Italian DLC

[LordKensis]

Hi, I am Gianmarco Rinolfi founder of Europa Universalis Italia community (with more than a thousand active members).
I have tried to make some good historical work concerning an Italian DLC. This post is highly historic based and is just a sample of a more detailed work that has been summarized for this forum. More info, ideas and stuff can be given in the next weeks.

Special thanks:
Manolo Fioravanti (cofounder of the group) for Venice Rework
Luca Baietti for Signoria of Rimini
Enrico Fallea for Genova suggestions
and of course, thanks to all the groups of Europa Universalis Italia for the suggestions.

Marketing:
+ good for Imperator Rome
+ Italian community is growing
+ HRE and Italy needs some love
+ People want to play EUROPA Universalis

Content:

Sphere of influence: Influence now is really a thing; like trust the value may change from 0 to 100. As in the previous patch only great power can Influence another nation with the addition of the holy roman emperor and the papal state (only in the age of discovery).

Influence Nation : Pay 1 year of target income to increase relations and grant +1 monarch points in their weakest category for 10 years in a target independent non-great power nation. This raises their opinion of the great power by +25 for 10 years and raises the GP influence on them by 5. Going to war with them cancel this bonus and ll lower the GP influence on that nation by 10

Influence goes from 0 to 100 and as no decay over time. Every influence point will count as +2 opinion for both ( Great power and influenced nation ) with no decay over time. Influenced nation does NOT occupy any diplomatic slot.

( names may change ) Free nation, from 0 to 25 : NO effect

Influenced nation, from 25 to 50:
The AI influenced nation will be more willing to offer condottieri to the great power. Automatically divert 10% of their trade power to the Great power. Can call their influential great power in a difensive war at the cost of +10 influence. ( GP can refuse for -20 influence ). GP can not declare DIRECT war against an own influenced nation. Great power can recruits influenced nation “genio” for half of the price.

High influenced nation, from 50 to 99:
The influence nation will suffer -1 diplomatic -2 diplo reputaition and -1 diplo relations. The influenced nation can call their influential GP to offensive or defensive war (+10 influence -20 influence if GP refuse ). Influenced nation always accept enforce peace by their influent great power, they also always accept threaten war, but their GP influence decreases by 30. Influenced nation divert 50% of their trade power to their influential GP. GP can force their dinasty over an High influenced nation.

Client State 100 influence :
When a GP reach 100 influence, the influenced nation become a vassal client state.


Italian Decadence :
Every Italian state ( except for Venice ) start with an influence of 25-40 by France, Papal State, Castille or Holy Roman emperor ( further information can be given if needed ). This influence will be changed also by lot of historical events.
Special : If the HRE is the most influential nation, italian states are more willing to joint-not leave HRE and to vote his reforms. If Papal State is the most influential nation, italian states gains +20% tech cost + 5yearly papal influence modifier

Genio :
Trough the history some exceptional minds have radically changed their time. Those special historical advisors will have extremely good bonus, useful to build up a powerful empire.The stepback of this is that every "genio" can be hired by any great power in the game at the price of his cost doubled (and paid directly to the owner nation)

Exemples of Genio :
Leonardo Da Vinci : Admin advisor lvl3 +20% fort defence +1 prestige -10% build cost +10% production efficency
Carl von Clausewitz : Mil advisor lvl3 +5% discipline +10% national manpower -10% army mantenience

Italian wars :
The Italian Wars, often referred to as the Great Italian Wars or the Great Wars of Italy and sometimes as the Habsburg–Valois Wars or the Renaissance Wars, were a series of conflicts from 1494 to 1559 that involved, at various times almost every italian state, France, Spain, Austria and Ottomans.
Every nation with italian culture can join a “special coalition” against every nation (included italian nations) that own not as core an italian province. The target nation must not be allied, overlord, leading trade league or influencing ( with 25+ influence ) with the nation willing to join. Italian Liberation CB works exactly as the Imperial Liberation CB.

