Espionage & Sabotage(?) in Star Trek: Infinite

[Raihslat]

Espionage & Sabotage(?) is a tricky part in a 4X game. Nemisis (DLC Stellaris) has done it so badly, that I quit playing Stellaris after 1800+ hours spent in the game. In my personal opinion, the whole mechanic have had zero impact in any way, shape or form during a war or peacetime.

"......and all it cost was the life of one Romulan senator, one criminal, and the self-respect of one Starfleet officer. I don't know about you, but I'd call that a bargain."


I loved it back then in BotF, as the Romulan Star Empire, you could easily play tall and bring chaos to all the major powers just by focusing your core worlds on producing intel. There was even the possibility to set your goals focused on diplomacy, economics, science or military, or even all at once.

I'm personally more interested in a state of "cold war" and play my mindgames with the major powers rather than just go out there and play the "blobbing game". Some schemes against minor powers for example, preventing them from joining the United Federations of Planets.


Can you tell us a little bit more about your plans in that regard, @PDX-Ruk ? Thank you sir

 

[RVallant]

I'd bet 1 federation credit, that this will likely be covered in a dev diary.

 

[Prussian Havoc]

I'd bet 1 federation credit, that this will likely be covered in a dev diary.

I see your one fedcred, and raise you 2 quatloos. : j

 

[Ken-Sw]

Only a few weeks left until release - They are really going to have to pick up the pace on those dev diaries.
I really want more info before release so I can make an informed decision on whether or not to buy.

 

[Jellefly12]

Only a few weeks left until release - They are really going to have to pick up the pace on those dev diaries.
I really want more info before release so I can make an informed decision on whether or not to buy.

Yeah, i would have expected more dev diaries.

Just look at city skylines 2, that has like 13.
could also be the case that there just isn't as much info to share or PDX / License holder wants to create some hype around the release by not sharing as much information

We do have one of the devs who is active on the forums and the discord, who shares information every now and then.
Isn't the same as dev diaries, but if you really needed to find information about something its not impossible to search for keywords on the discord or look at the dev replies on this forum.

 

[Prussian Havoc]

Paramount’s involvement and the offering of Lower Decks content is what drew me so strongly to ST:I…

…but it is the likely realization of Espionage, Sabotage and Spy-craft as valid options in pursuit of National Power advantage in Diplomacy, Information Warfare, Military Operations and Economic Development, that has me so excited for this games realesse into the Wild. : )

 

[rick19572021]

If folks want spooks, well, okay let them have them. I personally have no desire for them.

 

[Raihslat]

If folks want spooks, well, okay let them have them. I personally have no desire for them.

It´s not about just having spooks, they should have an significant impact, especially in this era.

 

[rick19572021]

I guess espionage will simply be one more facet of ST:I. Okay. No problem More fun for everyone.

 

[Raihslat]

@RVallant & @Prussian Havoc: I think one dev diary left guys, we will see who gets the pot

All jokes aside, we still have no information about the impact of spycraft in Star Trek: Infinite, with the exception of one screenshot which showcases a spy ship.

Another thing that concerns me is the fact that we have no clue about the diplomatic game between two major powers and/or between a major power and a minor power. Do we get a perk if we vassalize or integrate a minor power?

Stellaris diplomacy options are very limited imho, especially from the base game, something like civ6 diplomacy. And that is not a compliment.

The producers and developers are very active on feedback/questions but seem to avoid these typ of questions.

​

 

[Haakon_XIII]

The producers and developers are very active on feedback/questions but seem to avoid these typ of questions.

It's true. We know the vision and the art, but we know nothing about the mechanics with less than two weeks to go before release. What mechanics does each faction have to make them play differently? How does espionage and diplomacy work and how is it different from Stellaris?
How does exploration and travel through the galaxy work? How do the economy, planets, colonization and pops work?

Unfortunately, these are unanswered questions that are making most of my friends not interested in the game. We are used to Paradox telling us at length about each mechanic before the release of the game or DLC, but this time for now we are mainly having graphical things.

 

[Prussian Havoc]

There is a joy to be found in becoming immersed and fully conversant in all aspects of a game beginning years before it is released. For me that was Team Harebrained Schemes and BATTLETECH...

…but such a long lead time is not a prerequisite for me. I’ve already preordered the deluxe editions for both Star Trek: Infinite and Lamplighter League. Neither of which had appreciable lead time before their launches next week.

I’m a gamer.

I game.

And in a few days I’ll be gaming as a Lamplighter and in just under two weeks I’ll be gaming, briefly as a Cardassian, before diving headfirst into the Federation. : )

 

[rick19572021]

There is a joy to be found in becoming immersed and fully conversant in all aspects of a game beginning years before it is released. For me that was Team Harebrained Schemes and BATTLETECH...

…but such a long lead time is not a prerequisite for me. I’ve already preordered the deluxe editions for both Star Trek: Infinite and Lamplighter League. Neither of which had appreciable lead time before their launches next week.

I’m a gamer.

I game.

