Suggestions about the Prison Architect. What the devs NEED to know

[thekillergreece]

Hello!

Prison Architect was in development for a very long time now! It entered in EA with barely content and all such stuff. Now, it has ton of content which provides endless hours to play. The game is built it on.. C++? I don't remember much but definitely not Unity 3D or whatsover.

The game has suffered several performance problems, memory leaks and so on. They were terrible but they are patched now. The game uses heavily CPU usage, often requiring a powerful processor to run a 1000 prisoners prison. But the more prisoners, the more clusterfuck the game becomes as the A.I takes somewhat longer to react and execute tasks assigned by the game or by the player. This might be because of the engine.

Absolutely optimize the game before adding content. Oh, also: Absolutely fix the bugs the game got. Make sure to have access to bug-tracker that the IV had, it will greatly help the team to locate bugs and fix them. There are ton of bugs left unfixed in bug-tracker.

As for suggestions, I don't remember much now but there were a few highly requested features that IV did not implement as they probably didn't meet their vision:
1. Multi-floor.
2. Mixed gender prison.
3. Better Escape Mode.
4. Escape Mode in Multiplayer.
5. The DLC that the Console Version has. Something Ward-like.

I don't have personal suggestions about the game. Only thing I would hope is that the team will optimize the game and what not. But due to the engine the game uses, it probably won't be viable.

Regarding the big question towards to DLCs, Free Updates and Sequel to PA:
Free Updates - Most recent updates by IV were pretty much small to medium sized.
DLCs - Well, this might be a controversial move as PA is known to provide free updates. But what are you gonna add to the game anyway besides the 5 suggestions as stated above?
Sequel - Might be required. Either in 2D/Top-down or in formula of Cities Skylines. But, please find a development team that has made ton of research to prisons and how they all work orthewise the game may fail. A realistic prison style with violence and blood and with every mechanic used from PA.

 

[ow592]

- Multifloor
- mixed gender
- some more possibilities to let inmates work would be nice. there are some things in the workshop already, but it would be nicer if we could have it in the game without using workshop for every detail

 

[Dr_Brodsky]

Re: multifloor, IV weren't keen on this because they feared it would make the AI pathfinding too complex; Pathfinding was already shunted off to a separate CPU thread since it was the biggest lag generator.

Mixed genders, honestly I don't see the appeal here since that never happens in real prisons. Then again, prisons don't tend to house max sec prisoners with minimum security types, so this is more of a community habit than any sort of intended challenge.

Edit: Corrected "CPU core" to "CPU thread", wires crossed from an earlier conversation.

 

[Medu Salem]

I agree with OP on the part with improving the CPU performance (especially on bigger default maps or expanded maps that become virtually unplayable) and fixing all the bugs first before considering to add more content...

That alone will probably keep your guys occupied for this year. At least judging from the last time I had a look at the IV Mantis bug tracker...

I did some modding every now and then and also had some deep look into the content files and the savegames the game dumps (which in my opinion are always a huge insight on the way an engine internally works and why it does certain things the way it does) and one thing I can say is... oh boy... the game in its current state is a mess.

One of their backend devs even acknowledged it themselves while I had an in-depth discussion with another known PA modder back at the PA forums some time ago. Some features were just carelessly slapped ontop of what already existed due to the pressure they put on themselves... and they were aware that some things should probably have been entirely rewritten over the years, but it never happened due to lack of time or other reasons, haha.

All I can say is that I am not envying the Paradox guys who will have to work through the codebase.



... Yet besides that I would like a proper way for the Prisoners to transition between security levels depending on their good/bad behavior.

Because the way the game does it currently still requires lots of micromanagement that gets tiresome. The way it is currently done was also one of the last real features integrated (besides the Multiplayer craziness) ... and hence because of it is very unfinished and doesn't consider a lot of edgecases so you may end up with a overfilled maximum security section because the game doesn't even check if there is still room left to put a prisoner there. And on the other hand the game never checks if a prisoner is well behaving enough to downgrade them.

(which was one of the reasons I wrote a mod for that)

Pathfinding was already shunted off to a separate CPU core since it was the biggest lag generator..

They did? I only ever heard them mention in their Update Videos that they offloaded the graphics stuff to its own dedicated thread because of how rendering can easily run asynchronous to the engine and doesn't run into all kinds of synchronization problems but besides that they didn't do much for multi-threading, if that's even possible.

