Expanded Map based on the Current Game Version

[Miraiteko]

I attempt to expand the game map of the current version, and the final result is approximately like this. The distortion in the lower right corner is rather severe, which is done to align the coast of Sumatra with the current game coastline.

 

[klopkr]

Yeah looks terrible. They should just do what the asian expansion mods do and move the southern border of the game to include the swahili coast.

 

[Unknown Sage]

It's probably going to be similar to this

https://www.reddit.com/r/CrusaderKings/comments/lyyte5/an_illustration_of_how_the_rest_of_asia_would

 

[AessaSH]

A long time ago, I tried to add the rest of Asia to the map. This is how it goes:

1. First, I overlay the river map from the Rajas of Asia mod onto the vanilla CK3 river map. Then I make sure to align the yangtze river and bohay bay from both maps as the anchor.

2. I painstakingly warp the map of RoA to align rivers and coasts of the vanilla map. I'm also enlarging Korea, Japan, Khmer, and Java for gameplay purposes.

3. I merge both maps, and this is the result.

 

[klopkr]

@AessaSH I hate it and this is the worst way to do it but it's probably how it'll be done.

Have you tried overlaying the part of the paper map in the video to your current map? Might be useful to make predictions based on how it's warped.

EDIT: Nnm made it myself:

So I'll say that at the very least your projection is not the one they're using. It's really really hard to do line ups like this but it's very clear that Korea is much more squished, fat, and short. Japan is wider too. I think the eastern border of the map is further east too, not that it'll contain any more playable land.

If I line it up with the Bohai Bay for the top image and it makes south east asia move significantly more straight and downward. The pilipines are more or less the same vertical direction as your map but further north.

If I line it up using the gulf of Tonkin then the Philippines points significantly more eastward and Korea and Japan are more eastward too. The border is also further to the right. Manchuria is way wider and lower.

So at least if this paper map is accurate (it looks like the regular paper map) and not too distorted by a weird angle in the video and is at the games natural angle then your map wouldn't fit very well and it must be a different projection.

I was curious and did the same thing for both major asia mods:

So the china expansion map doesn't fit well at all either. It's much more northern if I line it up with Bohai Bay and southern if I line it up with the Gulf of Tonkin. The map seems to clearly have a banana shape and it will warp the north a lot (such a squished Korea and wide Japan makes that pretty obvious imo).

Rajas of Asia is pretty similar to the Asian expansion project in terms of warping.

So I think it's safe to say there will not be a swahili coast expansion (boo) but I think the warping used will make the north smaller and more squished and the south larger. I suspect Indonesia will be stretched more lengthwise.

Based on the philipines it could be a shopped Indonesia.

I don't have high hopes they'll do the right thing with their projection at the moment but we'll need to see more to know. I REALLY hope they'll do early dev diaries on the map to get valuable feedback.

AH it just occured to me that I could have tried to line it up to the Ganges river and lake Bikal but it's too late and I've done enough. Doing so would throw Asia way north on the maps I think. I'll do a quick one using the current map.

 

[klopkr]

Ok I just appended the map from the video to the current CK3 map.

Here it is aligned with the Ganges. Notably it aligns perfectly straight with the video version. The warping is all at the top of the map which makes sense considering how warped Japan and Korea look. Lake Baikal has shifted significantly in this version. The Steppe would have to be warped to be longer Baikal is not too much further east though so it might not be that much of a change.

This one I aligned with lake Bikal, Note that I had to rotate it. The Ganges do not line up and are mildly off which I believe would require a big redrawing of India.

So my theory is that they stretched out the north a bit and kept India more or less similar and are just going to cut half of Indonesia or really really squish it in.

Or it's a completely new map projection that rejigs the entire map. There's no way to actually match the Ganges to Lake Baikal without warping the image in the video. I think it's very likely the map just cuts off Indonesia right at Singapore. No Java.

If all of Indonesia does get confirmed then I would predict a full expansion south adding the swahili coast. I don't think the map warps enough to include all of indonesia and not expand the map south.

