• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
THI SSW v1.5: BTML/Modtek compatible
Ok. Fine. THI SSW is now BTML/ Modtek compatible as of v1.5

Also, because the changes were so trivial, I've included the following changes:

1. Updated shops in Campaign/ Career to sell some basic stuff. Specifically, some more common Mechs, Mechparts, HMG, LMG and Rocket Launchers. Other stuff like Artemis, MRMs, H/L PPCs are not available in shops.

upload_2018-12-25_16-56-39.png


2. The old problem of AmmoDef unloading itself is still in place, so I included a ApplicationConstants to have the necessary settings.

Ok, stop poking me about BTML/ ModTek already.
 
@Lynx7725 thanks for the answer, but if I understand this correct, adding your mod does not requiere modtek and btml? that is awesome.
Right now you have options -- v1.4 doesn't require BTML and Modtek, just some work with a text editor, and if you want things in Career, a DB/ SQL editor.

v1.5 is pretty much the same content, but is for BTML/ Modtek.
 
Mod v 1.6 for Btech v1.8 update
Oh good grief. It's been a year?

So, for all the disinterested people out there, an update...

Is this mod still alive? What the heck happened?

Short answer: Yeah kind of. Expect a release (v1.6) for Btech v1.8 in a relatively short time frame.

Long answer: Hobbes poked me about it and with Heavy Metal coming out I got curious enough to dig around. I fell off the Btech train just before Urban Warfare due to family medical issues and so I'm not as current as I liked.

Coming back at this time with mods supported is an interesting time. The short form of it is, my mod still loads and works (mostly) under v1.8, and I was able to quickly adapt the stuff to go into the new Modloader standard.

Unfortunately, that's where things ran off the rails. The Modloader works... but that's not the only thing that HBS changed. One of the changes was ammo category enumeration, and combined with a sequencing error I made in the mod.json, gave me no end of grief. The net effect of the enumeration is that you can't declare new ammunition -- that's the ammo, not the ammo box. Had ammo enumeration been opened up for mod work from the Modloader, it won't be a problem, but currently it isn't; the Factions was the first, the rest based on HBS pirority. Ammo enumeration is the correct way to go IMO, so it's a matter of Patience.

The issue sort of starts with the ammo boxes. We can declare new ammo boxes, but HBS changed a bit of the old behaviour, so there are some constraints now. previously, you can declare an ammo box of say, missile, but the internal ammo category could be say, AC. The system doesn't care about the internal ammo category, it'd just take the ammo box and feed your weapon.

Now, the combat system still doesn't care, but because the enumeration shifted some behaviour, the Mechlab UI suddenly cares. If you had done the above (AC ammo hiding inside a missile box), the Mechlab now peeks into the ammo box and puts the ammo box not in the missile category, but in the ballistic category.

Why is this important? Because if your mech doesn't have a ballistic hardpoint, the mechlab UI automatically blocks any attempt so use that ammo box, so now you can't load ammo for your weapon. Bummer.

So now your new missile weapon have to use a pre-existing missile ammo. You have to start worrying about ammo sharing. If you put MRMs on the same ammo category as SRMs, you may end up sharing ammo between SRMs and MRMs, which can lead to quite offensive mechs. If you stupidly put "NotSet" on say, an UAC, then you end up with an infinite ammo UAC. Some of you might actually like these changes, but we sort of have to strike a balance somewhere... I hear the AI Mechwarriors are unionizing.

So that leads to a lot of weapon tinkering, and that gets weird too. In order to avoid having AMS ammo lookups, I changed my Rocket Launchers to Flamer ammo, and that lead to a fun "out of ammo" audio because the enumeration now have those in settings. Rocket Launchers are Flamers now, ho ya. Actually, I ended up putting them as SRM Infernos, because that ammo has a new parameter to only use internal ammo (i.e., don't use bins... I think).

So yeah. Somewhat problematic, especially if you have a long history of new weapons that has been tuned. You now potentially have to go back and redo a lot of parameters and do retuning again, and that might not last very long, depending on when HBS will introduce Ammo Category Enumeration by Mod.Json.

(Obi-wan HBS_Ecks, you are our only hope.)

Yeah yeah, so what can we expect?

Short-ish answer: There will be a v1.6 rollout for my mod(s). This is primarily to keep things updated and users to have continuity in their saves. This is not intended to be a full blown update, just a technical bridge.

v1.6 will:
  • Use the new Modloader technique.
  • Ensure compatibility for Career and Campagin games.
    • This is still to be tested, as I am now focussed on Skirmish to test out the bugs there.
  • Ensure the new weapons are updated to work in the new environment.
    • Currently I think all the weapons work -- and I've upgraded the LBX. I'd need to do more testing on those.
    • Equipment I didn't test. They should still work.
  • My Warhammer and Marauder are still FrakenMechs.

