom of Brittany, and the Earl of Wessex was the first to swear fealty to the new King, which created the borders the Kingdom possesses to this day. Recent generations of the Breton royal family have been concerned mainly with defending Wessex against a possible Scottish invasion, and re-establishing the Celtic lands in Gaul that existed prior to the Frankish migration."
 
Two thumbs up!
 
Some help would be appreciated, in terms of some bare-bones facts and possible alternate histories - I think I can manage the Hanse, Granada, Byzantium, Burgundy, and possibly Savoy, UoK and Finland on current information.
 
You got much freedoom on it, just go ahead, the ones you already provided are nice and will be taken and implented.
 
Understood; it's just that the farther east you go, the less I know about the period, and I was looking for semi-historical points for the history to diverge from reality (the Vikings, the battle of Hastings, the Fourth Crusade, and the Granada-Christian wars for examples).
 
Base for UoK..

The Kalmar Union is a recent addition in the world of states. The royalty of Denmark, Norway and Sweden had spent more than a century in intermarriages and these links had pulled them closer and dethronements and wars had forced them apart again, until Olov II Håkansson became king of Denmark in 1376, Norway in 1380 and after defeating Albrecht of Mecklemburg also king of Sweden in 1386, at age 16. When travelling through Falsterbo in Skåne in 1387 Olof suddenly fell ill and died soon after, before having time to plan for the future.

His mother, Margareta Valdemarsdotter was a more than able replacement and soon had persuaded the nobility in both Denmark, Sweden and Norway to agree to a permanent union ruled from Kalmar and in 1396 she made them accept her six-year old nephew Bogislav of Pommern as king. Bogislav, who took the name Erik was accepted as adult in the year 1400, but wouldn't get any actual power before Margaretas death in 1412. He would then keep following Margaretas policy of trying to gain more lands in Holstein and to empower his own cities at the expense of the Hanseatic league.

By that time disaster would have struck the union, when Norwegian nobility would renege upon the agreement of 1396 and claim that their loyalty had been towards Margareta alone and that they had no fealty towards Erik. Scottish support of the Norwegian endeavour led to the surprised Erik backing down with loss of face, and it would take six years before he could even assert his claims again...
 
Here we go... slightly revised Eire/Scotland/Brittany/UoK files... these should be ready to be implemented.

Eire:
"The Celtic tribes of Eire were united under the authority of the High King in response to Viking raids, and became a powerful nation on the seas, in order to fend off further Viking invasions, in the 1040s. After the collapse of the Anglo-Saxon kingdom of England in 1066-67, the neighboring Celtic land of Wales swore allegiance to the High King as well, and the combined territories of Eire and Wales remain under the authority of the High King.

After the resurgence of Granada in the late 1300's, the nobility of the short-lived Kingdom of Portugal evacuated to Eire. There, the High King has expressed some interest in their ideas to establish sea trade with China, India and the Spice Islands by circumnavigating Africa, although this would lead through thousands of miles of uncharted waters. Following the example of St. Brendan, Irish sailors are beginning to look far beyond their own shores, now that they are protected from turmoil within Europe by the combined shields of their fellow Celtic kingdoms, Scotland and Brittany."



Scotland:
"The Kingdom of Scotland was formed when the Celtic tribal kingdoms of northern Britain were finally united in the 1040s, in response to a percieved threat from both the Vikings and the newly united Irish. Unlike the Vikings and Irish, who fought at sea where possible, Scotland laid its trust in a powerful land army. By 1067, Scotland had some of the best-trained foot soldiers in Western Europe, rivalling even the famous Breton mercenaries.

Following the mutual annihilation of the armies of the Kingdom of England and its invader, the Duke of Normandy, at Hastings in 1066, the King of Scotland led his troops south into the chaotic, disintegrating Anglo-Saxon kingdom. Soon, the entire northern half of England was brought under Scottish rule, although the advance was halted in a climactic "last battle" near Cambridge, where the combined forces of the Earl of Wessex and the Lord Mayor of London were able to fight the Scottish army to a standstill, and killed the King of Scotland's chief general.

The disheartened King made peace after Cambridge, establishing the borders that exist until this day, and the following generations of the Scottish royal family have devoted their attentions to fending off the continued Viking threat of the Kingdom of Norway. Within the last generation, the Kingdom of Norway has broken away from the Union of Kalmar, and thus its Danish and Swedish allies, with Scottish support. The current King hopes that this new alliance will finally end the Viking raids, and possibly even bring Norway into the Scottish sphere of influence."



Brittany:
"The current Kingdom of Brittany began as the Duchy of Brittany, itself a relic of the Celtic tribes that lived in Gaul prior to the Frankish migrations. In an attempt to preserve Gaullish-Celtic culture, the Duke of Brittany swore allegiance to the King of the Franks, Charlemagne, in the year 799, and afterwards Brittany lived in peace for over 250 years, its soldiers volunteering to crusade against the Muslim conquests in Iberia under the banners of French and Spanish lords as mercenaries. Brittany had always had a close relationship with Normandy, another French vassal state of non-Frankish culture - the Normans were originally Vikings - and with the peoples of the British Isles, who shared its Celtic heritage, and its well-trained warriors often served as mercenaries on both sides of the Channel as well as in Iberia.

