Wow. With your evasion buffs and the fact that support weapons ignore evasion, flamers are actually causing me some pain. What is this new world we're living in?
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Changelog for version 1.7:
Now Modtek compatible!
LRM stability damage un-nerfed back to stock (2 per missile).
+/++/+++ LRMs rebalanced to have the following bonuses:
Acc +1
Range +90m
Critical +25%
Acc +2
Acc +1, Range +90m
Critical +50%
Acc +1, Critical +25%
Acc +2, Critical +50%
Max Accuracy Bonus for all +/++/+++ weapons is now +2 (from +3)
Default Unsteady Threshold to 61 (from 41)
Unsteady Threshold +1 to 71 (from 61)
Damaged Weapons are slightly less accurate:
"ToHitSelfWeaponDamaged": 3
Evasive pip distance tweak:
"ToHitMovingTargetDistances":
[
20,
70,
100,
125,
150,
180
],
Made AI slightly more likely to fire at highly evasive targets:
/* Evasive "to hit" floor - if the to-hit is below this
percentage (0.0 - 100.0), only shoot a single
"conservative" shot. Note: ignored for attackers that
are not mechs. */
"k" : "Float_EvasiveToHitFloor",
"v" : {
"type": "Float",
"floatVal" : 30.0,
}
Now Modtek compatible!
LRM stability damage un-nerfed back to stock (2 per missile).
+/++/+++ LRMs rebalanced to have the following bonuses:
Acc +1
Range +90m
Critical +25%
Acc +2
Acc +1, Range +90m
Critical +50%
Acc +1, Critical +25%
Acc +2, Critical +50%
Max Accuracy Bonus for all +/++/+++ weapons is now +2 (from +3)
Default Unsteady Threshold to 61 (from 41)
Unsteady Threshold +1 to 71 (from 61)
Damaged Weapons are slightly less accurate:
"ToHitSelfWeaponDamaged": 3
Evasive pip distance tweak:
"ToHitMovingTargetDistances":
[
20,
70,
100,
125,
150,
180
],
Made AI slightly more likely to fire at highly evasive targets:
/* Evasive "to hit" floor - if the to-hit is below this
percentage (0.0 - 100.0), only shoot a single
"conservative" shot. Note: ignored for attackers that
are not mechs. */
"k" : "Float_EvasiveToHitFloor",
"v" : {
"type": "Float",
"floatVal" : 30.0,
}
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I am curious if anyone in the modding community has experimented with seperating out the ammo types. For example, an SRM 4 and SRM 2 are fed from different bins(as in TT and other titles in this IP) instead of the same ton of ammo.
@me987654
Have you played much with the LosTech weapons in any of your playthroughs? I'm not sure the values there make sense for an 'enhanced' weapon, especially considering they have no +/++/+++ versions.
for example:
What you are effectively paying for here is an extra 120 max range (at -4 to hit) and 30 optimal range (1 hex) for ELEVEN heat! I'm not sure I'd ever field the lostech over a regular +/++/+++ variant which is 'common' compared to the lostech. I would even argue that if the heat was the same (26), I still might not field it over ANY of the ++/+++ versions.
I understand that you might want to be respectful of the TT rules, but a bump to 450 optimal and a heat reduction to 30 or even 26 might make this a bit more 'balanced'.
I think all the LosTech weapons need some love. If you want some help I'd be glad to put forth some recommendations for all of them!
Have you played much with the LosTech weapons in any of your playthroughs? I'm not sure the values there make sense for an 'enhanced' weapon, especially considering they have no +/++/+++ versions.
for example:
-Large Laser - 45 damage - 26 heat - 450 max range - 300 optimal.
-ER Large Laser - 45 damage - 35(!) heat - 570 max range - 330 optimal.
-ER Large Laser - 45 damage - 35(!) heat - 570 max range - 330 optimal.
What you are effectively paying for here is an extra 120 max range (at -4 to hit) and 30 optimal range (1 hex) for ELEVEN heat! I'm not sure I'd ever field the lostech over a regular +/++/+++ variant which is 'common' compared to the lostech. I would even argue that if the heat was the same (26), I still might not field it over ANY of the ++/+++ versions.
I understand that you might want to be respectful of the TT rules, but a bump to 450 optimal and a heat reduction to 30 or even 26 might make this a bit more 'balanced'.
I think all the LosTech weapons need some love. If you want some help I'd be glad to put forth some recommendations for all of them!
@me987654
Have you played much with the LosTech weapons in any of your playthroughs? I'm not sure the values there make sense for an 'enhanced' weapon, especially considering they have no +/++/+++ versions.
for example:
-Large Laser - 45 damage - 26 heat - 450 max range - 300 optimal.
-ER Large Laser - 45 damage - 35(!) heat - 570 max range - 330 optimal.
What you are effectively paying for here is an extra 120 max range (at -4 to hit) and 30 optimal range (1 hex) for ELEVEN heat! I'm not sure I'd ever field the lostech over a regular +/++/+++ variant which is 'common' compared to the lostech. I would even argue that if the heat was the same (26), I still might not field it over ANY of the ++/+++ versions.