Following on:

v1.7+ will:
  • Update Warhammer and Marauder to use HBS assets. I still need to maintain these mech jsons for continuity.
  • Probably revise and update EW once I get to grips with the EW equipment from Urban Warfare. I won't replace my equipment, but probably update them with new capabilities that HBS introduced.
  • Reach a decision how to handle DLC mechs. I probably will have to spin off a "Reseen and Retired" package to update all of these mechs for DLC holders, so that existing users of the mod can apply those and still have continuity in their save files.
  • Maybe introduce more off-beat mech designs to replace DLC mechs. I would try to keep this mod at around 100 mechs, due to performance reasons.
Lastly, just to share...

My perspective of this mod is really an entry-level, simplistic (and in some sense safer) mod for users who aren't so keen to start with more complex mods. Think of it as a gateway drug. :D
 
*gives a lusty cheer*

We're all waiting for HBS to un-bork their mod loader.

And so you figured out some time back that you could mod the heat sink entry in the chassisdef file to reflect internal heatsinks including double heat sinks.

Darn I say DARN! And here I though all along that I was the one who spotted that. I had never taken a look at your mod, but Hobbes brought it to my attention indirectly just recently and I know the name Tetsuhara from battletech and wolf dragoon lore. Be shock to run into the "Iron man" out here, though it wouldn't overly surprise me as during the period of this game the Dragoons are contracted to house Kurita. Someone should write a mission where he comes out to collect Natasha Kerensky and the Black Widows for being in potential violation of the standard exclusivity clauses of their contract with the Draconis Combine. All types of potential hooks for missions when names wander out to the Pheripery.... oh yes, yes there are.

I'm just a baby modder.. the "Sandman" is mine.. which I just updated to use HBS only assets (it only looks like a Rifleman). Well looking forward to what you do, looking forward to running it with Hobbes "Hyades Rim" mod once HBS fixes the mod loader thing so it doesn't hose flash points when you run mods.
 
And so you figured out some time back that you could mod the heat sink entry in the chassisdef file to reflect internal heatsinks including double heat sinks.
I remember noticing that variable long ago, but it didn't do anything when we tested it... have you actually been able to verify that the number there makes a difference now?

If so, I wonder when it changed...
 
I remember noticing that variable long ago, but it didn't do anything when we tested it... have you actually been able to verify that the number there makes a difference now?

If so, I wonder when it changed...
I believe TLRoff was referring to the use of hidden heat sinks and reverse heat sinks to adjust engine heat sinks to book values. This had been done in my mod from early on, first in the mechdef, then later when fixed equipment became available, shifted to chassisdef.

The param you are thinking about, I don't think has changed (or any usage for that).
 
Here's some fun stuff as I was testing.

upload_2019-11-26_22-51-5.png


It's always a pleasure to see good work. On the left is a WHM-6R, the right a WHM-6K. The difference can be seen by the MGs in the torso. Unfortunately, the 6R suffers from a terminal case of CT Ammo. With the elevated ammo crit in CT, this particular 6R blew up really nicely, really quickly. The 6K proved a lot more resilient.

So resilient, the Marauder lance I was using had to obliterate it:
upload_2019-11-26_22-52-9.png


Speaking of the Marauder lance, let's play Spot the Variant! Each is a separate variant.

upload_2019-11-26_22-53-47.png
 

Attachments

  • upload_2019-11-26_22-53-23.png
    upload_2019-11-26_22-53-23.png
    1,9 MB · Views: 5
Onward and forward!

Testing tonight.
  • Tested:
    • UAC updated to new UAC effect; weapon params are still mine and THI UAC is noticeably bulkier (book value) but runs cooler and less recoil than HBS version.
    • RL tested with using Inferno ammo and the overall result is better.
    • MRM updated to use LRM ammo category. Yes, there will be ammo sharing issues, but it's not common for LRM and MRM to be on the same chassis.
    • LBX was updated previously to new LBX effect. Again, weapon params are mine, just utilizing new effects.
    • Light Gauss/ Gauss has been tested.
    • 1/2 ton MG ammo has been tested.
  • Didn't test:
    • Energy weapons - they have very little effects and no ammo, so quite safe.
    • Artemis launchers - they are stock LRM/ SRM launchers with special effects, should be safe.
    • HMG/ LMG - basic param change from normal MG.
    • Upgrade/ gear - these are largely effects and shouldn't have been affected, but I'd do a run through them as part of the re-familiarization and adaption to Urban Warfare.
Critically, I cleaned up and reworked the mod.json to test for compatibility with Campaign and Career saves, and these two screencaps are critical:

upload_2019-11-26_23-29-32.png

This Marauder.. well actually I don't even remember capturing a Marauder in my Career game. But apparently I did! Still, this image is very important because prior to 1.8 I was using an Orion as a shell for the Marauder. So this proves that the mod Marauder Defs are found in the DB and they are correctly applying the updated assets.

upload_2019-11-26_23-29-42.png


This Archer from the mod further proves that it is not a fluke (as I do have Heavy Metal and if there was some fluke it would have loaded the new Archer assets). So it looks like the Modloader do appears to be loading my stuff correctly into the DB and making it available to the saves.