 

[Dinges]

Most people haven't really been talking about it as far as I know, so it might be just me, but I think the mechanics that have already been implemented could use a little more work and become more coherent with the rest of the game. A lot of the mechanics in this game just make the game harder or more annoying, instead of more interesting. For example, max sec prisons carry a lot more risk and require a bigger investment, but don't really have a bigger reward. It's nice if you want to have a more difficult game, but I feel like that should be decided by difficulty settings, and not decided by something that can make your prison more interesting and rewarding.

Or the weather and heating systems, they are barebones, and to be honest, not all that fun. I really feel like more could be done with those to make it more fun and interesting

I could go on for a while like this, but the point I'm trying to make is not that I think it's a bad game (it's actually great), but that I think the current mechanics still have a lot of room of improvement, and that that's more important right now than even more mechanics for the time being.

 

[Dr_Brodsky]

They did? I only ever heard them mention in their Update Videos that they offloaded the graphics stuff to its own dedicated thread because of how rendering can easily run asynchronous to the engine and doesn't run into all kinds of synchronization problems but besides that they didn't do much for multi-threading, if that's even possible.

I did mean a thread, sorry, I will edit for clarity.

Re going through the many layers of half baked systems upon half baked systems, I wouldn't be surprised if Paradox just went straight to PA2. Gang members for instance are best handled imo by keeping them all in permanent Solitary, with the leader airlocked away, which means the only challenge really is manual busywork. It's telling that the cell grading system has a disable option, too.

 

[kjsdnfdkjsndksf]

I'd personally love to see more programs, and rooms. More micromanagement in general. The ability to really fine-tune and create unique prisons.

I have over 500 hours clocked on my steam for this game, and the most wanted thing on my list is more reform options. Especially for gang members. "ex-gang members" exist in the game already, you should be able to either convince or have people naturally leave the gang they are in; to be placed in protective custody and ultimately reformed back into society.

 

[Thedarkiller123]

as I had put on Facebook I would like to have the possibillity to have the tools that the developers of iv had in their alpha video like the "dev" properties or other stuff like his
PS : sorry for bad english but i'm french.
PS² : if this is not an expected addition would it be possible for us to have access to their version for those who wish?

 

[Dr_Brodsky]

as I had put on Facebook I would like to have the possibillity to have the tools that the developers of iv had in their alpha video like the "dev" properties or other stuff like his...

They have already been released, you need to be playing a map with cheats enabled, and press keys F1, F2 etc. for the different menus. If you don't have cheats already enabled, you can do that by opening the .prison file with notepad++, and adding "CheatsEnabled true" under the UseCellQuality line at the top of the file, about line 32 ish.

 

[Inge Jones]

Allow us to have a controlled door between cell block and canteen locked overnight without it flagging up the game as if the cells don't have a canteen. Cos they do in the daytime when the door isn't locked!

 

[Thedarkiller123]

They have already been released, you need to be playing a map with cheats enabled, and press keys F1, F2 etc. for the different menus. If you don't have cheats already enabled, you can do that by opening the .prison file with notepad++, and adding "CheatsEnabled true" under the UseCellQuality line at the top of the file, about line 32 ish.

I know we already have a menu of cheats however we do not have all the cheats like dev properties or the dev delete

 

[FantasticFwoosh]

This subforum seems to be loosely transcribed from the Introversion Forums in layout almost word for word, stamp it more classically Paradox please and show confidence to running things your way, you did want to aquire this franchise right?

I would hopefully think i speak for other people in the PA community that a suggestions board to house things like the OP describes to be read and paraphrased from archaic discussions would be great, else general might clog up when someone gets a fresh idea and nowhere to share it. Id been itching myself to put some things out to be heard.

 

[SteelRodent]

Most people haven't really been talking about it as far as I know, so it might be just me, but I think the mechanics that have already been implemented could use a little more work and become more coherent with the rest of the game. A lot of the mechanics in this game just make the game harder or more annoying, instead of more interesting. For example, max sec prisons carry a lot more risk and require a bigger investment, but don't really have a bigger reward. It's nice if you want to have a more difficult game, but I feel like that should be decided by difficulty settings, and not decided by something that can make your prison more interesting and rewarding.