Disaster :

Italian Decadence :

PREREQUISITE: it is currently the ‘Age of Reformation’, and this country:
is Catholic, Protestant or Reformed. One of the following must be true: As Capital in the Italian region As Italian culture is not a subject nation other than a tributary state. did not have this disaster before.

Monthly progress starts if:
does not have an ongoing disaster. has any GP Influence of at least 50 Is not a GP

Monthly progress halts if :
have an ongoing disaster. Has not GP with Influence of at least 50 Is a GP

Montly progress :
+1 for each GP with at least 50 influence
+0.5 for each GP with at least 25 influence
+1 has at least 10 loan

Finish condition :
Is a Great Power
As at least 1 colonial nation

During the disaster Italian states get :
-100% provincial trade power +20% development cost
+0.20 yearly corruption
-10% morale of armies
+2 national unrest
-1 yearly prestige

Italian Condottieri :
Any italian culture nation can rise Condottieri during the age of discovery ( in the same Russia rises streltzsy ) Condottieri will suffer 2% montly attrition and can not reinforce unless they are at war ( or serve as condottieri ) Condottieri generate devastation in any province at peace time Condottieri always came with a 100 Army tradition general Condottieri maintenance cost is a normal units maintenance cost.
AI GP are more willing to hire condottieri
AI Italian nations are more willing to rent condottieri

Fondaco:
it was a huge build, sometimes a district, the presence of fondaco ( as a set of buildings used for the trade and hospitality of their compatriots) in the most important Mediterranean ports is considered one of the fundamental characteristics to define a maritime republic city. Venice, Genoa, Pisa, Amalfi, Ragusa, Ancona, Trani had fondaco in Constantinople, Alexandria in Egypt and in the other centers of maritime commerce. A warehouse could reach the size of a neighborhood, where there was usually a church or a hospice (and in some cases even the baths), and was governed by a bailiff, who was a judge of economic disputes. Genova for exemples had a fondaco in almost every important center of trade in Mediteranean and Black sea, the most famous were in Constantinople, Pera, Chios, Gibraltar, Cadiz, Lisbon, Crimea and Tabarka ( Tunis )

Every Center of Trade now can be developed with a colony by every merchant republic.
Every point of development added in this way will count as a Fondaco point. Every CoT can have at maximum 10 fondaco points
Every nation that got a fondaco point will get ( for each fondaco point ) 10% of provincial trade power of that province
Every fondaco point will give to the province +10% taxation and +10% goods production
Remove fondaco now will be an option in every peace deal, it will cost 30% of the warscore.

Merchant republics change :
A slider like Dutch Republic -Patricians / +Parlament
If Patricians are in charge, ruler will rule untill death otherwise there will be standard election
Can construct a Fondaco (instead of trade post) for 50 diplo points. It gives +10 trade power, in one owned province per trade node (except your primary node) and a level 1 out 10 Fondaco


Rework Italian region with more relevant nations and province (we got lot of info about it, hard to provide on a forum):
Exemple of missing nation :

Signoria di Rimini (1334-1528)
Culture:Romagnan
Religion:catholic
Governament: Monarchy(signoria).
Starting ruler 1444: Sigismondo Pandolfo Malatesta 1/3/3
Capital: Rimini, located in Romagna, separed to Bologna located in Emilia.
Extension territory in 1444: Rimini and Cesena, in the game is like the half of Romagna state. The est Romagna.

Starting ideas: -City of condottieri: mercenary cost: -15% -Intensive agricultur: local goods produce:+10%

Ambition : Regional power : +1 yearly legittimacy

Malatestian ideas with first historic explanation.
Ideas:

School of Rimini- various artists from all of italian peninsula and Europe(L.B. Alberti, Giotto, Giovanni da Rimini, Piero della Francesca.) come to Rimini to perform their pratctice in arts and painting with a huge increase of splendor for the Malatestian court. They export the italian reinassence also in Rimini and Romagna, like all of this beautiful painting are conserved in Vaticans museums in Rome.-building time: -10%

