[Mod/Mod Idea]: Noah's Ark

[Nintz]

Current Phase of Development: Planning

Okay, first I would like to say that I have basically no modding expeirience.

I would like to do this, but without a mentor or modding guide, I am clueless.

Some help on that note would be appreciated.

Now, on to the idea.

Imagine this, if you will. Europe, circa 1000 or so, gets flooded en masse. The previous civilizations are killed off overnight, and a few lucky survivors take to the ships. After all, Europe is right on the coast, many will survive.

Not everyone though.

And when the waters recede, a strange blending of cultures from around Europe, and others parts of the globe, begin to claim land. This starts in 1066. It would end around 1100, by which point Europe would be fully risen.

That's the basic idea. There is far more in terms of details.

Cultures

Many cultures are still around after their 100 year hiatus from life. Some are gone, and some new ones have shown up.

Latin Group

Frankish

Occitan

Italian

Burgundian

Iberian

Portuguese

Andalusian

Castillian

British

British (The British culture is an odd mix of Welsh, Saxon, Iroquois Indian, and Egyptian. This unlikely combination found themselves trapped together sometime during the flood.)

Celtic

Irish

Scottish

Germanic

Dutch-Burgundian

Bavarian

Pommeranian

Franconian

Scandinavian

Swedish

Dorveijgan (A mix of Danish and Norweigan, with Russian influences)

Russian

*The Russian culture itself has died out. Or... perhaps they are simply in lands unknwon? Whatever the case, the only remnants of the Russian culture are found in the form of Dorveijgan.

Arabic

Maghreb-Levantine

Persian

Far East

*These cultures are people lost far from home, yet now stuck in this land. They are few in number.

Indian

Indonesian

American Indian

*While more numerous than the Asian cultures, the American Indians are still relatively rare. They are also somewhat tech-deprived at the start.

Delaware

Navajo

Azteca

Religions

New religions have come with the foreigners, while the previous balance has been wiped away. The mechanics will be completely reworked.

Catholicism

Orthodox (Catholic Heresy)

Sunni

Shiite (Sunni Heresy)

Shamanism

Hinduism

Buddhism

Some currently unnamed religion in which people worship the ocean.

Nations

The names of some of the first tribes to come down and re-form nations on the Earth, along with their cultures. I also listed what I think their landing points will be. This is an incomplete list.

Occitania (Occitan), the Carpathian Mts. Near Hungary

Bretange (British), The Pyrennes Mts, between France and Spain

Franconia (Franconian), Norway

Scotland (Scottish), French Alps

Sirajis (Persian), Also Alps, on the Eastern Side

Malacca (Indonesian), Georgia region

Tampico (Azteca), Atlas Mts in Morrocco



*Will post more on the idea soon. If you like it, feel free to help out. Constructive criticism greatly appreciated, "i dont like this idea" posts highly uninformative.

 

[Baneslave]

So, what specifically do you want to do? It is hard to give pointers with just this information.

 

[Nintz]

dynamic map (one that changes over time)

religion overhaul

DNA system changes

new systems aimed at the setting of the game and its post-apocolyptic nature

some general balancing


... a little bit of everything really.

 

[ticattack]

If you want to get this done, you probably need something a little more specific than "a little bit of everything". Beyond "it has Sioux and Rusodanwegians", how will your mod differ from vanilla? Are you intending there to be a serious backstory, or is it just handwaved with "there was a flood, now things are different"? With Japanese being washed either across Eurasia or around India, I guess the latter, but there's a consideration to be made.

Here's a few thoughts (my modding knowledge with CK2 is limited, so there may be some wonky reasoning):

- In 1066, each province is an independent county, with the remnants of the previous locals there. Most would be local dynasties - the "of X" dynasties, perhaps? Some major families remain, though severely reduced.
- Consider the history before the game starts. From where did the flood come? Were higher places less affected, or did it swamp everything? Were the mountains and the like contested? Did the Capets flee to the Swiss Alps and try and oust the locals there?
- Every province begins with a "diluvial" ("of or pertaining to a flood/the Flood") modifier. This reduces levy size, tax income and tech growth. This comes in stages - Diluvial I offers mild penalties, while Diluvial V makes the province next to worthless. As the game progresses, these traits fade, eventually returning to normal levels. Possibly, smaller floods could reoccur throughout the game, shattering the stability of Europe as powerful dynasties are washed away.
To my mind, if you're throwing in such an epic devastation, it should convey the force of nature. You're talking about something at least as potent as the plague, possibly more - it could conceivably destroy civilisation, even the human race as a whole. If the RNG decides so, it should be able to tear Europe apart every other generation.

