Stop badmouthing the game.

[Stoner_Saint]

What do you consider as "cheesing the game"?

Is it perhaps selecting a rally point near the enemy border, then rapid deploying your troops to the enemy capital before they even arrive with their troops?
It sounds pretty cheesy, but it's a game feature, working as intended. It's not an exploit or cheat.

Is it cheesy to marry a German princess as a Byzantine vassal, then proceed to utilize tens of thousands of German troops to take over the Byzantine Empire?
Very cheesy, but there are no game restrictions to this. There isn't a loophole, a hidden strategy to achieve this. You click Find a Spouse, and select the one with the biggest military as dowry.

Is it cheesy to marry a beautiful and genius spouse, then send your prodigy child to university, choose positive education traits and then select great Lifestyles for them?
Extremely cheesy, as you are making generations of God-Emperors. But, is the game penalizing me for marrying a lowborn genius? Not very much. Is the game giving me a hard time providing a good education for my kids? Not at all. Is there any reason why I should not pick specific lifestyles? None whatsoever.

None of these things are loopholes. None of these things are funny quirks from behind the scene. It's something that is openly available, clearly visible and clearly suggested as optimal gameplay. It's a marriage game - of course I'm going to find the best spouse. As for why the game doesn't offer any challenge to that aspect - well that's the game problem, isn't it? I mean, if I used a hidden exploit, then sure, it's not how you should play the game. But even then, exploits should be fixed by developers. Don't ask me to limit myself, in order to have a proper game.

Imagine playing Stronghold: Crusader. And someone tells you to not use Wheat Farms, as they are much more efficient than other food sources. It's cheesy (wheaty? *ahem*). Don't use Engineer Shields together with archers - they make the game too easy. Don't use Catapults - use Laddermen.
Why?

A gamer can use whatever tools the game provides, in order to play and win the game.
If these tools are cheesy, broken or exploitative - that's the fault of the game, and it's developer. Not of the gamer. A gamer should not need to limit their abilities, just to have a sensible gaming experience.

I was responding to somebody else saying they don't enjoy about the game first saying they like that it is cheesy then saying they don't.

Just do whatever makes you happy.

 

[PDX-Trinexx]

CK3 was released about 5 years ago now and is still growing and developing.
No video game is perfect if it were there would be nothing left to work towards.
The devs are clearly passionate about the game and an effort is made to improve upon it and listen to player feedback.
Maybe the Crusader Kings player base has become too spoiled.
Many of the features we have asked for we have gotten and those we are yet to such as trade are currently in development.

People complain about the difficulty and so 2 new difficulties are added following the same process as other Paradox games and buffing the AI, still this is not enough.
The only real limit to a game as full as CK3 is ones own imagination and creativity. Naturally if you are to just min-max everything and not read through the events properly just hovering over the decisions to see what benefits it might entail it may feel less immersive or full.

Many of the individuals who complain about the game often ignore what is there. Yes it isn't the most challenging game in the world though the devs have made it clear that that is not the intent behind it. Its a fun sandbox game if you don't like it that's fine but why do you feel the need to then make it known to everyone that you hate the game because you just aren't enjoying it?
I myself tried getting into other Paradox titles though I did not enjoy them at all, Stellaris for example though the game isn't perfect for the most part its that I just did not enjoy it.

Why must we critique many of ours favorite game so heavily.

I appreciate the sentiment here quite a bit, but constructive criticism and actionable feedback are critical for the long-term health of the game. Yes, some people get a little... carried away with it at times, but we're all adults at Studio Black; As long as you're not outright shit-talking/insulting our developers, we're grateful for any feedback players can provide.

 

[Alphonce]

I appreciate the sentiment here quite a bit, but constructive criticism and actionable feedback are critical for the long-term health of the game. Yes, some people get a little... carried away with it at times, but we're all adults at Studio Black; As long as you're not outright shit-talking/insulting our developers, we're grateful for any feedback players can provide.

Absolutely, everything should be done with full respect. I had a question: considering the addition of new difficulty in the settings, could we imagine different playstyle presets in the future?


I think that would solve all the issues. Those who prefer a more relaxed and less demanding strategy experience would be satisfied, and so would those who enjoy being challenged by deeper, more intricate mechanics.

 

[Jose_ck3]

Genuine question: Do you play with mods or have tweaked your game settings? I'm, just curious because in my current run, I've already gone through ca. a dozen characters and only one of them made it barely into their 70s, most died in their 50s/60s. Two of them way sooner because of being murdered, one rather sudden because of harm event. Does this never happen to you?