- “best loser of the history”cit.: The longtime tradition of the malatestian House as a condottrieri or mercenary give them a very good skills in a combat fields. They served house Sforza and Visconti. Very famous was the rivalry between Sigismondo Pandolfo Malatesta against Federico di Montefeltro, for their battle for the strategic point of Pesaro and Urbino during the famous italian wars!. - attrition for the enemies: +1

-“One More Loan!” The relevant cost of the mercenary regiments compared to the small income of house malatesta force them to take loan from various tuscanian and milanese banks, also the papal state support the costs of the malatestian’s campaign. This situation give them a good ability in banks affairs. Interest per amnum:-0,25

- the defense is the best attack Our territory needed protection against the attacks of our enemies. The house Malatesta have built or improved a lot of fortification and castle around Romagna and Marche ( Gradara, San Leo, Verucchio, Montescudo, Montebello, Pennabilli, Sant’arcangelo, Cesena’s castle, Sant’Agata Feltria, Santa Sofia, Sogliano’s fort, Castel Sismondo. All of them are castle or city where the house malatesta have built fort.) most of them are at the top of hills or low mountains, is a very difficult mission have a succes in a siege in this region. fort defense + 10% fort cost -20%.

-“Our own currency” After the establishment of the Riminese Signoria, and their dominion on est Romagna, the Malatestian rulers starts to create and fabricate their own currency. With an enourmous advantage in commerce and taxation. ( in the history this is one of the causes of excommunicated declaration send by pope Pio II to Sigismondo Pandolfo Maltesta.) Yearly inflaction reduction: -0.10%

-Defender of the true faith/ Malatestian Tample: During the XVI and during the religious turmoil Romagna and house malatesta remain loyal to catholic faith and the pope, for centuries Romagna and romagnan rulers followed the pope during his mission against the protestants or reformed force. They were in the first line to command the troops of the pope in some case,( in other case the pope and house malatesta were at war each other). Tolerance of the true faith:+2 yearly papal influence : + 1

-Riminese boathouse: With an important and strategic port as Rimini, the city has grew strong and increase their trade range until Croatia’s coast and all of Adriatic Sea which is a great source of fish. The Riminese signoria started their relations with Venice, Aragon and balcanic coast. Ship protect trade efficiency:+ 20%

Venice:
New Government: Most Serene Republic of Venice:
Same as Merchant Republic, except:
A slider like Dutch Republic -Council of Ten / +Great Council
If Council of Ten is in Power: Doge is elected for life, -1 yearly republican tradition, -0,10 Yearly corruption , +2,5% Discipline, +2,5% Mercenary Discipline -10% Mercenary Cost (Condottieri too); can dismiss Doge from command at the cost of -1 stability, -50 prestige, +2 unrest for 5 years
If Great Council is in Power: +1 yearly Republican Tradition, the Doge is elected every four years, +10% Taxation, -10% increase stability cost, Reduce Inflation cost -10%; every 10 years can Use the Button: Sell Council Seats, gain 1,5 years income and +1,5 Corruption
Missions:
New Branch: Expand on Terraferma
Conquer Ferrara: If Venice owns and has core on Ferrara: Gain Permanent Claim on Emilia Romagna, +1 yearly prestige for 10 years +5% morale of armies for 10 years
Conquer Cremona: If (Venice owns and have core on Cremona): Gain Permanent claim on Lombardy, Venice gain “Northern Italian Dominance”, -0.5 monthly Autonomy in every province located in Northern Italy for 10 years, +10% tax for 10 years
Stop the Rise of Milan If (Venice owns and have core on Milan) +100 military power +25 prestige
New Branch: Take back the Bizantine domain
Naval race against the Turks: if Number of Galleys equal or larger than Ottomans: Galley combat +5% for 20 years. Galley cost -10% for 20 years, gain permanent claim on Morea and Athens
2A) Conquer Morea: if Venice owns and has core on all provinces in Morea region +5% morale of Armies & Navies for 10 years, +1 yearly prestige for 10 years, gain permanent claim on Bizantium
2B) Conquer Athens: if Venice owns and has core on Athens: Greek becomes an accepted culture in Venice, -2 unrest on all Greek Culture provinces
Reconquest of Bisanzio: if Venice owns and has core on Bizantium: +50 prestige, +10% trade efficiency for 10 years, +20 trade power for 20 years in Black sea trade node, gain permanent claim on Thrace Area
New branch: Trade Hegemony in Venice Trade Node
Center of Mediterranean: Venice is the highest trade power in Venice trade node, Venice has at least 30 development, a Marketplace and a Shipyard: gain permanent Claim on Apulia Area, Cariola Area and East Adriatic area
Gain a Bridgehead in Southern Italy: If Venice owns and has core on Apulia Area: +10% trade efficiency for 10 years, gain a permanent claim on Alexandria
2b: Get Dalmatian coast: If Venice owns and has core on East Adriatic area: -0,05 yearly autonomy in East Adriatic area for 10 years, 50 diplomatic points
Conquer Alexandria: If Venice owns and has core on Alexandria: +25 prestige, +10% global trade power for 10 years, gain permanent claim on Alexandria (?) Area, gain +5 mercantilism
AGE AMBITION: Each age would have 4 focus which give us ( and also AI nations, but AI will always choose the historical ambition ) some bonuses, a new standard branch of missions and some events.
Exemples ( could be better ) :