I understand that you might want to be respectful of the TT rules, but a bump to 450 optimal and a heat reduction to 30 or even 26 might make this a bit more 'balanced'.
I think all the LosTech weapons need some love. If you want some help I'd be glad to put forth some recommendations for all of them!
I don't really care about TT (in fact I've never played it
)You are right on the optimal range - that is WAY off. Should be 380 or 400. I'll definitely buff the range... which will help.
I've thought about dropping the heat (more)... Just haven't done it yet.... the thing is you get DHS to use with Lostech, so the heat doesn't matter as much...
Believe it or not the lostech weapons aren't THAT bad... the only two that might need a little heat buff are the ERLL and ERPPC.. I think the rest are mostly fine. I may drop the heat by 5 on the ERLL and ERPPC at some point.
Here are my suggestions:
The evasion ignore is nice for the pulse's but I thought they needed a bit more for the heat, stability! and crit! why not?!
I fixed the top 2 "ER" optimal ranges to extend to the 'normal' version long range, and reduced the heat of all the "ER" versions as the extra range is not that great for most of the game.
The ER PPC get's no minimum range, extended long range, and a stability increase... but 40 heat is tough to justify.. I remember from my vanilla playthrough. Plus, you won't get your hands on many LosTech weapons, so they should be delicious.
The evasion ignore is nice for the pulse's but I thought they needed a bit more for the heat, stability! and crit! why not?!
I fixed the top 2 "ER" optimal ranges to extend to the 'normal' version long range, and reduced the heat of all the "ER" versions as the extra range is not that great for most of the game.
The ER PPC get's no minimum range, extended long range, and a stability increase... but 40 heat is tough to justify.. I remember from my vanilla playthrough. Plus, you won't get your hands on many LosTech weapons, so they should be delicious.
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Here are my suggestions:
The evasion ignore is nice for the pulse's but I thought they needed a bit more for the heat, stability! and crit! why not?!
I fixed the top 2 "ER" optimal ranges to extend to the 'normal' version long range, and reduced the heat of all the "ER" versions as the extra range is not that great for most of the game.
The ER PPC get's no minimum range, extended long range, and a stability increase... but 40 heat is tough to justify.. I remember from my vanilla playthrough. Plus, you won't get your hands on many LosTech weapons, so they should be delicious.
Interesting - I'm not going to give Lasers stab damage.... but I like your crit idea... heck, I might just use the crit idea for the ER PPC and ERLL also... which would allow me to leave the heat as is. I might push it so +50%.... makes sense for those weapons to be basically +/++/+++ weapons on their own anyways.
Yeah - really like that idea
Remember that pulse lasers are (at least in theory) really, really strong against evasive targets (assuming the ignore evasion works... my next story mission is the raid on the castle... so I'm about to find out). A pulse laser has I think a -8 to hit bonus against a target with 5 or 6 evasion pips.
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When I did my own weapon balance I gave pulse lasers a little bit of all the bonuses as well to make it like the + weapons. Got this idea from some other mod and thought it was cool. It is awesome that you guys are converging upon the same ideas.
Here's an initial shot at giving the lostech weapons a bit more oomph (note that I'm going to review ranges also.)
[
[
I really think heat needs to be adjusted. 35 heat for the ERLL that has no real bonuses over the base LL other than range (which is of very low value as it's likely only going to get 1 round of fire before you are in regular LL). I cant see any reason to field this over a +++ LL.
Also, the tonnage for the LPL is a huge restriction, as it stands the LPL is comparable to the base PPC, but trades longer range and stability for no min and ignore evasion pips. But, as soon as you add on the +++ version of the base PPC, it's flat out better.
I like where you are going with the ignore evasion pips, and the +2 acc and ignore 2 pips effectively ignores 3 pips. I'll need some time testing these to see if they have a material impact, those things might just be enough. I'm concerned about the SPL as it already ignores ALL evasion (due to being a close-range weapon) so it's just a hotter slightly more damaging small laser.
@me987654 are you going to balance the weapons added by JK's? If not, I'll work with @don Zappo to continue to balance those extra weapons against your balance overhaul.
Do they really? If I melee the game *does* give me evasion based hit rates for all the fired-at-melee weapons too, and they definitely are lower when there are evasion pips left :O
I am very surprised that the ranges for all weapons (ok I'm not sure about ERML and ERSL right now actually) are exactly like tabletop except the pulse lasers. Those should be very (-3 base if regular lasers are -1 feels right) accurate but short(er)-range. As it stands the vanilla LPL has a 450 range but it should be 300...but yeah the ER lasers (and PPC) heat is pretty damn ridiculous
Ok Version 1.8 is up!
