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It's not green. It's yellow. And it used to be useful to inform you that there's a full pop you can do something with or just let it migrate. Now it will permanently be on and there's no way to distinguish where you actually can make use of a pop, and where it's 0.01 of a pop that's not worth looking at. So it wrecks the old use case and offers nothing but distraction. I do not need to know that planet is full. I made it full and left it be so I can focus on other things, I do not see a purpose of dragging attention back to it with less than full pop to manage.
One of the best changes from pop systems for me is there's less use in micro, pops migrate bit by bit so it's not important where the pops flow unless you discover a destination where you don't want them. This goes against that and, by using the same icon, also encourages to ignore situations where you actually need to do something about pops migrating because there's a few of them there and auto-migration is too slow to take care of it.
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New game started for 3.99.7. Super early reactions:
* Something is causing it to run significantly hotter than previously; my fans are running audibly harder than previous versions. I'm guessing uncapped frame rate problems. Note that in previous 3.99.x versions the main menu screen would run up the temps uncapped, but the game itself did not have issues.
* Surveyed planets are showing City?, Generator, Mining across the bottom of the window; there's no visible Agriculture district or way to see how many there are easily. The starting capital looks normal. The Management tab shows that it should have Ag districts. Off by one error?
* Something is causing it to run significantly hotter than previously; my fans are running audibly harder than previous versions. I'm guessing uncapped frame rate problems. Note that in previous 3.99.x versions the main menu screen would run up the temps uncapped, but the game itself did not have issues.
* Surveyed planets are showing City?, Generator, Mining across the bottom of the window; there's no visible Agriculture district or way to see how many there are easily. The starting capital looks normal. The Management tab shows that it should have Ag districts. Off by one error?
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I want performance improved as much as anyone else but galaxy sizes above 1k are not officially supported by the game so that is a terrible metric for what 'good performance' means.
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Isn't this beta running off 1 core of the CPU? performance should be ignored
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Yeah, as long as you can reach the first or second crisis on a large map the performance is good enough
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No, stellaris has multi processing capabilities, the bulk of the work is done by 1 core it's true but there are multiple cores doing stuff while you run the basegame
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that is true. but i tried a storm chaser run some time ago and locked myself into a perma storm and 100% planetary devastation. i did not finish the game suffice to say. this change is better than the status quo. devestation from storms should be mitigatable
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As long as there is outward migration going on there's never going to be more than a few excess pops available on a planet.
I still want an indicator to tell me "this planet has all jobs filled to capacity, you can build more jobs here if you want, but it's not strictly necessary".
Sure, I could see a new system where the briefcase is green in this situation, yellow when there are a lot of civilians preparing to migrate (say, 100 or 200), and red if they can't migrate anywhere. That would be better.
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AI empires still sitting at +10K minerals stockpiled barely building anything while having 1K fleet power.
Yesterday’s stream gave us a glimps into the plans and thoughts.
Yes, the zones are staying — and the reason why is that they plans to add more cool stuff for them and this new system over the course of the next year. But again, no specifics. So to be clear: for this argument to work, I imagine there must be a big document with a well-thought-out list of features and mechanics planned that only work with the new zones.
I do not feel like the goal will be met by the end of May. We are losing the industrial district by merging it into city districts — so technically speaking, we can no longer build industrial districts. In the last patch post, there was an attempt to sway us by saying we can still have an industrial planet by just building industrial zones in our city districts, and that it's basically the same — with extra steps. Nitpicky, but also not entirely false.
Having clear and easy access to building slots is also gone. It now requires us to jump through the hoops of zones, as building slots are not the same across all planets anymore. The UI and the transparency of building access and job creation are far better now than in 3.99.0, but still not fully transparent.
But these aren’t really my main problems with this approach.
I already teased it in my second sentence: they plan to finalize and implement the reasons for this change over the course of the next year.
That sentence made me stop for a second — because it shows a kind of mentality that doesn’t really fit with the current state of the game.
It told me: “We made changes to the game that seem odd now, but we plan to develop the features that make this system complete in the future.”
And that doesn’t sound like a rework — it sounds like a development milestone in an Early Access game, testing out new stuff, with an end goal or list of things that still need time in the oven.