And in a few days I’ll be gaming as a Lamplighter and in just under two weeks I’ll be gaming, briefly as a Cardassian, before diving headfirst into the Federation. : )

Prussian Havoc says it very nicely. Why does he (I presume) game? Why do I game? It is for the joy to be found while gaming. Building a perfect city or empire. It doesn't matter to me.

I too can easily see my experience with STI as a joyful experience -and we're just days away.

(BTW, I stop playing a game when it isn't fun any longer. I bet you do the same.)

Why do you game?

 

[Raihslat]

I'm personally more interested in a state of "cold war" and play my mindgames with the major powers rather than just go out there and play the "blobbing game". Some schemesagainst minor powers for example, preventing them from joining the United Federations of Planets.

Stellaris diplomacy options are very limited imho, especially from the base game, something like civ6 diplomacy. And that is not a compliment.

The producers and developers are very active on feedback/questions but seem to avoid these typ of questions.

​

If you ask me "why?" - you shoul also ask me "how" do I wanna play a game. The blueprint, Stellaris, is a grand strategy game. But it failed in my opinion to deliver a meaningful diplomatic concept. I´m not looking for civ 6 in space or a braindead "blobbing game" in terms of just go out there and conquer everybody and you will be fine.

Imho the core mechanic of a Star Trek game should always be diplomacy. Spycraft is an important part of it. That´s why I´m so interested in this type of subject. The current screenshots indicate that it is indeed on Stellaris base game level (currently).

But don't get me wrong, I preordered Star Trek: Infinite and gifted it to four of my friends as well.

 

[rick19572021]

I really was only asking for why anyone games. Saying more than that is okay. Just not needed. I see what you mean about spycraft even though Star Trek means a lot more than that -for me. Thanks Raihslat.

 

[rick19572021]

For me, Star Trek is not about hot or cold wars even though they can exist. Star Trek is about exploration. Meeting new and different life forms and civilizations. Looking past differences and celebrating commonalities while learning and growing as a species from the entire effort that all the while is exciting and fun.

 

[PDX-Ruk]

Espionage & Sabotage(?) is a tricky part in a 4X game. Nemisis (DLC Stellaris) has done it so badly, that I quit playing Stellaris after 1800+ hours spent in the game. In my personal opinion, the whole mechanic have had zero impact in any way, shape or form during a war or peacetime.

"......and all it cost was the life of one Romulan senator, one criminal, and the self-respect of one Starfleet officer. I don't know about you, but I'd call that a bargain."


I loved it back then in BotF, as the Romulan Star Empire, you could easily play tall and bring chaos to all the major powers just by focusing your core worlds on producing intel. There was even the possibility to set your goals focused on diplomacy, economics, science or military, or even all at once.

I'm personally more interested in a state of "cold war" and play my mindgames with the major powers rather than just go out there and play the "blobbing game". Some schemes against minor powers for example, preventing them from joining the United Federations of Planets.


Can you tell us a little bit more about your plans in that regard, @PDX-Ruk ? Thank you sir

Ok, so we won't have a Dev Log on this topic (not enough Fridays left) so let me give you some high level insights on this.

Spycraft is about gaining benefits for you, and not so much about negatives for the others. For other players they are a nuisance for the people you spy on, not devastating. The Spies are in ships, so you have to select the planet they go to, and what operation you want them to perform. There are events and situations tied to this, so can grant better or worse outcomes based on how that works. Missions include the normal range of steel resources, get intel, cause problems etc.

If I had to give an analogy of what it feels close to, it would be Civs Spy System. The Spy is trained, have levels and are sent to cities to do operations, operations work depending on levels of spy, difficulty of mission and countermeasures put in place by the one you are spying on.

 

[RVallant]

Hmm...

So basically, something the majority of players can pretty much ignore if they don't fancy dealing with it? To be honest, I barely remember the mechanic in Civ 6, it has been a long time.

I thought spycraft would be a bigger focus for Romulans and Cardassians given their history? Is there many differences between those two and say, the Fed/Klingons for spying?

 

[PDX-Ruk]

Hmm...

So basically, something the majority of players can pretty much ignore if they don't fancy dealing with it? To be honest, I barely remember the mechanic in Civ 6, it has been a long time.

I thought spycraft would be a bigger focus for Romulans and Cardassians given their history? Is there many differences between those two and say, the Fed/Klingons for spying?

You get benefits if you want to use it, but as the Federation, I tend to set my spies to either find intel, or counterspy. I don't want to create a diplomatic incident. Cardassians and Romulans have more spies, but there I mostly use it for stealing resources. It provides a steady supply of income in whatever field I put them on.

 

[Raihslat]

For me, Star Trek is not about hot or cold wars even though they can exist. Star Trek is about exploration. Meeting new and different life forms and civilizations. Looking past differences and celebrating commonalities while learning and growing as a species from the entire effort that all the while is exciting and fun.

Indeed rick - Meeting new and different life forms and civilizations. How do you do this? Precisely - diplomacy. Let me put it this way: My favourite Empire has a cautious approach, leans more to doublecheck the intention of an foreign entity and how to "use" them for their own interest.

Which empire/organization could that be? My name says it all

r-a-i-h-s-l-a-T