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Trastamaraa

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Oct 14, 2015
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Hello everybody,

Im not sure if the developers havent done this for a reason or not, but what i want to claim now is burgundy event for Spain. In 1516 Charles V von Habsburg becomes king of spain while being duke of burgundy.


But that's not all. Ottomans have an event about jenizars, buffing morale and discipline and i think spain should get the same for a period like 1490 to 1643 (rocroi), because, spain was pretty invincible in the battle fields at that time with Los Tercios.

Thank you for your time, and i hope you guys find this viable.

Regards.
 
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Spain already has a good chance to get the Burgundian inheritance. Especially with a royal marriage. If you start the game at the later date it will line up with history.

Spain's tercios were adopted by other nations as well and improved upon. You can recreate this by emphasizing mil tech until you unlock the tercio unit type ahead of everyone else.
 
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Im not talking about the unit itsElf. Im talking about the fact we changed war in europe For over a century. We should get Gonzalo fernandez de cordoba event, and Get temporal morale and discipine.
And about burgundy, chances are too low, we want historical event like the iberian wedding.
 
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He's pretty right, tbh.
I played with Spain countless times. I married Burgundy so many times my inheritance could populate Siberia twice, yet never inherited the bloody low lands 'cause of the difficult of it.
The spanish tercios trigger would be great in two ways:
-Compensate the poor manpower Spain has.
-To be more realistic according to the history (the tercios weren't defeated in almost 300 years, it's a fact you just can't ignore).

PS: I haven't inherited the low lands as Spain since EU2.
 
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The chance is 70%+ right now. That is very high considering the game starts in 1444.

Tercios weren't defeated for almost 300 years because everyone was using tercios. That's like saying humans win all the Olympics as if something else was competing. Keep in mind Spain already gets a 15% morale boost at the start to help simulate it's early game combat ability. 5% discipline is added a bit later (first national idea) but still in the early game. So by about 1490 you should have your elite bonuses. Better still you keep them for the whole game.
 
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Well I minored in history and have a library with about. . . 500 books on the subject. Anything in particular you think I don't understand? Spanish nationalism perhaps?
 
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I think u are not being fair with what our armies achieved for a long time. Maybe others adopted the spanish tercios for theirselves but we were set ahead the rest of nations in the battlefields for a long period. a early 15% morale buff isnt enough, coz all the rest of great nations get buffs aswell, france gets early 20% which sets him ahead, plus the huge manpower it owns, puts spain in an unreal situation for the XVI and XVII centuries in my opinion.

And that 70% chance of inherinting burgundy...where can i see that ? Coz it doesnt feel like so.
 
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France has to advance two techs and three ideas to get their first national idea. Spain starts with 15% morale bonus. This is intentional. Keep in mind 10% morale is roughly balanced with 5% discipline so at this first NI you are still better than France. Boost production at your gold mine to fund mercenaries and suddenly Frances manpower isn't worth jack.

http://www.eu4wiki.com/Burgundian_events#Burgundian_Succession_Crisis

Looks like I misread it. It's a 90% chance. 20% of direct inheritance, 70% for royal marriage due to 4 vassals preventing burgundies AI from marrying more than one country typically. Become emperor as Charles V did if you want a 100% guarantee of it.
 
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Hello everybody,

Im not sure if the developers havent done this for a reason or not, but what i want to claim now is burgundy event for Spain. In 1516 Charles V von Habsburg becomes king of spain while being duke of burgundy.


But that's not all. Ottomans have an event about jenizars, buffing morale and discipline and i think spain should get the same for a period like 1490 to 1643 (rocroi), because, spain was pretty invincible in the battle fields at that time with Los Tercios.

Thank you for your time, and i hope you guys find this viable.

Regards.

