I need an advice for the resolution of a conflict between different players

[mouse707]

We play a game with 4 human players : USSR, UK, Germany, and Japan.

We have some homemade rules, such as no war between the axis and the komintern before 1st January 1941. The Axis side has exploited this rule by putting a great pressure on UK in 1940.

The japanese has puppetized the chineses countries in 1938, and has joined the axis side in 1940, and then has annexed Holland and Phillipine, and control most of India etc....

Brazil and Spain has joined the komintern, and Brazil has DOW the japan on july 1940. After some tests, even if Japan gives freedom to some countries (Laos, Phillipine), Brazil still DOW japan. Then the axis players argue that the agressive behavior of Japan has nothing to do with the brazilian DOW, and then they're not faulty for this thing (for them, it looks like a bug). Their argument is that even giving freedom to some countries does not change nothing, and even if we change the level of aggresiveness of the game to the lower level, it does not prevent from the DOW. And as we don't know precisely what are the parameters used by the IA to DOW, the axis players say that this situation is in contradiction with our rules (no war between Komintern and Axis before 1941), and they request that the Soviet player has to remove Brazil from its alliance, and to not take it in the alliance before 1941. They think that is is stupid that Brazil can declare war over major countries, and it has nothing to do with Japan.

Even if Brazil is not the key of the war ( ), the soviet player finds very unfair to pay for the agressive behavior of the japanese player. In return, the japanese player says that his behavior has nothing to do with this DOW and doesn't want to have any penality consecutively to the DOW (after a long negociation, he offers to pay 1300$ to the SU in exchange to the removing of Brazil). However, the soviet players thinks that it is more a matter of principle than money, and the game is blocked for this very minor problem (and the SU player thinks that in return, axis players would never take rumania out of the alliance if it has DOW the S.U.)

So given these opposite positions, we turn toward the great wisdom of the members of this forum, in order to have an advice, both to resolve this particular problem (which is not important), but also to know your behaviour when facing such problems (which occur often).

 

[Galverizer]

In most games you have a rule that more or less forbids japan to enter war with anyone except china until 1941. And if they do enter before usa can join as well, but in this case since usa is AI maybe you can change it for SU.
If you let japan join so early UK don't stand a chance in india.
Can't you get usa in the alliance to even it up and let SU still be at peace with Axis?

 

[unmerged(12303)]

just lower brazilian interventionism and japans bel and it wont dow Japan.

 

[mouse707]

thanks for your prompt reply

It is clear that for the next game, japan should not be allowed to DOW before 1941 (the last game, japan was at suez in 1941, et this game follows the same way).
We shall lower brazilian interventionism (lowering japanese bel does not have any impact for the moment), hoping that it will be sufficient

Do you have a link to a page summarising all the standard rules for the multiplayer games with doomsday ?

 

[mouse707]

@ Phadishar : USA are with the allies since the japanese DOW on UK, but they are AI controlled, and for the moment, it means that they don't do nothing, as in most of the game I have played in multiplayers (in my first MP game, with HOI 2, in 6 years, they only take africa and one japanese island, even with a AI japanese player)

 

[Galverizer]

@ Phadishar : USA are with the allies since the japanese DOW on UK, but they are AI controlled, and for the moment, it means that they don't do nothing, as in most of the game I have played in multiplayers (in my first MP game, with HOI 2, in 6 years, they only take africa and one japanese island, even with a AI japanese player)

Let UK take military controll over usa then they will do a lot more. I add in all the rules here instead most people find them to be balancing. The rules are best for the 1938 scenario.

Rules

1. Diplomacy&Trading

1.1 No DOW until Danzing Event, exception made to event wars(i.e. Italy to Albania, Japan in China).
1.2 Couping of player controlled countries is forbidden.
1.3 No crazy alliances. The alliances are historical Axis against Allies and Comintern.
1.4 Allies/commitern may not ally nat spain and axis may not ally rep.spain.
1.5 USSR cannot grant(or be granted) military access to other Allied players.
1.6 Guarantee of indepence(GOI) is only allowed to do to Sweden, Spain, Switzerland and Turky. Finland may also be GOI for but only after the winter war have ended.


1.7 The Allies and USSR may not trade for rares unless their IC gives them a deficit of rares.
1.8 After the Allies are in war with Axis, Allies are allowed to initiate trade deals with USA at 50% otherwise 90%. Once usa is at war any trade deals may be offered.
1.9 After USSR is in war with Axis, USSR is allowed to initiate trades with USA at 70%, 50% if USA is also in war with Axis. Otherwise 90% just as allies.
1.10 Game get paused after the first day in the first session so axis can do trade, after that all can trade as much they want.