Age of Discovery:

Exploration Focus :
Extra missions: Colonize, Trade company, Colony wars, Secure estern trade etc
Extra events: Colony-exploration related Bonus: cheap explorer, cheap conquistador, trade range.

Merchantile Focus :
Extra missions : Secure CoT, Increase Trade profit, Focus on Trade, Secure Rich Regions etc
Extra events: Merchants-Inflations-Goods related Bonus: Can make a fondaco in a CoT .

Holy Wars Focus:
Extra missions : Secure Holy city, Prestige wars, Push Heathens back etc
Extra events: Deus vult, Fight back Heathens, Religious fervor and CB Bonus: Bonus relations with nations of your religion that have this focus, more bonus from crusade, can always rent condottieri for free to a nations that is fighting an Holy wars and get extra Papal influence-Piety prestige and army tradition.

Cultural Focus:
Extra missions: Arts, Accademia, Prestige, Embrace istitutions etc
Extra events: Prestige, Development and Artists related Bonus: Development cost and Istitutions Spread.


Age of Enlightenment:

nationalism : nationalism CB, lower unrest and culture conversion but also less accepted culture, diplo rep and relations with others.

Imperialism : Imperialism ambition with imperialism CB, lot of more settlers, more culture accepted, global trade powers and stuff

Enlightemnent: Enlightemnent ambition that allows revolutions disaster, Libertè Egalitè Fraternitè event, gives you huge boost to tech cost but lot of unrest etc

Determination : that help minors, colonies and threathened nations with big military bonus against the threat and stuff for spies network


HRE CHANGES :

The holy roman Emperor now has no more force limit bonus, instead he can rise troops with no maintenance from HRE states at the cost of Imperial Authority if HRE is in war with someone outside the HRE. Troops will automatically disband when the war is over.
HRE members get 2X times influence by influent nation of the Emperor
A nation now can only join HRE if has at least 25 influence with the HRE and an development no higher then opinion
Proclaim Erbkaisertum now gives +1 yearly influence of the Emperor to every nation of HRE
HRE Emperor now has a special branch of missions to return the HRE at his maximum expantion


Ideas for game balance:
Naval warfare is, by far, less important then land warfare, To ensure more importance to naval warfare in order to make the game experience more historical and more dynamic (especially in multiplayer games) we thought about the following changes:

Trade egemony casus belli : Works as trade dispute but CoT and Fondaco can be given in the peace deal

Humiliate casus belli now also exist in naval version, with blockade wor goal

Colony isolation CB: same as trade dispute but agitate colonies as potential peace deal. It cost 30% of warscore and gives +25% liberty desire in a colony of your choice

Sea superiority : an army fighting in a costal province blocked by an ally fleet get +1 to every dice roll.