First, almost every country in EU4 has some special events or historical event that was very special to them etc. But seeing as Paradox don't have a staff of 10,000 people, they don't have the ability to implement it all. Why is Spains history more important than anyone else's? They get easily some of the most development attention so they're hardly being ignored. Also, its a historical grand strategy. NOT a history book. Not everything is meant to happen 100% like real life. That would be extremely boring. Spain get good representation of their military prowess in their ideas. If you want an exact recreation of history build a time machine or read history books. Don't start whinging that one if the major focus countries of the game isn't getting enough preferential treatment.
 
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First, almost every country in EU4 has some special events or historical event that was very special to them etc. But seeing as Paradox don't have a staff of 10,000 people, they don't have the ability to implement it all. Why is Spains history more important than anyone else's? They get easily some of the most development attention so they're hardly being ignored. Also, its a historical grand strategy. NOT a history book. Not everything is meant to happen 100% like real life. That would be extremely boring. Spain get good representation of their military prowess in their ideas. If you want an exact recreation of history build a time machine or read history books. Don't start whinging that one if the major focus countries of the game isn't getting enough preferential treatment.
Sorry but I can not agree with you. Spain got a lot of attention during the development of the game. However, since the release Spain has been almost completely ignored. For example, Spain has ones of the biggest provinces in the game (Leon for instance), almost any other part of Europe has been reworked more deeply than Spain. Besides, the terrain of several Spanish provinces is wrong. Google Asturias and you will find out it is not plain at all, and the same for Cantabria. Long time ago I complained to the devs about this mistake which, although it is quite easy to fix, has not been corrected yet, so it is difficult to say you are right.
 
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As others have said there is already a pretty big chance for Spanish Netherlands in the inheritance of Burgundy chain. That makes more sense than the extremely specific circumstances around Charles V abdication IMO :)
Spain does have military bonuses and quite a few events. It's possible we will do something more for flavor related to the Tercios at some point but I don't see it as being very urgent. They're already sufficiently strong.

Sorry but I can not agree with you. Spain got a lot of attention during the development of the game. However, since the release Spain has been almost completely ignored. For example, Spain has ones of the biggest provinces in the game (Leon for instance), almost any other part of Europe has been reworked more deeply than Spain. Besides, the terrain of several Spanish provinces is wrong. Google Asturias and you will find out it is not plain at all, and the same for Cantabria. Long time ago I complained to the devs about this mistake which, although it is quite easy to fix, has not been corrected yet, so it is difficult to say you are right.

If you feel the terrains are wrong, please bug report them and tag me.
If you have specific ideas for the Spanish provinces you can make a suggestions thread with specific requests and justifications and we might revisit it at some point if we are convinced of the need.
As for events: It's never too late to add more but the world is big and Spain has actually received a big batch of extra ones in patches since release. I know because I wrote them :)
 
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As others have said there is already a pretty big chance for Spanish Netherlands in the inheritance of Burgundy chain. That makes more sense than the extremely specific circumstances around Charles V abdication IMO :)
Spain does have military bonuses and quite a few events. It's possible we will do something more for flavor related to the Tercios at some point but I don't see it as being very urgent. They're already sufficiently strong.



If you feel the terrains are wrong, please bug report them and tag me.
If you have specific ideas for the Spanish provinces you can make a suggestions thread with specific requests and justifications and we might revisit it at some point if we are convinced of the need.
As for events: It's never too late to add more but the world is big and Spain has actually received a big batch of extra ones in patches since release. I know because I wrote them :)
Thanks, I'll do it ASAP :)
 
Spain does have military bonuses and quite a few events. It's possible we will do something more for flavor related to the Tercios at some point but I don't see it as being very urgent. They're already sufficiently strong.

Would eventually adding Inf Combat to their ideas be possible - aside from the spirit the Spanish Tercio had, there's also the guerillas that endlessly plagued Napoleon during his invasion. And while I do agree that Spain's power is more or less proper right now, there's still a fair point in pointing out all the Quality buffs the Ottomans can pile on in comparison to Spain (and that French NIs can easily eclipse Spanish militarily).
 
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Spain looks like a poor brother of France in EU4. Not only Iberia has so much less development than French region, but also Iberia starts fractured and is dependent on random with Ibeian Wedding.