 

[EmperorDweeb]

Yeah looks terrible. They should just do what the asian expansion mods do and move the southern border of the game to include the swahili coast.

I like this because it the most straightforward, and we also get the Swahili Coast just in time for Trade Mechanics.

 

[Unknown Sage]

Ok I just appended the map from the video to the current CK3 map.

Here it is aligned with the Ganges. Notably it aligns perfectly straight with the video version. The warping is all at the top of the map which makes sense considering how warped Japan and Korea look. Lake Baikal has shifted significantly in this version. The Steppe would have to be warped to be longer Baikal is not too much further east though so it might not be that much of a change.
View attachment 1265382

This one I aligned with lake Bikal, Note that I had to rotate it. The Ganges do not line up and are mildly off which I believe would require a big redrawing of India.
View attachment 1265381

So my theory is that they stretched out the north a bit and kept India more or less similar and are just going to cut half of Indonesia or really really squish it in.

Or it's a completely new map projection that rejigs the entire map. There's no way to actually match the Ganges to Lake Baikal without warping the image in the video. I think it's very likely the map just cuts off Indonesia right at Singapore. No Java.

If all of Indonesia does get confirmed then I would predict a full expansion south adding the swahili coast. I don't think the map warps enough to include all of indonesia and not expand the map south.

to be fair it might also be relevant to keep in mind that the view of the map could be from a different top view angle. Meaning it doesn't quite match up with the ingame standard view for the map.

 

[raistlin_wizard]

Japan is on the same latitude as Spain. Most of this projections make it look like it's too far north.

 

[klopkr]

Japan is on the same latitude as Spain. Most of this projections make it look like it's too far north.

Yes that's true. But the CK3 map is already kind of warped strangely and it's not really easy to unwarp it. I think they're going to lean into the warp. For example the southern part of lake Baikal is significantly further north than in real life.

@Unknown Sage Yeah that's very possible but I will note that the actual drawing of Korea and Japan are so warped it's going to be something pretty strange in game regardless.

It's not very easy to torture the map into working.

 

[klopkr]

Ok I stitched together the map from the video. There's no way to actually stitch it to the current CK3 map. There's a real banana shape or more unlikley cylindrical shape to the map. The map of europe is also notably shaped differently. It still seems like there's absolutely no room for Indonesia without a southern map expansion. There is tons of room for Papua new guinea though if indonesia was added.

The Video actually shows straight map borders next to Japan and England (Iceland is suspiciously missing) But in order for the map to be straight the middle would have to move up by a lot. There's definitely something fishy going on. There's absolutely no way to fit it to the current map. This is either a map only made for the trailer (that uses the exact same paper map format at the game) or the map is tottaly new.

Notably the monsters in the sea between england and norway are different. Also lending credence that this is a totally new map.

If you 'straighten' things out Japan is actually much closer to Spain in latitude, but the map has a natural curve and the feature cannot be straightened that way. I'll not the area I had the hardest time matching was just north of the black sea.

Anyways I couldn't infer more than that and there's no way to know how south the map goes from this.

 

[okawfj]

I think I wrote something similar in another thread before, but I would like to see the Miller cylindrical projection adopted for vanilla maps.

 

[Ksiendzu]

Indonesia was confirmed i YT video and in forum post about Chapter IV.
I belive we will get most of Indonesia. Players need terrains for expansion in that corner of the map.

 

[Ksiendzu]

Paper map in the wideo looks "chinese styled". Look at mountains and trees.
Maybe we will get different paper map when we play in Asia?

Compare it with this:

https://www.reddit.com/r/CrusaderKings/comments/ukp3pe/blank_ck3_map

 

[AessaSH]

@AessaSH I hate it and this is the worst way to do it but it's probably how it'll be done.

Have you tried overlaying the part of the paper map in the video to your current map? Might be useful to make predictions based on how it's warped.

...

I tried to overlay the video's paper map onto the current paper map, but the video's map is presented at an angle, so I need to skew it first.
When I overlay it on the current map, I find that there's not enough room on the map, and I need to add 10% more to the map's length to the east. And it matches perfectly!