These two points will allow for very different outcomes. One game could see the Capets return to power through luck and skill, while another sees them crushed by the mighty de Bordeaux dynasty under Hugh de Bordeaux, King of Nuestria, King of the Bretons in 1093, only for Hugh's son to see his realm flooded and then invaded by an alliance of Irish dukes who've stayed nice and dry.

- Throughout the game, migrations of foreigners will arrive. These could be small (maybe a single coastal province changes culture), or large and violent (as with hordes). You could have cultural/religious minority modifiers, if you wished, so a province could be English or Arabic, but have a sizable <whatever> population, which feeds events as the involuntary neighbours clash and intermingle.
- Areas that lose their negative modifiers may face events where surviving peasants in neighbouring provinces seek to relocate. It may also be possible to create a CB or plot where the lords of flooded areas seek to invade or sieze control of their drier neighbours.

Enough rambling, on to your raised points:
dynamic map (one that changes over time)
AFAIK, dynamic maps, as in "terrain or de jure empires/kingdoms/duchies change over time" are not possible. I would leave them as is, but perhaps create a few new titular titles with different requirements.

religion overhaul
Overhaul, or just new religions?

DNA system changes
To what end? How?

new systems aimed at the setting of the game and its post-apocolyptic nature
You need more details.

some general balancing
Balancing is good.


Have a ponder, work out exactly what you want to do. You'll find it easier than just slapping some new cultures in a text file and adding to it as you go.

 

[Nintz]

@ticattack

Thank you for the feedback. First time I've tried something like this, so it will be a bit rocky.

Now, I will respond to your different points.

1. In 1066, each county is independant and some some remnants of their old heritage. I would say no to the heritage part, as everyone has gone to everywhere and then some. But yes, each county would start independent.

2. Did the flood reach mountains and such? Yes, but only for a short time. Thusly, everybody had to flee at some point. Perhaps mountainous regions could be less affected though.

3. On the flood-related modifiers. I love that idea. If I can make this mod, will definetly use this idea.

4. On migrations of foreigners. Well, this was part of my original dynamic map idea. I had intended new cultures and religions to show up as the waters receeded. As it stands, I don't think that's possible. However, foreign minorities are quite possible. I see no reason why that wouldn't work.

5. On events and plots related to the flood. Hmm, I hadn't thought of that. It could certainly be possible. Perhaps the peasents of a province could rise up if they were a cultural and/or religious minority after losing the flood effects. They would be less concernced with life and death by that point.

6. On the dynamic map. Dang. It's not really necessary, but it would be cool to have Europe's water levels rise and/or fall over time.

7. On religion overhaul. Both. While some of the new cultures would bring foreign religions, I also think religion should be worked a lot differently considering the circumstances. I doubt the Pope would be that important a figure if people went 100 years without land.

8. DNA System changes A minor point, I realized that by introducing some Asian and American Indian cultures, the current DNA system wasn't quite right. Aside from needing the features for those ethnicities, I would like to have a system that can more easily blend cultures. For example, in CK2 at this time, someone is either Western (white) or Eastern (Middle-Eastern/African) It seems a little odd that a child can't be a combination of said cultures.

9. Post-Apocylyptic Systems I am not 100% sure, to be perfectly honest. I just know that if the world flooded, things would work a bit differently. There might be a primitive UN type of organization to help society resume. There could be some sort of mercenary organization that holds an exclusive due to the limited manpower. Might be something in that idea. Still, I am open to suggestions.

