Government is Broken?

[RobRoy3]

Does anyone know if there is a randomness or any special criteria that need to exist for a country's government to be broken, when the Capitol is occupied by rebels?

I've been able to use this trick with varying degrees of success, both on other nations (to get the free annexation of any of their provinces that you control at the time of rebellion) and on myself (to increase the stability).

But it doesn't seem to work consistently. I'll frequently get rebels occupying a capitol without any apparent effect. It takes a great deal of planning and patience to put yourself in a position to take advantage of rebels, so I don't have any ethical problems with taking advantage of this "feature", but I would like to know if I'm missing something.

Is there just a random element (although trying save/restart when testing seems to suggest that it is not random)? Does the age of the rebels matter (it seems to matter for getting new countries to form)? Could stability be a factor (mine or the enemies)?

Anyone out there know what the deal is? Or have any reasonable guesses?

 

[unmerged(548)]

Originally posted by RobRoy3
Does anyone know if there is a randomness or any special criteria that need to exist for a country's government to be broken, when the Capitol is occupied by rebels?
...
Anyone out there know what the deal is? Or have any reasonable guesses?

I would guess the same rules applies to a government overthrowing as to a new countries forming due to revolts (random chance once minimum provinces in revolt, check revolt.txt).

 

[Virginian Gent]

wait... why do you want the government to be overthrown again?

 

[Kedryn]

Another way to do it is if, as often happens, the nation has a province deep within someone else's territory. Eventually, that province will be taken over by rebels. Now declare war on the victim and take all his provinces except for the one controlled by rebels. Wait for the beginning of the next month, and... everything is yours. I discovered this by accident while playing as Russia... Rebels held Polish Lugansk (taken from the Crimeans who took it from Golden Horde who...). I declared war on Poland (who held almost all their original provinces) to stop them from increasing their fortifications to level 3. As the war ground on, I found it impossible to get the 3 provinces I wanted and Poland kept offering places like Welikia and Smolensk. So, with half of Poland's provinces flying the Green Flag of Serenity, I decided I would conquer everything so I could get the 3 provinces that I wanted; I would leave Lugansk for last, as it was flying the Red Flag of Annoyance and could not hurt me. And then, as my armies went for that last province, having occupied everything else, the first of June rolls around and suddenly I control all of Poland and Hungary (had been diplo-annexed) except for 2 provinces. And I thought to myself, "Uh oh... my empire now has representatives from every religion. Joy".

 

[RobRoy3]

Originally posted by Virginian Gent
wait... why do you want the government to be overthrown again?

If your enemy's government falls, all their occupied provinces go to whoever occupies them (hopefully that's mostly you). Thus you might be able to acquire more than three provinces without a BB hit, if you can manage it. The instances I've seen have mostly been by accident, so I wasn't able to take that much advantage of it. My attempts to "arrange" broken government have been mixed.

I had thought the trigger was rebel occupation of the capital city. But that does not consistently result in a broken government, so there must be something else. Kedryn's post suggests that it can occur by some other means (is that right Kedryn? The government fell in your example, but the trigger was not rebel occupation of the capital?). Rebels still appear to be involved, and from his description, I would surmise that the age of the rebel force(s) was advanced (this may make a difference).

Someone (Robo, maybe?) also pointed out that it could be advantageous to have your own Government Broken. You regain stability of 3 after your government is broken. Also, remaining rebels (now in charge of the government) disperse. Assuming you survive any dismemberment, this might be a good deal. But I've had even less luck engineering this situation than engineering an enemy coup.

Thanks for the input Huszics. I'm also thinking the prerequisites have got to be awfully similar to new nation creation. Unfortunately the revolt file is not particularly illuminating. There is probably some randomness, maybe mixed with age of rebel army, but I'm pretty sure there is something else. And I'm wondering if the "randomness" might be preset and saved somewhere odd, since a simple save/restart doesn't seem to yield any different result when I've tested for either Government is Broken or new nation creation.

Anyone else have any thoughts on what may be needed to achieve a Government is Broken result?

 

[Kedryn]

Yes, that is correct. The trigger, in my case, was that Poland controlled no provinces, but the rebels did.