Thus, it was torn between its historic loyalties when the Duke of Normandy decided to invade the Kingdom of England in 1066, and declared neutrality, with the Duke taking the unusual step of forbidding Bretons from serving on either side as mercenaries. This turned out to be a stroke of luck, as the Norman and English armies virtually annihilated one another at the Battle of Hastings, and the Kingdom of England collapsed, with the Duke of Normandy lacking the force to take over. England was soon being overrun by the armies of Scotland, and the two most influential noblemen in Southern England - the Earl of Wessex and the Lord Mayor of London - formed a final alliance to stand against the advancing Scots, and the Duke of Brittany allowed Breton mercenaries to join the Earl of Wessex. The resulting Battle of Cambridge ended in the death of the chief Scottish general and a peace treaty. This preserved the independence of the two noblemen's territories, but neither was large enough to defend itself against a future Scottish attack, so both looked beyond their borders for help. The Earl of Wessex quickly signed an alliance with both Eire and Brittany, hoping to balance the forces of Brittany against any attempt by Eire to force him into fealty to the High King.

When the King of France died without heirs in the Fourth Crusade, the Duke of Brittany quickly applied to the Pope to create the Kingdom of Brittany, and the Earl of Wessex was the first to swear fealty to the new King, which created the borders the Kingdom possesses to this day. Recent generations of the Breton royal family have been concerned mainly with defending Wessex against a possible Scottish invasion, and re-establishing the Celtic lands in Gaul that existed prior to the Frankish migration. They have also been moving towards a policy of retaining the well-trained Betron warriors for their own purposes, rather than allowing them to hire themselves out as mercenaries throughout Western Europe, as they have done in the past six centuries."



Kalmar: (original text by Nikolai II, revised and expanded by Sheridan)
"The Kalmar Union is a recent addition in the world of states, having come into existence in the closing days of the 14th century. The royalty of the three Scandinavian kingdoms - Denmark, Norway and Sweden - had spent more than a century in intermarriages. These links had pulled them closer together, and dethronements and wars had forced them apart again, until Olov II Håkansson became king of Denmark in 1376, Norway in 1380 and after defeating Albrecht of Mecklemburg he also became king of Sweden in 1386, at age 16. When travelling through Falsterbo in Skåne in 1387, Olof suddenly fell ill and died soon after, before having time to plan for the future.

His mother, Margareta Valdemarsdotter, was a more than able replacement and soon had persuaded the nobility in both Denmark, Sweden and Norway to agree to a permanent union ruled from Kalmar. In 1396, she made them accept her six-year old nephew Bogislav of Pommern, who took the name Erik, as king. However, Erik wouldn't weild actual power until Margareta's death in 1412. He then continued following Margareta's policies of trying to gain more lands surrounding the Baltic Sea, and empowering his own cities at the expense of the Hanseatic League.

In 1412, following Margareta's death, disaster struck the union, when Norwegian nobility backed out of the agreement of 1396 and claimed that their loyalty had been towards Margareta alone. Declaring that they had no fealty towards Erik, the Norwegians elected a new King, finding support with their ancient enemies, the Scottish. Their support of the Norwegian endeavour led to the surprised Erik backing down with loss of face, and it would take six years before he could even assert his claims again, in an attempt to stop the young Scottish-Norwegian alliance from solidifying."
 
Teutonic Order is quite simple, they won the battle at Tannenberg and the Polish state was reduced.
 
Okay... I've got rough jumping off points here... (note that my story for some of the German states means I may not be able to support Milan without serious changes)

Granada - military reforms following the 1238 relocation of the Caliphate of Cordoba to Granada allowed a resurgence against the Christian reconquest, leading to the fall of Catalonia, Castile and Lisbon in the late 1300s.

Savoy and Burgundy - gained full independence and expanded following the Fourth Crusade demise of France, as mentioned in Brittany story.

Hanseatic League, Bavaria, Bohemia - fully independent after death of Emperor in Fourth Crusade, the Emperor possibly being recreated later.

Hungary - victory at Battle of Kosovo, 1389 - but over Byzantium, not the Turks - led to permanent peace on that side. Had allied with west in the Crusades. By the virtue of defeating Byzantium, who had killed the last Emperor over 180 years before, the King of Hungary was then proclaimed the Emperor, reviving the HRE.

TO - victories in war nearly destroyed Poland and Lithuania (leading to fractured state of region at game start).

Finland - resisted Swedish attempt at conquest in 1249, then expanded into NW Russia, forcing Novgorod into the Hanse.

Genoa - defeated Venice in 1381, rather than other way around.

Sicily - staunch independence thanks to lack of Aragon.

Byzantium - killed King of France and the Emperor in the Fourth Crusade, when they attacked Constantinople; has retained Greek territories since then.

Milan - if it stays, mercenary state previously allied with Genoa and/or Savoy. But, it was created by HRE in 1300's - after I have the position vacant...

Caliphate - since the Mongols did not conquer Persia, the Caliphate was not weakened to the point of collapse by those events (the Mongols seem to have run into more trouble further east, or devoted more attention toward Russia).
 
Caliphate:

Tamerlan was there and was rebuffed by the Mamelucks or the KoJ?

But unlike history, the ottoman empire wasn´t there to take over the lead of the muslim world.
 
TheArchduke said:
Caliphate:

Tamerlan was there and was rebuffed by the Mamelucks or the KoJ?

Easiest would be to let Tamerlane be assassinated or just fall off his horse - or just not appear.

As long as mongols have no powerful leader they tend to embroil themselves in internicine warfare aimed at producing a strong leader, which means less troubles for surrounding lands ;)
 
Sheridan, your descs were put in today, thanks a lot.