I wouldn't say "in favor of" - Sextus and me back the opinion that we send the Gauls and Carthage a peace offer as outlined by Sextus.
That said peace offer is likely to end up with more war is coincidental.
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I wouldn't say "in favor of" - Sextus and me back the opinion that we send the Gauls and Carthage a peace offer as outlined by Sextus.
That said peace offer is likely to end up with more war is coincidental.
I think I can agree these terms if they are altered so Gauls will give us Aquitania and they will pay us 150 denari per turn. I think we should have a port to the Oceanus Atlanticus. There is chance that we can us that province as a stepping stone to Britannia as well.
Or we should ask Carthage to give us more time to debate in this issue. This is a fair request because we suffered a defeat and we should have time to find a way to deal with it.
I have considered that we should concentrate our forces at Lugdunensis and let them attack to Narbonensis and then we should spring a trap. I think Gauls have some 20 CV of units assuming that their tribal units didn´t transform to legions. If that happened then they should have about 30 CV of units.
I will alter suggestion for our orders:
1. We need to build two new legions at Apulia and Bruttium to replace our losses. (-200)
2. We need to make sacrifice to the Gods to secure their favor.(-75)
3. We need to increase happiness in all provinces. (-300)
4. We need to reinforce legion in Narbonensis (-25).
5. We need to build fortifications at Narbonensis. (-200)
6. We should send a spy in Central Gaul.(-25)
Costs will be 825 denari.
Consul Gaius Draconius
Carthage might refuse the annexation of Aquitania, as well - though if we say we'll have 150 denarii as tribute, and not a % of their income, it won't sound so bad because it means that any benefits from future ports and mines will go into the Gauls' hands.
Whatever, I'd bet that the Gauls would refuse any of these proposals. The main reason of such a deal is to appear conciliatory to other powers, and to an extent to our people, and not look like warmongering savages - our NAP with Carthage runs for one year and half, after which they might be free to act openly against us if we refuse any offer except complete surrender.
We could also argue that we just want to get these provinces so that we can build a canal between Adriatic Sea and the Ocean, but I don't think many people would buy it...
I've also been pondering the wisdom of luring their army into our own province and attack them while they're sieging its cities.
(But I have no idea to which extent it's a winning strategy in this game or if I just played too much EU3
)
Whatever, I'd bet that the Gauls would refuse any of these proposals. The main reason of such a deal is to appear conciliatory to other powers, and to an extent to our people, and not look like warmongering savages - our NAP with Carthage runs for one year and half, after which they might be free to act openly against us if we refuse any offer except complete surrender.
We could also argue that we just want to get these provinces so that we can build a canal between Adriatic Sea and the Ocean, but I don't think many people would buy it...
I've also been pondering the wisdom of luring their army into our own province and attack them while they're sieging its cities.
(But I have no idea to which extent it's a winning strategy in this game or if I just played too much EU3
)
There is two more issues to consider regarding Carthage. That is our defense pacts with Numidia and Macedonia. If Carthage attacks us then we would request Numidia to respect the pact and declare war on Carthage. We would request Macedonia to do the same and to incite Syracuse to attack Carthage in Sicily by using troops financed by us and Macedonia.
In the end, I don´t think Carthage´s position is as strong as you think. I think we could offer Carthage that we will not extend our defense pact or sign any pact with Numidia in exchange that they do not meddle in the situation in Gaul.
Consul Gaius Draconius
This is why I haven't been that much upset when I heard that Syracuse has entered an alliance. It's far better for us to see them allied with Macedonia than with Carthage.
Carthage and a few Iberians aren't that much of a problem. Carthage and Iberia and an independant Gaul, or Carthage and Iberia while most of our troops fight Gauls in the North is far more annoying.
I think these are our domestic orders unless Consul Aquila wants to veto them:
1. We need to build two new legions at Apulia and Bruttium to replace our losses. (-200)
2. We need to make sacrifice to the Gods to secure their favor.(-75)
3. We need to increase happiness in all provinces. (-300)
4. We need to reinforce legion in Lugduensis (-25).
5. We need to build fortifications at Narbonensis. (-200)
6. We should send a spy in Central Gaul.(-25) (I suggest that spy´s mission in Gaul would be to provide false information to Gauls that the Roman army much weaker in Lugdunensis than it is in real life and it would be a good time for Gauls to invade both Lugdunensis and Narbonensis.)