Changelog:
Lostech buffs:
ERPPC = +10 stab, +25% critical
ERLL = +70 optimal range, +50% critical
ERML = +50% critical
ERSL = +50% critical
Nerf precision shot acccuracy bonus (precision shot was still just way too good... I almost increased cost by 10)
"ToHitOffensivePush": -2 (from -4)
Increase precision shot cost:
"OffensivePushCost": 35, (from 30)
"OffensivePushLowMoraleCost": 45, (from 40)
"OffensivePushHighMoraleCost": 25, (from 20)
Increase vigilance cost:
"DefensivePushCost": 35, (from 30)
"DefensivePushLowMoraleCost": 45, (from 40)
"DefensivePushHighMoraleCost": 25, (from 20)
All chassis +15 stability (formula now 90 + (tonnage/2)) (we need more stability with the un-nerfing of LRMs and the buffing of AC stab damage)
"PilotingBaseFloor": 0.8, (from 0.9) (melee is slightly more difficult)
Tactics skills that reduce minimum range changed to reductions to the minimum range to hit penalty.
The base minimum range to hit penalty is +8, the first skill reduces this to +6 and the second kill reduces it to +4
Further encouraging the AI to shoot at evasive targets.
{
/* Evasive "to hit" floor - if the to-hit is below this
percentage (0.0 - 100.0), only shoot a single
"conservative" shot. Note: ignored for attackers that
are not mechs. */
"k" : "Float_EvasiveToHitFloor",
"v" : {
"type": "Float",
"floatVal" : 20.0,
}
},
Called Shot Mastery Multiplier to 2.5 (from 2.6)
Changelog:
Lostech buffs:
ERPPC = +10 stab, +25% critical
ERLL = +70 optimal range, +50% critical
ERML = +50% critical
ERSL = +50% critical
Nerf precision shot acccuracy bonus (precision shot was still just way too good... I almost increased cost by 10)
"ToHitOffensivePush": -2 (from -4)
Increase precision shot cost:
"OffensivePushCost": 35, (from 30)
"OffensivePushLowMoraleCost": 45, (from 40)
"OffensivePushHighMoraleCost": 25, (from 20)
Increase vigilance cost:
"DefensivePushCost": 35, (from 30)
"DefensivePushLowMoraleCost": 45, (from 40)
"DefensivePushHighMoraleCost": 25, (from 20)
All chassis +15 stability (formula now 90 + (tonnage/2)) (we need more stability with the un-nerfing of LRMs and the buffing of AC stab damage)
"PilotingBaseFloor": 0.8, (from 0.9) (melee is slightly more difficult)
Tactics skills that reduce minimum range changed to reductions to the minimum range to hit penalty.
The base minimum range to hit penalty is +8, the first skill reduces this to +6 and the second kill reduces it to +4
Further encouraging the AI to shoot at evasive targets.
{
/* Evasive "to hit" floor - if the to-hit is below this
percentage (0.0 - 100.0), only shoot a single
"conservative" shot. Note: ignored for attackers that
are not mechs. */
"k" : "Float_EvasiveToHitFloor",
"v" : {
"type": "Float",
"floatVal" : 20.0,
}
},
Called Shot Mastery Multiplier to 2.5 (from 2.6)
New version up.
Changelog for version 2.0:
Slight change to evasion scaling:
"ToHitMovingPipUMs":
[
1,
3,
5,
8,
11,
14
],
Juggernaut now also braces (from dz Consolidated Company Commander)
Ace Pilot now makes the last 2 pips of evasion permanent on a per turn basis (they can not be stripped by firing). (from dz Consolidated Company Commander)
Note that the last two options are separated out into their own folders... so they are optional if you want a more "vanilla" experience.
Changelog for version 2.0:
Slight change to evasion scaling:
"ToHitMovingPipUMs":
[
1,
3,
5,
8,
11,
14
],
Juggernaut now also braces (from dz Consolidated Company Commander)
Ace Pilot now makes the last 2 pips of evasion permanent on a per turn basis (they can not be stripped by firing). (from dz Consolidated Company Commander)
Note that the last two options are separated out into their own folders... so they are optional if you want a more "vanilla" experience.
Ah, so you have the slightly different Ace Pilot, here. Interested to hear your opinion on this slight change!
Yeah I nerfed it just a touch..... was going back and forth between 3 and 2.... and I kept thinking about a highlander jumping nonstop and keeping 3 pips
Do you wake up in a cold sweat thinking about jumping Highlanders? That seems to be the singular motivation behind a lot of your balance decisions.Yeah I nerfed it just a touch..... was going back and forth between 3 and 2.... and I kept thinking about a highlander jumping nonstop and keeping 3 pips
Do you wake up in a cold sweat thinking about jumping Highlanders? That seems to be the singular motivation behind a lot of your balance decisions.
HA .... I actually use them all the time.
BTW after some more playtesting I may be upping the permanent pips to 3. Two is not helping my poor grasshopper with Dekker very much right now
And that change will allow me to fold in your AI changes
Have you considered attaching permanent pips to speed instead of chassis weight classification?
I'll let myself out now.
I'll let myself out now.