So far, I am seeing Hsubs close to 5 VS capital ships and around 25 VS asw fleets. Anecdotal only, I don't do the numbers and calculations like you and our Azure Avian overlord lol
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Why not use Hsub2? Cost more IC but it has more sea attack and speed for positioning.
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I was puzzled what you are refering to for a while but you mean HSubs to hunt HSubs, don't you?
I mean it is just better in general. Very early tech too.
It is faster, more sea attack, but pricier.
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[Hsub vs Hsub]
It would be interesting if someone gave it a try...
My guess: nothing happens.
Most likely with sub detection of 5 and a visibility of 1.5... both fleets don't manage to find each other.
But that's only a guess.
It would be interesting if someone gave it a try...
My guess: nothing happens.
Most likely with sub detection of 5 and a visibility of 1.5... both fleets don't manage to find each other.
But that's only a guess.
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Actually, I have built a navy test bed for 1.06. When I get back from Florida, maybe I will run that test. If so, I will publish it with some screen shots.
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My first day back will be spent on the Princely Federation AAR but maybe Tuesday or Wednesday I can run some tests on Hsubs vs each other. Note the the subs built for my expiremental test bed Have float planes and improved hull as attachments. We all know FPs are good. I am curious about the IH mainly vs ASW fleets.
IH is good, more HSubs are even better.
The quality of HSubs is there quantity. If you make them more expensive you are actively lowering their advantages.
FPs are a necessary brigade, though.
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That might be a factor for UK, Italy, and Japan but for post BP Germany and for the USA, cost difference is basically irrelevant.
Naval play was always a weakness of mine in Darkest Hour. Thank you for this wonderfully detailed guide. I have some questions.
What about regular subs? Is it worth to tech into them to slowly augment and eventually take the place of Hsubs?
What should my fleet composition look like? Should I divide my fleets according to their ship role, or keep multiple types of ship all in the same fleet? This is a very confusing element for me, so I'd like to have somebody explain it.
I know that you need to have a certain ratio of capitals to escorts, but does that mean the ratio has to be exactly equal? Do you get penalized for having more escorts in a fleet than capitals, which logically follows from the cheaper cost and greater availability of the former?
What about regular subs? Is it worth to tech into them to slowly augment and eventually take the place of Hsubs?
What should my fleet composition look like? Should I divide my fleets according to their ship role, or keep multiple types of ship all in the same fleet? This is a very confusing element for me, so I'd like to have somebody explain it.
I know that you need to have a certain ratio of capitals to escorts, but does that mean the ratio has to be exactly equal? Do you get penalized for having more escorts in a fleet than capitals, which logically follows from the cheaper cost and greater availability of the former?
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I think starting from diesel electric sub, they become relevant again due to insanely hard to spot.
What a fleet composition should "look like" has been a near constant conversation for as long as I have played the game. Probably longer. There is no penalty for more escorts than capitol ships. It is actually a good idea to have a couple spares in case you lose 1. The role of subs in your fleet and which kind you want depends entirely on what you plan to use them for. Keep in mind that @Altruist was using them as a poor man's battle fleet in his examples. Not the "normal" sub role. Why do you want subs in your fleet? What will be their purpose? Then you can answer your own question. Fleet composition is not the first question you should ask. What are my objectives, should be first imo. Then, how do I achieve those objectives? Then you make a plan by answering that question. Your answers and your starting tech will lead to decisions on fleet comp among other things. Good luck
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Has there been a test on this?
15CVL1 and 15DD 1937 vs 30 Hsub
DD is equiped with ASW, CVL gets 1937cag. Hsub use the usual.
Both admiral are equal skill, with no traits. Doctrine is something like your set up.
Who come out on top? Granted, I think sub lose, but who actually lose in terms of IC? Hsub is much cheaper than DD even though it should lose to DD in a duel. And if any torp manage to slip and kill CVL, thats 10hsub worth of IC. If HSUB kill 3 CVL by dumb luck, thats an even trade if you lose all 30.
15CVL1 and 15DD 1937 vs 30 Hsub
DD is equiped with ASW, CVL gets 1937cag. Hsub use the usual.
Both admiral are equal skill, with no traits. Doctrine is something like your set up.
Who come out on top? Granted, I think sub lose, but who actually lose in terms of IC? Hsub is much cheaper than DD even though it should lose to DD in a duel. And if any torp manage to slip and kill CVL, thats 10hsub worth of IC. If HSUB kill 3 CVL by dumb luck, thats an even trade if you lose all 30.
Cvl or cve? Cve's are the antique capitol shop. I could test it and see but if you meant cvl. Why 15? As soon as you lose that first dd, your fleet would suffer major penalties
CVL. But fine, 14CVL 16 DD if that suits you more. The purpose is a minmaxed carrier fleet.
I think CVE wins though, but thing is a one trick pony vs sub. CV fleet counter all but hsub, and hsub counter all but DD, CVE. CVE is more vulnerable to cvl than subs are to CVE, due to stealth difference.
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If I were purpose building a cvl fleet to hunt and destroy HSubs, I would go 6 cvl, 6 cve, 18 dd/asw. However, I would only build such a fleet in a multi-player game. I have yet to see the ai build a 30 ship fleet of heavy subs. Jmo, ymmv
Now, what I do build when needed is 4 cve and 8 dd/asw with spotter admiral. That fleet gets shadowed by 6 CV, 6 CL/AA/FP, and 6 DD/ASW superior tactician admiral. Still, against the AI, such an asw fleet is very rarely needed. Jmo, ymmv
Why not spam cve only for anti sub?
Anyways cvl and cve mixed will lose to pure cvl dd fleets. It also gimp cv's positioning through bad speed.
Anyways cvl and cve mixed will lose to pure cvl dd fleets. It also gimp cv's positioning through bad speed.
The fleets I would build do mot mix cvl and cve or even cv with cve. Read it again. 2 separate fleets. 1 to hunt subs or heavy subs. The other to protect the subhunters from enemy surface fleets.