I'd need to do additional testing (especially to undertake a combat mission, for completeness of testing) but signs are good. Unfortunately, that Crusader you see in my mechbay? It proved that the old LOD in Career/ Campaign mechbay issue with my mod still persists, so I'd need to do a writeup on that in my README in the mod.

Thus, currently v1.6 will:
  • Use the new Modloader technique.
  • Have compatibility for Career and Campagin games.
  • Ensure the new weapons are updated to work in the new environment.
    • Equipment should still work but beware of issues.
  • My Warhammer and Marauder are upgraded to use new HBS assets.
 
Last edited:
I believe TLRoff was referring to the use of hidden heat sinks and reverse heat sinks to adjust engine heat sinks to book values. This had been done in my mod from early on, first in the mechdef, then later when fixed equipment became available, shifted to chassisdef.

The param you are thinking about, I don't think has changed (or any usage for that).

I use it in my Sandman over on Nexus. It defiantly works.

Sandman has a 330 XL engine.. that would give it 13 internal heat sinks in game.. 39 cooling for standard heat sinks, or 78 cooling with doubles. In the chassisdef file for the sandman 1A,1B and 1X the "heatsinks" entry is incremented to 48. The base 30 cooling is automatic, the heat sink entry is for additional cooling above and beyond 30.

So 78-30=48 and that what the entry reads.. it works and it is simple. You want proof, go download my Sandman pack and take it for a spin.
 
You want proof, go download my Sandman pack and take it for a spin.
It makes sense that they would enable it eventually as prep work for more advanced mechs... it's just that Lynx and I were both around when it wasn't working and didn't really expect it to get turned on until one of the mechs in the unmodded game needed to use it.

I'm glad someone that didn't know it wasn't working came along and gave it a try!
 
I use it in my Sandman over on Nexus. It defiantly works.

So 78-30=48 and that what the entry reads.. it works and it is simple.
Worth relooking at it at some point. However as described it only solves one half of the problem, specifically when the engine is big and can take additional heat sinks. It's the other side of the equation that it doesn't solve, unless the parameter can take negative values; and in both cases, the issue of tonnage isn't quite addressed, and have to be tinkered with via the base tonnage parameter.
 
I haven't tried negative values.. I'm afraid I'll see a mushroom cloud where my comp used to be. Give it a go.. a stinger or wasp with it's itty bitty 120 engine is only going to pack 6 HS internal and 4 in the chassis so value would be set to -12, and you going to need a zero mass heat sink.. call em free heat sinks and make them fixed equipment, and blacklisted. Absolutly not a thing that would ever appear on a loot table.

those not familiar following.. TT rule say take engine rating divide by 25, round to nearest whole number and this is the number of heat sinks internal to the engine core.. Heat sinks beyond this need to be mounted like any other equipment, but do not take up mass. Internal to the engine heat sinks over 10 however must have the additional heat sink mass accounted for. There for a 330 engine would have engine wight plus mass for 3 heat sinks over the 10 that are no mass. TT Rules are little bit stricter on construction rules, and I really wish Mitch and Co. had simply stay'd with them.

Wich would have ment they could have implemented a full on battletech mech construction app internal to the game.. Guess they were in a rush.. Not like it hadn't been done before... All the Mechwarrior games have had it.
 
From comments made, I suspect that the heat sinks in the engine were set to a constant ten not because they were in a hurry but because they wanted to keep things simple and easy to understand for new players. Really, the way the rules work in TT add a lot more complication than they add realism or fun. Though of course judging realism and fun strays into massive YMMV territory.
 
Realism.. ok, hold on here.. we're talking multi ton anthropomorphic machines that walk on legs and mount weapons systems that are outranged by most all current real world systems.... Battletech has never been realistic.. how ever the folks writing rules for it all these years have tried real hard to keep it internally consistent.
 
Was a bit rushed for time but managed to get a bit of testing in for my mod.

Career wise the mod loads and I was able to get into a contract. From there, the combat system in career could load, and select from my mechs to act as OpFor.

My Mod Marauder, Mod Archer, HM Phoenix (from the crate) and Mod Dervish went up against 3 Locust-M, a Firestarter, 1 Mod Whitworth, 2 Javelins and a Mod SP Hunchback. Yes, even a 3M Marauder runs too darn hot and the Firestarter managed to shut me down (but failed to follow up... team physically beat the crap out of that mech).

