Heraldry

[Earl Uhtred]

It's a million to one this has been covered, but I haven't seen it, so here goes...

I'm pleased to notice CK will be enormously flexible and will have many hundreds of political entities be they merchant republics, duchies, kingdoms, empires, khanates, etc. I'm wondering how (if at all) the computer will allocate coats of arms. If a new principality arises in some godforsaken backwater will it be given a random coat of arms or has some poor sod had to research examples of heraldry from the nobility of every European province? Do all your noble families get shields too?

You know what would be REALLY cool is if you had a coat of arms which changed as your dynasty interacted with others (for example gaining that 'bastard' stripe if your current king was born out of wedlock). A bit more than the programme can deliver I'll be bound but it would be super fun.

 

[Murmurandus]

The original plan was to create new CoA out of the existing ones when new territories where acquired. However this might have changed due to the difficulty to implement that.

 

[kurtbrian]

Originally posted by Murmurandus
The original plan was to create new CoA out of the existing ones when new territories where acquired. However this might have changed due to the difficulty to implement that.

Yes, I also remember Sergei mentioning something about it being changed...

 

[unmerged(485)]

From what I remember only the bare necessities of CoAs are going to be present. SOme 900 or so (I guess for provinces) won't be in due to lack of resources. However, IIRC you will still be able to import you own CoAs into the game so you can customize all you want on your own. There is however only 5 areas of the CoA so you are limited as to how much customizing you can do.

At least that is my impression of the current state of CoAs.

 

[Norgesvenn]

Didn't he also say "this belongs in a later patch"? I think he did.

 

[unmerged(485)]

Originally posted by Norgesvenn
Didn't he also say "this belongs in a later patch"? I think he did.

Yes, the other CoAs likely will be future patches.

 

[ErmineClad]

Anybody know of any good heraldry links where we could feast our eyes on some of the CoAs of the day?

 

[unmerged(6975)]

So, in theory, we'll be able to just create our own coats of arms if we don't like the ones in the game? Does that mean that the individual components will be stored as seperate files that can be edited in photoshop, and then teh game assembles them, or does it already have the components assembled? The second option would require a hell of a lot of coats of arms!

 

[Earl Uhtred]

'Course you can already do that in EU.

 

[unmerged(6160)]

Originally posted by Celt
So, in theory, we'll be able to just create our own coats of arms if we don't like the ones in the game? Does that mean that the individual components will be stored as seperate files that can be edited in photoshop, and then teh game assembles them, or does it already have the components assembled? The second option would require a hell of a lot of coats of arms!

I believe the game assembles them, becauses COA's change and you might see France, England, and Bavaria all on one COA

 

[unmerged(5664)]

Originally posted by Celt
So, in theory, we'll be able to just create our own coats of arms if we don't like the ones in the game? Does that mean that the individual components will be stored as seperate files that can be edited in photoshop, and then teh game assembles them, or does it already have the components assembled? The second option would require a hell of a lot of coats of arms!

I believe we'll have to hand-edit any new graphics in Photoshop or the like, and import them into the game by ourselves (much like EU2).

 

[unmerged(485)]

Originally posted by BarristerBoy
I believe we'll have to hand-edit any new graphics in Photoshop or the like, and import them into the game by ourselves (much like EU2).

That sounds right. At least they are not hard coded. So you can make whatever you like and import it.

 

[Murmurandus]

That's indeed right...

 

[Earl Uhtred]

Right - but what form will the default shields take? After all St George and the St George Cross came to us by way of Aquitaine, and the England flag as seen in EU, in common with most other West European flags, did not come into general use before the fourteenth century.

 

[Havard]

Originally posted by snuggs
Right - but what form will the default shields take? After all St George and the St George Cross came to us by way of Aquitaine, and the England flag as seen in EU, in common with most other West European flags, did not come into general use before the fourteenth century.

To have heraldry at all we'll have to compromise with history, since close to nothing of the heraldry we know today existed in 1066... I believe there is a CoA in the screenie from the Estonia meeting btw...

 

[unmerged(7537)]

Originally posted by snuggs
Right - but what form will the default shields take? After all St George and the St George Cross came to us by way of Aquitaine, and the England flag as seen in EU, in common with most other West European flags, did not come into general use before the fourteenth century.

I assume the game would use the Plantagenet coat of arms as default for England. Fine for me, although not entirely historically accurate.

 

[Earl Uhtred]

There's always the cross of St Edmund - a bit like the Swedish flag but with a yellow martlet in each corner.

 

[unmerged(485)]

Originally posted by Tambourmajor
I assume the game would use the Plantagenet coat of arms as default for England. Fine for me, although not entirely historically accurate.

Why would William's dynasty use the Plantagenet CoA? If the progeny of William don't ever marry the progeny fo Fulk of Anjou then there may never be a Plantagenet dynasty - or it might be a minor one.

 

[unmerged(6160)]

England/Norman Dynasty should use the Norman Lion as their COA, one long lion

The Saxon Dynasty should use the arms of Wessex/Mercia

 

[Earl Uhtred]

Wessex's emblem was the red dragon; Harold Godwinson's personal standard was the 'Fighting Man' - I imagine looking like the Cerne Giant. Bastard Bill captured it and sent it to the Pope o' Rome in exchange for his sanctioning of the invasion.

God knows what they'll use for Wales/Ireland - and Scotland's foremost saint at this time was Columba not Andrew.