The "what to do with a murderer" question is one of those mechanics IV never managed to sort out, that would be nice to see Paradox deal with. No matter how much you play the game, eventually you run into the issue of a prisoner repeatedly killing inmates. They did make prisoners auto-upgrade to higher security when they commit certain crimes, but the problem with the game's current design is that you can have a guy commit dozens of murders while in your prison, but you can't do anything about him other than shove him in a box for the duration of his stay. Meanwhile you can have people on death row who have not committed more than a single murder, if they've even done any serious crime. It is simply illogical to not "promote" prisoners to death row for repeat killings, whether that mean they have to be shipped out to a different prison or not.

Whether or not people agree with death penalty is a different matter, but it's part of the game and having repeat-killers given the death sentence could be a toggle option, just like we have the choice to not build a death row. We had a fairly long thread about this particularly issue on the old Mantis. Although it's just one of many issues IV never got around to resolving.

 

[bacondragon7]

Officer customization. Picking colors of uniforms, putting correctional officers into a special team such as SERT with their own outfits, and training standards for any officer that you place in the special unit. More education courses for guards, or ability to have them train offsite. These training's could be use of force (Won't kill cop killers, have the "skilled fighter" trait type in doing more damage in fights, dearming foes, and being able to take more hits). Perhaps even deescalation to talk rowdy inmates down. Also to customize officer loadouts, could be in twined with research of tasers for example, and having them pass a course for tasers. Other equipment that could be added would be a riot shield, that you could then decide which officer category is able to be trained and use the equipment.

Customization to name cell blocks, choose colors of inmates outfits for the security division that they're put in.

More traits, someone who is able to create custom shanks out of beds and other materials, and then sell it to inmates for a profit. Prisoners who don't do dirty work, but use money to pay off other prisoners to rob, kill, or protect them (shot caller). In many prisons what prisoners buy in the store determines their wealth in the prison, prisoners with more items from the store are seen as more wealthy. They also use these items bought in the store to sell/trade with other prisoners for favors or contraband.

 

[RealBrandonMcGowan]

In many prisons what prisoners buy in the store determines their wealth in the prison, prisoners with more items from the store are seen as more wealthy.

A lot of the goods are from family who send it to them rather then from the store.

 

[RealBrandonMcGowan]

It is simply illogical to not "promote" prisoners to death row for repeat killings

I agree but instead of the player "promoting" them they get on a prison bus to a court where the judge hands out the punishment. Im not saying that there needs to be a cut scene or anything, but it would be more realistic instead of how currently it just gets added to his rap sheet and increases how many years they are in the prison. I want them to be transferred to another prison; I vision them being transferred to a super max prison, like the ones where they stay in their for 23 hours out of the day. It isn't super necessary but it is something I think would be kind of cool.

 

[FantasticFwoosh]

Certainly the path for inmates to work metal sheets & wood planks into lockers/(other metal items of interest, maybe statues or superior tables/chairs) and superior beds, as to keep up productivity with reformation programmes that doesn't revolve 100% around timber and also allow us to properly control our exports. Welders would be interesting addition for contraband with a more advanced metal workbench as a alternative to the pressers, and a seperate high skill metalworking, idea being that welder could burn through fences and certain walls with time as well as scald quite nastily.

• A big problem is that in the existing game, superior beds can be placed instead of a regular bed when availible in stock but as a sort of a afterthought the exports areas automatically queue them to be sold. So a means to vetoe certain goods if you didn't want to sell all your wood-timber similarly queued to be exported and wanted to manufacture it, even if its just a little 'Mark X to disallow export' checklist in the prison manifest screen.

• Would also likely require changing the way stockpile inventories work, a checkbox on the building screens to make stored objects more preferencial or to prefer to buy new objects would help both free up and circulate things players hoard by accident in storage, expensive equipment pre-supplied by missions for instance that never gets used because due to possibly bad or buggy implementation the player ends up fronting the cost for a new one because no workers were currently not busy.

 

[Supersotamies]

I would like to see ability to have one player as a warden and other players as a prisoners.

 

[UltimateTobi]

Fixed Sprite orientation.

 

[GunnyMunny]

I would be happy if they just fixed the "AI". It's garbage, all random with no logic.