Anyhow. That means Career (and by extension Campaign likely) loads fine, which means I can release my updated mod. In time for Thanksgiving!

Right after I write the README. (sigh)
 
THI SSW v1.6: HBS Modloader compatible
Tetsuhara Heavy Industries is happy to announce that the THI-SSW mod is updated to v1.6!

Usual spot to look is Nexus Mod.

This is primarily a technical bridge to bring the mod inline with Battletech v1.8. The mod has moved onto HBS's Modloader framework and because I am now using some resources only from Battletech v1.8, it is now a pre-requsite to be on Battletech v1.8. As an side-effect, the Mechs and equipment are now defaulted into the Campaign and Career game.

With the movement onto Modloader, it is now significantly easier for normal users to access the mod content, and as this mod is not particularly ambitious, the content is fairly safe for less technically inclined users to use.

No DLC is required. However, I would be working to use some of the DLC resources in another mod, for those people who have those DLC.
 
Eh sod. I just realised an error crept back in.

Remember this particular bug? https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...scussion-thread.1091249/page-17#post-25028994

Yeah somehow it crept back into the files. I'd have to resanitize and re-release, just to be on the safe side.

EDIT: I also have to review through my mech files, because I might have created some unintended dependencies on DLC, particularly for Flashpoint mechs (Crab, Cyclops, Hatchie). Will work on a release that's "clean".
 
Last edited:
Today, at work, I spent a good deal of time going through the MUL... my boss is going to have words with me on that one.

Anyway, for THI-SSW 1.7+, I want to include more Mechs, hence the trawling in MUL. So far, here is the shortlist for newish mechs I want to include.
  • Assassin (SB variant)
  • Wyvern
  • Chameleon
  • Merlin
  • Exterminator (4A version)
  • Striker
  • Longbow (7Q version)
  • Banshee (3S version)
The criteria is period-appropriate, tech appropriate. For most parts these are listed as Intro tech, so they should fit well into the 3024 timeline. However, these would require me to go back and mess with assets again, so development time will be longer. Well, at least with the Banshee and Longbow, I would have existing DEFs to work off.

In addition, the following are also on the shortlist, 'cept they are there primarily for the Lostech edge. Their rarity should be elevated.
  • Thorn (N version)
  • Exterminator (4D version)
  • Thug (11E version)
  • Crockett
  • Highlander 732
  • Nightstar
These will all be available in Skirmish, as I'd want to include these for the variety. But I will be (hopefully) setting things up such that they don't show up in the Career shops (at least not that often). Similarly, I have taken a first pass with my existing, and the following would be adjusted for Career:
  • Period inappropriate:
    • Thorn (S/ T variants)
    • Mongoose (68)
    • Hussars (300 + 350)
    • Wolfhound
    • CLint (Denton variant)
    • Vindicator SIC
    • Hunchback 4SP
    • Trebbie-K
    • Grand Dragon
    • Rifleman 3C
    • Cataphract 2X
    • Charger 1A9
    • Hatamoto Chi
    • Zeus-6T
    • Battlemaster 1S
    • Daboku
  • Partial period/ tech issues:
    • Raven 1X
    • Charger 1A5
    • Zeus 5S/ T
I'm not sure how I'm going to do it at the moment, but I'd definitely make these available for the Skirmish. It's just that in Career/ Campaign, I rather not have a Mauler running around the Periphery in 3024 when it's a prototype in 3038....

Aside from this, 1.7 will need to have a correct pass of all Names in Defs to avoid the AI Lobotomy problem, and I would be working on a DLC friendly mod to update my Flea, Javelin, Ravens, Assassins, Vulcans, PXHs, Crabs, Riflemans, Archers, Cyclops and Annihilators to DLC assets. At the current moment, planning is such that this THI-DLC mod will depend on THI-SSW, but overwrite any existing Defs so as to take advantage of the new assets.

One concern currently is the performance impact having so many mechs would have. Previously I had more mechs that current, but performance issue in loading was the primary reason why things were scaled back. For that one, I'd need to do a bit of testing to see how things work out.
 
Turns out refitting the Mechs with DLC assets turned out a bit stupid easy once I get into things:

upload_2019-12-3_1-50-48.png


That's a Rifleman-4D, with 2 PPCs and 2 Large Lasers, so very definitely not part of the HM DLC, but still using the assets. It does throw out an incredible alpha strike, but it's also incredibly HOT.

So all the mechs that I have that can use DLC assets had been converted. For efficiency I would next try to unload the files I no longer need from the manifest, to free up resources. But basically done, just need to QA and test. Raven and PXH definitely works, but I need to go do a pass with each of the 19 Mechs affected.