And if you see my point here, you'd agree — this is not an Early Access game.
I find this worrying, again.
Many people have already pointed out that this feels undercooked and should have been more complete before it even went into beta.
Because the initial reception, as I perceived it, was bad — and if this was a test, then that would be the point where you throw it in the bin or take a step back.
But since this has a nebulous end goal, we’ve only seen glimpses or arguments that can be easily rebutted with “well, that could’ve worked in the old system,” which makes the whole thing seem more and more silly with every patch.
Again, I would suggest either rolling this back completely until we can REALLY see and TEST the reasons behind this rework of planet building to make us understand— or rework the rework into something more akin to the old system, but far more flexible and more fun than zones.
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This is a repost and rephrase of some posts from the end of the .6 thread:
Zones having repeatable buildings that add flat +X empire resource jobs to a planet and do nothing else are a half and half return to the old system that combines the worst pitfalls of both.
But the base building being a repeatable building with a zonesworth (or more in .6, so I'm really, actually very happy that got walked back) of jobs for far less money is shooting the whole concept in the foot. If I was looking to actively sabotage player impressions of zones I couldn't come up with anything better. It's probably too late for any more beta releases, but if that's still the setup in 4.0 you're definitely going to get a lot more "Zones are pointless" feedback because, well, they'll be right.
Zones having repeatable buildings that add flat +X empire resource jobs to a planet and do nothing else are a half and half return to the old system that combines the worst pitfalls of both.
- Building buildings to add fixed amounts of jobs of type A in zone B and having to compensate by building buildings to add fixed numbers of jobs of type C in zone D is just 3.x buildings but with more steps, killing the "just scale up" selling point of zones.
- Providing repeatables just to avoid empty slots only to replace them later works against the Less Clicks selling point of zones.
- Building a single power district and then spamming multiple districtsworth of technician jobs into the zone is a problem unique to the combo that defeats the entire purpose of rural districts.
But the base building being a repeatable building with a zonesworth (or more in .6, so I'm really, actually very happy that got walked back) of jobs for far less money is shooting the whole concept in the foot. If I was looking to actively sabotage player impressions of zones I couldn't come up with anything better. It's probably too late for any more beta releases, but if that's still the setup in 4.0 you're definitely going to get a lot more "Zones are pointless" feedback because, well, they'll be right.
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Also you should rename zone buildings to facilities and keep capital zone slots named buildings to further differentiate them and their function.
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Personally I think green briefcase would be more distracting than useful, but I can at least see sense in it. The loss of functionality from the old indicator system is the bigger issue as far as I am concerned. We had pretty consistent red - "Do something", yellow - "you have options". But now yellow briefcase shows up when the things you can do are irrelevant or outright impossible to accomplish due to planet being full, and there's no way to shut it off.
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Actually, I take back my words about galactic weather control being useless.
Now galactic weather control might actually be extremely good.
I had forgotten about putting storms on my own planets, which previously was a bad idea due to devastation.
Now? Now you can get a permanent -200% metallurgist upkeep on your alloy world.
You can finally make a defensive layer of particle storms around your empire.
So basically it just went from being an offensive ascension perk to being an ascension perk about boosting your own empire.
A bit sad though that we lost the only fun/good espionage operation the game had.
Now galactic weather control might actually be extremely good.
I had forgotten about putting storms on my own planets, which previously was a bad idea due to devastation.
Now? Now you can get a permanent -200% metallurgist upkeep on your alloy world.
You can finally make a defensive layer of particle storms around your empire.
So basically it just went from being an offensive ascension perk to being an ascension perk about boosting your own empire.
A bit sad though that we lost the only fun/good espionage operation the game had.
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The last thread also had quite decent discussion on the subject, with people, including myself, explaining why this sentiment is not universal and many people do in fact like job buildings for a variety of reasons.
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The devs have said several times that the "performance optimizations" won't be active during the beta due to them making bug fixing more difficult.
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Oh, I forgot to mention my thoughts on this! Probably the yellow/green suitcase should not show up at all if all district and building slots are in use, and there are no blockers you can clear.
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