Edit:

10. On backstory. My current idea is this: At 1066, people are lost. They do believe it was a hand waved, world drowned thing. However, it wasn't. A super-advanced civilization (Atlantis) was secretly living under the waves for years. They continued to advance as a nation, but made a mistake. While experimenting with demolition charges in the Atlantic, they shattered the fragile balance of currents the oceans were living in. Old terrain features were blown up, and new ones were created. This was possible due to the super-advanced nature of the civilization. The result was a 50-100 year flood as nature worked to correct the harm done. These experiments also broke down the mysterious defenses of Atlantis itself. The people either drowned, or maybe some fled to the surface. However, the Atlanteans were far too few to survive this catastrophe as a people. They wouldn't re-form as a nation if any did live.

 

[Sleight of Hand]

British (The British culture is an odd mix of Welsh, Saxon, Iroquois Indian, and Egyptian. This unlikely combination found themselves trapped together sometime during the flood.)

:rofl:

 

[Nintz]

British (The British culture is an odd mix of Welsh, Saxon, Iroquois Indian, and Egyptian. This unlikely combination found themselves trapped together sometime during the flood.)

:rofl:

Yep. Can't have everythnig be all doom and gloom, can we?

 

[Sleight of Hand]

I genuinely admire your originality.

 

[DCyDe]

dynamic map (one that changes over time)

religion overhaul

DNA system changes

new systems aimed at the setting of the game and its post-apocolyptic nature

some general balancing


... a little bit of everything really.

Altering the map after the game is loaded is impossible, you cant even change de jure countrys after the game is loaded.

 

[Nintz]

Altering the map after the game is loaded is impossible, you cant even change de jure countrys after the game is loaded.

Yeah, I realized as much. Luckily, the current map (or one very similar) should work fine for this mod, so that's not an issue.

 

[ticattack]

A couple of quick points:

1. In 1066, each county is independant and some some remnants of their old heritage. I would say no to the heritage part, as everyone has gone to everywhere and then some. But yes, each county would start independent.

You'll need to assign cultures to provinces. That in itself is a sort of heritage. Are the saxons still in England? Are the franks still in central France? If not, where are they? Who's there instead? You can just throw some dice and assign cultures randomly but, personally, I'd work out what happened in the years and months leading up to and directly after the flood. Maybe there's a general "pull" towards mountains and away from the coast, for example. So, the franks reach a little closer to the Alps, as they tried to make their way to safety. The bretons and normans reach a little further east and south, respectively, for the same reason.

4. On migrations of foreigners. Well, this was part of my original dynamic map idea. I had intended new cultures and religions to show up as the waters receeded. As it stands, I don't think that's possible. However, foreign minorities are quite possible. I see no reason why that wouldn't work.

Pretty sure you can still have new cultures and religions show up - the mongols do, don't they? Just have an event tied to the flooding level of a certain region and the year. If the waters in Leon have receded enough, then Leon might face an invasion of <new culture>. This would also let you bring in some more titles - the leader of this invasion holds the king-leve title "King/High Chief/whatever of the <culture>". Kind of like how there was a King of the Romans or Germans or whatever.

8. DNA System changes A minor point, I realized that by introducing some Asian and American Indian cultures, the current DNA system wasn't quite right. Aside from needing the features for those ethnicities, I would like to have a system that can more easily blend cultures. For example, in CK2 at this time, someone is either Western (white) or Eastern (Middle-Eastern/African) It seems a little odd that a child can't be a combination of said cultures.

Needing the features requires an artist. Unless you're able to do them yourself, I'd use the existing three as placeholders until you're able to get something proper. Once you've got a mod to a playable state, someone might be more enthused to get all artsy for you.

I think the Mongol DLC might serve as a decent replacement for East Asians. Not perfect, but hey, if Ethiopians can look like Turks....


Also, historical issue that just ocurred to me - IIRC, the Aztecs appeared in the early fifteenth century and I think they were more of a politcal than cultural term. As a culture, you probably want nahuatl. If anyone's more knowledgable on the subject, feel free to contradict me.

 

[Nintz]

A couple of quick points:


You'll need to assign cultures to provinces. That in itself is a sort of heritage. Are the saxons still in England? Are the franks still in central France? If not, where are they? Who's there instead? You can just throw some dice and assign cultures randomly but, personally, I'd work out what happened in the years and months leading up to and directly after the flood. Maybe there's a general "pull" towards mountains and away from the coast, for example. So, the franks reach a little closer to the Alps, as they tried to make their way to safety. The bretons and normans reach a little further east and south, respectively, for the same reason.

