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EG:
Splitting up the British Empire after a Central Powers victory.
Allowing the "Russia first" as a choice for Germany.
Splitting up the British Empire after a Central Powers victory.
Allowing the "Russia first" as a choice for Germany.
Baltasar said:
And what exactly do they demonstrate? That you call something 'prejudicial' if you don't get your own way?
What's wrong with splitting up the British Empire after a total German victory, with the Kaiser's legions parading around London? If anything the Germans seem to be awfully nice if they let Britain keep India.
Russia first - Moltke senior and Count von Waldersee had this written up in a plan before Schlieffen changed it to France first. And the Kaiser asked that the plan be halted in a late effort to keep Britain out.
Nothing absurd here methinks.
Or perhaps the only way to satisfy you would be for Germany to cede all its colonies to Britain in the event of a total German victory, and for Kaiser Wilhelm to abdicate the throne and beg Britain for forgiveness?
Russia first - Moltke senior and Count von Waldersee had this written up in a plan before Schlieffen changed it to France first. And the Kaiser asked that the plan be halted in a late effort to keep Britain out.
Nothing absurd here methinks.
Or perhaps the only way to satisfy you would be for Germany to cede all its colonies to Britain in the event of a total German victory, and for Kaiser Wilhelm to abdicate the throne and beg Britain for forgiveness?
Would the Germans really have a need for India? I see them taking Hong Kong and Singapore to enhance their Pacific holdings.
Perhaps not, but they would certaintly have encourage independence if only to deny it to Britain. Of course they might have exclusive trade rights for a decade or so in repayment for helping them become 'independent'.Henry v. Keiper said:
Did the Germans really need the world's best fleet either? Not really - just goes to show that imperialist aims are hardly about necessity.
Allenby said:
I call it prejudical if you don't even consider it, because you don't like the idea, regardless if it may be a valid historical outcome. As ptan54 already pointed out, Germany would surely not let Britain stay as it is while her troops were parading in London. The Empire would be ripped apart much like the AH historically. India, New Zealand, Australia, Canada, South Africa. They all would become independent without a commonwealth of nations.
The simple reason would be to split up the economic entity 'british empire' and take the lead as the most important economic country in the world, may be second only to the USA if they hadn't declared war yet.
Besides; the German decision to attack Framce first was made no earlier than 1905, after the Russian defeat against Japan. Germany might well have stayed to that decision, even if it was only for to keep the British out of the war for some time. The British would have a hard time declaring war on Germany without the latter violating Belgium soil. I don't know if they actually could DoW Germany later on with any justification.
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How can you tell the Germans would break up the Empire? Do you have any documentation to back up your contention?
I can decide what is included in the mod, and what is excluded because I have put in hours and hours of effort in seeing it reach the stage where it is now. I have earned the right to be the arbiter of its fate.
Undoubtedly and inevitably, the mod's content will be a reflection, to a certain extent, of some of my opinion. What gets produced, gets produced. Take it or leave it.
I can decide what is included in the mod, and what is excluded because I have put in hours and hours of effort in seeing it reach the stage where it is now. I have earned the right to be the arbiter of its fate.
Undoubtedly and inevitably, the mod's content will be a reflection, to a certain extent, of some of my opinion. What gets produced, gets produced. Take it or leave it.
ptan54 said:
Technically a German military ideal was to counter Britain's supposedly "great" navy with one of their own by combatting them at open sea and blocking trade route. They did it much better in WWII, but I believe the idea started in the Great War.
The point of the German navy was that if it were strong enough, Britain wouldn't be willing to risk a war with Germany. Therefore Germany would have a free hand to invad... er, I mean conduct an independent foreign policy without British interference.
The Hochseeflotte wasn't really meant to do anything - just look mean and dangerous.
The Hochseeflotte wasn't really meant to do anything - just look mean and dangerous.
Allenby said:
The nearest thing in that case I know of, are the war aims announced by Bethmann-Hollweg in Sept 1914, but these ought to be obsolete as the war dragged on.
In my case, splitting up the Empire seems very logical to me, at least from a economic point of view. I'll try however to find later documentaries, but they won't be enough to satisfy you, I think, because the historical context couldn't be achieved. Germany didn't invade Britain historically and had never a real chance to do so in WWI, so I don't think I'll find something in that way.
If you'd accept the peace between the Central Powers and Russia, you'll see Russia lost large parts of her territory of which much was newly formed (officially) independent countries.
However, having German soldiers marching through London should have some inpact on the future of the British Empire. More inpact than just loosing some colonies.
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StephenT said:
That's certainly the rationale advanced by Tirpitz and described by Herweg in Luxury Fleet. To see it demolished as a credible strategy see Wolfgang Wegener, The Naval Strategy of the Great War.
Makes depressing reading for anyone who ever considered the Risk Fleet notion to have even superficial validity.
I've not read it, but I presume it's this person:Caractacus said:
and
In other words, Wegener thought that the Risk Fleet theory was flawed; but that was the strategy that the Germans were following in WW1.
Yep, that's the Wegener in question.
And yep, it was the risk theory that was the cornerstone of German naval strategy throughout WWI. Probably more properly, it was the decisive battle corollary to the risk theory that the Germans pursued throughout the war. The risk theory itself was pretty much killed off once Britain entered the war as an ally to France and Russia.
Wegener did publish some of his criticism early in the war but then (on some accounts at the direct request of Scheer) closed the book on the subject until it was all over.
And yep, it was the risk theory that was the cornerstone of German naval strategy throughout WWI. Probably more properly, it was the decisive battle corollary to the risk theory that the Germans pursued throughout the war. The risk theory itself was pretty much killed off once Britain entered the war as an ally to France and Russia.
Wegener did publish some of his criticism early in the war but then (on some accounts at the direct request of Scheer) closed the book on the subject until it was all over.
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