Fantasy Options for the IGC

[Doomdark]

I need your input to help improve these... Currently we plan to include the following ahistorical options:

1) USA 1492
This is a wild and crazy option for our spunky friends overseas. The problem here is to configure the US for a nice and balanced starting-position. I plan to give them Massachussetts and Connecticut, with the capitol of Boston. They will need some colonial dynamism to expand at all, so they must be given one settler per year in the beginning. They have no explorer or conquistador leaders, so they must also have a fair knowledge of their surroundings. However, I am not sure whether they should know much about Europe. Suggestions?

2) Burgundy the Mighty
Charles the Bold survived to produce an heir, and so Burgundy was not inherited by Maximilian of Austria in 1477. Thus, we have a powerful state consisting of Friesen, Holland, The Hague, Zeeland, Flandres, Hainaut, Artois, Luxembourg, Franche Comte, Picardie and Bourgogne. The capital would of course be located in Bourgogne. A case can be made for also giving Calais and Lorraine to Burgundy, but I think it will be best not to. The main problem with the Burgundy option is their lack of leaders and monarchs. We will have to invent some...

3) Prussia 1492
This option would unite Brandenburg and Prussia under the Prussia tag, with the nice dark gray color. The main problem would be the early monarchs and leaders, which should come from the Brandenburg files.

4) Balkan Mess
Here, we would have a free Greece and a free Serbia, adding to the general confusion. Again, we face the problem with the lack of leaders, plus we need to decide which provinces Greece should start with.

Comments?

 

[Savant]

Hail the rebirth of Lotharingia!

I vote for the Lotharingian transmogrification into Burgundy.

Also, rather than a "new Hellas" how about a "petite Byzantium" consisting of Thrace (and possibly the Morea) as vassals to the Turks? Someone had brought this up as a possibility in another scenario thread and if we are talking fantasy... well, it would be rather.. fantastical (McGuinn could color-code this country porphyrogenitu).

Personally, the United States in 1492 would be my least favored option.

 

[BiB]

A "European" nation in America before the Europeans even dicovered Europe seems a bit absurd to me too. I think it'd be better to use another starting .inc for that.

Obviously if it were to go fantasy, I'd consider playing Burgundy

 

[Vandelay]

How about a "Jews with an Attitude" scenario sporting the Rabbinate of Saloniki as an Ottoman vassal?

I've actually played this. Killed a lot of shiksas and raped a lot of dogs. Oy vey!

/Vandelay

 

[Griffon]

I second Vandalay's proposition. You'd have to give them quite a few merchants and diplomats and monarchs with high money and diplomatical skills, but low armies. The only issue left is religious, maybe pagan?

The point is to force this nation to expand economically and diplomatically, but make it difficult to colonize and expand militarily (although Israel.... oh well, that's an OT thread ).

Oh, but if you make them Pagan, then they can't vassalize their neighbors, hmmmm.... maybe Catholic then (heresy, I know)?

 

[Hartmann]

About US: No need for a seperate inc as You folks may simply turn that option off (i.e. it *is* off by default). It´s just there for the hell of it.
About Burgundy: Maybe someone could provide some suggestion for monarchs and leaders?
About Balkans: Here our assumption is, that between 1453 and 1492 a successfull Balkan revolt lead to independence of Serbia and Greece. IMHO Greece should only have Hellas and Morea. No additional monarchs/leaders are needed, though, (Doomie), as we already have the original patriarchs as monarchs and some of them are also listed as leaders.
Prussia: This is more tricky than it may seem on first glance. The best solution would be, that the IGCConfig would automatically rename the leaderfile whenever the Prussia option is "on".

Hartmann

 

[BiB]

I used the Holland tag for it (to stop the revolt) and gave them as leaders starting with Filips the Beautiful over Karl V (if they can treat him like 2 persons for Spain and Austria might as well add a third). Those 2 after all are of Burgundian descendance and were quite Burgundian style rulers, not to mention the lawful rulers.

And then over to Willem of Oranje. It's quite plausible a daughter of him married Oranje seeing it's fantasy anyway. Or that Oranje took over in the disarray following Karl's demise. And so on.

And solved The other option is fantasy rulers. Might as well use the Dutch ones IMO.

 

[BiB]

Originally posted by Hartmann
About US: No need for a seperate inc as You folks may simply turn that option off (i.e. it *is* off by default). It´s just there for the hell of it.
About Burgundy: Maybe someone could provide some suggestion for monarchs and leaders?
About Balkans: Here our assumption is, that between 1453 and 1492 a successfull Balkan revolt lead to independence of Serbia and Greece. IMHO Greece should only have Hellas and Morea. No additional monarchs/leaders are needed, though, (Doomie), as we already have the original patriarchs as monarchs and some of them are also listed as leaders.
Prussia: This is more tricky than it may seem on first glance. The best solution would be, that the IGCConfig would automatically rename the leaderfile whenever the Prussia option is "on".

Hartmann

About the US, if u start the scenario in a later .inc at least u can keep a high level of realism (what if the colonies broke away earlier or so) while staryting in 1492 is plain fantasy. Which is fine but not my cup of tea. I4d like it to be somewhat historical as Burgundy is just a slight what if for example.

 

[unmerged(530)]

We could say that Serbia and Byzantium were never bellicose in the 1430s and that Turkey left them alone as thier vassalls. Ill try to find what territories they should have.

 

[unmerged(810)]

Free Novgorod

I would like to see free Novgorod option too (as a vassal of Russia?). Free Lithuania (or, rather Chief Principality of Russia) after successful Svidrigaylo's revolt should be interesting to play, too...

 

[Dark Knight]

You could probably have separate threads for discussing three of the four options.

1) I would suggest having the "United States of Vinland" not have any knowledge of Europe at the beginning (otherwise, wouldn't they be able to conduct diplomacy with European states that haven't discovered the Americas yet?). Also, couldn't the US be given explorers and conquistadors.

2) This is a rather interesting idea. Would the state religion change to Reformed? And how would the Dutch Revolt work?

3) This is rather simple to do.

4) I'd suggest starting Serbia with Serbia and Kosovo provinces and Greece with just the Morea and Hellas. This makes it a challenge for both of them to survive.

 

[Pan Zagloba]

I'd support the inclusion of an option for "Shell of Byzantium", comprising Thrace (renaming Istanbul to Constantinople) and perhaps the Morea. However, it should have a fair number of ambassadors ("Patriarchal diplomacy") and good relations with Russia and Hellas (if it exists). It should also have a CB shield over all Arab territories and everything in the old Eastern Empire.

Zagloba (currently reading Norwich's Short History of Byzantium)