I suppose that's true. I was planning on having each province have cultures, just not the ones they had before. If you look at my original post, I edited some ideas for civilizations near the mountains. Still, I don't plan on having people in the same place on the whole. This flood ripped the very fabric of society.

Pretty sure you can still have new cultures and religions show up - the mongols do, don't they? Just have an event tied to the flooding level of a certain region and the year. If the waters in Leon have receded enough, then Leon might face an invasion of <new culture>. This would also let you bring in some more titles - the leader of this invasion holds the king-leve title "King/High Chief/whatever of the <culture>". Kind of like how there was a King of the Romans or Germans or whatever.

Interesting...

Perhaps I could implement a culture that was basically "neutral". Religion too. Then when the land begins to emerge... new civilization pops up and takes over. I'll have to look into it, but it shows promise.

Needing the features requires an artist. Unless you're able to do them yourself, I'd use the existing three as placeholders until you're able to get something proper. Once you've got a mod to a playable state, someone might be more enthused to get all artsy for you.

I think the Mongol DLC might serve as a decent replacement for East Asians. Not perfect, but hey, if Ethiopians can look like Turks....

I should point out I don't plan on requiring DLC. Unless of course, it is absolutely, positively neccessary. Otherwise, I was planning on using the current system.

Also, historical issue that just ocurred to me - IIRC, the Aztecs appeared in the early fifteenth century and I think they were more of a politcal than cultural term. As a culture, you probably want nahuatl. If anyone's more knowledgable on the subject, feel free to contradict me.

Well, as far as I know, the Aztec people called themselves the "Mexica". This referred to their people as a whole. Political as well as cultural. Aztec, or Azteca, is the European form of the name. If you could give me a link to something, that would be appreciated.

 

[ticattack]

I suppose that's true. I was planning on having each province have cultures, just not the ones they had before. If you look at my original post, I edited some ideas for civilizations near the mountains. Still, I don't plan on having people in the same place on the whole. This flood ripped the very fabric of society.

Alright, just went back and re-read. There's some... interesting changes. That's probably just personal preference. In the whole "simulationist/narrativist/gamist" setup, I fall pretty heavily into the simulationist category. For example, I'm curious how Occitans (Occitan? Occitanians? Occitanii?) ended up in the Carpathians in sufficient quantities to remain Occitan, while the Persians ended up in the Alps - but, as I say, that's just personal preference on my part, go with what you want.

Perhaps I could implement a culture that was basically "neutral". Religion too. Then when the land begins to emerge... new civilization pops up and takes over. I'll have to look into it, but it shows promise.

Perhaps you could make a "refugee" (for lack of a better name) culture group and culture, representing the many smaller bands of survivors trying to settle into new lands with new neighbours. Individuals would not be given this culture, of course, only provinces. From there, standard cultures could emerge. You can perform a check based on the culture of a neighbouring province. Provinces with the refugee culture would eventually adopt the culture of their lord, or of a neighbouring province - if there are Persians in the Alps, then Northern Italy, beginning with "refugee" culture, would be more likely to become Persian. This would, in theory, lead to regions of contiguous culture, and less of a patchwork going on.

Even better, have a check when this happens. If it's the first time this culture has reemerged, have the province marked as a sort of new homeland for that culture, with prestige modifiers for holding it if you are of that culture.

I should point out I don't plan on requiring DLC. Unless of course, it is absolutely, positively neccessary. Otherwise, I was planning on using the current system.

Shouldn't be necessary - if you did go that way, I believe you can set fallbacks, as was done with the mongols. I understand that, if you don't have the DLC, they share the graphics with arabs or turks?

Well, as far as I know, the Aztec people called themselves the "Mexica". This referred to their people as a whole. Political as well as cultural. Aztec, or Azteca, is the European form of the name. If you could give me a link to something, that would be appreciated.

Don't have a specific link, was mainly pulling from memory. Wikipedia (yay for lazy research!) says that the Mexica were a Nahua people, who spoke the language Nahuatl - so I was a little off there. Meh. It doesn't really matter. Forgive the unfounded pendatry on my part.