I am in possession of so much further information about Italy and with my friends we will try to keep this post updated and add some maps and stuff.

 

[Van Kasten]

Another thing that could be done is to guarantee a CB "restore the union" to the Duke of Provence, as he was the heir of the Anjou kings of Naples.

This were my thoughts:
•The Aragonese succession event for Naples would start when Alfons V dies. The event fires for Aragon, of course.
•The event has 2 or 3 choices, one of the which is to release Naples (Ferdinand I will rule the kingdom) and the other being denying the will of the late King Alphonse and not releasing Naples. The latter choice will get +25% liberty desire on Naples and two stacks of pretender rebels rise in the capital led by Ferdinand of Trastamara.
• if Ferdinand enforces his demand, Naples will become independent and ruled by him.
• the AI will choose to release Naples 90% of the time and to fight Ferdinand the rest of the times.
• Provence gets “Restoration of Union CB” on Naples for at least 50 years.
• if Provence is a subject, the overlord gains the CB
• whoever annexes Provence gains the CB.
• if Provence do not exist, France gets the CB
(This may be the spark of the Italian Wars as happened in history)
• Ferdinand I of Trastamara must be a Catalan Catholic.

Then I thought something about Alfons V employing Catalan advisors for the Kingdom of Naples: there could be a modifier from the start giving Naples 100% of Catalan advisors, then 50% when Alfons V dies and the modifier goes away when the successor (whoever he is) dies.
This will represent the forming of a new Neapolitan bureaucracy after the end of the Aragonese dominion.

 

[eferthad]

I also tried this.

 

[Palando]

I also tried this.

If the devs ever added more provinces to Naples, I would like them to base it more on this map:

 

[JustCaesar]

Italy needs and deserves more love. I hope to see an italy focused expansion soon, and this entire thread is filled with really good ideas. Also i hope that the devs will release an italian translation in the future!

 

[Van Kasten]

Also i hope that the devs will release an italian translation in the future!

This seems unlikely.
Te lo dico da italiano ahaha

 

[Prometheus_1]

I think Italian gameplay should require a lot more attention starting from the reqork of the geography .

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/revising-italy.1113093/

Then implement a better system of specific ideas for Italian states since the only one I saw is for venice and nothing for the rest.

The Italian peninsula should be quite more rich and advanced than the rest of europe and have a lead on that for most of the time.

The peninsula should abtract like flowers the beez the big powers of europe and fight in the peninsula as happened historically.

Italians shoudl be able to form leagues among them and repel both muslim invaders and big powers.

Ottomans should be able to get stopped by leagues of european nation to be able to reproduce Vienna and Lepanto.

 

[Van Kasten]

Then implement a better system of specific ideas for Italian states since the only one I saw is for venice and nothing for the rest.

Venice, Florence, Milan, The Papal States, Genoa and Naples have specific NI. The rest of the tags lacks them. But, let me say it, if you want a change to be made begin with having your own suggestions. You want Montferrat to have specific NI? Try creating a set yourself. This makes it a lot more likely to it actually been implemented.

The Italian peninsula should be quite more rich and advanced than the rest of europe and have a lead on that for most of the time.

The Italian Peninsula IS rich, and will be with more provinces. I don’t know what your idea of “rich” is, but Milan having the higher development on Europe at the start and Genoa, Venice, Florence and Naples scoring very high levels of development is pretty neat.
This said, the first Institution (The Renaissance) spawn in Italy and guarantees that the Italian States have an advanatage early game. The “lead for most of the time” is wrong, since during and after the Italian wars Italy was not ahead of anybody really. So early game advantage and then a struggle to maintain primacy. That is how it should be, and how it is.

Ottomans should be able to get stopped by leagues of european nation to be able to reproduce Vienna and Lepanto.

They can be beaten by multiple nations. The only fact is that a rule to form Leagues is needed first.

