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nhsk

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May 13, 2012
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So this thing dawned on me in a moment of going to the fridge for a beer.

How will the game treat democratic or like minded empires using WMDs early on in a war (from your own empire view)?

A democratic nation that is usually peacefull would likely have a high amount of civil unrest if it goes around throwing WMDs willy nilly at the first month of war.

So it dawned on me that WMDs (from the democratic POV) should be deterrents and only be brought in if its last resort (being wiped out), "M.A.D" (the other guy did it first so we are free to go) or the war has run for a serious long time and can't be resolved quickly and war exhaustion (assuming there is such a thing) is tremendeously high and no one wants more soldiers in bodybags.

So if the democratic empire found itself at war with an empire run by a dictator the democrats couldn't just with nukes and win despite perhaps that being the "cheapest" option in terms of own resourses. Because their own people would oppose this horrid thought.

The democrats would only be allowed to use WMDs if the enemy used it first or war exhaustion is really high. Could tie in with modes of war allowed where relatively low defcon level is limited to minor skirmishes and defending borders from raiders that could escalate into full scale wars if a diplomatic solution could not be found to a skirmish that happened.

A nation could have sent a minor fleet on a scavenging hunt, general exploration or any other (perhaps) peacefull purpose but might have stumbled upon border guards that initially tried to turn the intruders away but the situation somehow got out of hand.

Could open a plethora of possibilities for events that would spice up the gameplay and throw you into wars that you had no chance to avoid. The empire that lost ships might wow revenge or back down, and the offending empire might or might not offer reparations etc. that could turn the dice in favour of war or peace.

Hope I explained it well enough, but would like some deterrent from simply just going WMD crazy "because you can".

Obviously a player can work around the negatives in own empire, might even use it to force a change or mentality in your population, but if you roleplay the "good guys" it would be an interesting barrier.
 
Most 4x give more representative government war exhaustion penalties Distant Worlds being an obvious example as far as using nukes I would imagine it would be more concerning to the galactic community as a whole and the quality of the planet. Both of those would be better then your people simply hating using them.
 
I disagree that democracies should be supermega peaceful constantly all the time. It should depend on a bunch of different things that affect the character of the species. I think it'd be dumb if every single democracy became the federation from star trek, who were pretty unrealistic imo. A democracy can easily be as warmongering and xenophobic as any empire.
 
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The Romulans of Star Trek are a republic are quite aggressive. The USA has been in many wars throughout its history. I don't think democratic necessarily equals peaceful.
 
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Wasn't saying they should stay out of war, was saying the nukes should be deterrents, not the go to weapon of choice. In order to (in gameplay) encourage fleets, invasions etc. instead of just nuking it from orbit.
 
In our world the "great democracy" of all had nuked twice Japan, just for the sake of test their realibility, this mean that democracies don't care about nothing when they are at war.
 
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Being a democracy has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not a nation is warlike, believes in a particular moral viewpoint on use of WMDs, or believes in a particular moral viewpoint on the mass slaughter of other sentient beings. You could have a highly xenophobic democracy that believes all other sentients should be wiped out. You could be a highly nationalistic democracy that believes that all enemies should be destroyed with all available capability.

You're conflating democracy with a particular set of morals and ethics. In reality democracy just means the government is beholden to its citizens. Those citizens, however, could hold any viewpoints imaginable.
 
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Well the only country to ever use an atomic bomb was a democratic federation of republics :) Maybe Democracy in game would make POP reactions more important. Excited to see the political mechanics!
 
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Well the only country to ever use an atomic bomb was a democratic federation of republics :) Maybe Democracy in game would make POP reactions more important. Excited to see the political mechanics!

Yes this exactly. If your species is xenophobic and jingoistic and a democracy then you should be forced to go to war with and and not have relations with other species or suffer huge penalties. However, the same species in a dictatorship shouldn't have those problems nearly as much and be more free to conduct itself how it wants.

Conversely if your species is pacifistic then going to war at all should cause massive penalties in a democracy but fewer problems in a dictatorship.
 
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I disagree that democracies should be supermega peaceful constantly all the time. It should depend on a bunch of different things that affect the character of the species. I think it'd be dumb if every single democracy became the federation from star trek, who were pretty unrealistic imo. A democracy can easily be as warmongering and xenophobic as any empire.

Which Federation you talking about? The one in DS9 seemed quiet realistic at times. Going as far as almost falling to a Military Coup or when the chips were down using biological warfare on a massive scale.

The Federation was anything but peaceful and as stated didn't hold back when the chips were down.

I agree though it should not be the Government type that decides the reaction to war or what weapons are used but the attributes (for want of a better word) of the race itself.

Also even a friendly peaceful race could accept using "non-conventional" means if it looked bleak