I suggest that we redeploy our legions from Narbonensis to Lugdunensis. Let´s try to lure Gauls to a trap. At the same time, we should request Carthage to give us some time because we are debating this issue and we haven´t reach the conclusion.
Consul Gaius Draconius
1. We need to build two new legions at Apulia and Bruttium to replace our losses. (-200)
2. We need to make sacrifice to the Gods to secure their favor.(-75)
3. We need to increase happiness in all provinces. (-300)
4. We need to reinforce legion in Lugduensis (-25).
5. We need to build fortifications at Narbonensis. (-200)
6. We should send a spy in Central Gaul.(-25) (I suggest that spy´s mission in Gaul would be to provide false information to Gauls that the Roman army much weaker in Lugdunensis than it is in real life and it would be a good time for Gauls to invade both Lugdunensis and Narbonensis.)
I suggest that we redeploy our legions from Narbonensis to Lugdunensis. Let´s try to lure Gauls to a trap. At the same time, we should request Carthage to give us some time because we are debating this issue and we haven´t reach the conclusion.
Consul Gaius Draconius
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Deal
Since most of the points i made are incorperated into Draconius's proposal.
Also i agree with him on the Carthage matter.
They would face us in Gaul, Macedonia in Sicily and Numidia in Africa.
I would like to buy clients (5)
Since most of the points i made are incorperated into Draconius's proposal.
Also i agree with him on the Carthage matter.
They would face us in Gaul, Macedonia in Sicily and Numidia in Africa.
I would like to buy clients (5)
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I agree with our Consuls' 6 points.
Strategic redeployment and reinforcement is good, it allows us to act as if there's a ceasefire during potential negotiations. And might lure the Gauls to attack our own provinces.
On the other hand, I still think we should reply with a copy of Carthage's Iberian treaty, which I outlined earlier. Delaying tactics might not work and could lead these pesky Greeks to mess with us as well. At least it wouldn't be a clear refusal...
Sextus Atilius
Strategic redeployment and reinforcement is good, it allows us to act as if there's a ceasefire during potential negotiations. And might lure the Gauls to attack our own provinces.
On the other hand, I still think we should reply with a copy of Carthage's Iberian treaty, which I outlined earlier. Delaying tactics might not work and could lead these pesky Greeks to mess with us as well. At least it wouldn't be a clear refusal...
Sextus Atilius
I believe that the chances for Gauls to attack Lugduensis are pretty high. Gauls have dealt us a crushing defeat and they probably feel hubris right now. They are getting unified but they haven´t finish that process yet. They haven´t been able to send spies yet. Also, Vercingetorix will have an awful dilemma right now. His most trusted hawkish commanders will probably advocate starting the "liberation" Gaul provinces or at least to deal us a serious defeat in order to force us to start negotiations. They don´t know the exact situation and they may optimistically think that if they are able to defeat us once more then the war is over. I think the human nature and Vercingetorix´s prestige will force them to attack us at Lugduensis. If that happens then they think that they are attacking against a small and demoralized army but they will meet the bulk of our legions there.
We will need the unity of command in there and that shall be Lentulus while Merula will command his army but he will do as Lentulus tells him to do. We need to switch the commanding general because of the recent defeat and to motivate our men. I request that both Lentulus and Merula should make sacrifices to our God of War, Mars. I believe that this battle will decide the fate of our country.
Let us show those pesky Gauls that what real Romans can do. They were able to defeat us once. Now, we have the element of surprise. We have excellent commanders and we will have the favor of Gods as well. So, we have a nasty surprise ready for them at Lugduensis.
Consul Gaius Draconius
Clarification for spy orders:
6. We should send a spy in Central Gaul.(-25) (I suggest that spy´s mission in Gaul would be to provide false information to Gauls that the Roman army much weaker in Lugdunensis than it is in real life and it would be a good time for Gauls to invade both Lugdunensis. The Gauls should also be informed that according to a rumor Rome has decided to spread her legions in order to cover her provinces against possible Carthaginean attacks. In practice, it means that Rome does only have a small army at Lugduensis. If the Gauls can destroy that army then there will be a very good chance that Rome will start negotiations with them.
OOC: I am basing my strategy to the battle of the Caudine Forks in 321 BC. In that battle, the Samnites lured Roman army to mountain pass by giving them false information and trapped that army in mountain pass. Romans around 260 BC would most likely know that battle because it was a humiliating defeat for Romans at that time.