 

[Prometheus_1]

Venice, Florence, Milan, The Papal States, Genoa and Naples have specific NI. The rest of the tags lacks them. But, let me say it, if you want a change to be made begin with having your own suggestions. You want Montferrat to have specific NI? Try creating a set yourself. This makes it a lot more likely to it actually been implemented.



The Italian Peninsula IS rich, and will be with more provinces. I don’t know what your idea of “rich” is, but Milan having the higher development on Europe at the start and Genoa, Venice, Florence and Naples scoring very high levels of development is pretty neat.
This said, the first Institution (The Renaissance) spawn in Italy and guarantees that the Italian States have an advanatage early game. The “lead for most of the time” is wrong, since during and after the Italian wars Italy was not ahead of anybody really. So early game advantage and then a struggle to maintain primacy. That is how it should be, and how it is.



They can be beaten by multiple nations. The only fact is that a rule to form Leagues is needed first.

That's not really correct, according to economic History , untill 1650 Italy was the lead , surpassed then only by England and yet untill 1800 Italy was still second to rest of europe until 1825 .

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/44/Maddison_GDP_per_capita_1500-1950.svg

as for sugestions if you follow my link you can see I already did some.

 

[Van Kasten]

That's not really correct, according to economic History , untill 1650 Italy was the lead , surpassed then only by England and yet untill 1800 Italy was still second to rest of europe until 1825 .

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/44/Maddison_GDP_per_capita_1500-1950.svg

as for sugestions if you follow my link you can see I already did some.

Your link redirects to this thread. If you’re talking about the mod you made, in the preview I can see that all the nation you added have Italian ideas or Divine Ideas. But maybe I did not look the right thing, or you misplaced the link.

The institutions do not affect economy. They affect technology. The economy is regulated by development and modifiers. The latter are gained through national ideas, idea groups or policies.
Let’s take a look:
1) DEVELOPMENT: Italy already has high development, and since development is modeled almost exclusively to rise this puts Italy in an advantageous position. Then, adding more provinces and more states (aka more monarch points in the peninsula) will make Italy an economic powerhouse through all of the game.
2) MODIFIERS: Italian ideas are all well centered around developing, taking ideas, using mercs and increasing the value of the economy (though whatever means). Which Idea Group to take or Policy to enact are based only on player’s choices.

What I’m saying is that I do not see a problem here. Italy is and will be a significant economic area for tax, production and trade (with a lot of trade centers from the next patch). Do remember that two of the theee end nodes in the game are in Italy.

 

[Prometheus_1]

Your link redirects to this thread. If you’re talking about the mod you made, in the preview I can see that all the nation you added have Italian ideas or Divine Ideas. But maybe I did not look the right thing, or you misplaced the link.

The institutions do not affect economy. They affect technology. The economy is regulated by development and modifiers. The latter are gained through national ideas, idea groups or policies.
Let’s take a look:
1) DEVELOPMENT: Italy already has high development, and since development is modeled almost exclusively to rise this puts Italy in an advantageous position. Then, adding more provinces and more states (aka more monarch points in the peninsula) will make Italy an economic powerhouse through all of the game.
2) MODIFIERS: Italian ideas are all well centered around developing, taking ideas, using mercs and increasing the value of the economy (though whatever means). Which Idea Group to take or Policy to enact are based only on player’s choices.

What I’m saying is that I do not see a problem here. Italy is and will be a significant economic area for tax, production and trade (with a lot of trade centers from the next patch). Do remember that two of the theee end nodes in the game are in Italy.

Hee if you can't see the image .

 

[Prometheus_1]

If the devs ever added more provinces to Naples, I would like them to base it more on this map:

This is what I did here.

https://www.deviantart.com/n-a-i-m-a/art/Renaissence-Italy-744212539

 

[Van Kasten]

Hee if you can't see the image .

Apart from the fact that the Italian line seems to slowly decrease. But let’s say it’s a straight line until 1800.

This graph has 7 measurement points: 1500, 1600, 1700, 1820(?), 1870(?), 1920(?), 1950.
So this linea are approximations based on data that will likely be approximated. So what’s important here is the overall shape of the various lines.