If we talk about SP, then I often see Aragon or Castile fall to France. In MP weird policies distribution leaves Castile (who takes exploration as 1st or 2nd idea group) completely vulnerable to France that always stockpiles something like Quality + Economic + Quantity,

I completely agree with @Grand Historian that Castile should receive Infantry CA (+10% at very least) in NIs or at least in events.
 
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It's always weird seeing people using we, us and our in a historical context a few hundred years ago. I assume no one is 500 years old.
 
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Sometimes I feel that old :/

Spain has a gold mine so their income is superb. They inherit burgundy, PU Aragon, PU Naples, and have stronger military ideas than France for the first half of the game. They even have a small chance of getting Portugal in a PU which is huge if Portugal makes a bunch of colonial nations. They are poised to dominate colonially. They are a lucky nation until 1700. Now you want to give them an event similar to janissaries or simply add +10% infantry combat ability. I just don't think they need it.
 
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As others have said there is already a pretty big chance for Spanish Netherlands in the inheritance of Burgundy chain. That makes more sense than the extremely specific circumstances around Charles V abdication IMO :)
Spain does have military bonuses and quite a few events. It's possible we will do something more for flavor related to the Tercios at some point but I don't see it as being very urgent. They're already sufficiently strong.



If you feel the terrains are wrong, please bug report them and tag me.
If you have specific ideas for the Spanish provinces you can make a suggestions thread with specific requests and justifications and we might revisit it at some point if we are convinced of the need.
As for events: It's never too late to add more but the world is big and Spain has actually received a big batch of extra ones in patches since release. I know because I wrote them :)

Granada could be split in two creating Malaga. This would help Granada be a bit stronger. Also Granada was a major city at the time and merits higher development.
 
Sometimes I feel that old :/

Spain has a gold mine so their income is superb. They inherit burgundy, PU Aragon, PU Naples, and have stronger military ideas than France for the first half of the game. They even have a small chance of getting Portugal in a PU which is huge if Portugal makes a bunch of colonial nations. They are poised to dominate colonially. They are a lucky nation until 1700. Now you want to give them an event similar to janissaries or simply add +10% infantry combat ability. I just don't think they need it.

First, Spain's gold income is insignificant; the AI does not know how to prioritize development, and France's development is so superior to Castile's that it doesn't change anything early game.

Secondly, while the Iberian Union is highly likely to happen, AI Castile still often ends up in a war with Aragon, or Aragon ends up in a war with France or someone else that makes them loose Naples as a PU. AI Castile almost never inherits Burgundy - whereas France is guaranteed to get a share, in addition to all the cores it starts out with - which I'm not exactly complaining about. I have only seen the Portuguese vassalization event once, and that was playing as Castile and actively pursuing it. Nevermind all the free cores and claims the Ottomans get.

The idea that their ideas are better than France's early on is a misconception; yes, +15% Land Morale is extremely powerful early game, but it's rarely actually able to be used by AI Castile in a French-Castile war. In the first few decades both are occupied by other issues; France with conquering England and Provence, and Castile with North Africa and Aragon. The difference being that France gets about 100+ development easily into their nation - often free due to cores - which makes them even stronger, while North Africa is more trouble than it's worth and Aragon either ends up in a PU or the amount of development Castile gets is insignificant compared to France's. Secondly, Castile's starting ruler and heir are absolutely atrocious, while France's are significantly better. Between this and the Castilian Civil War disaster Castile is more often than not slammed with, Castile is almost guaranteed to be behind in the tech and idea races by the time they actually come to blows with France. That France unlocks Elan as it's second idea makes it incredibly easy for it to have by the first time they fight, which not only negates but edges out Castile's tradition. Secondly, Discipline is not exactly useful early game, and certainly not as useful as Frances +20% National Manpower tradition which allows them to take full advantage of their developmental superiority. Not to mention France's +1 Diplomatic Reputation, which allows them to form silly alliances at start that their vassals normally would have prevented, which means Castile can easily be dogpiled in both Quality and Quantity too.