We will need the unity of command in there and that shall be Lentulus while Merula will command his army but he will do as Lentulus tells him to do. We need to switch the commanding general because of the recent defeat and to motivate our men. I request that both Lentulus and Merula should make sacrifices to our God of War, Mars. I believe that this battle will decide the fate of our country.
Let us show those pesky Gauls that what real Romans can do. They were able to defeat us once. Now, we have the element of surprise. We have excellent commanders and we will have the favor of Gods as well. So, we have a nasty surprise ready for them at Lugduensis.
Consul Gaius Draconius
Clarification for spy orders:
6. We should send a spy in Central Gaul.(-25) (I suggest that spy´s mission in Gaul would be to provide false information to Gauls that the Roman army much weaker in Lugdunensis than it is in real life and it would be a good time for Gauls to invade both Lugdunensis. The Gauls should also be informed that according to a rumor Rome has decided to spread her legions in order to cover her provinces against possible Carthaginean attacks. In practice, it means that Rome does only have a small army at Lugduensis. If the Gauls can destroy that army then there will be a very good chance that Rome will start negotiations with them.
OOC: I am basing my strategy to the battle of the Caudine Forks in 321 BC. In that battle, the Samnites lured Roman army to mountain pass by giving them false information and trapped that army in mountain pass. Romans around 260 BC would most likely know that battle because it was a humiliating defeat for Romans at that time.
OOC : The samnites ruled, in terms of military strategy. The early roman way to fight was mostly inspired by them, after all. And good to know your knowledge isn't limited to a certain T-named rock
On the topic, Greeks are held in check by Macedonia and Egypt will not help them. Nothing to fear from there, I think. There is a nice balance of powers in this game, with the alliances and pacts present.
I suggest sending an emissary to Egypt as well, to prevent Carthaginian action against them. True, they have the Greeks, but they're far away and their navy is weak, from what our spies have gathered.
On the topic, Greeks are held in check by Macedonia and Egypt will not help them. Nothing to fear from there, I think. There is a nice balance of powers in this game, with the alliances and pacts present.
I suggest sending an emissary to Egypt as well, to prevent Carthaginian action against them. True, they have the Greeks, but they're far away and their navy is weak, from what our spies have gathered.
Turn over, begin updating (fortunately it can only go upward considering the last turn )
)
Gaul War?
A messenger is send to Vercingetorix with the proposal for a peace treaty between Rome and Gaul. The Messenger explains, that Rome will accept Gaul independence, if they agree to become a Client State of Rome and pay a tribute of 50% of their actual income.
About a week later, the Head and Hands of the Messenger are delivered to the Consul`s office along with a message of Vercingetorix, in which he curses all Romans for their arrogance and hybris. Finally he explains that, confronted with the choice of fighting for freedom or being Rome`s slaves, they decide to fight.
The Senate is informed about this.
(If the Senate decides to fight the Gauls, the Gaul War will start. Since the Gauls are a NPC-country now, the population will suffer -1 happiness each turn of the war. But since they are still a tribal Country, the War may end in total annexation.)
Early 255 B.C.
Senate report:
Having recovered from the shock of losing about three Legions in the Gaul wilderness, the Senate discusses future operations there and how to deal with the Carthaginian proposal for a stable peace with the now unified Gaul tribes.
Senator Sextus Atilius Aelianus proposes a treaty similar to the one that Carthage signed with the Iberian tribes. Consul Gaius Draconius basically agrees with that, but likes to see an amendment, so the Province of Aquitania will be ceded to Rome. After a long debate, Senator Aelianus` wording succeeds in a vote with 143 versus 88 votes, while 69 Senators abstained. A messenger is send to Carthage and Gaul to deliver the offer of the Senate.
The Senate is informed about a serious Slave uprising in Venetia (2 CV). The Governor of the province urges the Senate to send help, before the Slaves might attack the main city. During the unrest, the Province generates only 50% income.
Consul report:
Consuls Gaius Draconius and Lucius Aquila inform the Senate about the recruitment of two new Legions in Apulia and Bruttium, that will be ready for duty in Late 255.
Pontifex report:
Pontifex Quintus Livius Varro holds a sacrificial ritual in order to gain a blessing for the roman Legions, but the Gods somehow don`t seem to be that convinced.
Afterward, he travels through the whole Republic to hearten the population. He succeeds to improve the Happiness in Cisalpine Gaul, Dalmatia and Latium by 5. On his day of arrival in Tarentum (Apulia) a severe rain occurs after two months of drought. Especially the peasants are glad and the Happiness increases by 10.