Italy stay more or less the same throughout the timeframe of EU4. But is this possible? As I said, development (as a rule of thumb) will always increase, so if Italy starts with the most development, it will have even more development by the end for the game, no matter what you do. So the game will never follow this graph. If you wanted to say: Italy should take the lead until ~1650, I’d say that this game is about alternative histories but with (some) historical rues and historical setting.

Besides, GDP per capita does not give info about the size of the economy but the wealth of the people living there. So, how much the Nation’s income or economy are worth is the data we need to start talking about this.
Moreover, the lines of the graph above are averages: the real flow of GDP per capita through the centuries can be something like this. (And this are averages too).

Ps: this image is only for argument’s sake. It’s not how I want the game economy to be. Just to be sure.

 

[Prometheus_1]

Apart that I not sure how works development, By the end of the game I had the most developed countries, if by that means increasing the three icons of production tax and manpower, but the game didn't even list me in the top 8 , why?

Apart from the fact that the Italian line seems to slowly decrease. But let’s say it’s a straight line until 1800.

This graph has 7 measurement points: 1500, 1600, 1700, 1820(?), 1870(?), 1920(?), 1950.
So this linea are approximations based on data that will likely be approximated. So what’s important here is the overall shape of the various lines.

Italy stay more or less the same throughout the timeframe of EU4. But is this possible? As I said, development (as a rule of thumb) will always increase, so if Italy starts with the most development, it will have even more development by the end for the game, no matter what you do. So the game will never follow this graph. If you wanted to say: Italy should take the lead until ~1650, I’d say that this game is about alternative histories but with (some) historical rues and historical setting.

Besides, GDP per capita does not give info about the size of the economy but the wealth of the people living there. So, how much the Nation’s income or economy are worth is the data we need to start talking about this.
Moreover, the lines of the graph above are averages: the real flow of GDP per capita through the centuries can be something like this. (And this are averages too).

View attachment 395520

Ps: this image is only for argument’s sake. It’s not how I want the game economy to be. Just to be sure.

As for the graph you posted, it doesn't seems collime ... how did they do to measure exactly every fluctation ? We do not have so much data per year to make such kind of graphs spanning over centuries anyway I took from wikipedia anyway.

According to the Madison project looks stil lvalid the first graph I posted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_regions_by_past_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita

 

[Prometheus_1]

Anyway my most wanted feature for Italy are about region rework subdivision, political gameplay , improvement of ideas and achievements in science and general gameplay .

Also I would like to see the formation of inter Italian leagues to repel foreign invaders.
Also leagues made to repel muslim invaders like Ottomans as happened historically.
And finally Italian wars , the Italian regions shoudl be more economically advanced and have a lead on the rest of europe as said for most of the game time untill 1800 apart a couple of cases and straight dominance untill at least 1650 , the reason for the desire of conquest by other european powers and eventually turn the region into a battlefield where also new ideas for warfare can spread faster and emerge .

 

[Prometheus_1]

I also tried this.

Thats the mod I did some time ago ....

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=612459817

But I dunno how to make compatible with all the latest patches and dlcs....

 

[Van Kasten]

As for the graph you posted, it doesn't seems collime ... how did they do to measure exactly every fluctation ? We do not have so much data per year to make such kind of graphs spanning over centuries anyway.

I explicitly said that that graph was not shown as a new golden standard the game should adapt to. It’s propose was to show that economy always fluctuate in time. It’s not a straight line: your graph was an approximation and cannot be posted a golden standard to follow.

That is all I wanted to say, but if you keep insisting...

 

[Nuajan]

Humiliate casus belli now also exist in naval version, with blockade wor goal

I agree

 

[KRBLACK]

Best suggestion thread I have seen I a long time. The changes to condottieri, influence and the interaction between the HRE and Italy would be good additions to the game.

But adding a naval humiliate rival CB is downright genius. This will make navies actually worth using since you will need them to earn and maintain your 50+ power projection.

Hats off to you sir!