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Getting ducal title in peace agreement does not vassalize the former duke

Not sure if it is WAD or BUG but:
If a duke lose his ducal title in a peace agreement, all vassals to that ducal title become vassals of the new duke, but the former duke itself become an independent count, not a vassal of a new duke.
If this WAD isn't there lacking an option to force vassalise entire duchy?
Also the same problem is probably at the king level but I did not test it yet.
 
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This does not exist at King level. If you take all King titles from the King, he will become a Duke and you get his dememse. I did this to the King of Germany.

Not sure why this would not work at the Duke level. I would also like to hear if this is WAD or not, since the game works differently for different tiers... :confused:
 
horragoth said:
Not sure if it is WAD or BUG but:
If a duke lose his ducal title in a peace agreement, all vassals to that ducal title become vassals of the new duke, but the former duke itself become an independent count, not a vassal of a new duke.
If this WAD isn't there lacking an option to force vassalise entire duchy?
Also the same problem is probably at the king level but I did not test it yet.
Click to expand...

Is the county of the former duke a part of what makes up the new duchy? It is possible the duke had other holdings which wre not part of his original duchy to which he fled when he lost the title to you (not real likely but possible).
 
Sonny said:
Is the county of the former duke a part of what makes up the new duchy? It is possible the duke had other holdings which wre not part of his original duchy to which he fled when he lost the title to you (not real likely but possible).
Click to expand...

No, It was in my game as Duke of Gwyneddnot very long after the start of the game, so that posessions were as those in 1066 setup. The duke of Ulster, apart from his ducal title, had Count of Ulaid - one prov demesne and Counts of Tir Connail and Tir Eoghain as vassals. I grabbed his ducal title and not his count title. Then I DOWd him and in peace agreement requested the ducal title. It was accepted and left Counts of Tir Connail and Tir Eoghain as vassals to me (to my new Ducal title actually) and the former duke became free Count of Ulaid.
I have analyzed the save game and in this particular case the count of Ulaid was the vassal of Duke of Ulster before the war, although they were the same person. So when I got the ducal title the vassalship should pass to me as a new ducal title holder.
 
Right, you can not vassalise an enemy by force EVER period, thats just how the game works. You need to take all his titles and then give them out to vassals, spending hundreds(or thousands) of prestige.
 
Force-vassalising = EU2
Getting title = CK

WAD.

Cat
 
Cat Lord said:
Force-vassalising = EU2
Getting title = CK
WAD.
Click to expand...

If it is WAD, why does it work one way for a King title (old King/new Duke is vassalized to new King), and the other way for a Duke title (old Duke/new Count is not vassalized to new Duke)?

Designed two different ways for roughly the same thing?

-Richard Campbell.
 
ulmont said:
If it is WAD, why does it work one way for a King title (old King/new Duke is vassalized to new King), and the other way for a Duke title (old Duke/new Count is not vassalized to new Duke)?

Designed two different ways for roughly the same thing?
Click to expand...
Ha.
That I don't know.

I'll ask.

Cat
 
It's worked both ways for me. In one game as Duke of Meath I took the Ducal title from Ulster and got his two vassals be he remained independent. In a different game as Duke of Meath I took Connaught's (sp?) Ducal title and got both his vassals (sons of his) and the former Duke himself as my new vassals.

I've seen it work both ways for the AI too. In one game Norfolk rebelled against England to back up Northumbria (me) and then settled a peace a few years letter where the King grabbed his Ducal title and he and all his lands & vassals became subjects of the King again. France, meanwhile, fell apart under similar circumstances.
 
madogvelkor said:
It's worked both ways for me. In one game as Duke of Meath I took the Ducal title from Ulster and got his two vassals be he remained independent. In a different game as Duke of Meath I took Connaught's (sp?) Ducal title and got both his vassals (sons of his) and the former Duke himself as my new vassals.

I've seen it work both ways for the AI too. In one game Norfolk rebelled against England to back up Northumbria (me) and then settled a peace a few years letter where the King grabbed his Ducal title and he and all his lands & vassals became subjects of the King again. France, meanwhile, fell apart under similar circumstances.
Click to expand...

Yes I have tried once more in similar situation and this worked right. Perhaps it has something to do with a loyalty. Yes there IS a loyalty value defined for the character with titles Duke of Ulster, Count of Ulaid despite it is a single person and there is no King above him.
 
Cat Lord said:
Force-vassalising = EU2
Getting title = CK

WAD.

Cat
Click to expand...

I have probably experessed myself badly. The term 'force vassalising' was intended to describe situation where there are both the count and the ducal title held by a single character. In my case those were count of Ulaid (C005) and Duke of Ulster (ULST). Despite they were owned by a single character ULST is the liege of C005 according to savegame. But once I taken the ULST title, C005 was no more my vassal. Thus I probably had to use the term 'vassalship persistence' then 'force-vassalising'.
Now, as madogvelkor confirmed that the game can behave both ways I think there is a bug involved.
 
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