Provinces with a below-average happiness are Lugdinensis (35), Campania, Etruria, Latium, Umbria (30 each) and Narbonensis (25).
Aedile report:
Tiberius Belisarius oversees the improvement of the Fortifications in Narbonensis. His efficiency in exploiting the local sources of construction material decreases the cost of the project to 160 Denarii.
Quaestor report:
Titus Ceadicius improves his management of the tax collection, but still the revenues of the last six months are slightly lower than expected and sum up to 774 Denarii. The Treasury holds 1.618 Denarii.
[= 1.629 Denarii (last turn`s Treasury) - 25 (Spy movement) - 25 (Reinforcement) - 75 (Ritual) - 300 (Happiness)- 160 (Fortification) - 200 (Recruitment) + 774 (Taxes)]
Censor report:
Due to his obviously good relation to Jupiter, the popularity of Quintus Livius Varro increases to +2. Tiberius Belisarius` administration skill is rewarded with an increase of his popularity to +1. The popularity of Gaius Draconius and Lucius Aquila remains at +2 respectively +1.
Spy report:
The Spy, disguised as merchant from Massilia, arrives in Central Gaul. Although it is more difficult, to gain the trust of the Locals, he learns, that 8 tribal units are in said province. There seem to be no other Units in the adjacent Gaul Provinces.
He also reports, that the Gauls received a very large sum to improve their Fortifications, but the origin of the funds can`t be traced.
Tribune report:
The crippled Legion in Narbonensis is reinforced. Finally the three Legions in Narbonensis are moved to Lugdinensis and passed to the Command of Gnaeus Scipio Lentulus. Aulus Manlius Merula returns to Rome, where the Censor awaits him.
Foreign affairs:
- Phoenician War:
Egypt launches an attack on the slightly superior Seleucian forces in Coele Syria and succeed in totally defeating them with no serious casualties. The Egypt forces in Phoenicia and Arabia manage to avoid battles. Warscore: 15 (Egypt)
(Deadline for oders and statements is Monday, 4 PM GMT. Have a nice weekend.)
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From: Titus Octavius; Censor of Rome
To: The Senate of Rome
Dear Senators,
I agree to the Consul`s decision to move the remaining three Legions from Narbonensis to Lugdinensis and pass them to the Command of Gnaeus Scipio Lentulus. Nevertheless did the incapability of Senator Aulus Manlius Merula damage the security of the Republic, the well-being of the still upset citizens of Rome as well as our prestige among the nations. Therefore I propose to prosecute him for his performance during the so-called "Marsanus-Battle" and await your vote.
Titus Octavius
To: The Senate of Rome
Dear Senators,
I agree to the Consul`s decision to move the remaining three Legions from Narbonensis to Lugdinensis and pass them to the Command of Gnaeus Scipio Lentulus. Nevertheless did the incapability of Senator Aulus Manlius Merula damage the security of the Republic, the well-being of the still upset citizens of Rome as well as our prestige among the nations. Therefore I propose to prosecute him for his performance during the so-called "Marsanus-Battle" and await your vote.
Titus Octavius
Tought it would have been worse
We should bleed Gaul dry. They only have 500 income.
If we can destroy there army it will take them a long time before they can rebuild it.
1) Move the 2 Legions in Apuila to Venetia and destroy the slaves. Leave none alive!
2) Increase popularity in Lugdinensis, Campania, Etruria, Latium, Umbria and Narbonensis. (150c)
3) Build 2 more legions (Apuila and bruttium) (200c)
I propose to let Senator Aulus Manlius Merula ride out the storm in the position of Quaestor.
Consul Aquila
a few questions:
Shouldn't the garrison in Narbonesis be a level 3?
Does Macedonia have 2 trade slots or only 1?
We should bleed Gaul dry. They only have 500 income.
If we can destroy there army it will take them a long time before they can rebuild it.
1) Move the 2 Legions in Apuila to Venetia and destroy the slaves. Leave none alive!
2) Increase popularity in Lugdinensis, Campania, Etruria, Latium, Umbria and Narbonensis. (150c)
3) Build 2 more legions (Apuila and bruttium) (200c)
I propose to let Senator Aulus Manlius Merula ride out the storm in the position of Quaestor.
Consul Aquila
a few questions:
Shouldn't the garrison in Narbonesis be a level 3?
Does Macedonia have 2 trade slots or only 1?