Origins dlc installed and restoration of union cb causing massive AE intended?

[Ort]

Hi, I'm playing my first run post-patch with the new dlc as Austria.

I declared on bohemia with the restoration of union CB which I gained by completing the "secure electors" mission.

However, I noticed that taking bohemia under the union causes a few dozens of nations to join coalition against me.

I recall that this was not the case pre-patch and restoration of union CB had fixed warscore of 60 and significantly lower AE.

Is this burst in AE intended or is there something I'm failing to understand?

Thanks in advance for any answers.

 

[Xary Moft]

So it was a "bug" before, and now PU's for some reason grant more AE than to vassal or annexing land is intended? Nah I dont buy that.

I do agree that PU's should in theory give more AE (like France PU giving a ton of AE, it's really big country) but when It's time to PU a 3 province minor I get 73 AE but if I vassal it I only get 48 AE... It's so weird. Considering you have way more direct control over vassals (and they are generally better). There seems to be a bug or a typo for PU cb's, since they always give a ton of AE almost if they have a base AE. And doesn't matter what you do (like releasing countries) you still get the same AE value for the PU. If it isn't a bug idk what is.

 

[nukemind2012]

I believe I saw next week.

After Leviathan this was the first DLC I didn’t buy on launch day. Was really looking forward to a chill Austria run if it came out well with the two +IA monuments. Guess I’ll wait til the hotfix. That’s not terrible but… once again I’m surprised game breaking bugs (IE Austria which is a container on the Ottomans, development which is necessary for tech) make it into live.

 

[Ixal]

I do agree that PU's should in theory give more AE (like France PU giving a ton of AE, it's really big country) but when It's time to PU a 3 province minor I get 73 AE but if I vassal it I only get 48 AE... It's so weird. Considering you have way more direct control over vassals (and they are generally better). There seems to be a bug or a typo for PU cb's, since they always give a ton of AE almost if they have a base AE. And doesn't matter what you do (like releasing countries) you still get the same AE value for the PU. If it isn't a bug idk what is.

By lore it makes sense that a PU would give more AE than vassalization. When you make a vassal you leave the other ruler in place and just make him listen to you. That doesn't violate the order of things as far as nobility is concerned.
With a PU you are deposing someone with a divine right to rule.

But in game terms vassals are better than PUs in many waysand often easier to achieve. As you said it makes no sense that a PU gives more AE in the game.

 

[Zemurin]

While it is working as designed, the many mission trees in Europe were designed around the fact that you did NOT get so much AE in the first place.
We will address this issue for the hotfix

Mistake is here:

0.8 instead of 0.08. This means it's 8 times increase instead 20% reduction.

 

[Johan]

It is technically WAD, but it seems not too popular.

We'll be adjusting the numbers down dramatically in the first hotfix.

 

[MirageHarbinger]

I am suspecting the devs dont get paid for playing their game during work hours. Otherwise spending two or three days playing will easily spot these bugs.

 

[Arthenean]

At a higher level, I think if possible there needs to be an ethos of not changing historic paid content, unless it is materially imbalanced / damaging to the broader game such as Concentrate Development / Tribal Development mechanics from Leviathan. Changing historic content, in particular paid content, can have materially adverse impacts on game balance / enjoyment of the game for the customer base, which unless there is a specific balance need for, should be a last resort given age of the game.

 

[Jespoke]

Mistake is here:
View attachment 772524

0.8 instead of 0.08. This means it's 8 times increase instead 20% reduction.

There are 2 things in these screenshots:
- Form PU doesn't just cause the same AE as conquering the provinces now, IT CAUSES 33% MORE.
- The next line down, they forgot/decided against reducing the AE from vassalizing

 

[Zemurin]

There are 2 things in these screenshots:
- Form PU doesn't just cause the same AE as conquering the provinces now, IT CAUSES 33% MORE.
- The next line down, they forgot/decided against reducing the AE from vassalizing

Correct. Also correct.

 

[Elrawien]

Mistake is here:
View attachment 772524

0.8 instead of 0.08. This means it's 8 times increase instead 20% reduction.

So demand province has an AE modifier of 0.6 whereas PU has an AE modifier of 0.8? How is PU causing more AE than outright conquest WAD @Johan ? How does that make sense?

To those who rushes to defend PDX, at least do some research before activating fan boy mode.