Now it makes sense why this person disagree with any and all complaints about the game, they play exactly like the AI.

 

[Benismann]

Absolutely, everything should be done with full respect. I had a question: considering the addition of new difficulty in the settings, could we imagine different playstyle presets in the future?


I think that would solve all the issues. Those who prefer a more relaxed and less demanding strategy experience would be satisfied, and so would those who enjoy being challenged by deeper, more intricate mechanics.

So, you are suggesting making entirely separate (and probably pretty big) sets of mechanics as optional gamerules?... I dont think that will happen

 

[Quuaddib]

Now it makes sense why this person disagree with any and all complaints about the game, they play exactly like the AI.

What do you mean?

 

[Alphonce]

So, you are suggesting making entirely separate (and probably pretty big) sets of mechanics as optional gamerules?... I dont think that will happen

I don’t know, maybe not as drastically — or just do like EU5 and make those mechanics automatable. They already made army management automatable, so why not the rest?

 

[Citizen Caen]

Why must we critique many of ours favorite game so heavily.

It’s not my favorite game. I don’t play CK3 anymore, I don’t enjoy playing it, so I’ve gone back to CK2.

However Crusader Kings was my favorite franchise. CK2 might be my favorite game ever, I played an ungodly amount when I was high school. I’ve been disappointed with the direction of CK3 a game I purchased under the expectation that it was a sequel. But I still follow developments because it’s interesting and I like history and systems development. I have a right to express my displeasure at it’s direction and make suggestions for products I would like as a consumer.

Again your complaints are non-issues this is an incredibly accurate simulation considering what it is.
Id go so far as to say that CK3 provides the best simulation of the medieval political landscape.

There is so much wrong with this… No ck3 is not even close to a “incredibly accurate simulation” it’s closer to a pop-history pencil and paper roll player game. Which is fine, but don’t mistake that for learning actual history.

it doesn’t provide the “best” more like the “only” depiction of medieval politics in a video game. Which doesn’t mean I have to be happy with its depictions.

 

[guiskj]

EU5 is going to end up being the best Medieval GSG, leaving CK3 to truly become a "Sims in Castles" game and a platform for total conversion mods.

I expect/hope to see a 1066 start date mod for EU5 within that game's first year of release.

 

[Tschobo]

I absolutely adore the Game and have 2,5 k hours in it. But I will always state my critiques on the game as I want.

Currently I have still huge gripes with the House/Dynasty AI and the direct line by marriages is not holding up too well. The language system ist downright broken (yes I am on the Lingua Franca achievement right now). Some Tournament Events are bugged out and there are still only a handful of stress traits which devalues an actually interesting system.

And these are just some points that I have. The most important thing is to keep it constructive and not to spout hateful nonsense.

 

[frostbiyt]

Naturally if you are to just min-max everything and not read through the events properly just hovering over the decisions to see what benefits it might entail it may feel less immersive or full.

I've already stopped taking the blood dynasty perk, I never murder my kids to secure succession, I almost never disinherit, I rarely ever make alliances, I don't even use the accolade system, I use my levies in battles, I rarely build MaA boosting buildings beyond level 1 or 2, I consider flavor when hybridizing my culture or reforming my religion rather than taking the most OP perks, I almost always start as a count, I rarely create a custom character. The game is still easy.

What's next? Do I stop marrying for alliances and traits entirely? Should I stop taking good lifestyle perks? If my realm fractures on succession should I just ignore the fact I have claims on my siblings and a superior army? Should I stop hosting feasts and hunts as a tribal, because the AI doesn't know how to properly generate and use prestige, but I do, so I soon have triple the MaA of any of my neighbors? Should I stop raiding too? Should I just sit and twiddle my thumbs even though I have the CBs and the means to keep expanding, because I'm too good at strategizing which targets to go after? Should I stand idly by while the conqueror who has double my troops just sieges down my castles without any siege units, because the AI is too stupid to recognize that I'm carpet sieging their tribal holdings at a significantly faster rate than they're taking the wargoal? I could go on.

What you and the people like you who keep repeating the same tired arguments are asking skilled players to do is to take the strategy out of the strategy game. And I find that an unacceptable solution.

Credit where it's due though: in lieu of massive balance changes and overhauls, the choose a new destiny feature is a fantastic, elegant patch to the system. Instead of getting bored in the second or third generation and starting a new game, being able to continue playing a fun game in the world I've already influenced is awesome.

 

[Strompator]

All you had to do was say....look you guys beat the game....so shut up and move on...and spared yourself composing a wall of text.