If you don't believe me, perhaps we should actually take a look at their NIs:

France
Traditions:
+20%
National manpower modifier
+1 Diplomatic reputation
French Language in All courts

+1 Diplomatic relations
Elan!

+20% Morale of armies
Estates General

+10% National tax modifier
Native Trading Principles

−50% Native uprising chance
+50% Native assimilation
Vauban Fortifications

−20% Fort maintenance
The Philosophes

−10% Technology cost
Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité

+2 Tolerance of heretics
+2 Tolerance of heathens
Ambitions:

+5% Discipline

Spain / Castile
Traditions:
+15%
Morale of armies
+1 Missionary
The Reconquista

+5% Discipline
Spanish Inquisition

+2% Missionary strength
Inter Caetera

Can fabricate claims on any overseas province, provided it is overseas for its owner
+1 Colonists
Devout Catholicism

+2 Yearly Papal influence
Treasure Fleet

+10% Provincial trade power modifier
+15% Global tariffs
A Spanish Armada

+10% National sailors modifier
+10% Heavy ship combat ability
Siglo De Oro

+1 Yearly prestige
Ambitions:

+25 Global settler increase

As you can clearly see, not only does France cancel out Spain in quality in every area, but they exceed them in quality with Elan and easily surpass them numerically - both militarily and economically - of which is perfectly acceptable. The only thing that Spain does have over France is naval ideas, which are usually worthless when fighting France.

Secondly, you of all people should know that saying that Castile has better quality ideas for the "first half" of the game is untrue; you made a thread a few days ago about how quickly NIs can be filled up, and France usually fills theirs up more quickly the Castile's.

And yes, while Castile is poised to dominate colonially, they often do not in the AI's hands; Portugal usually beats them to the Caribbean, while France or England usually takes Brazil, both of which are the most useful Colonial regions, and Spain won't colonize there due to ToT. This usually leaves Spain to the less than valuable Mexico region, which until they conquer the Mesos is often worthless (and Portugal usually goes for them as well), and forces them to go into the Great Plains and California. This is, again, in part due to their horrible starting leaders which leave them in the dust compared to their colonizing neighbors. Castile being a lucky nation is irrelevant; so is France.

Now, I can already hear the retort; "in the hands of the player..." anything can be overpowered or outwit the AI. We do not measure a human against an AI in terms of determining nations capabilities when making balancing decisions, we measure an AI nation against an AI nation. Spain often catches up in most games, but to say the achieve even half the things you say they can, let alone half the stuff they did historically, as an AI is at best a misconception.

Finally, I love the double-standard you have; 'it's perfectly fine for the quality of the Ottoman's elite units to be represented, but not Spain's because I don't think they need it'. The Ottomans get +5% Discipline, +15% Cavalry Combat Ability, +20% Manpower Recovery Speed, and +33% National Forcelimit Modifier in their NIs alone, Devershime throws on +10% National Manpower Modifier and gives an event that provides a free +50 Army Tradition, Enderun gives them either +2.5% Discipline or +10% Cavalry Combat ability for ten years, Military Reforms give them either +10% Inf Combat, +5% Inf Combat and +10% Galley Combat or +20% Galley Combat for twenty years, the Janissaries give them a whooping 10% manpower recovery speed, +10% infantry combat ability, +5% discipline indefinitely, and their other NIs and events mean they can easily absorb large tracts of land and make the most out of them economically, and they almost never fall behind technologically. Finally, Islamic Piety almost completely negates Spain's Morale advantage and only makes the Ottoman's superior quantity even worse.

Spain gets squat to represent the quality of its armies outside its NIs - not a single event or decision. +10% Infantry Combat ability will not unbalance the game or make Spain too powerful in comparison to France or the Ottomans.

Edit: And there's no way you read this in the two minutes between me posting it and you downvoting it.
 
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