Edit: Disagree all you want, facts are facts. Before the patch, the PU ae modifier WAS 0.8. Drastically reducing it to 0.2 one week later just shows how ridiculous it was before. It was so ridiculous, if it was WAD, then whoever made the change is grossly incompetent; if it was a bug/mistake, the dev team either did not bother to take a second look or outright lied and tried to cover up the sever lack of testing.

 

[EarlKonrad]

Looks like the public are still doing the playtesting then.
But don't forget, we're only supposed to be playing in Africa now. The far East other than that.

But look at all the new 52 shinny new Monuments! Ok, apparently one of them is bugged and isn't working. But look at all the new 51 shinny new monuments!

 

[EarlKonrad]

I am suspecting the devs dont get paid for playing their game during work hours. Otherwise spending two or three days playing will easily spot these bugs.

For a while now (at least since 1.29) Devs talk about how stuff they change change how the game is played by showing us results from games that they let run overnight. We even got a bunch of examples like these in the last DD.

With each new DD I'm more convinced that no one at PDX is playing EU 4 and that all is automated.

 

[Eolath]

It is technically WAD, but it seems not too popular.

We'll be adjusting the numbers down dramatically in the first hotfix.

I honestly cannot imagine it is WAD that the PU CB gives more AE than demanding full annexation.. even if you take realism into account.

Many of the other CBs got their AE reduced by 20%, while the AE impact from the PU CB has instead increased by 800%. The CB is only one part of the AE equation so this doesn't mean 8x the AE, but it's about 4x as much...

Just a quick test, opened the game up as Bologna and gave myself a force union CB on Ferrara. Used ''add_cb cb_restore_personal_union FER" and declared, also enabled winwars.
Forcing the union gives me 51 AE with Mantua and full annexation 38 AE with Mantua. So even when Ferrara ceases to exist I get more AE with Mantua for forcing the PU.

 

[theTyke]

Looks like it will be the second expansion I am not buying

 

[Mayonass]

It is technically WAD, but it seems not too popular.

We'll be adjusting the numbers down dramatically in the first hotfix.

You say an automatic coalition of over 50 countries for using a cb given by a PAID mission is WAD? To basically make the entire cb useless as you also reduced the cost of direct annexation is WAD?

This isn't a high risk high reward mission, this is a quick reward for certain death as any coalition with over 20-30 countries is certain doom to the average EU4 player. And I get that, but it needs to be gradual, you can't just one click your way into death by a mechanic. You can so by a poor choice like declaring a day one war against Ming playing as Ryuku, but not by a mechanic. To have a mechanic that serves as nothing but a death sentence for newer inexperienced players is poor taste.

Like mistakes in coding happen we get that, but don't try to pull the wool over our eyes and say this is a design choice, cause if it is its a pretty bad one in my opinion. This is one of the reasons I didn't buy by this dlc at launch (cause I learned from Leviathan thanks for that). I can tolerate the bugs Paradox but don't try to bullshit us as that is not good pr...

 

[raphi1985]

Mistake is here:
View attachment 772524

0.8 instead of 0.08. This means it's 8 times increase instead 20% reduction.

This seems logical. The intention was to reduce AE by 20% in general. But a "0" is missing, so we got a steep AE increase just for this specific CB.

Some argue, that AE from PUing should be higher, than it originally was. I would on the other hand prefer, if developers made it a 20% decrease in line with other CBs, as we need a hotfix and not a patch rebalancing AE. Rebalancing would in my opinion need to take into account AE-impact from all the different CBs.

To me, the idea to reduce AE-impact in general, because of overall dev increase, made perfect sense in the first place.

Many people talk about Austria PUing Bohemia. I am more focused on my beloved English with their PUCB on France through surrender of Maine event and in their missions.

 

[Temper93]

Looks like it will be the second expansion I am not buying

Even a regular upgrade to 1.32 would do this unfortunately

 

[Agostinos]

It is a shame this WAD, it only shows devs are no testing the game by playing the game and/or dont have people to test the game or just ignore the feedback of testers. This change kills many nations like Bavaria or Austria. Killing Austria has massive impact on the game and gives Ottomans free reign with nobody left to defend Europe. This change needs to be reverted or tuned down massively asap.

 

[Atomcreator]

Looks like it will be the second expansion I am not buying

Same. I don't think there will be any more purchases until EU5. I just don't trust them with this any longer.
1.32 was supposed to be the fix. But still waiting for a hotfix again. Time to give up on this.

 

[Walugus Grudenburg]

It is technically WAD, but it seems not too popular.

We'll be adjusting the numbers down dramatically in the first hotfix.

It literally costs more than conquesting does! If that's WAD this game deserves better designers.