2. Events

2.1 Anschluss, Munich Treaty, End of Czechoslovakia, Memel, Danzig and Poland join Allies, should go historical.
2.2 Germany must declare war on Poland in the Danzig Event.
2.3 USSR must accept Bitter Peace if offered.
2.4 France must accept Vichy event if offered.

3. Axis

3.1 Italy free to join Axis after ending war with albania.
3.2 Japan can join Axis or DOW Allies after Vichy Event.


4. USA allowed to join Allies or DOW Axis (if sliders allow this) :

4.1 1 December 1941.
4.2 3 months after Japan is in war with the Allies, USSR or Netherlands.
4.3 Immediately after any invasion of an American country.
4.4 USA must have all air, navy and land forces stationed in USA main land or islands.

5. USSR and the MR-Pact

5.1 Germany may dow USSR when ever.
5.2 USSR must accept and honor the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact if offered full.
5.3 USSR can DOW Axis after July 1, 1941 (Full Pact).
5.4 USSR can DOW Axis after July 1, 1940 (Limited Pact).
5.5 USSR can DOW anyone, anytime (No Pact).
5.6 May not disband any of its starting infantry divisions during peace time.
5.7 No Unholy Alliance, unless all players agree to it when starting game

6. General

6.1 No use of any exploits or cheating of any kind. If you see anything you consider exploit or cheating you must report it.
6.2 No 'phoney-wars'. Wars declared should be fought to a peace or annexation (ie. no eternal wars with Albania as Italy or Chinese as Japan).
6.3 No stationing of any country's, Land, Air or Navy forces, on other country, prior to war.
6.5 No more than 36 divisions may garrison an urban capital. 24 for the poles.
6.6 No redeployment/disbanding of units about to be encircled/outflanked/destroyed by land forces.
6.7 No redeployment of units that are adjacent to enemy units.
6.8 Free France shall not have more than 5 Land/Air units, when declares independence.
6.9 Forbidden to sell VP provinces to your allies to prevent their annexation.
No exploiting of sending exp. forces to save supplies, especially in peacetime.
6.10 No allying before Vichy (exceptien Germany may ally italy,hungary and Romania.)

7. Victory Conditions

7.1 Game victory points, at Jan 1, 1958, decide who claims victory.
7.2 A team can claim victory earlier than 1958, if all opponent players are annexed.
7.3 A team can claim victory earlier than 1958, if its enemys industrial capacity is less than 40% of theirs.

 

[unmerged(50486)]

Brazil always DOW's axis from my experience, i have never seen a game in the last year where Brazil has not Dow'd Germany. (Yes Germany)

Japan shouldnt be allowed to even fart in UK's general direction, and stipulation to Japanese DOW of UK should be that USA is also bought into the War. (Hence Japan should DOW USA not UK)

Sounds to me like you have a typical group of axis that like to constantly raise the stakes and not get "blowback". Id tell them to suck it up, Ally USA and kick there asses.

Japan shouldn't join axis till they actually Dow the States, Japan shouldn't be allowed to freely invade UK without looking over its shoulder. Alot of people have this misconception that the Japs were at war with UK first this is infact utter bullshit. The Invasion of British Colonies did not commence till some hours after all hell precipitated over Pearl Harbour.

Playing a 4player game with Japan is also a bad move IMHO. with 4 you should have UK, USSR V GERM ITA

Japan and USA should be left out of the Equation because one without the other completely erodes the balance of the game.

Simple fact is that you need Germany, UK and USSR (andItaly), but you throw Japs into the mix and you MUST have USA. UK does not have the manpower to wether the storm in Europe and defend 100% of the Japanese onslaught... FACT

As for Brazil..... Tough luck for Axis.... they should have allied Argentina, after all there IS a very good reason that Brazil has DOW'd Japan and it has nothing to do with the japs... and EVERYTHING to do with Germany.

To the Axis stake changes in your game i say this..... Reap what you sow...

 

[Galverizer]

Playing a 4player game with Japan is also a bad move IMHO. with 4 you should have UK, USSR V GERM ITA

Japan and USA should be left out of the Equation because one without the other completely erodes the balance of the game.

That is very much true

 

[mouse707]

thanks for your posts
As the axis players launched a threat to stop the game if the soviet player didn't remove brazil from alliance, the deal was the removing against 1300$ from the jap

however, I note your suggestions to improve the rules for the next games, notably the choice of countries for a 4 players game