The Lake Baikal is aligned perfectly. The rivers in the Bengal and Burma areas are also perfectly aligned. And the right edge of the video's paper map is perfectly vertical.

Next I throw the map from the Rajas of Asia mod into the mix. While the mod has the wrong map projection, it's enough to illustrate the final map. I choose this four spot on the map for the alignment.

My predictions:
1. The length of the map will be increased by 10%.
2. Java Island and Papua Island will be on the map (and maybe a little bit of Australia too?).
3. The old part of the map will not be changed because the lakes and the rivers of the old map match perfectly with the new one.

 

[klopkr]

I tried to overlay the video's paper map onto the current paper map, but the video's map is presented at an angle, so I need to skew it first.
When I overlay it on the current map, I find that there's not enough room on the map, and I need to add 10% more to the map's length to the east. And it matches perfectly!
View attachment 1265959

The Lake Baikal is aligned perfectly. The rivers in the Bengal and Burma areas are also perfectly aligned. And the right edge of the video's paper map is perfectly vertical.
View attachment 1265960

Next I throw the map from the Rajas of Asia mod into the mix. While the mod has the wrong map projection, it's enough to illustrate the final map. I choose this four spot on the map for the alignment.
View attachment 1265965

My predictions:
1. The length of the map will be increased by 10%.
2. Java Island and Papua Island will be on the map (and maybe a little bit of Australia too?).
3. The old part of the map will not be changed because the lakes and the rivers of the old map match perfectly with the new one.

I think you did a better job than me. But have you attempted to integrate the other parts of the map shown when they do a pan?

The rivers do match on the old map, but it is a different texture of paper map at least with new monsters and asian style mountains and trees. There was definitely stretching going on. Aligning the side of the map straight was well done by you, the other side also has a straight border edge shown (no iceland?) but it's during the fade.

Britain and Ireland and Scandinavia look distinctly different to me but it might be the squeue.

 

[Cooleatack]

Ok I just appended the map from the video to the current CK3 map.

Here it is aligned with the Ganges. Notably it aligns perfectly straight with the video version. The warping is all at the top of the map which makes sense considering how warped Japan and Korea look. Lake Baikal has shifted significantly in this version. The Steppe would have to be warped to be longer Baikal is not too much further east though so it might not be that much of a change.
View attachment 1265382

This one I aligned with lake Bikal, Note that I had to rotate it. The Ganges do not line up and are mildly off which I believe would require a big redrawing of India.
View attachment 1265381

So my theory is that they stretched out the north a bit and kept India more or less similar and are just going to cut half of Indonesia or really really squish it in.

Or it's a completely new map projection that rejigs the entire map. There's no way to actually match the Ganges to Lake Baikal without warping the image in the video. I think it's very likely the map just cuts off Indonesia right at Singapore. No Java.

If all of Indonesia does get confirmed then I would predict a full expansion south adding the swahili coast. I don't think the map warps enough to include all of indonesia and not expand the map south.

Stating to include Indonesia without then including Java seems silly. So, I would discard that as an option. Can’t be the greatest Khan without surpassing it’s greatest failures! I can also already smell the ma-ja-pa-hit reference in a dev diary. No way they will miss out on that haha

 

[Cooleatack]

Your comparisons makes it likely that the map in the video is an artist interpretation for the purpose of the promo video, and should not be regarded as the actual map or projection thereof. There is so much changed in Europe on it too. So that leaves us a little empty handed right now. @Devs feel free to chime in!

 

[Ksiendzu]

Check this post about map graphics from my thread:

Happy you noticed!
Yes, we plan to have an Asian paper map style and a Western one. We want it to be something the players can pick between, or at least be culturally triggered depending on who you are playing as. I can't promise how and if this feature will be implemented, though, as we're still figuring that out.

This map is not only for trailer.

 

[WolfClaw]

I hope PDS use real-world proportions instead of the Mercator projection.